I listened in alarm at portions of tonights roadmap. Namely the part about adding layers into timetables with the incorrect rolling stock etc. For many this might be welcome news, however for myself and no doubt others this is going to hinder the immersion. I know a layer toggling tool has been requested before, but now with this shift in focus it becomes even more important, and would please more people, more of the time. So please DTG let us have control over what we see when running trains. I suggest each layer is listed in a sub menu for each route. along with a brief description on the prototypical nature, for example. Only Fully prototypical for era. Correct formation and loco and livery but era differs from other services. eg BR Blue services on WCL Correct loco and livery but incorrect rolling stock for example Amtrac LD services on Trenton. Incorrect loco and formation but correct livery, for example Lake Shore Limited on BS or the BR612 on Bremen Incorrect loco, formation & livery, for example HST on BML Correct loco but incorrect livery & formation, for example Night Jet services on SKW Even with layers deselected it would be possible to drive the service, this would just stop seeing AI trains
Yes I was alarmed at this announcement too. We have already seen some ridiculous layers on some routes, TGV on SEHS and I don't need to mention the utter fantasy which were the WCL layers. "We haven't got any intercity HST's so to make the experience more realistic we will layer in stock which either never ran in the south west, or had been withdrawn long before the early 90's, in liveries which were almost extinct and formations which would have been against regulations"! Why should those of us who want to have as realistic experience as possible suffer because of others?
More and more I am questioning if I am playing the right Train Sim, just read about the updates to TSC so I'm in the middle of downloading it and seeing if the updates make it playable on my laptop.
Completely agree with all of the above comments. I like things to be as realistic as possible. Layer toggling might also offer performance benefits to those willing to sacrifice layers.
I would definitely like to see some toggling features including this kind (and with liveries on Ai) whilst I support calls for layers, I call only for those that are the correct stock (usually when it’s already available) I must be honest though I did always think the WCL Br blue stock seemed genuine. Edit: I hope their hasn’t been confusion in that people calling for layers on routes such as Trenton, have been calling for Ai M7/M3 at Penn, with complete timetables of other stock (i count myself among them) It kinda seems DTG have heard the call but thought people wanted wrong trains running other trains services… I’m sure many would agree that it’s better to focus timetable timings/upgrades on real possible services rather than made up
From what they said last night they've listened to the people who want "proper timetables and busy routes" and tried to act on this by sticking in half appropriate (if you squint and look out of the side of your eye) stock on those "missing runs". The main issue we have in TSW that we don't in TSC is a lack of loco and carriage assets. In TSC we've got years and years of production by a fair few developers, all reskinned into any livery you could wish for (I'm sure there are loads that are missed of course) whereas TSW doesn't have that...
I get that a portion of the community want that, and that's perfectly valid opinion. But there needs to be a way to keep more people happy, more of the time. Things like the TGV and ICE on SEHS, BR Blue locos on WCML, BR612's are turn offs for some people, being able to turn off layers to suit shouldn't be beyond the technical expertise of DTG.
I'm sure it's not, the only issue I can see with it is where something is toggled which interferes with an interaction somewhere on a scenario or timetable, meaning you would have faced some opposing signal which you now won't as the asset has been "toggled out"
Make them invisible then, so they are still present in the block and will be present in blocks just not seen. Although given 99% of make believe layers are dependent on owning other DLC, they clearly don't impact the other services by not being there, so I consider this improbable.
I remember back when I used to play TSC, "invisible trains" were seen as bugs... Not sure that's the best option in this instance
TSC is great in that regard but I am more and more finding it is a faff nowadays TSW's service mode has made it too easy I guess. I think if TSC had some kind of full timetable I would touch TSW a lot less. Still in TSC you can create realistic scenarios and not be at the behest of what DTG and third parties deem to be realistic, or not realistic but think it doesn't matter.
You can easily achieve this already by simply uninstalling DLC that containes unwanted layers. In regards to the ICE and TGV on SEHS: there is absolutely no problem with those being present. An ICE did run into St. Pancras at one point, and a TGV could easily do it as well. Given that in total there are only 1 ICE and 4 TGV services on the entire timetable, it is not that hard to avoid seeing anything you rather didn't.
Once a ICE turned up. By that argument we should get a ICE1 layer on NEC as that did actually run services for a couple of months on the NEC back in 1993.
For me it just comes down to being sensible with it, if you have a similar looking train in the correct livery, then go for it (Trenton’s ALP-46 being my point here). The issue I have is when it’s totally wrong (see BR stock all over modern routes [MML & WCL]). It just needs common sense is all, not this all or nothing approach.
I live on a canal boat, sometimes I have great coverage, other times I struggle to get 3G. A big download involves decamping with my laptop to use either a cafes WiFi or a friends broadband. Seems overkill when DTG are creating the issue. Ever thought perhaps I enjoy running SEHS and then want to jump straight in LGV without having to faff about reinstalling content?
True but it's still a faff and it's all or nothing in that case. Plus if it's uninstalled then this isn't possible.
So you'd be happy if the ICE1 appear on NY Trenton? I mean that actually spent a couple of month on revenue earning services back in the 1990s so far more prototypical than a TGV at St Pancreas
I think toggling layers would be very advantageous to both DTG and players. All it needs is a list of layers that are on a route with a check box next to each one. This could even include layers that a player doesn’t have the content for yet and that takes away the problem of a player not knowing which DLC to get to enhance the route. Each layer that isn’t native to the route could have the name of the required DLC next to it. Players can do their own research or use their own knowledge to only populate the routes with what they consider authentic enough. Players could have an option to increase performance by disabling a layer they don’t much care for. It has many advantages.
And make each non-owned layer a link to buy it! This would also fix the issue that I've yet to see anywhere where it is shown what layers onto what. If someone new comes to TSW it appears that there is no way to tell this - which considering how much DTG love money seems a massive missed opportunity.
Do tell us all, exactly how you'll stop having fun if you have a toggle you never use to turn off layers?
Not at all. In principle, adding flexibility will make a better game. But given the resources and development time such a toggle might take, I want to make it clear that some of us want more gameplay and more fun at the expense of someone else's notion of realistic. I'm not against the concept but I was responding to the person who says that they are suffering when DTG creates a full timetable that's not 100% realistic.
You could easily use that argument about every single new feature, 2/3 of the player base didn't want or need addons manager, yet DTG spent probably in the excess of 1000 hours to accommodate PS5 users. A large number of the player base probably has no interest in US Freight railroads, so lets stop developing them. Many people will never turn PZB or SIFA on in their life, so no point in developing that is there.
So maybe you should consider that not everyone who uses the sim thinks like you, and so should DTG. And, cater for those that want a more realistic experience. I wouldn't use TSW if I wasn't having fun but maybe my fun, which I would hope is as important as yours would be spoilt by seeing the incorrect trains on a route, and you will find I am not the only one. Selectable layers would solve the problem so we would both be happy. I would like us both to be happy, I presume you are only concerned about yourself, however.
But the route isn't set in the 1990s nor is sehs set in the period where there was a ice or a tgv. I do agree though that the game should have layers that can just be switched on or off. It's a win win for both sides
Have you ever considered if we had togglable layers then DTG could go mad and stick virtually anything they wanted on to the route so you could have more fun as well? Like others have said, its a win win for everyone concerned. DTG get more sales, Realists get a more immersive drive Those who dont really care what they drive as along as its fun get more layers
So that automatically means then it should appear on SEHS because it happened once in 2012 from what I have found out and not even the same type of TGV.
It was complete PR exercise, apparently towed through the tunnel topped and tailed by Class 9000's, then hauled by diesel shunters into London as wasnt certified to run in the UK. Actually the more I read into the TGV in UK the more nonsense the layer actually is. https://www.railforums.co.uk/threads/tgv-la-poste-at-st-pancras-21-03-12.62190 https://www.flickr.com/photos/47500/7001487921/in/photostream/ https://www.flickr.com/photos/christopherfitzgeraldphotography/7002795253/in/photostream/
Completely 100% agree that this should be a feature. Really not a fan of the unrealistic layers on SEHS and other routes, so the option to be able to disable the ones you don't want to see would be really nice. Also though, as someone who had made numerous liveries now in Livery Designer, the option to disable these substituting in would also be gladly appreciated, preferable by train and livery, but a general all liveries on/off toggle would be appreciated. Using MML as an example, 158 liveries on there seem to sub in much more than the proper livery itself. Even though I created them and have used them a few times in scenario planner already, I don't want to see most 158s be in GWR or TfW livery, I want to see the proper one.
