PC Birmingham Cross City Bug Posting Thread

Discussion in 'TSW General Discussion' started by londonmidland, Nov 17, 2022.

  1. londonmidland

    londonmidland Well-Known Member

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    Come on guys, please fix this ridiculously over bright cab. It's so immersion breaking and distracting.

    TSW3_Josh_1669481254_00.jpg
    TSW3_Josh_1669482583_00.jpg
     
    Last edited: Nov 26, 2022
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  2. theorganist

    theorganist Well-Known Member

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    Do you get any enjoyment out of TSW?
     
  3. JetWash

    JetWash Well-Known Member

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    Both of them, but that second one though. Good Lord :-(
     
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  4. tsw2

    tsw2 Well-Known Member

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    DTG Matt please look at these screenshots. :( :(
    Eye Adaption and brightness needs to be fixed. We have gone from way too dark (TSW2) to way to bright (TSW3, see can for example).
    Eye Adaption seems broken in many situations.

    Yeah...and remember, its almost 2023...and TSW3 was supposed to fix the lighting issues.
    Also, what the hell is going on with the reflection of the sky in the second screenshot??
     
    Last edited: Nov 26, 2022
  5. Sharon E

    Sharon E Well-Known Member

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    bandicam 2022-11-26 15-16-30-742.jpg bandicam 2022-11-26 15-29-20-086.jpg I look at the above screen shots and wonder. Here are 2 just taken inside the cab on my pc. I have never noted the brightness shown in those shots from London Midland.
     
    Last edited: Nov 26, 2022
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  6. JetWash

    JetWash Well-Known Member

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    The cab in both images you’ve posted is far too light and bright. Not as bright as the shot LM has posted, granted, but still a million miles from how it should be.
     
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  7. rennekton#1349

    rennekton#1349 Well-Known Member

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    i think 1 of the reasons why his shots may be overexposed could be an out of tunnel shot or going into a tunnel. The only time I get that sky reflection on the windshield is in the tunnels so it might become overexposed cuz of the eye adaptation
     
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  8. arek#2842

    arek#2842 Well-Known Member

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    How could you have a sky reflecting on the windshield while being inside the tunnel?
    It's a bug?
     
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  9. It's mainly when it's cloudy, no sun.
     
  10. rennekton#1349

    rennekton#1349 Well-Known Member

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    Seems like it. I also saw it during a livestream by an ambassador. It's like a weird effect that occurs near tunnels I believe.
     
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  11. Do you mean the reflection thats a rectangular panel at the top of the windscreen?
     
  12. Rhazv

    Rhazv Member

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    I've noticed a sound inconsistency with the class 323, specifically with that knock sound you hear when you accelerate past 5 mph or so. Sometimes it just works every time I set off, sometimes it never plays. Very rarely I've had that it plays maybe the first and second time I set off and then it stops working. I've done a bit of testing and it seems that it is related to the cab from which I'm driving. When I'm driving from the cab closest to the pantograph (if that makes sense) it seems to just work every time. When I'm driving from the cab furthest away from the pantograph, it usually doesn't work at all. I've tested it maybe a dozen or so times, so definitely not an exhaustive test, but there does seem to be a pattern.

    The similar knocking sound when you slow down below approximately 3 mph on the other hand works every time. I know it is a small glitch in the grand scheme of things, but I can't unnotice it and it just annoys me every time it's not working. Has anyone else noticed this?

    Also, I'm a bit disappointed with service 2N20 Four Oaks - Longbridge. I thought it would be quite interesting to take the service into that little siding after terminating at Longbridge, but the game won't let me. Instead, the AI takes over and drives the service into the siding. After that I can immediately take the service over again and take it back out of the siding into Longbridge platform 1. Just a bit weird that you cannot drive that little section of the service, it would have made for a little bit of variety. I don't know if the other services terminating at Longbridge behave the same way.
     
  13. rennekton#1349

    rennekton#1349 Well-Known Member

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    In terms of that service, it is just not a playable area for the player. That is the likely explanation. I haven't run any of those services so I wouldn't know. So with each dlc, there will be sidings and depots modeled and stuff where you won't be able to access. Or not modeled at all like soho depot.
     
  14. rennekton#1349

    rennekton#1349 Well-Known Member

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    Yea. If you look in the london midland screenshots, you'll see a weird effect on the top of the windshield. In the stream I watched, it was dark and you could clearly see the reflection of the sky. It's very jarring when you get a bright greyish when the scene is dark
     
  15. Yeah I've noticed it. It's like it's a mirror or something, coming out of tunnels or under bridges it's clearly visible.
     
  16. londonmidland

    londonmidland Well-Known Member

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    That’s because your weather settings are, what looks like, clear sky during sunrise or sunset.

    Try 50% cloud cover during June midday and it’ll be a very different story.
     
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  17. tsw2

    tsw2 Well-Known Member

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    DTG needs to fix this
     
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  18. alexjjones6024

    alexjjones6024 Well-Known Member

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    I've been into Longbridge sidings with the 323 after a service, you can drive there I promise you. As you can see from my photo, there is the walkway, which is bugged as I fell straight through.
     

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  19. OldVern

    OldVern Well-Known Member

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    Oh you mean like everything else on every route going back to Rapid Transit :) !
     
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  20. Sharon E

    Sharon E Well-Known Member

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    LM, if you had looked at the time stamp, the second shot is just after noon. Yes, the sky's were clear and the date was the date I ran this schedule, since I tend to drive on today's date and not change it, I will now go back in and run a late June time around mid-day. The top image was run with 26 November as the date and the bottom one with 27 June as the date. There is some increased brightness in the summer shot, which since I would never have run it until next summer, I would not see this change. In the interest of fairness, I went back and shot a 27 November with 50% clouds, which is the last image.
    bandicam 2022-11-26 15-29-20-086.jpg bandicam 2022-11-27 12-27-25-291.jpg bandicam 2022-11-27 13-11-44-862.jpg
     
    Last edited: Nov 27, 2022
  21. Crosstie

    Crosstie Well-Known Member

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    Have to say, all Sharon E's shots look OK and perfectly acceptable to my eyes. I just don't see the issue here. Probably down to settings or mods.
     
    Last edited: Nov 28, 2022
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  22. londonmidland

    londonmidland Well-Known Member

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    Crosstie All my TSW 3 settings are stock and I also have no mods which affect the daylight lighting.

    You’ll notice in TrainSimTV’s video, the exact same thing happens in the exact same location as where it happened to me.

    Watch from 32:00 and note how much brighter the cab is compared to the outside world. Considering the the weather is mostly cloudy, it should be nowhere near this bright. So it seems very weather and/or time of day dependant as to when and where it happens.

    This is a screenshot from his video:
    837217F6-0DE7-4379-A337-4774FBAA4EFC.jpeg
     
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  23. JetWash

    JetWash Well-Known Member

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    Whilst the shots that Sharon E has posted are not as overblown and washed out as others (which, as has already been explained, is down to the amount of cloud) the cab is still much too light and lacking in any variance in light or shadow. Take his first image as an example. It’s Autumn and the sun is therefore low in the sky. Outside the train are shadows cast by the trees but the cab, however, is a flat, lifeless image. In the real world that cab would be much darker with much more in the way of shadows cast across it.

    The problem with these cabs is compounded when you enter a tunnel, where DTG have clearly got the eye adaption set up all wrong. As you enter a tunnel the cab initially gets brighter, like the player is downwind of a nuclear blast, before going dark at a painstakingly slow and unrealistic rate. The reality of the human eye going from light to dark is that it goes pitch dark immediately before your eyes start to adjust to the lack of light. On a positive note I would say they have the tunnel exits much closer to how your eye would cope. Finally, I’d love an explanation as to how there are reflections of the sky on the inside of the cab window. Not only is that impossible (being blocked by the cab super-structure) but the damn train is in a tunnel!

    The cabs in TSW (and particularly TSW3 and the 323) look like a static image stuck on the screen that is not affected by outside conditions except in a scripted and unnatural way. Both the exterior and interior of the trains seem to be lit entirely independently of their surroundings, and have this weird, unnatural glow like they are somehow emitting light themselves. If you feel otherwise, then might I suggest you go and play other games of this type which have their lighting nailed down - MSFS is a perfect example. I will concede that MSFS has an issue with the external lighting of aircraft in thick cloud, but then I have faith Asobo will fix this eventually, I just wish I could say the same about DTG. If you don’t own that particular title, then next time you’re driving a car and it’s overcast look at how the light in and outside match up. The interior of the car will certainly not be flat and lifeless whilst lighter than it is outside.

    Finally, this isn’t a ‘nice to have’. Lighting is fundamental to any simulation game and TSW remains the only ‘game’ I’ve played in the last 20 (or more) years where the lighting has been anything other than spectacular. There are clearly a number of players of this game whose attitude is ‘I don’t care about bugs and / or issues, I’m just happy to drive trains’. Good for you. Many more of us expect better though, particularly from a game that has been out over 5 years and is built inside one of the biggest game engines there is. DTG need to do better.
     
    Last edited: Nov 28, 2022
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  24. tsw2

    tsw2 Well-Known Member

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    So when are we going to hear something officially from DTG about the eye adaption cab issue?
     
  25. deeuu#6908

    deeuu#6908 Well-Known Member

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    Even games with some of the best lighting available have issues, GT7 on the PS5's dashboards can look amazing, but can also look flat and lack depth at time due to the way rendering low light situations in cabins isn't great, MSFS is also very good, however.....
    I am going to disagree with some of what you say here, I actually think BCC and the 323 has very good lighting, the dash has dynamic reflections from the environment and the gauges / buttons, it also reacts well to the light, especially at sunrise and sunset, I did a timetable this morning where the weather changed from dry and dawn to snowy and the sunrising just off to the left of the cab, and the result was really very good, infact I wish I'd have recorded it at the time, and I might have to go back and run it again to capture it.
    I will agree that the windscreen environmental map is way too low resolution, and when the sun is slightly behind you, it can look horrible.

    Just to pick up on this, having high expectations is fine, however, there has got to come a point where you either except that your expectations aren't going to be met, for whatever reason, or you readjust your expectations with what the development team can do within the fiscal and time constraints, and you just need to move on, you can't sweep water uphill.
     
    Last edited: Nov 28, 2022
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  26. theorganist

    theorganist Well-Known Member

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    I don't think that is quite fair, there maybe some who really aren't bothered about bugs at all, but I think for many of us the bugs vary from being mildly irritating to in some cases immersion breaking to the point where you don't want to use a particular add-on, for me SOS is one.

    Yes Cross City has bugs but for me so far it is the most immersive of the routes so far released and I am clearly not the only one who thinks that. The 323 is well modelled, has some nice features and sounds good, all round. The route is nicely detailed and apart from a small section of missing scenery looks very good and the TSW3 lighting, in the main makes the route more immersive. It feels quite busy with frequent services and there is quite a variety of services on the route.

    Yes the cab looks washed out, does it bother me, a little, do I want it fixed, of course! Am I going to throw my toys out of the pram and vow never to allow another item of DLC from DTG to darken my desktop, of course not!

    Reading this thread and not any of the others, could give the impression to some that the route is awful. I am sure there are a few who are striving to believe that.
     
    Last edited: Nov 28, 2022
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  27. londonmidland

    londonmidland Well-Known Member

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    Hey DTG JD do you have a list of confirmed fixes which will be included with the next patch for this route?
     
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  28. tsw2

    tsw2 Well-Known Member

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    Eye Adaption needs to be fixed for all routes
     
  29. londonmidland

    londonmidland Well-Known Member

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    For those that have recently downloaded my Birmingham Cross City Enhancement mod, the good news is that you DO NOT have to remove the scenery fix we did.

    Today, DTG released an update for the route, to ‘fix’ the scenery.

    Here is a comparison between DTG’s attempt (top) vs our attempt (bottom). I’ll let you decide which one looks better…

    For those that are wondering where you can get the mod from, you can download it from here

    F66BB1C6-CAED-4C05-887A-3A2D72DC7F15.jpeg
     
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  30. fakenham

    fakenham Well-Known Member

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    Blimey, it seems they forgot to upload the update.
     
    Last edited: Nov 28, 2022
  31. breblimator

    breblimator Guest

    Foliage is better~more diverse in TS than in TSW / in Your mod than in a fix, etc. TSW needs new 'assets.pak', I think. BR o7

    PS... I recently compared the quality of the scenery for Clinchfield in TS and TSW and unfortunately, TS is much better / more natural. For me, it's a matter of vegetation (density, variety, realism).
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Nov 28, 2022
  32. tallboy7648

    tallboy7648 Well-Known Member

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    How does a multi million pound company get outclassed by modders?
     
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  33. JetWash

    JetWash Well-Known Member

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    Because one of those groups of people cares, the other on the other hand….
     
    Last edited: Nov 28, 2022
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  34. rennekton#1349

    rennekton#1349 Well-Known Member

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    Modders have all the time in the world. Dtg have other things to do. But dtg should have done better
     
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  35. tallboy7648

    tallboy7648 Well-Known Member

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    How long was this route in development? You would think if this is $40, they would've done better from the beginning
     
  36. rennekton#1349

    rennekton#1349 Well-Known Member

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    Probably another rushed project. There's also reigate on London commuter that is modeled wrong completely. But corners were definitely cut. Could be lack of time, etc.
     
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  37. Jalio

    Jalio Active Member

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    What's that saying? A picture is worth a thousand words...

    DTG KNOW this is a quick run and gun attempt. Shame because the rest of the route is very good. Thanks to the modders we can actually still enjoy the routes!
     
  38. bescot

    bescot Well-Known Member

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    It took me a few hours to populate the lineside with trees, foliage and the bridge parapet for the mod. Most of that time was fighting with the editor, cooking, packing, checking. I'm sure with DTGs professional team and the proper editor, a much better job could have been done than my effort, even in a couple of hours. Astounding really

    A short list of other remaining bugs I noticed just - after today's BCC patch

    1. On train PIS a) AI external doesn't show a destination b) Internal PIS is completely confused as to the current location.
    2. Lack of Cab AO
    3. TPWS OSS set to wrong speed at Lich City approaching the 20mph restriction, Trigger should be over 20, not 20.
    4. AI leaving brakes released, even when the door interlock is active - causes roll aways if you take over, or hand over from an AI driver
    5. Canal bridge at Uni is blocked (fixed in the BCC mod).
    6. Streetlight timing limited to 1900-0700 all year round.
    Not to mention an almost complete lack of lineside fencing - especially running adjacent to the canal.
     
    Last edited: Nov 28, 2022
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  39. tsw2

    tsw2 Well-Known Member

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    Lol. Modders do this in their limited free time, beseides family, friends, sport, other hobbies, and they work a 9 to 5 job still.
    There is no excuse why the DTG version looks so bad. If modders would be in charge this game would probably be 100 times better !!
     
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  40. breblimator

    breblimator Guest

    GJ \o/
     
  41. bence950906

    bence950906 Well-Known Member

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    I hope this was just a "quick" fix. We can't do more than that, everyone has written down the bugs they found, but only about 50% of them have been fixed. It was quite some time ago that a new Q&A lead was hired who may not have lived up to expectations.
     
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  42. tsw2

    tsw2 Well-Known Member

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    QA has not changed at all in my opinion, wonder what they did to try to improve...
     
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  43. Bravo2six

    Bravo2six Well-Known Member

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    Most of these existed before the patch, at least the ones I left behind anyway.
     
  44. londonmidland

    londonmidland Well-Known Member

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    So what happened to the pantograph sparks which were supposed to be added shortly after release? Anything which is said to be fixed post release is always a big red flag for me.
     
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  45. londonmidland

    londonmidland Well-Known Member

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    By the way, what an earth is going on at the Alvechurch Marina? In real life its level.

    [​IMG]
    upload_2022-11-29_23-41-26.png
     
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  46. Factor41

    Factor41 Well-Known Member

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    I'm not sure the person who modelled that has really grasped how locks work! :D
     
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  47. tsw2

    tsw2 Well-Known Member

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    Nobody from DTG seems to be willing to respond and if there will be a response it will probably be "it's on the list" and " we are optimizing our QA".. :(
     
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  48. Another issue I noticed last night is snow textures missing from the tracks at the rhtt depot.
     
  49. Pipe

    Pipe Well-Known Member

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    You forgot " ... totally understand your frustration."
     
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  50. Thanks it looks 100 times better.
     

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