PC I Want All My Money Back!

Discussion in 'TSW General Discussion' started by grumypop51, Nov 8, 2022.

  1. grumypop51

    grumypop51 Well-Known Member

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    INDEED!:love::mad:
     
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  2. ARuscoe

    ARuscoe Well-Known Member

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    Nat moved sideways into their Boardgame department but haven't seen anything on that forum from her in a while (haven't looked in a couple of weeks though)
    Sam was always in the background, and only came forward when DTG decided to be more forward themselves with information and resolutions of issues (or at least talking about them)
    Since JD has taken up the community lead role Sam has gone back to another role in leadership, direction etc
    (Both according to whats been said on streams)
     
  3. Suryaaji#2369

    Suryaaji#2369 Well-Known Member

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    Hi! After receiving the latest update, i follow your instruction and guess what! I run an intermodal service in Cajon Pass and experiencing more stable performance and lot less micro stutter!
     
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  4. breblimator

    breblimator Guest

    This is my daily after-update rutine. Sometimes this is like a magic touch :)
     
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  5. joerg.lange

    joerg.lange Well-Known Member

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    But... doesn't that kill/default all my individual settings?
     
  6. breblimator

    breblimator Guest

    Yes, it will
     
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  7. joerg.lange

    joerg.lange Well-Known Member

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    Keyboard assignments too?
     
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  8. breblimator

    breblimator Guest

    I think all settings will go default
     
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  9. trainsimplayer

    trainsimplayer Well-Known Member

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    Nat moved the board game project thing (Catan? Can't remember the name) and Sam is now in a different role.
     
  10. They all work, quite well if your running decent hardware. Not so well if your talking about how they run on low end pc's or laptops. Windows server 2008 I had running on a server for months with no shutdowns or restarts. Windows 7 was one of the best operating systems ever made.

    I don't really see how you can compare a game made in 2018 to a operating system that was made a decade before that anyway but look at windows xp, still being used all over the world. It wasn't that long ago banks were still using it! How many times have you gone to a cash machine to find its crashed? Or how many times have you found the Internet not to be working at all?
     
  11. karlack26

    karlack26 Well-Known Member

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    I cant even run Peninsula Corridor in tsw2 with out it crashing.
    The long promised preservation crew updates came to TSW3 first for reasons.
    So some how fixes in development for one game for months got put on the back burner for the new shinny game.
    For technical boring reasons as i was told. I was told this 2 months ago and those fixes still have not come to TSW2, its been almsot a year since they announced them.
    I am not spending another 45 dollars to get the crap i already bought fixed.

    If iI knew the broken crap i bought in early July would become a second tier product only a month later I would not have spent my money on it.
    I unknowingly bought abandon ware.
    To top it off, Its been 6 months since Spirt of Steam came out and no fixes or updates for it either for TSW2. Look like non of those promised features are coming to TSW2 now, the dlc still has those broken ass freight carts that you have to manually release the breaks on.

    People love defending this company.

    They will continue to shovel out half finished crap until people stop paying them money.
    They will continue release and selling the same game with a new date tacked on to the end of the title until people stop paying them money for the same game over and over and over again.

    I wont be buying any TSW product again that's for sure.
     
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  12. grumypop51

    grumypop51 Well-Known Member

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    I'm pretty damn certain we aren't the only ones!
     
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  13. grumypop51

    grumypop51 Well-Known Member

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    'to upgrade to TSW3' Won't happen here old mate. On sale or otherwise. Why should we have to upgrade to a new model to play the routes we already paid for, when the old one was broken by the same firm who built the new one? Madness!
    And look at the announcements page.....patch notes galore for TSW3!
     
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  14. meridian#2659

    meridian#2659 Well-Known Member

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    Same for me, didnt have any derailments at all.
     
  15. grumypop51

    grumypop51 Well-Known Member

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    Version 2, or 3?
     
  16. OldVern

    OldVern Well-Known Member

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    In my case V3. V2 is pretty much dead stick right now and with the new pricing policy you can effectively get V3 free with a DLC purchase.
     
  17. ARuscoe

    ARuscoe Well-Known Member

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    I've worked in IT since the 90s. Seen many windows of all versions with all sorts of issues including things like not being able to rename or set certain network protocols once you have exchange installed or windows explorer simply locking the top bar when you run adobe and having to kill a certain process to allow users to use the menu bar (I know they can always half screen it, but even now it seems many people don't know about windows key left (or right))
    And don't get me started on Microsoft's default virtual memory settings up until the more recent versions of windows... Who runs with 2Gb of memory nowadays?

    Yes XP was stable, as is windows 10 for the most part. The rest - questionable
     
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  18. arek#2842

    arek#2842 Well-Known Member

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    Well, derailment issue is on the November roadmap and marked as
    So, not for all routes, but for some?
    Anyway - if it's on the roadmap I believe the fix will be provided, same for remaining Pres Crew updates, but I don't have high hopes for it. It may be just not delivered and removed from the roadmap with some more or less reliable reasons.

    This is true if you fancy any of the new routes, if not - then you have to pay for it the amount of regular DLC.

    I don't understand DTG logic here.
    Why do they decide to invest more time in providing those Pres Crew updates and (some) fixes for both version of the game?
    Why not provide to the current TSW2 owners free upgrade to TSW3 (core only, with Training Center only) and invest time in fixing only one instance of the game?
     
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  19. ARuscoe

    ARuscoe Well-Known Member

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    Because they announced the fixes before announcing TSW3, so "morally" they're obliged to release the fixes they said they would for TSW2 otherwise they needn't bother
    Because at some point they want all TSW2 players to move to TSW3 and this would remove that revenue stream
     
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  20. Pipe

    Pipe Well-Known Member

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    That seems to be reasonable. But only if we forget that PS4 (and even PS5) seem to have serious performance issues in TSW3. The forum is full of reporting.
    I know my PS4 Slim can´t handle it, it already struggles with TSW2 BML. Which is fair enough, it IS outdated hardware after all.
    I´d consider purchasing a PS5, but -> see above, and than we still have no solution for the DLC limit issue.

    So, no I don´t want TSW3 (which inherited lots of bugs from TSW2), not even as a gift.

    The BIG X of this question is a fact that most posters here simply neglect: TSW2 and its DLCs worked reasonably well on PS4 until some amateurish "patches" screwed up things big time (starting from 1.86 for PS4 on). One step forward, three steps backwards. And that is NOT acceptable, not at all.

    All we ask DTG is to fix what their "patches" have screwed up. Simple, really.
     
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  21. arek#2842

    arek#2842 Well-Known Member

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    Yep, but giving TSW2 players availability for free upgrade to TSW3, they would still be able to keep that promise and at the same time would be working only for those fixes/updates for one version of the game. But, there is also business justification why they didn't do that, which you are mentioning:

    That's a fair point and I took it under consideration before posting. Although let's look at the Starter Packs with one route against the single route DLC prices.
    At the TSW3 release the price different between Starter Pack and sole new route DLC was 5GBP (I think, if more please correct me here). Now, as OldVern mentioned - Starter Pack and standalone BCC DLC prices are the same.

    So I wonder if, by the past two months, those 5GBP difference generated enough revenue to justified working on fixed and Pres Crew updates for two instances of TSW?
     
  22. ARuscoe

    ARuscoe Well-Known Member

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    No, they promised to make fixes for TSW2, TSW3 is a separate issue that other people keep trying to bring in for their own reasons
    I doubt that decision had been made when they made the promise to release fixes for TSW2 DLC
    There is also the possibility that you've got this back to front.
    The DLC being fixed were created in TSW 2 so maybe they're easier to fix in that version, and then porting to TSW3 becomes easier because they have already made a transform matrix for such things. Don't forget they transferred every route, loco, MU etc from every TSW2 route to TSW3 and unless they did a heck of a lot of dev work they likely made some automation
    SO actually it may cost MORE to work fixes in TSW3 on preserved routes, mainly because they were, by definition, old tech with old ways of working, as has been acknowledged by Matt several times (such as getting a HST to work in livery designer)

    My money in this instance would be that for some techie reason it's just easier to work this way round
    But I could always just be wrong and DTG are working back to front. It has been known
     
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  23. grumypop51

    grumypop51 Well-Known Member

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    Hear! Hear!
     
  24. grumypop51

    grumypop51 Well-Known Member

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    Hi again OldVern, just tried (again!), the 146 from Koln to Aachen. Spontaneous derailment between Ehrenfield and Horrem, sudden lurch and bang! So, taking your comment on board, and thinking maybe I am a bit of a loose cannon, took the same setup from Munchen to Augsburg with not one problem. So, to answer your question, yes, I think I'm driving correctly. There seems to be a derailment issue with this loco on this route.
     
  25. Princess Entrapta

    Princess Entrapta Well-Known Member

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    I've not felt safe with less than 32 since I upgraded to Win7 over a decade ago...
     
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  26. The_Drunken_Engineer

    The_Drunken_Engineer Well-Known Member

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    What exactly do you expect? A car you bought in 2021 to still work and not be obsolete in 2022? If you didn't guess that SOS would be rushed out riddled with bugs and broken features and took DTG at their word that they'd be using the summer to focus on fixing bugs in DLCs, that's YOUR fault. You're owed nothing for the cash you handed over, let alone a working product. In fact, you should be grateful it works at all, now stop complaining and buy the new product that'll still be buggy when TSW4 rolls out.

    /sarcasm off

    I hear ya, bro. I bought SOS first day and never thought it would be like this so long after release, figured that dlc, of any, would receive love and be worked out in a reasonable manner. Even despite the fireman system being broken, it still was great to play when it worked but I haven't bothered to play it in months. Why hasn't the updated schedule for bakerloo for TSW2 come out yet? I read it was finished for TSW2 first yet it's nowhere to be seen. But hey, I'm just a TSW2 pleb... like, so yesterday.
     
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  27. bakedpotatos.jm

    bakedpotatos.jm Well-Known Member

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    When did they promise TSW2 would be fully fixed with no bugs. I must have missed a memo, but I only remember them saying the preserved collection updates and the DLC manager were promised and everything else was to be decided.

    So I wouldn't expect too much support going forward.

    And I don't remember seeing TSW2 beside any derailment fixes.

    So you must hearing things.
     
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  28. tsw2

    tsw2 Well-Known Member

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    They claimed there would be a "extended period of time fixing bugs after SOS release"
    Back then nobody knew about TSW 3.
    Then suddenly TSW3 was announced
     
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  29. ARuscoe

    ARuscoe Well-Known Member

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    They didn't. They said they would do bugfixes and pres crew updates as they are doing

    This is what they HAVE been doing. There's been nothing new for TSW2 for ages, only bugfixes and updates...
    They didn't say they wouldn't be making an entire new game with a load more bugs, all of which would require fixing, or that we would need to pay again for the same game (sorta) or that DLC cost would rise...
     
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  30. ARuscoe

    ARuscoe Well-Known Member

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    If you're able to replicate the issue at the same location, or time of day or whatever, get a vid of it happening and submit a ticket.
    There may be multiple causes with the same outcome, and yours may be different to others they've worked on
     
  31. arek#2842

    arek#2842 Well-Known Member

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    If it would be developed this way then I think the remaining Pres Crew updates would be provided simoultaneously for TSW2 and TSW3.

    Anyway, here's what Matt says about the fixes for TSW2. So, in example, if derailment issue will be fixes for TSW2 routes in TSW3 - fix should also arrive to TSW2 at some moment.
    Quoted from thread: https://forums.dovetailgames.com/th...ates-for-tsw-3-before-tsw2.58284/#post-533413
     
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  32. ARuscoe

    ARuscoe Well-Known Member

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    To quote Matt "It will be delayed for boring technical reasons"
    Those reasons are likely to be along the lines of "Things SHOULD work the same in TSW2 and TSW3 but they don't so when we port it from one to the other something else will break and we have to fix that before we can get it out to the wilds..."
     
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  33. grumypop51

    grumypop51 Well-Known Member

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    And there's the rub. It happens randomly.
     
  34. grumypop51

    grumypop51 Well-Known Member

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    "Boring technical reasons," being the poor suffering owners of the bugged routes? If they bore us enough, we may go away? :D
     
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  35. tsw2

    tsw2 Well-Known Member

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    DTG has clearly shifted all available recources towards TSW3. TSW2 updates might or might not happen....
     
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  36. redrev1917

    redrev1917 Well-Known Member

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    In my opinion they need to get the derailments fixed in TSW2 as promised and then draw a line under the title.

    Its a waste of resources trying to maintain, improve and patch 2 different games.
     
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  37. tof70110

    tof70110 Member

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    Bjr Redrev1917,
    It's completely understandable, you have a rant about a game that has a forum so you take the opportunity to see what the community thinks about it and possibly these opinions concerning the facts they put forward, after he gets carried away a little too much under the fact of nervousness from which the incendiary trtre "I want that one reimburses me" but who has never had this thought after x crashes and after having spent x €, of course that engages only him, but that can easily be understood, (it is not me who will play the moralists) and he is free to express himself as long as he does not offend anyone!!! I take it personally like that, I could be wrong!!!
    Sincerely, tof
     
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  38. mgbgt

    mgbgt Well-Known Member

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    Surely it makes sense to prioritise the new thing over something which is quite frankly well outta date now and probably by now tsw3 probably has a larger player base than tsw2!
     
  39. Blacknred81

    Blacknred81 Well-Known Member

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    I'm reminded of the TGV Reseau debacle on TSC way back in the day. A broken DLC released by DTG. And they never fixed it and eventually just pulled off of the steam.

    Wonder if DTG will just abandon the fixes to TSW2 and pull it from existence in the near future as well....
     
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  40. rennekton#1349

    rennekton#1349 Well-Known Member

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    It's been promised on the roadmap that tsw2 would get the preserved updates and manual firing. Those at least should come
     
  41. grumypop51

    grumypop51 Well-Known Member

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    I'd be happy if that happened!
     
  42. bakedpotatos.jm

    bakedpotatos.jm Well-Known Member

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    Sounds like what happened to TSW 2020.
     
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  43. OldVern

    OldVern Well-Known Member

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    I fully agree that DTG should honour their commitment to fix derailments etc. In TSW2. After all, no one else broke the game other than their own coder(s).

    However I can't help but get the feeling their whole organisation is in a bit of chaos at present. We get the flagship new UK route which has already had loads of errors pointed out before it's even released. As noted above, the follow up to Spirit Of Steam has been woeful, another flagship route released with great gusto and now left to rot, certainly there seems no sense of urgency to fix the many issues - in TSW2 or 3.

    It seems TSW is very much descending into a DLC cash cow factory, along with a significant price increase.
     
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  44. Pipe

    Pipe Well-Known Member

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    I share that feeling. As I´ve stated in another thread: The current state of SW delivery from DTG is pitiful. And that leads to the impression that the bean counters have kicked out the train enthusiasts from the decision making level. Squeeze the lemon until its dry.
    Aaaahhh, but that´s gonna shoot back into your face! I´ve been working time enough in medium to big high-tech companies to have seen this movie several times around. The classic showcases that we teach the future manager generation contemplate names like "Nokia" and "Kodak". ´Nuff said.

    In order to continue supporting DTG I´m considering to migrate to the Fishing Simulator. At least there you can feed the bugs to the fishes. Or not?
    (/ yeah, that was acid sarcasm)
     
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  45. OldVern

    OldVern Well-Known Member

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    Hee, hee.
    And following on from discussions in this thread and others, I genuinely wonder how much of the work - including route building - is actually now being done in house by people with a bit of enthusiasm for the job and how much is being outsourced to Romania, Phillipines or wherever and done by people with no real love of the subject or knowledge for that matter. Hence the off scale roof at Crewe in SOS, the missing footbridge supports at New Street (since resolved but only because pointed out) and the low hanging PIS screens at the Cross City stations. Smacks of someone working from a Google Earth aerial view and a few photographs as a guide.

    I probably will pick up a couple of items in the Thanksgiving or Christmas sales, but not as much as I might have spent. Following release of their V5 Update, I just got back into Run 8. Only thing stopping me spending a bit more money on that is the lousy exchange rate (I do wish 3DTS would put it on Steam, though I understand why not).
     
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  46. ARuscoe

    ARuscoe Well-Known Member

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    This makes it sound like you believe that the train enthusiasts ever had decision making control...
    Matt would be the highest up train enthusiast in the company (TSW wise at least) and even though he's Exec Producer people still say he has no control over such things
     
  47. arek#2842

    arek#2842 Well-Known Member

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    Guys, I just quoted you Matt's, the DTG's Executive Producer answer that all fixes provided for TSW2 routes in TSW3 game's version will be also provided for TSW2 game's version.

    Did he stated the same for TSW2020?
    Is there any reason why we should not believe his words?

    I'm not being sarcastic here, I'm asking seriously. If he or any DTG's executive stated the same for TSW2020 and then it ended up to be empty promises, let me know, I'll not be awaiting for those fixes endlessly then. Personally, I have no reson to not believe him.
     
  48. redrev1917

    redrev1917 Well-Known Member

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    Just because Matt says something, doesnt mean I have to agree with it, what happens when a preserved route breaks but for whatever reason a fix in TSW2 isnt possible. If Matt is going to stick to his word then that will need to remain broken in TSW3 as well.

    Surely no one actually wants or expects that to happen.
     
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  49. arek#2842

    arek#2842 Well-Known Member

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    Fixed for TSW2 will probably be provided if possible so I think in such case it will be fixed for TSW3 only and will be left broken for TSW2.
     
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  50. grumypop51

    grumypop51 Well-Known Member

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    And there's the damn problem!
     
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