So, their politics "buy our patch" unchanged? That's sad. What useless garbage I need to buy now - "Training centErE 2"?
Right. And what? Remeber the lot on Steam "upgrade from 2 to 3 for 19.99(or whatewer you have) and get 0 new routes(training centere is not a route for me) and 0 new rolling stock. Just break the system and change the number - limited proposition!" That was a freaking patch for sale. I don't wanna buy another freaking patch. It's disgusting when a set of fixes and improvements(ey! they don't even updated any old routes, just copy-paste) are sold to you for money. I don't know who else does this (except EA).
For me it's all about the 3 routes that come with the new TSW4, I can swallow the fact that I'm paying for a core update that many devs would do for free, providing it comes with 3 new routes and new rolling stock, no extensions to existing routes please DTG. If one of those new routes is ECML current day with an Azuma then it's a pre-order for me. The other 2 routes will be a bonus especially a NY subway. The 3rd route I don't really mind but it would be nice to have something else from Europe other than Germany, perhaps a part German part other country route, but I'd like new rolling stock otherwise Germany is getting a little "red train samey". How about a loco/train belonging to one of their neighbouring countries such as France, Poland, Czech, Austria or whatever, that would be cool and introduce anew livery into the game as well.
Last year one of the main selling points for the TSW3 launch routes was length. The routes were the 3 longest routes in the game. However, 1 was a freight route, the German route was high speed route with 3 stations, and SEHS extended added 6 stations and around 48 miles of track. I wonder what would be the big selling point this time
According to Matty May, Tsw4 is going to include 4 new routes each with a new train, how true that actually is though I do not know.
True... But new routes are no part of upgrades... That's always the case... Other way you have in TSW3 new lightning and 3D cloudes..... Better interface scenario planner etc etc
Emmm... no. Cause all new sky and liting only for a new routes. Yes, there was some old routes updated for free when their recive a new rolling stock dlc. But thats all. Their sale training centere, new number and promising to do some fixes. Sadly, but buying "update from 2 to 3" gives you allmost nothing. And I find it hard to believe that things will change this time.
This info came from another Forum user called Matty May, he's the guy who made the well know 'an open letter to dtg' thread a while back, he said that he has it on very good authority that this is what Tsw4 will be. But like I said, I do not know how true this will end up being, we only have Matty's word for it after all. Edit: his post has been deleted so I'm gonna assume that it was fake.
Selling point was length, since launch we haven’t gotten a route longer than 60 miles since launch ? I would say selling point was dynamic weather
You’re correct after those 3 routes every time after was shorter. But during the reveal they made it seemed that was the beginning of longer routes…. Never happened
No you're wrong... Southeastern Highspeed has received the free lightning and other fixes update Only the extra route parts are not for free
I find the whole "paid upgrade" argument to be so silly. For me, it boils down to whether you want to continue to buy new TSW content with new features- if yes, then you'll need to buy the newest version. If you're happy with your collection as it stands (as in, right now, with potentially no further patches or upgrades), then there's no reason to buy it. I don't see any evidence this is changing for TSW4.
Correct! If you dindt have enough interest do not buy it.. for me this season updates are good quality for less money
Not simple. If I don't want the "core routes", but suddenly want upcoming dlc I need to pay money for the damned patch. Example. TSW4 contents: another boring Germanys LZB route, another British 3rd rail route from London and another boring US pass with 15 mph speed restriction. I dont want this, so I'm pass. After month their anounced countryname routename of your dreams, yeah, you requested it 42 times and there you go. But... you also need to buy the damned patch!
Mate... I give you a lesson... Not everything is free in this life! You have to pay for the things that others have to offer. This discussion is useless I think... It's not that DTG change this policy I guess
Cheers captain obvious. This is why the game is in such a state, people like you who just gobble up the trash no matter how buggy or unfinished it is. We all want the game to be better, stop drowning out the sensible discussion of what should be done to improve the game.
I don't ask - GIVE ME ALL YOU'VE GOT FOR FREE. I just want the same scheme that we already have in TSC: updates for free, new content for money!
Its not really about wanting to get the next big thing for free, or even interest in new DLC/features of the next iteration, IMO. This is the way I look at it, and this is the same opinion I held last year with TSW3 and it hasn't changed: The big issue with a constant upgrade to the core (and having it behind a paywall) is that it locks bug fixes behind that paywall. Just see TSW2 fixes as an example. I can't remember if they ever did come out, but I know at the July roadmap they still hadn't - that's almost a year since TSW3 where TSW2 fixes were unavailable because the next iteration always had priority in the queue. As a consumer, you do have a right to expect bug fixes for a product you purchased for free. DTG is already shooting themselves in the foot by having as many platform builds as they do, it just complicates things even more needing to support multiple versions of the game. Combined with their backwards priorities, the result is a slap in the face to the end user. The core of TSW offers you nothing on its own - absolutely nothing. All of the value is unlocked with the routes offered for the game, whether they're bundled with the core or a separate DLC add-on. Updates to the core of the game are done to support new DLC routes, and therefore that cost should be factored into the DLC price, rather than making everyone re-buy the core to move forward. The only time a repurchase of the core is warranted is if it underwent a complete re-write, like UE4-UE5 or just major rebuild from the ground up on DTGs part, where its not just a few tweaks and feature additions here and there (like TSW3 was). TSW1-2 with the jump from 4.16-4.23 is an acceptable example - upgrading UE4 version shouldn't warrant it generally, but they did do a lot of fixing to the game in that time period too since that was original code, some probably dating back to their experiments in the early days. This isn't a major EA sports title where a new version comes out each year with updated teams and player stats, etc. where they can get away with making it a completely new game (I remember this coming up last year in this debate). FIFA or Madden is sold as a whole unit, where the core IS the game. TSW is sold where the core enables you to play, and the DLC routes are the game. Two very different models. There's also the issue of a new game means re-downloading all your content, and that's not a quick task. I still don't have my entire library downloaded into TSW3 because I didn't want to run a >100GB download when I bought it. This is relatively minor, and I'm lucky to have a decent internet connection, but I feel for those that don't. I really hope, if DTG is offering yet another version of the game, the core is released for free for current owners of TSW3. If the routes are interesting or appealing, I'll consider buying those and have no problem doing that. But if payed core updates (especially yearly) is the new norm for DTG and the TSW franchise, then they clearly aren't based in the UK, rather the lowest levels of Coruscant with a member of the Pyke Syndicate as their CEO.
TSW3 was sold for 44,99€ at launch, including 3 new routes (or 2 and an extension). Single, new routes are sold for 29,99€ (TSW2 days) and now 35,99€. If we assume that 35,99€ is a fair price for a new route (from the side of DTG), with a normal but not exorbitant profit margin, DTG does not really earn much money selling the TSW3 standard pack. On the other hand, they have a high risk of losing long time customers. I, for example, did not switch from TSW2 to TSW3 as I was not interested in any of the three new TSW3 standard routes (I bought it now in the Humblebundle, however thereby the profit margin for DTG was propably zero). Additionally, I did not buy any new DLCs, as I'm not agreeing with the yearly (or every two years (we will see shortly)) paid upgrades. However, if the TSW2 to TSW3 upgrade would have been free of charge (obviously without the 3 new routes) (as in TSC), I would have bought e.g. BRO, LFR (NDR as well but that is TSG) for full price. Further, by promising to maintain and upgrade two versions of the game, they broke promises (again). They (propably intentionally) never released bug fixes for the old version (TSW2), which where promised. Thereby frustrating more customers further. All in all, I really can't see the economical sense of releasing a new paid upgrade every year (or two, doesn't matter), if your business model is based on selling DLCs.
There is no sensible discussion. You’re just complaining about a company selling a product that you HAVE NO OBLIGATION TO PURCHASE. It’s really as simple as that. If you don’t like them releasing a new version annually then don’t buy it.
They’re a business. Their goal is to make you purchase their product. In your example they’re doing that. You aren’t obligated to buy the route of your dreams. You buy it because you want to.
Anyway... Japan is a big market with a lot of train fans and yet TSW3 doesn't even support Japanese. I'm not entirely convinced they'll call it TSW4 but either way it's pretty clear that it'll be a new SKU. And I wonder if maybe they're using Focus investments on this SKU for a marketing push in Japan, including adding Japanese language support.
My interest in TSW3 has been slowly fading away. Yes I’m glad that they are waiting to announce something. But since there have been no new routes or anything announced that I would be interested in, I’m slowly loosing interest. Hope that whatever comes, is to my interest.
if u dont know by now union workshop is a 3rd party that are in the works of a japan route it will be a far way off know they they just started to understand the engine on building routes and stuff for TSW
The Odakyu line in full and later a JR Tokyo Circle line or similar to Ueno which Union Workshop did in TSC would be amazing. I think they would need some marketing like TSW first had with Sean Bean when it was first launched. Japanese advertising is HUGE, inside the trains for example the ads are everywhere. Because Japanese spend 10% of their lives average on trains commuting. It requires some serious capital and the licensing. But Union did it with Wakayama and Ueno and the north Shinkansen route. I just can't use TSC any more. It is TSW3/4 or nothing. Well not true, I like the Berlin Wittenberg route from TSC and that needs to come across to TSW. Dresden has received similar beautiful attention to detail..... I'm just loving how they add details in. It has been suggested or spoken of but that high speed freight section in Dresden Riesa which only goes for 15km or so, goes to Leipzig. So there is talk that is might get a rendition. The Dresden Riesa route is beautiful, really beautiful. Also I think they can't add too much to it (have to be like the Munich routes separating them due to FPS and performance) so need to have a separated route. I just which the shader cache system can be made for each route so it isn't wiped. Otherwise it might be another game that has overwritten it? Also a rumour is that DTG has Sydney railway technical diagram (signalling) data.
They don't have to dictate anything, it's implied. You can criticize aspects of TSW up to a point but if your channel is linked to DTG and the TSW brand it is understood that overall your review will be favourable to the game. Your whole purpose after all, from DTG's perspective, is to help them market the TSW brand.
Lets take a different track here. Maybe those that have channels enjoy it and will give an honest outlook. I see DTG cop an absolute roasting at times when really its not necessary. Like I saw the huge criticism over Midland Main Line so I decided to buy it! And I loved it!! I don't believe it deserved that extreme criticism. I have had a few AWS snags but that isn't a drama. Scenery is great. If you enjoy driving then at the end of the day it will show through in your channel or reviews etc....
I know my English isn't good, but what I really try to say that you need to buy something to receive the opportunity to buy something. Like you go to the market and say - sell me some bottle of cold pure water, but the seller answers you - first you need to buy our t-shirt. You bought it before but that's was t-shirt with number 3 which is outdated, now you need to buy our t-shirt with number 4 to get acces to the bottle of water. Technically they are iddentically t-shirts, only number changed. You can drink your water in any of this t-shirts(they are iddentically), but we wont sale you any botles before you change clothes.
Not a good analogy. You don't need the T shirt to drink the water and vice versa Maybe "I want to buy water and it used to come in a square bottle, but now they want to charge me for a round bottle" ie the game is the container and the water is the DLC. Same water, different bottle But again this isn't the case here. The "new bottle" also comes with new water, with different minerals or a different taste (ie new routes, new weather etc), so what you're buying is a new product, even if it looks like the old one with knobs on ie TSW3 is NOT TSW2 even if you get similar things from both, so if you want the new stuff you have to buy "the new container"
OK. As you say. I mean the situation is allmost absourdic. Good seller always create comfort for their buyers. Like "you can buy a fresh water and fill the bottle that you have already bought from us a year ago". The bad seller will do like "throw away our old bottle and buy a new one from us, otherwise we refuse to sell you water".
Sorry... I don't know that many "sellers" who give things away unless they believe that the person receiving the gift is going to spend a lot more money on other things For instance I cannot demand a refill from Coca Cola no matter how much of their product I've bought previously. Also, look back through the history of tech. I've had just about every version on Windows and office since the 90s. I had to buy each of them. None of them was free. Even if I bought a piece of software that ran on them, I had to buy the OS first. Why should DTG be any different?
But there is a major difference. DTG business model is based on selling DLCs, not the main game. There are other simulators based on the same business model (every large flight sim, ETS, most racing sims (AC, ACC, RFactor etc). And they do not split their playerbase by selling a "new" version of the sim every year. Other games do this (e.g. F1, FIFA etc.) but their business model is not based on selling DLCs. That is the major difference. The next argument will be that "the playerbase for these games is much higher, train sims are niche games on the other hand". I would agree with this in the case of flight sims and racing sims. However, I will not agree concerning trucks. I bet many more people find trains interesting than trucks. However, SCS produced a very good game, thereby gaining a large playbase and supporting the game over years!
That's you're idea of a good seller... It's not the case for DTG.. they have a another point of view.... So 2 options.... whining or crying or accept this point and stop this useless discussion
What discussion aren't useless? Creating another thread about praises the DTG how great they are, that they released a full of bugs, disgusting sounds and a lot of inconsistencies DLС? This is what the forum has turned into - sycophancy. Any opinion other than that of local DTG fans is called "useless". Any criticism of saint DTG is called what? "Your useless stupid opinion"? Any product without criticism will not grow and evolve. If everyone is happy, then why fix something? Let remains the conveyor.
You are just whining, sucking and nagging, but you don't realize that yourself and impose your own opinion on others, but respect for the fact that there are people who like the game is not there because you simply have your own opinion want to print. Your point is now clear and stop nagging! Thanks!
You don't answer my question. What discussion aren't useless? Thi is a forum and I'm still in topic - discuss the game and devs politics. Forgive me for not bowing at their feet.
For me, a discussion is adversarial application and I miss that a bit.... You make your point, which you keep pushing through, but don't listen much to other people's opinions, have little respect for that either.... Anyway you're not the only one who does this there are many more here who like to voice their opinion at the expense of others who think it's a nice game. Other than that, this conversation is done for me! I wish you a nice afternoon and evening
I still don't believe that there is a TSW4 in the pipe until it is ready to be preordered. It is simply too early for a entire new TSW-game (this would be next year) and I don't trust leakers.
