Dovetail Direct Live Stream Reaction

Thank you for putting a lot of my thoughts on this into words so well

 

It feels like marketing/sales department of DTG haven't learned nothing from TSW 3 release.

Why do DTG insist of changing the number after 'Train Sim World' name every time they want to publish some medicre improvements to the core game?

I think it's natural that people seeing new edition of a product expect major update against previous version and hence so many dissapointed/pissed off users we have here now (and had after TSW3 announcement).

While the same could be easely solved by the change of the way it's being sold to us. Instead of putting another number after TSW I would announce it as 'Summer's three routes bundle' or put whatever catchy name here at the price of XX.YY EUR/USD with some FREE core game improvements like (list the improvements here). Then, every new route should just be 'equipped' with these core game improvements and that's it.

Nobody is pissed - you buy new route - you have it with some improvements to the core game for 'free' - and you're happy because you expect some medicre improvements to the core game with some new DLC from time to time. You buy older route - it will differs from the latest ones in some aspects, because back then it was not developed yet. If you are aware of these differances and accept them, you buy it and enjoy, otherwise just skip it and move on to the latest released content.

And I would keep the number's change if there is really some major change being implemented for TSW like, for the lack of better idea now, game engine change.

 

Every business decision ever, will always have detractors. It is literally impossible to make everyone happy in a commercial sense.

 

They could even sell the upgrades for 15 to 20 Euros ... I wouldn't mind and the route bundle seperately.

 

I'm irritated because I have all the same issues with TSW4 as everyone else on this thread. Everyone is right to be criticising DTG right now.

... But I've desperately wanted an 800 in the game for years now, and I adore the idea of flying down Stoke bank in an A3, so in my heart I know I'll be pre ordering this game. My head knows I'm getting ripped off, and that I'm just enabling DTG to continue doing the same awful practices they've been doing for years, but in this case it's outweighed by how much I want to drive the 801 and Scotsman.

Would it really have hurt for them to put in the extra effort to extend it to York though? I know it's even more miles but there's no stations at all, and I think people would be a lot happier then.

 

Because it's £30-40 on a game we love, for lots of good new content. I would have paid £30 for the ECML and the Azuma alone.
Should they updated the base game for everyone like with TSC? Yes, they should. But they don't seem to be willing to do that. So that's how it is unfortunately.

 

I think this is the point some people are missing. The chances are most of those moaning would have bought at least one of the three routes, in fact if at least one doesn't appeal what are you doing here? The starter packs do exactly that. Standard route price buys you into TSW4.

 

I don't understand why people are acting like it's hundreds of pounds. I've never been that angry/spirited over £30 before.
I spend more than that on a night/meal out.

 

Nope, in this case everything would have been fine, like in the other years, because in this case it is a bargain. But this time, I really do not like the offered routes at all. I wouldn't have bought them. But now they force me, if I still want to have the chance to buy new routes, to buy at least one of them ... so thats why I'm disappointed.

 

Not sure if everyone is understanding this and it's very important IMO:

They're promising basically ONE final legacy patch to update TSW3- specifically corrections to tutorials and the NYT timetable update. All the other fixes that were on the roadmap are abandoned. Penninsula Corridior fixes from when they broke it in the TSW3 update? Nope. Baby bullet on Oakville? Nope. Rush hour passengers on BML? Nope.TSW2 fixes? PFR and MML that's only a few months old? Forget about it!

Oh and it comes out "a few weeks" after TSW4 launches. Might that date get pushed back even further if there are TSW4 launch issues? I bet it might!

Most importantly, with them moving to a paid annual update, this same thing will happen EVERY year. If it isn't fixed in the first patch it probably never will be.

That's what i'm annoyed about.

 

Because I don't spend 36 Euros and then throw it away ... simple isn't it. Btw it is not about the money. The offer is bad. The lack of choice without routes is bad.

 

The offer is great. Three routes for the price of one. If you don't like the choices, that is fair, but the value isn't bad.
So you don't spend money on nice food? Alcohol? Going to a club? You've also not thrown it away, presumably you've had hours of enjoyment out of it already yes? And will continue to do so?

 

The value is bad if you don't want it!

I! Don't! Want! Theses! Routes!

I would by the upgrade to TSW4, but I can't!

 

DTG probably took it from the roadmap because that incapable person (me) is not able to bring a single train within over 2 years now. That's fine. It's still nearly around the corner. Constantly working on it now.

 

Hurray I'm really looking forward to this train!

 

I enjoy using those routes in their current form, I'll enjoy using them in TSW4 as well. LIRR runs fine for me, other than NY skyline being bad.

 

I just noticed that EA FC releases on the same day for people who bought the early access version.

 

In fairness to DTG, anyone moaning about paying for fixes is wrong... at no point in that presentation did they say they had any intention of fixing any of the existing bugs

 

Exactly

the best restaurant I ever went to had some 1 star reviews.

Dtg has done some things that I challenged. Leaving save game out of tsw3 and the NYT timetable some good examples. In both games they are making it right

 

It doesn’t look that much better irl

 

Then maybe wait for the upcoming German DLC? Last year they offered also Bundle with TSW3 and BCC which was the first „new“ UK DLC iirc.

 

...hah

 

On a related note and if anyone from DTG is still following the thread…
I didn’t pick anything in the FAQ about the following:
1. Have you finally managed to implement reverb etc sound effects for bridges tunnels and viaducts?

2. Has the save game been improved. Specifically more than one save slot and not losing objective data if you save and resume on a second train trying to chain several runs?

3. No mention of extending “Guard” mode into the game.

 

Yes, Yes and Yes.

 

I don't hope for anything when it comes to DTG. What if they don't ... then I have to buy TSW4 AND the new route. To assume that this happens is not an option.

 

Save game works just fine

 

Yes

Don’t care about safety systems

I’ve had exactly one problem with the signaling system quickly resolved with a restored save game

 

Well I've completed several service runs on it in the last few weeks with no problems. So I'm not sure what issues you're talking about?

 

I’ve restored numerous saves

it works just fine

[EDIT - Jan - Language]

 

Both because I would like to drive the DB BR 420 and because of the (good) work you delivered in the past, it sure is something worth looking forward to!

 

Sooo...I've mixed feelings today.

First of all I'm not interested in any of the new routes that are coming with the release of TSW4 (but that's for sure my personal problem). On the other hand I love to see the Update for Dresden. I'm really excited about the new OHLE System, but it is only for the new routes + Dresden and KWB. Why is Linke Rheinstrecke and at least BRO with the new System? ALL routes should get it, at least all TSW3 routes. If everything would have been done right from the beginnig it shouldn't be any problem for DTG to bring this new system to ALL routes including every Legacy route. Also this is something which should have been a normal core update.

I like to see that we finally get an Editor, this was promised with the first release of TSW.

So I don't know what to add here...I have to buy it in the end so I can enjoy new routes and new content and new features, as well as hopefully community routes / trains made with the Editor. Also with the release of the Editor I can hope for the community to fix bugs and other stuff which is in the game for years now. It is nice that we are finally able to do this, but in the end it is not our Job.

I've several times before posted that I'm willing to pay money for "support" which means, if their is good support I will spend money even on stuff which I'm not interested in. In this example an update to TSW4. But it is not believable that something about bug fixing on older routes and rolling stock will change. We will still have tons of versions of the same locos and rolling stock in TSW4, some more broken then others. Yes neat little new features, but nothing special besides the Editor which, as mentioned above, was promised with TSW already. So DTG here is your chance to impress me...but I doubt things will change. I'm honestly now hoping for rail-sim getting more content soon, which would raise the pressure on DTG (hopefully).

 

Yes, this is part of what I find so disappointing, especially SFJ fixes and LBN rush hour passengers not coming to TSW3 (and it was TSW3 that broke SFJ in the first place!) And what about the promised improvements to the CJP SD70? Not coming to TSW3. I also bought the 700 thinking that, as a much-vaunted "loco DLC," I would be able to use it on at least one or two future routes. Even the Acela can be used on more than one route. But, again, no. Presumably custom liveries will now never appear where they do not already. And the list goes on.

I also find it rather disingenuous that DTG knew most of the roadmap fixes and improvements were never coming and left them on there anyway. However, I can't say that I am particularly surprised by any of this. I will be happy playing my library of DLC in TSW3, and who knows, at a deep enough discount perhaps TSW4 is not out of the question someday. TSW is leaving Game Pass so maybe the sales will be better? Anything is possible, but when we say DTG has poor communication with their players, I think this is what we are talking about.

 

Wake up Mattty I think I've got something to say to you.
We understand you are disappointed. Some agree with you, some are happy to move on. We get your point. DTG have made their decision, time to let it lie.

 

I’m looking forward to all the routes; particularly the US route and being able to “do” passenger services but get that desert / mountain scenery.

swiss route looks great and Azuma is my highlight

I’m SO PLEASED that controller rumble and haptics are being introduced; really will add another level of immersion, so very much looking forward to how this is implemented on PS5.

Free Roam and being able to plonk any train onto any route in service mode so you get full timetabled AI running around sounds awesome!

 

They aren't a "god awful" company. They are just a normal company. This is how pretty much any publicly traded business works.

 

How can you comment on something you don’t use?

I have something better than reading the forums … personal experience. I have had exactly one save game issue on tsw3. I happened to save while the doors were opening and I had to close them by hand when I wanted to leave the station. I couldn’t remember how to change from ac to dc on sehs and took so long I was way late. So I restored. This was during morning rush hour on a busy line. Save worked great. I’m not going to beat my head against the wall arguing with someone who is complaining about something they know nothing about

 

they are a private company, if they were public it would be easier to find out profit

 

because people are probably tired of the amount of complaining

 

Yes that would be ridiculous but this is a video game and not something important

 

Funny how you didn’t correct my assumption that you don’t even play the game.

makes sense now.

 

They are owned by Focus Entertainment. Which is a publicly traded company: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Focus_Entertainment

 

Tornado isn't dangerous so long as you manage the boiler properly, and in any case we are getting Flying Scotsman, not Tornado

 

I'm just disappointed in the current announced East Coast Main Line Petersborough to Doncaster so disappointing. I feel like it's too short of a route with a couple stations!!!

 

They meant it as a joke.

 

Why did you need the font like that? Also I think it's good. What's not to like?

 

Perhaps you should try it. It works better than you think. I’ve had exactly one signaling issue on lirr in which I slammed into a train on the station and I got a false green light. I had fortunately saved the station before. So I restored and innediately went to hard hard brake and was able to slow enough for the other train to move in time. I was able to finish the service.

now … should I have had to do that? Of course not. The game shouldn’t have that problem.

am I going to have a tantrum about it? No I’m not. The good outweighs the bad.

if you feel otherwise that’s fine. You can think what you want.

 

Likewise you don't take an old Ford Kuga back to the dealership and have a massive girly strop when they refuse to make it like the new model do you?

Maybe you do, I dunno.

 

I respect your point. I'm very critical of DTG and I'm very vocal when it comes to their content myself. I'm still patiently waiting for NYT new timetable. I was very disappointed with the two out of the 3 routes that aere launching with TSW4. If you don't like any of the routes or deluxe offered locos , I feel your frustration. Honestly, I don't see myself playing Antelope route more than a couple of times. Is not my cup of tea. The section of the ECML was probably the easiest to make (only 5 stations) and most boring part of the ECML. the LNER 801 is coming with the route which is what I'm looking forward to. I think it was a missed opportunity not to make the ECML south, but I think with the amount of work and assets it requires to make the ECML south, it would have to be a standalone DLC as it would have probably cost themselves to priced themselves out for what players are willing to pay.
I'm not interested in steam so won't probably play with the Flying Scotsman loco. The only two other items I'm interested in is the S-bahn Austrian route and Vectron. I do like metro style routes, so it fits my play style. I was very upset initially, but after doing the math I think is a good price if you like some of the content. In my opinion, I think they should had offered a basic package for those that just wanted the one or both of the deluxe loco or even offered a free upgrade for TSW4. At the end, they should be confident that the player base will buy new DLC in the near future. I think mostly, included myself, don't like with their tactics and furthermore, they have a bad history when it comes to keeping promises.
I know is a business to make money. But there way of doing business and treating your customers to keep them happy and buying more future content. I stated this many months ago, I don't think they would have lost any money by offering free upgrade. This practice is already has been in place in TSC, so they should know more or less what financial cost would be. Is my opinion and by no means I'm no expert. Just think, free upgrade today, next month the JT route comes out which you know lots of players will likely get. They will get their money sooner or later. And just remember, everyone has a boss.

 

On the TSW4 Steam page under the special edition it says:4 more TSW compatible routes. What does that mean exactly?

 

What warranty do DTG offer? That the game will be perfectly realised for every user? Come on.