PC Will We Ever Get The Promised Fixes?

Frankly, I don't believe them.

 

Yes, and I think the "don't know when" part is the biggest issue.

This thread is to point out a missed point in DTG logic. The logic is: TSW3 patches and DLC releases takes priority over TSW2 patches. The problem is that since TSW3 release there haven't been a month without new DLC release or numorous of patches releases for TSW3 content.

The point that DTG might have missed in their TSW2/TSW3 releases logic here is that if TSW2 patch(es) will be always pushed behind TSW3 patches and DLC releases, it may never find it's way to be released.

Hence, if TSW2 patch(es) or just remaining Pres Crew update is to be released - date has to be planned, it has to be placed in the bulid queue and keep its place there until released, not constantly being pushed to the end of the line, because another TSW3 content release takes the priority.

 

I am no expert in law, but I think it would be grounds for a class action lawsuit.
1. Company sells Product to Customers
2. Company breaks Product with an update
3. Company releases New Product, with fix for the broken feature
4. Company refuses to fix Product, says "You must buy New Product to get the fix"

Imagine the product was an expensive car or television set. You download a software update which bricks or cripples the product. Dealer says you must buy a new car/TV. What would you do?

 

DTG JD,

Instead of relentlessly threatening users with closing threads and issuing warnings (which you seem to do an awful lot of), why not answer the question with something other than non-committal politician-style fob-offs? I dare ya….

Presuming you don’t / won’t, then have a crack at these instead;

1) Did DTG, less than one year ago, state publicly that they were slowing down the release schedule to concentrate on fixing long-standing issues (both bugs and game-design) flaws with TSW2?

[ ] Yes
[ ] No

2) Did DTG then not only not do what they’d committed to, but instead release the same game, on the same engine, as a ‘new game’ and charge TSW2 owners for the privilege of continuing to add to their collection, effectively putting the game behind a paywall?

[ ] Yes
[ ] No

3) Did DTG then list a load of fixes for TSW2 content, release them for the ‘new’ game but state publicly, again, that those releases would be released to TSW2 imminently? They were ready and waiting to go after-all.

[ ] Yes
[ ] No

4) Do DTG have no intention of releasing these fixes for TSW2 and keep using this non-sensical excuse of finding a ‘release-slot’ in the hope that any TSW2 stragglers will finally give in and switch to TSW3?

[ ] Yes
[ ] No

5) In releasing the fixes for TSW2 content to TSW3, have DTG in fact broken things in the ‘new’ game that worked perfectly well in TSW2 rendering a lot of that content almost unplayable, despite the game engine being identical? These things are nothing to do with the ‘new’ (quiet at the back!) features

[ ] Yes
[ ] No

Finally,

6) Is the way DTG does business, particularly where TSW is concerned, as shady as hell?

[ ] Yes
[ ] No

I make that a clean sweep of 6.

 

Broken Rapid Transit Dostos being the only one which immediately jumps out at me as bring missed from that.

 

We can agree on the questions being loaded. It was entirely intentional as I don’t see them as questions, I believe them to be statements of fact. The only one that I believe is up for debate is the intention to release these fixes. The proof there will be in the pudding, I don’t believe there is any intention to release those fixes at all.

I also wasn’t criticising you for locking threads, but you threaten to do it by veiled threat quite often, like the other day when you popped up out of nowhere in the AP weather thread on the TSC forum telling people to respect each other or there would be consequences. There was absolutely no need for that, nothing had even been said. Credit where it’s due, however. These forums are infinitely better moderated than the MSFS forums.

Finally, DTG were committed to fixing the TGV for TSC and we all know how that ended up. In that context perhaps you can see why many of us simply no longer believe a word of it. We are talking, after all, about a patch (which is all done and ready for release…right?) for a computer game in the age of fast computers and gigabit internet. No one is building a hospital here.

 

You would be even more suited for telly politics than JD.

I previously believed it was willful ignorance. Now I'm beginning to believe it's genuine.

Cheers

 

I wouldn’t last 5 minutes in politics. A fact based approach to decision making seems to be very much out of fashion these days.

On that note, the second part of your post has passed me by completely. Afraid I’ve no idea what you’re getting at, or even if it were directed at me.

 

What list is that? Because it's not on the roadmap. And looks like items not on the roadmap are easily forgotten.

 

I really miss the times when invidual bugs were actually shown on the roadmap. You knew what was acknowledged and what you can expect to get fixed. I think bringing that back would be a good thing to do, either via the roadmap or as a separate bug list.

 

Don't you think the list of bugs has grown too much for fitting into the roadmap?
They prefer obfuscation, not clarity. See how they phrase the work being done by the Special Projects team:

It sounds like a medication ad, where they list a ton of side effects in 10 seconds.

 

At the start of summer 2022 Matt announced on a stream that new route development was being put on a back burner for a while whilst fix patches for TSW2 were being worked on. This was a blatant and stinking lie as a few months later the awful TSW3 was rolled out to some very muffled applause along with a dismal failed attempt to swiftly brush TSW2 under the carpet.

This is the same Matt who told us all in Oct 2021 that the terrible performance/stuttering issues on Brighton Main Line would be fixed with patches that we are still waiting for 18 months later.

I hate calling out people but you know the phrase "The buck stops here" ? Well Matt it does stop with you and frankly you should bow your head in shame at the shabby way you have misled people with your empty dishonest promises. Time to come clean and at least apologise for your lies and accept some of the blame for the rage you are witnessing daily on this forum on threads like this. Show some leadership qualities and stop blaming everyone and everything else for your poor decisions and mistakes.

I and many other on here wanted to trust DTG and gave them the benefit of the doubt with a chance to prove themselves to be true to their word. They FAILED. Until DTG deliver what they promised and owe the paying customers of TSW2 there is zero chance of those disgruntled folk ever getting TSW3. These people will always hold a grudge against DTG and will continue to spread the word about it being a company best avoided.

I fully expect the Gary Lineker treatment now for daring to speak the truth but as I have said before I will speak my mind and damn the consequences. I'm done with DTG and TSW so make me vanish off your forums if you want.

 

Also don't want to forget cab cars used by the DB BR 182 don't work.The 182 still works but there cab car has no control of loco.

 

Those are the Rapid Transit Dostos

 

Oh yeah another useless patch of 200 mo for content I don't own

 

In fairness what was said at the time was that there was going to be a gap in releases after Spirit Of Steam and this time would be spent focusing on upgrading rush hour and latter routes with improvements etc.

 

The issue I see if they had offered TSW3 as a free upgrade is that you would lose the old SEHS, SOS, Boston, and any other route they downgrade to the TSW3 standard. I'd much rather play the TSW2 versions of those routes as they performed far better.

 

The updated versions of all these routes are waaaaay better. Well, I can't speak for SOS because I barely play it but the TSW3 versions of SEHS and Boston crap all over the TSW2 versions (Boston TSW2 is basically unplayable with safety systems thanks to the borked signals and TSW2 SEHS is only like 1/3 the route that TSW3 SEHS is). I also can't imagine going back to pre-Acela Boston after using it.

 

Yeah I can't sign up to TSW2 being better route-for-route than TSW3. Also, neither can the people on this thread who refuse to buy TSW3...

 

Length isn't the only determinant of quality. Some people miss the railtours, some people think there's performance issues etc

 

Sure as a screenshot simulator I would agree, but when motion is involved.. TSW3 stutters so badly that I cannot play the routes. Hands down the worst performing game that exists on an Xbox Series X.

 

At this time TSW3 didn't exist so those unfulfilled promises clearly referred to TSW2. It is completely fair to describe these comments as BLATANT AND STINKING LIES as any upgrades and improvements were always planned to be just for TSW3 which we as customers had no inkling was even in the pipeline yet alone just months from release.

Like others I too would refuse a free update to TSW3 because I honestly believe that it is not as good a product as TSW2. I am pleased it is not part of an automatic update as I do not want useless gimmicks like pantograph/pickup sparks, changeable weather, snow flurries and deployable brollies eating up the available processing power with the unavoidable result of degrading overall performance.

Perhaps Matt should make an appearance on this thread to discuss these issues instead of cowering in the background whilst using JD as a human shield.

 

I am not talking only about length. The timetable is also much better and busier, not to mention added AI and layers. I guess maybe there are a few people who might specifically miss diesel railtour but in exchange you get a steam railtour and the chance to run a TGV on HS1. I really can't think of a single reason to prefer the old SEHS outside of like you said maybe specifically someone liking that one diesel rail tour. Performance too I guess for some people but speaking from XSX it runs flawless for me and on PS5 minor stuttering (which isn't all that much worse than stuttering I saw in TSW2, which never exactly ran great anyway).

I am surprised with all the performance arguments in here because lets be frank, TSW2 performed poorly especially toward the end of its run.

 

You are right. If TSW3 actually had good performance then yes I'm all for the expanded route and added features. I mean who wouldn't? I'm sure there are many in this thread who have either tried or even purchased TSW3 yet refuse to play it due to its glaring deficiencies. Hence the only other option in this space is to continue to enjoy the content already purchased on the better performing platform.

 

I don't understand where this performance issue is coming from unless your XSX is broken or overheating. I play TSW3 on XSX and it is basically flawless. Running the system on 60hz with VRR on and a 4k TV I'd call this game downright smooth. It has microstutters for tile loading (which affects all platforms and also TSW2 from Unreal) and some minor noticable low FPS at London Victoria but overall I'd say XSX is as close to the best platform to play this as it gets.

I also have TSW3 on PS5, which is where I played TSW2 (200+ hours). Performance is not as good as XSX but not noticeably worse than TSW2. TSW is a poorly optimized game period regardless of it it is 2 or 3 and I had performance issues on TSW2 in the same places as I do in TSW3. The TSW2 routes ON TSW3 run either exactly the same or better.

And it is not like any performance drops are entirely thanks to new graphics. London Victoria is the worst area for FPS across all platforms for me and it is a non-upgraded TSW2 route and if anything has gotten better on TSW3 with recent patching compared to where I left off with it on TSW2.

 

Hard agree, especially for those of us who cannot tolerate all the issues with the new lighting system. I've uninstalled the updated routes from TSW3 and gone back to playing them exclusively in TSW2.

As time has gone on, this has been a deciding factor in me supporting the TSW2/3 disconnect rather than it having been a free update.

 

Maybe VRR is the difference? My screen doesn't have that feature. Perhaps it should be in the TSW3 system requirements. But I should clarify. TSW2 routes in TSW3 are like for like. Oddly enough in TSW2 at London Victoria my FPS do drop, but remain strangely smooth for the most part. It's specifically TSW3 only routes that are unplayable for me. The stuttering (rapid fluctuation of FPS between about 40 to 60) is so bad that it makes me nauseous. So even when I have tried many times thinking "ok this time..." within minutes I need to turn off the game. Never in my life have I had a video game of any sort induce such a feeling (everything from the original Donkey Kong to today's latest and greatest). And you're right, TSW2 does suffer from stuttering mainly when there's a passing train (but not always). But it's for a far smaller section of any given route and for whatever reason those moments of stuttering feel "smoother". Less choppy for the most part. Anyhow if it is my specific Xbox Series X causing this I would be foolish to write to Microsoft and advise them of this while telling them that this is the only game that suffers from this issue in my entire library.

 

Not sure on this one. Didn't they remove the Rainham services??? That would make the section east of Gravesend half as busy as it was.
Yes you get more High speed services, but really they're all boring green light specials anyway

 

As a VRR user, it absolutely helps, more than you can imagine, but there are still notable issues beyond that, and the heavier FPS dips and stutters still end up noticeable.

 

You must have a really awful processor for it to be that much affected by some sparks

Erm, answering on the forums is JDs job... You know, as Community Director...

 

Isn't all that much worse ! Jeez mate you just admitted that TSW3 is a downgrade and yet you are trying to defend it. Get real my friend.

TSW2 on Ps4 had serious performance on some routes like BML. Other routes had annoying stutters but were not as dreadful as the slide show sections in BML. On Ps5 TSW2 the old Ps4 routes run well even BML and SoS. The Ps5 versions of those two routes still stutter to an unacceptable degree so I use the Ps4 routes for the smooth performance.

Every video I have seen of TSW3 shows ridiculous amounts of stuttering right up to the latest new German route presentation a few days ago. As a product it is a total turn-off and I will not downgrade to it from TSW2 which I now have running in a way that I find enjoyable.

 

There we go. I guess that makes 2 of us that simply cannot play TSW3 routes as the game causes negative physical effects. But we're only 2 people so our opinions don't matter much in the grand scheme of things. Just nice to know that I'm not alone in the category.

 

I really tried to give TSW3 a chance, too. BCC, EBG, I saw stuff that really appealed to me, and I bought it! I enjoy driving those trains on those routes in principle, I even like the cats!

But things like the tunnel entry flash, the washed out lighting that feels the same as what you get from a very poor HDR implementation, the shiny reflectiveness of so many things, my eyes are just too sensitive for this stuff.

 

You're entitled to your opinion, you're wrong but your entitled to that.

 

You must have really awful reading comprehension to squirt out a vacuous reply like that. I have TSW2 installed on Ps5 and it runs fine as it is with some routes still on the Ps4 versions. I do not want the extra useless gimmicks in TSW3 as they are unwanted and will undoubtedly use up processing cycles and degrade performance.

 

Those gimmicks as you refer to them add to the immersion which on a sim is important for many people (myself included), but hey you can turn the sparks and lightening off if it bothers you that much and is causing performance issues on your obsolete console.

 

Did they really add the options to turn off the laughable eye candy? I'd gladly turn off the tunnel flashes, sparks, flickering snow and clouds to see which one of these things is causing such performance degradation. I doubt it's the nuclear lighting itself, but that can't ever be switched off.

 

Lmao. I own both, why would I go out of my way to "defend" TSW3? If TSW2 was so much better I'd just play it, because I own it and have for years, but it is not. In every comparable situation it is worse. If you want to twist my words then I will state it definitively: TSW3 is better than TSW2.

I get people are mad about promised fixes not being there but to argue 2 is a better game is la-la land.

And you can't judge a game by a video or a streamer. I own both and I even own TSW3 on two platforms and I can say definitively that TSW3 in like for like situations is either not noticeably different from TSW2 or BETTER than TSW2. In situations that aren't like for like (i.e. new routes that aren't out for TSW2) there is no point in comparing since its a different experience but I don't see anything close to making the game "unplayable". It is not the best optimized game on any platform but neither was TSW2 and people for some reason want to look at TSW2 with rose coloured glasses.

 

Ah, you're running the PS5 version.. No wonder. I don't think that version has ever been properly optimised for the format.
Can't really complain about the processing power in those machines

 

LOL Another one with reading comprehension deficit.

Hey mate tell me where I can get the Ps6 to replace my obsolete Ps5 ? I'll order one right away.

 

Grabs Popcorn

 

You do seem to post a lot about the performance of a game you don’t even have.

 

Is the Long Island Railroad going to receive the small update that has been on the roadmap for about 2 years? I am curious, what is the small update that is mentioned for the Long Islans Railroad? I believe it is part of preservation crew updates but not too sure since this is a TSW2020 route

 

Umm.. have you read my posts? I actually do have TSW3 and have mentioned it many times. It would make no sense to post about the game making me feel nauseous without ever playing it.

 

PS5/PS6 regardless anything made by Sony is obsolete even before release.

The amount of issues caused by Sony that have eaten up Dev time of TSW2 and TSW2 considerably more than any other format are testament to how poor they are.

 

Good question. I don't even think they care about that part of the roadmap anymore. Just copy and paste the same thing and call it a day. Everything preservation crew related has not changed for quite a while now. No TSW2 preservation crew updates, no LIRR small update (whatever it is), no Oakville passenger layer, no Oakville/Peninsula Corridor timetable fix... All these things seem to be left in the void. I would not be surprised if even they themselves don't remember whan the LIRR small update is supposed to be, lol.