Rivets’ New Scottish Route

Discussion in 'TSW General Discussion' started by londonmidland, Dec 22, 2022.

  1. KMAN

    KMAN Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 7, 2018
    Messages:
    431
    Likes Received:
    576
    Latest Route Video:-
     
    • Like Like x 1
  2. SHINO BAZ

    SHINO BAZ Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 10, 2019
    Messages:
    2,584
    Likes Received:
    1,917
    So this is how you make a one train route you build up everything in site which looks good but a 2nd new train would have ment more and helped make the price increase mean something,Players come for trains not more hallways to roam.But the AI tram might still save this route we'll have to wait and see.(assuming it's found the whole dlc is not to prebroken).
     
    • Like Like x 5
  3. Dinosbacsi

    Dinosbacsi Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 20, 2017
    Messages:
    3,312
    Likes Received:
    8,665
    Looking at the video, the modelling itself and the details are nice, but once again, horrible (basically nonexistent) shading and weathering. Overly bright and very noticeably repeating textures everywhere, and it doesn't seem like they used light baking at all.

    Looks very bad, it you ask me.
     
    • Like Like x 3
  4. eldomtom2

    eldomtom2 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 31, 2022
    Messages:
    1,623
    Likes Received:
    1,829
    No worse than DTG's work.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  5. Bravo2six

    Bravo2six Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 9, 2021
    Messages:
    1,208
    Likes Received:
    1,816
    I would disagree and say it looks pretty good.
     
    • Like Like x 2
  6. SHINO BAZ

    SHINO BAZ Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 10, 2019
    Messages:
    2,584
    Likes Received:
    1,917
    The training center got a building to explore which is fine but is this the new norm single train routes with big huge stations with miles of hallways to wander around after the single new train become boring.A nice station all well and good but i'm having a hard time forking over 40.00 for a one train route over and over.(yeah otr helps but those are old trains not new) I know I know one doesn't have to buy it but do they want to make more money or not.
     
    Last edited: Jan 22, 2023
    • Like Like x 5
  7. Dinosbacsi

    Dinosbacsi Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 20, 2017
    Messages:
    3,312
    Likes Received:
    8,665
    It depends. DTG's work is also often low quality, but at least they use light baking sometimes - though still not as often as they should.

    A great example for light baking is this small waiting room on Great Western Express at Reading station.
    [​IMG]

    The platform area also gets some light baking, though it's not perfect. The shadows under the canopy look good, though the roof itself seems to be too light. But you can see what I mean on the platform floor, under the benches and around the stairs.
    [​IMG]

    Sadly, many stations, assets and even rolling stock interior miss light baking. This station from the video doesn't seem to be an exception either. Which is a shame, because I bet it would make it look much better. The way it is now, it's just ugly.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  8. PAFC47760

    PAFC47760 Member

    Joined:
    Oct 13, 2021
    Messages:
    60
    Likes Received:
    47
    Nice but you still haven't fixed the 150
     
  9. Jpantera

    Jpantera Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 6, 2019
    Messages:
    751
    Likes Received:
    1,781






    Maybe they cant we have been told to forget about the 204 so perhaps its dead also.



    The one thing that gets me about TSW is that everything is hard to fix to the point were we just don't see any improvements after paying full RRP for content.



    If we do it's months or years after release. Looking forward to more TSG content as they have standards which don't seem to get lowered.



    This Scotrail Lift simulator route is definitely not getting a day one purchase despite a pre order discount and I have funds in my steam wallet from another refunded DLC. If more layers get added in the future and it launches without issue then maybe get a look.
     
    • Like Like x 3
  10. TimTri

    TimTri Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 31, 2021
    Messages:
    1,241
    Likes Received:
    2,641
    I may not fully agree with you, but I can admit that ScotRail Lift Simulator is incredibly funny ;)
     
    • Like Like x 1
  11. Bravo2six

    Bravo2six Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 9, 2021
    Messages:
    1,208
    Likes Received:
    1,816
    What do you mean by this? what's the 204?
     
  12. Jpantera

    Jpantera Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 6, 2019
    Messages:
    751
    Likes Received:
    1,781


    German BR204 physics are very bad, needs a total rebuild apparently to fix. Was refunded early on by me and a few others I suspect. I really do want Rivet to hit this one out of the park but I have already said my piece on it before.
     
  13. PAFC47760

    PAFC47760 Member

    Joined:
    Oct 13, 2021
    Messages:
    60
    Likes Received:
    47
    Maybe those of us with West Cornwall should get an extra discount on the new buggy mess of a lift sim they are releasing if they won't fix the 150
     
  14. KMAN

    KMAN Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 7, 2018
    Messages:
    431
    Likes Received:
    576
    Enhancing the Environment | ScotRail eXpress: Glasgow - Edinburgh | Train Sim World 3
     
    • Like Like x 1
  15. Sharon E

    Sharon E Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 9, 2016
    Messages:
    1,367
    Likes Received:
    1,498
    Things keep getting better as they show off what they have done in designing this route. Thursday just can't come soon enough.
     
  16. glenn.doig

    glenn.doig Member

    Joined:
    May 23, 2019
    Messages:
    21
    Likes Received:
    41
    AI timings and the motors sound when no power is being applied. Two things that needn't exist but do, Nevermind!
     
  17. Cygnific

    Cygnific Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 26, 2018
    Messages:
    238
    Likes Received:
    324
    The overall lighting seems pretty poor and the trackballast is the same texture for 77km.. Such a shame. :|
     
    • Like Like x 4
  18. StrikeEagle78

    StrikeEagle78 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 29, 2019
    Messages:
    1,132
    Likes Received:
    3,484
    The route and train look decent enough with typical Rivet detailed pieces. But seeing now a 3rd party developer using TSW3 it looks like they couldn't get the route running smoothly as seen on stream (although I will say it looked smooth in the majority of places). Micro pauses and scenery stutters on what is most likely a powerhouse PC. I doubt it would run as well on a series x. Sad that Rivet is shouldered with bad tech as I have enjoyed their content in the past.
     
    • Like Like x 2
  19. Krazy

    Krazy Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 13, 2020
    Messages:
    654
    Likes Received:
    1,508
    upload_2023-1-24_11-57-35.png

    Screw the trains, we have MOTHS!
     
  20. Mr JMB

    Mr JMB Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 1, 2020
    Messages:
    1,323
    Likes Received:
    3,079
    There is something about the lighting that is off, the textures look very flat and quite TSC like around Waverley, especially the trees and the track. I do like the interiors to the stations, but unless you like walking around the routes rather than driving them they are a short-lived novelty.
     
    • Like Like x 5
  21. Craigyboy81

    Craigyboy81 Member

    Joined:
    Oct 26, 2017
    Messages:
    48
    Likes Received:
    51
    The ballast is the worst thing for me. Looks bad, especially from the cab
     
    • Like Like x 1
  22. Jamy

    Jamy Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 5, 2020
    Messages:
    429
    Likes Received:
    912
    you gotta love Jaspers honesty "Gimmicks"
     
  23. olly.smail

    olly.smail Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 28, 2022
    Messages:
    673
    Likes Received:
    1,078
    most noticeably at waverley i think, it’s red stone irl not brown/grey
     
    • Like Like x 1
  24. Bravo2six

    Bravo2six Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 9, 2021
    Messages:
    1,208
    Likes Received:
    1,816
    Funny thing is, I really don't think it was.

    At least, it didn't seem so.
    I still don't think it's as bad as all the naysayers are trying to make it out to be.

    Leaves me wondering if the community will ever be happy with some of these dlcs.
     
    • Like Like x 2
  25. Redbus

    Redbus Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 8, 2016
    Messages:
    1,011
    Likes Received:
    2,103
    I’m sure there’ll be a mod for the ballast soon enough from the talented folks in our community to make it look more « Scottish » (a touch of salmon pink?), as well as LM’s famous signal aspects.
     
  26. londonmidland

    londonmidland Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 8, 2017
    Messages:
    3,423
    Likes Received:
    18,133
    Yes, I plan on making an Enhancement Pack mod for this route. Hopefully with the help of a few other people too :)
     
    • Like Like x 4
  27. StrikeEagle78

    StrikeEagle78 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 29, 2019
    Messages:
    1,132
    Likes Received:
    3,484
    I just thought it was a powerhouse PC because the FPS looked decent for a lot of the route (but still suffers from the core game technical issues). I'm sure they weren't going to showcase this on an Xbox as the core game defects would make it look laughable.
     
  28. chieflongshin

    chieflongshin Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 4, 2019
    Messages:
    4,369
    Likes Received:
    7,214
    Lots of poster, branding, potentiallly some new logos on the vans unless networx rails up there too.
    I'd be curious to see whether that Murray field has any branding in reality. Looked like a lovely model.

    Can ballast be changed in sections independently to give a variety of shade?
     
  29. Dinosbacsi

    Dinosbacsi Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 20, 2017
    Messages:
    3,312
    Likes Received:
    8,665
    I love the fact that we have moths flying around the light, but not a light corona around the light to actually make it appear lit up. It looks like they fly around a turned off light...

    As for the ballast, I have to agree, it looks horrible. The lighting indeed looks a bit off, but maybe it's recorded from console? Those stream seem to have worse lighting.

    Overall not really impressed. It does have a nice feel to it and some really fun features, but I see many issues, sadly.
     
    • Like Like x 5
  30. londonmidland

    londonmidland Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 8, 2017
    Messages:
    3,423
    Likes Received:
    18,133
    Yes, there are all planned to be part of the Enhancement Pack. Ballast unfortunately can only be one colour for the whole route, but I think we can agree with a shade of Scottish pink would be a lot better than what is currently on offer.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  31. londonmidland

    londonmidland Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 8, 2017
    Messages:
    3,423
    Likes Received:
    18,133
    I plan on fixing the light issue in my upcoming mod. :)
     
    • Like Like x 1
  32. tallboy7648

    tallboy7648 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 9, 2020
    Messages:
    6,567
    Likes Received:
    10,793
    Some here have stated valid criticisms about the ballast and lighting for instance. Not everyone will wear rose tinted glasses and pretend like issues don't exist. If you think it's fine, then good for you. But understand that there are those that do have valid criticisms and there is nothing wrong with that
     
    • Like Like x 3
  33. Dinosbacsi

    Dinosbacsi Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 20, 2017
    Messages:
    3,312
    Likes Received:
    8,665
    I assume changing the brightness is relatively easy, but you can't add light flares to it, can you?
     
  34. londonmidland

    londonmidland Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 8, 2017
    Messages:
    3,423
    Likes Received:
    18,133
    I won't know until I actually get my hands on it but I'll obviously post the reports when I make the changes.
     
  35. Yerolo

    Yerolo Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 16, 2018
    Messages:
    1,180
    Likes Received:
    2,360
    Regarding the TMS announcements....it looks like the player has to manually activate the 'Next station' annoucements before arriving. Is this prototypical ? Not being a driver myself I have no clue.
     
  36. londonmidland

    londonmidland Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 8, 2017
    Messages:
    3,423
    Likes Received:
    18,133
    Nope. Irl, on all trains, announcements are automatically triggered. Be it by GPS or track side equipment. I don't think the driver touches announcements irl. Any announcements which are manually triggered would be by the guard.
     
  37. Yerolo

    Yerolo Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 16, 2018
    Messages:
    1,180
    Likes Received:
    2,360
    Ok that makes sense. I guess the tech isn't quite there yet to automate them before the stops (although its working automatically for the AI trains if I heard correctly? Or is that just for the generic announcements ?).
     
  38. rennekton#1349

    rennekton#1349 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 5, 2022
    Messages:
    6,223
    Likes Received:
    4,021
    It plays one of 23 possible announcements. From one of the teasers, some people pointed out that destination announcements were not part of it. It might have changed, but idk
     
  39. Crosstie

    Crosstie Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 8, 2016
    Messages:
    4,529
    Likes Received:
    10,148
    Good for you londonmidland, but there's something seriously wrong and embarrassing when it's necessary for you to correct developer shortcomings on release.

    Now, PC players will get an enhanced route compared to console users.

    This is not how it's supposed to work.
     
    Last edited: Jan 25, 2023
    • Like Like x 5
  40. PegasusLeosRailwayFanatix

    PegasusLeosRailwayFanatix Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 7, 2020
    Messages:
    1,473
    Likes Received:
    1,010
    Looking forward to all your improvement to this route :D:cool:;)
     
    • Like Like x 2
  41. PegasusLeosRailwayFanatix

    PegasusLeosRailwayFanatix Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 7, 2020
    Messages:
    1,473
    Likes Received:
    1,010
    So true its either the guards men/ women or the conductor that press the button to activate the announcement on the train
     
  42. cloudyskies21

    cloudyskies21 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 9, 2021
    Messages:
    1,248
    Likes Received:
    3,407
    Some of my thoughts of the preview which I had already mentioned in another thread:

    Have just watched the stream in full; I thought the 385 and the scenery overall looked nice, but regarding the long-term playbility of the route, I'm not sure - so my excitement levels aren't that great if I'm honest.

    Positives:

    - Let me just say that while I think there are a loft of improvements needed (especially timetable), I do congratulate the Rivet team on their longest route to date and is fantastic progression for them in TSW.
    - Having the SDO feature for trains doors implemented (and unique door closure times too) is great, now if we can get that for the Electrostars that would be awesome!
    - Having the interior of stations modelled is fantastic, and certainly gives each station their own character.
    - TMS is another great addition (perhaps the best in the route) and has set a benchmark for DTG to follow.
    - Cab cam was another interesting feature.
    - Was surprised how good the trams looked which is a bonus.

    Negatives:
    - I'm rather concerned with recent UK-based TSW 3 routes which seemed to be characterised by large, empty stations and rather lifeless routes overall. I love this route in real-life, but I think this route (like Cross City) for TSW has come way too early before any extra modern rolling stock is available. As such, I'd of rather seen a 2014-based route from Glasgow Central to anywhere which could have at least had frequent 314s from existing content, more freight opportunities etc. For future UK content, route choice needs to be made with existing rolling stock in mind, or simply avoid this continuing theme of one-loco routes :| and large, empty stations without appropriate trains.
    - The timetable looked okay (although still AI-generated times which is a shame), but with just the basic 385 services, could get quite boring very quickly with what looks like a lot of green signals overall - again, at least they could have giving us more RHTT services other than just one (why not rail tours too?). Additionally, with the departure from Waverley in timetable mode, I did not recall seeing hardly any other AI traffic - considering we've come from Rush Hour in TSW 2 with the likes of London Commuter to such in TSW 3 nowadays is a huge disappointment - also considering the amount of traffic seen in the Bremen route as a recent comparison. Again, while this comes down to route choice, I simply don't want empty routes! On this subject, why was the main concourse at Waverley completely empty of passengers?
    - I thought the '10 features in 10 minutes' seemed to overly focus on stuff which doesn't really add that much (or perhaps even necessary?) to a train sim such as elevators, moths, pianos...
    - A lack of consistency: a prime example being the GSM-R not being implemented at all functionality wise.
    - No coupling/uncoupling in timetable mode (only in scenario): seems a wasted opportunity to have none at all which is frustrating.
    - Not sure entirely, but I thought at times there were quite a few micropauses and really hope performance is better than the Bremen route on Series X.
     
    • Like Like x 5
  43. Crosstie

    Crosstie Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 8, 2016
    Messages:
    4,529
    Likes Received:
    10,148
    I just watched the stream, skipped around some because I wasn't seeing anything particularly riveting.
    The route and the train look well- modeled, but the scenery looked a lot like previous routes for long stretches.

    I didn't see much AI traffic.
    I didn't see any busy stations, even the terminuses were quiet, no Rush Hour elements, then. ( whatever happened to that feature? )
    I didn't see any nighttime driving, is there a reason for that.

    I don't really care much about elevators or in-train announcements ( which I couldn't hear, anyway ). And the guard's panel is not very accessible in-game, is it? Then there's that narrow cab view which would force me to use an outside camera pretty much all the time.

    Overall, I'd give it a C+, I think. Nothing makes it stand out for me. I think my Steam wallet balance will be unchanged until either the US route or a sizable discount on this one comes along.
     
    Last edited: Jan 25, 2023
    • Like Like x 2
  44. rennekton#1349

    rennekton#1349 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 5, 2022
    Messages:
    6,223
    Likes Received:
    4,021
    Matt said rush hour passengers are there. They can't add ai traffic if there's no appropriate train in game in the correct livery with the correct modifications
     
  45. rennekton#1349

    rennekton#1349 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 5, 2022
    Messages:
    6,223
    Likes Received:
    4,021
    Even if it was a very good route, londonmidland would make an enhancement pack lol.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  46. cloudyskies21

    cloudyskies21 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 9, 2021
    Messages:
    1,248
    Likes Received:
    3,407
    I'm glad I'm not the only one who noticed the micropauses, especially towards the start of the preview after departure from Waverley. Micropauses and stuttering have been a major frustration for me on the Bremen route in particular on Series X - for context I have hardly any problems with any other routes (both TSW 2 and 3) performance-wise. Thus, I really hope the new Edinburgh-Glasgow route has smooth performance on Series X - fingers crossed!
     
  47. james64

    james64 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 1, 2020
    Messages:
    1,176
    Likes Received:
    2,750
    It's amazing how the general opinion on this route within the community appears to have shifted. When it was first announced and the first articles came out everyone was excited, and looking forward to everything about it. Now all we're hearing is "why isn't it BR Blue" or "not enough trains". There seems to be far more negativity surrounding the route now than there was a week or so ago.
     
  48. theorganist

    theorganist Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 1, 2018
    Messages:
    5,565
    Likes Received:
    11,446
    My enthusiasm has cooled a bit, well a fair bit, infact quite a lot. I thought the route was quieter than I was expecting and I really didn't like the ballast or the AI timings. That isn't necessarily going to stop me getting it.

    I suppose having now read of things which I wouldn't have a clue about, the poor sound implementation and the weak brakes, it probably sours things a little more, although, I thought the sounds were okay and tbh didn't particularly notice the braking problem, I just thought it was Matts driving!

    I am on the fence but still more skewed towards getting it as there was plenty I did like.
     
    • Like Like x 4
  49. james64

    james64 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 1, 2020
    Messages:
    1,176
    Likes Received:
    2,750
    Matt's driving is always painful to watch, but especially so last night! I genuinely think they need to get someone else to drive for these streams, as Matt's blunders are only funny up to a certain point, then they just become irritating. The brakes did seem weaker than I would expect for a state of the art EMU though, I'm not sure whether that's true to life or not

    I've never been on a 385 in person, so I can only compare them to their big brothers down south (the 800s), which I am painfully familiar with. I knew the sounds a 385 makes when accelerating from a stop are almost identical to an 800, and listening in the stream it sounded pretty accurate. Beyond that though I'm unsure. One thing I didn't like were the track joint sounds when going over points and junctions. Those particular sounds have never been good and I really don't know why they're still being used. We already have good ones in BML, where they sound muffled in the cab. It's a shame they don't sound similar here.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  50. byeo

    byeo Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 13, 2018
    Messages:
    1,315
    Likes Received:
    2,392
    Not to pick on Matt but I agree, there should be someone out of shot doing the driving while Matt, JD and anyone else do the talking and whatnot. At least then, they can direct whoever is driving to give us outside shots, sounding the horn, walking the platform at the next station etc.. At least then we get (hopefully) decent driving from the driver and good chatter from the hosts regarding the route.
     
    Last edited: Jan 25, 2023
    • Like Like x 4

Share This Page