Or just a part of a route like they did with the CSX: Heavy Haul Beta. The Academy is worthless, as it just contains very simple tracks, the Training Center (which is an updated version of TSC's TestTrak) would be better, but I think a route will get people into it much quicker. Personally, I tend to write short reviews, there's other people that can summarize the experience better than me, I consider myself a bug hunter. And a Youtube review tells more than a thousand words, if done unbiased. Still miss "At The Railyard"
I just posted my positive review I am very much a newbie to TSW, i only bought TSW3 back in June and absolutely loved it and so bought lots of DLC and had no issues buying TSW4 as i just enjoy playing routes. i also noticed on some of the negative reviews like one by Not so Spoopy Bob has 16 hours of gameplay on TSW4, and itzmxrkomg had 4.8hrs at time of his negative review but he has now 5.3hrs, it seems like these two are really hating the game so much that they must keep playing it.
I think if you base your purchasing decisions on steam reviews, not just for this game but I have seen them for other games in a similar vein, then you probably shouldn't be allowed out on your own!
As an aggregate, if Steam reviews are mostly positive or negative there's usually something there to look into. If a game showed Overwhelmingly Positive and it's a genre that you liked it may influence people's purchasing decisions. Same in the reverse. Not everybody takes reviews seriously, but like it or not they do influence some people's purchasing decisions.
Yes of course, I did have my tongue firmly in my cheek when I typed that, I was really going on the current crop of reviews for TSW4. One liners, including a positive review "I like trains". I don't buy many games but when I do it is just taking a chance if it is cheap or watching Youtube videos, I have never found the steam reviews very convincing really.
Dishonest? No. But they do tend to look on things in a more favourable light...or subtly avoid situations that could prompt a negative response. For example: I remember British ace playing Tramsim and whilst he was waiting for a set of lights to change he went outside and did a camera sweep....but whilst doing so he caught an AI vehicle pointing vertically, with it's front end buried in the road. Instead of commenting on it (as neutrally minded streamers would) he instead went to great lengths to ensure it didn't fall into view again and immediately moved the conversation on. A rather extreme example, granted, but nonetheless, it does kind of highlight what ambassadors are prepared to do for the sake of a little self-preservation.
If the game is good and the developer cares for the content, some extremists cannot pull the rating of a game down. It's just sad to see that DTG are constantly sabotaging themselves, ruining their own game. The game is great, it's just those glaring issues that are not being addressed that are frustrating, and this gets reflected in the reviews. I'm happy much has been fixed with the Mega Patch - but most of it were issues DTG introduced themselves, breaking former functionality.
Strange really because I don't ever recall anyone ever criticising all those completely useless 5 star reviews (of which there are quite a few) on the XBox marketplace that offer zero insight as to what the game has to offer! But there again they've helped bolster the average score so I guess that's ok! The other thing is, I've actually taken the time to read some of those negative reviews and contrary to popular belief, a fair chunk of them don't just fixate on one thing, they're extremely comprehensive and list a sizeable amount of 'cons' as well as a few 'pros'. Sure, there's the usual pointless negatives from the Steam Ultras - but the only difference between them and the pointless positives on XBox is that one set works to your advantage and one doesn't. By all means encourage the community to review their thoughts (I'd also recommend they do it because all opinions matter) but when you look at the bigger picture, asking them to do it "for a balanced view" just comes across as a little bit desperate. I applaud your cheek though.
I think the reputation so far established supercedes any steam review trend. Steam reviews at this point really only serve to confirm or deny that reputation, especially on cyclical releases which traditionally score lower. If you don't like negative reviews, fix the issues causing them. Better still, don't let the issues make it out the door on release. By any standard and regardless of where blame lies, its been a shambles. That's before we even get to reviewing the product itself. Given a lot of issues exist there too with poor sound quality, not yet released elements that form a major part of the upgrade (for that is what it is) missing at launch, graphical issues that have been in TSW for years and for which the community themselves now apply fixes routinely etc etc etc.. Well, on the basis of that I think the reviews at the very least provide reasons for research before purchase. That seems reasonable to me.
Wow, actually I didn't wanted to contribute in this thread, but this reply triggered me really hard and even after hours I'm fuming. Yes! There are a lot of trolls and inconsiderate people who write "reviews" and yes, there are a lot of reviews that do not consider actual gameplay. Everyone on the internet knows that. But given the behaviour of DTG considering all what happend last year with TSW3 and in the last two days with 4 you really wonder and question why there are so many negative reviews? Are you kidding me? DTG build this reputation it self and this triggers trolls and honest gamers a like. Screw the first group. But on the second group: All we want is a working game. We don't want to download the complete library every year, waiting days for already paid content to arrive (and I don't care whos fault it is, in the end it is your game and your choice of operation). The excuse that it is a "new" game and hickups occure does not count because this is the third time you do this stunt. So if anything you as representative of DTG deserve is a lot of clown faces, because it is a clown show. So all these negative initial reviews could also be seen as a cry for changing behaviour. I really want TSW to be a good game, I enjoy driving trains, I'm really passionate about it and I used to enjoy TSW, but the last 12 months it really became frustrating and all this is putting me off. Now since I haven't bought (yet) I haven't written a review, but as it stands I don't recommend TSW anymore.
Rather than make a new topic, I thought I'd piggy back here, do we know how well it's sold over the last two days?, I usually check the steam player numbers to give me an idea, 169 playing TSW3, and none playing TSW4? is that right?
Wow criticism about the lack of new and overhauled content justifying a whole new game that has to be bought again is "hate" or "trolling"? You've got to be kidding me honestly. If you don't understand, or do not want to understand the arguments, viewpoints and stance from others that differ just slightly from your own and your bubble's opinion and viewpoint on things - then do not engage in it, and especially do not pass your views and stances on things as the only correct one that exists
Somebody at DTG needs to get a grip JD. Nobody can advocate situation normal and expect to be taken seriously. Echo chamber massaging in a post launch conference review will serve nobody in the long run. Its just a game to us, but some of us badly want to see it succeed and succeed well, both immediately and for the long term. Of course for you as well its jobs and livelihoods. If the company and the company strategy is serious about being passionate and wanting to deliver a quality product (across the board), its time to prove it. I get the feeling the elastic is getting pretty stretched now. Just dont take any of this personally. It must be difficult for you to keep the headspace right in all of this. Just keep in mind the vast majority of us all want the same thing- a successful product of high quality that forms the backbone of a solid reputation. I think even you'd have to agree that there is potential left untapped there..
Absolutely. Though I could not get through that section near the end where you have to trap the Sentinels in the cells, without activating the invincibility cheat. That said it is a wonderful game and I genuinely had a tear in my eye at the moment you realise B12 isn’t going to make it. I do think they should have shown our protagonist reunited with his friends, though. I have heard rumours of a movie based on the game so definitely up for that. Anyhow sorry for OT ramble.
Steam reviews are important to developments as I believe as they hit negative territory they start losing traction and priority on the storefront pages, which is often a good reason for these yearly re-releases. I could be wrong though. But they are always a good way to get feedback and general feelings about these releases across to DTG. At the end of the day people often look at the ratings/written reviews before making a purchase. Previously TSW3 improved on TSW2 sale numbers/player numbers as far as I'm aware (again could be wrong). However, I don't see a similar happening here unless things greatly improve quickly, but I fear the damage has already been done just purely on the decision to go 4 after only a year.
In fairness, that is the experience many people buying TSW4 at launch will have had from the bug when everything got delisted for TSW3 and relisted, and odds are most of them don't pay attention to the forums, so won't have had the information once DTG became aware of what had happened. That's not on them as purchasers of TSW4, it's on the people who messed up the launch of all the TSW4 compatible DLC such that people temporarily lost access to it and were told by the stores that they had to rebuy it.
I definitely don't base my purchases based on reviews, what i was meaning was that those people who had given negative reviews were still playing the game based on their hours played.
Why wouldn’t they play a game that they bought? They want the game fixed so they can enjoy it properly. DTG came out as per usual with the bells and whistles on the announcement of TSW4. There are a lot of angry people that will now have to pay to see DLC patched to a new version of the game. Some of this DLC isn’t even 2 months old! No-one (as far as I can tell) has justified this decision even though this new game would have been long in the making when they pushed out DLC knowing full well they would never release the promised patches for the previous version which was current at the time. It seems TSW4 has the same mix of functionality issues, lighting, sounds, graphic bugs, features / content “coming soon” that all the other versions have! Coming on the forum and asking players to put forward a “balanced view” is a very interesting way to communicate. Maybe the negative reviews are based on the company practices and not the game, either way the potential customer will be left with the product of these business practices.
As they have purchased TSW4 then presumably they have read all the blurb and would know that the add-ons were to be transferred over. If they haven't then presumably they wouldn't have expected the add-ons to have been moved across so why would they be complaining if they thought it was a new version without the ability to transfer previous content? People should exercise some patience and instead of being angry on a whim, check out facts before leaving angry reviews which are factually incorrect. I will be interested to see in six months time how many of these have been redacted.
Posting a negative review is hardly reason to stop playing a game, you know. Both of the above have clearly made the decision to keep TSW4 (they've exceeded the refund threshold) but have decided that, after their varying amounts of time within the game, a negative review is the only one of the two options available to describe their overall experience. Besides, 4.8 hours - 5.3 hours isn't exactly obsessive amounts of negatively inclined gaming, is it?
My GWE review has me showing 0.0 hours playtime, which doesn't matter as the playtime gets reset with each new TSW. Still can't understand why they release the game in such a state (Track Monitor not toggable, no rain on the Talent windows, GWE wipers) which is again a sign of them not testing their game and not reading the Technical Reports. Those negative issues are weighing far more than the positives - because as a player, I am losing trust in the game and start questioning if all the rest is realistic at all. Probably the folks at Valve are already fearing next year's TSW5. DTG had already crashed Steam in the past (having the biggest DLC library on Steam for TSC), but this yearly transfer of entitlements, assigning those to each AppId and Bundle, is surely not an easy thing for Steam. No other game does this mass transfer of DLC to new versions. It is not a simple thing technically.
Quality control is pathetically non existent. Remember the great fanfare when they hired a dedicated QC Director? Did that person ever show up to work? I should have applied for the position myself. Get paid to do nothing. Win-win for me!
That is very obvious - and it's as bad for DTG as it is for us. Probably the devs check their work themselves - which leads to overlooking things because you're too much in it. 4-eye-principle? Guess not. Checklists (Brakes, Lights, all switches, wipers, etc)? Guess not. The Executive Producer stating the Track Monitor toggle works on his end - players reporting otherwise - where is the mistake here? It's perfectly understandable to not support legacy DLC - but if you leave them in a broken state - people will be angry. Why not, DTG? Regards, an ex Daimler Trucks QA employee
I'm pretty much done with DTG, I like playing TSW3, but I am not buying TSW4, or any content for it, as far as I am concerned DTG have acted in bad faith way too many times, and I've lost any confidence I had for them.
I'm not, though I was very angry often and wanted to dump the game many times, but the game offers things I enjoy that can't be found in other games. But if it weren't for TSC's accessibilty and easy to edit files, fixing stuff yourself, I'd probably not be playing that all. A misplaced tree up in the air? Just press Ctrl+E while playing, grab the tree and drag it to the bottom. Press play again, issue fixed in seconds. Not possible in TSW. In TSW that's much harder because of cooking (which is another thing than TSC's Serz xml tokeniser.) Cab camera views hardcoded - killer for me. Even one of the best content creators for TSC, JustTrains, has had terrible issues with file distribution. Combinations of their routes may crash the system, because Assets are spread over multiple folders, and you may end up with two .ap files in one asset folder, so you have to know what you're doing and can only get stuff to work by first installing to dummy folders and unpacking/repacking the assets. (And find workarounds to avoid Steam verifications undoing all your fixing). The Metropolitan Line has bad reviews on Steam. It's one of the best routes for TSC, superb quality, detailed scenery and stock, correct approach control signals - but the installation is the issue. All it takes for DTG is someone who is in charge say "Stop! Development halted, reputation is on the line here. The next two weeks will be bugfixing the backlog of issues." Do you really not want to get out of the fatal "Publish or Perish" cycle you're in?
Maybe that could have been done before, but too late. No new owner would say "sure I'll buy you, but don't make any money until you fix your house first". Shouldn't take too long for Focus to find out if they bought themselves a lemon.
Don't ever trust reviews! This kind of trolles are such a pain in the ass! The game is realy good but those kiddies are have fun to write so many things that is already fixed or not the end of the world!
That is your opinion. It's like somebody in here dismissing all issues by stating "I enjoy the game." Nice but not progressive. But this is not the point here. Someone may enjoy driving a car with smashed glass and wonky steering, others may not. And their point is valid. "Not the end of the world" is a highly dismissive term (that may help you accept things and not struggle with stuff you can't change in real life) - surely it's just a game, but we're measuring things inside that game's frame of reference and not the world's. Or to address your annoyance with the "kiddies", their reviews are not the end of the world, are they?
As DTG acknowledged, there was a BUG with the stores such that the stuff that was supposed to transfer over didn't because people had purchased them as part of historical SKUs which were overlooked in transferring legacy ownership, thus leading to stores trying to charge people who owned the old content to download the TSW4 compatible versions. It's entirely possible that a lot of people who already owned TSW3 went out and bought TSW4 on launch day having not followed any of the marketing, ran into this bug and quite reasonably drew that conclusion. https://forums.dovetailgames.com/th...tible-content-26th-september-overnight.74076/
Yes, there is a lot of elderly players in here, not being that fast in reading all the forums and FAQs and all that tech blabber, and I can perfectly understand them feeling lost, just wanting to press a button on their console and play the game - which is one of the pros of console gaming. The way DTG handles these DLC entitlement transfers due to constantly changing the AppID must be a PITA for the folks at Valve, Sony, Epic and MS. TSC is the same app (24010) with the same core depot (24009) for the last ten years now, where all the updates are taking place.
Another argument for having a single "Train Sim World" going forwards where there's none of this faff, as the core and route updates are all just pushed as patches to the same game.
That appears to be happening on both "sides" of the argument. I am sure a lot of the negative one line reviews of "I have to buy my content again" have been liked by some of the those who just want to be angry at DTG even they know the statement of those reviews to be factually incorrect.
Agreed. There should be a separate review section for the developer itself. I know it would be "overwhelmingly something"
I was watching a Post Scriptum review on youtube because I like to thoroughly research something before I buy it. Start watching from 20 seconds in for about 30 seconds.. You couldnt make it up.. Shows how reputations are forged though and once established can be hard to shift. Anyway, not a wasted exercise as it doesn't look like my cuppa tea (Post Scriptum that is). As they say, time spent on reconnaissance is seldom wasted.. Railroads Online on the other hand will likely be added to my library. Thats looking rather good fun tbh..
I decided to have a look at the steam reviews and honestly, it shows how pointless this thread is. Whilst yes some reviews lack detail, there were also those that explained why they didn't recommend tsw4. The most helpful review stated that Train Sim World 4 was exactly the same as TSW 3 and that the new features weren't significant enough to justify a new game and went on in great detail. Another negative review also said that the game was nice, but that he couldn't recommend it because of the quality not being good and explains the issues he had. I also watch Blu Games review who is a DTG ambassador I believe and he even agreed with some in the community that the features were not significant enough to warrant a new separate game and that tsw4 should have been an update with the dlc's being sold separately but gave a balanced assessment overall One thing I noticed is that the op didn't mention was positive reviews that lack any detail. In fact, there are some here that don't mention that at all but complain about the negative reviews which shows the hypocrisy of some in this thread. It leads me to believe that they don't mind if a positive review lacks detail, but if it's negative, then it's somehow a "pain to look at" There are those that say reviews are pointless which just isn't true. Whilst there are those that may think that, the reality is that reviews do sway people on whether to purchase a product or not. Games like Star Wars Jedi Survivor had poor user scores because of the performance which led me to buy the game several months after release for $10 on a third party site so EA couldn't get my money. Cyberpunk 2077 was a game I was looking forward too, but after the terrible launch, I will not buy that game. While those games have gotten better months after release, the damage had already been done and hurt the reputation of the developers and I'm not alone in that view The DB BR 187 was a train that I considered buying when it was announced for tsw2, but I didn't get it because of the issues and reviews that explained why it wasn't a good locomotive. This thread can easily be summed up as, I like the game but if someone says something that I don't agree with, then they are wrong and the reviews are a pain to look at. There are many reviews that are detailed (positive-negative) and explain why they would or would not recommend the product. To dismiss negative reviews because they don't fit your viewpoint is disingenuous and frankly hypocritical given that positive reviews that lack detail are fine by the OP's logic. If you like the game, that is fine. But there will be those that don't and can explain why even if you may not agree with them. Also, this whole mess with dlc's not being brought over on release could easily be prevented if DTG didn't re-release TSW over and over again. It really must be a pain for Valve, Sony, Epic and Microsoft to have to deal with this.
DTG need to find the reason people are posting negative reviews. The answers are all in here, on the forums. You can't change a reviewer's opinion by telling them to do so (someone used the word "desperate" which fits well), but by sorting out the issues that lead to negative reviews. Simple as that. For example, there is a lot of complaints on the ETS2 Steam forums. Almost ALL of these are user errors, bad mods (or mod combinations which modify the same file) and crazy expectations ("Why not 1:1 scale", "Why can I hire only 300 drivers?", "Why is my town not featured", "Why is my game crashing", "Why can't I drive faster than 90 km/h, it's boring!"). Two members are seemingly permanently active (Mojo and Wolfgang) only having to tell each player the same simple stuff over and over again. I'm playing and loving ETS2, got a huge map combo that goes from Iceland to Korea seamlessly and Promods, some truck mods (which I am able to maintain and update or fix myself luckily), and have not had any issues with that game at all. It is very well maintained, and the player base gets informed well in advance on upcoming DLC, and the developers really are taking their time to release a polished and QA approved DLC, and permanently adding features and reworking older maps for free. Success story. Having their own game engine makes development a lot easier for SCS. DTG chose UE4 for the looks and saving development costs, while it seemingly makes it harder to maintain, fix and add features TSC has that seem impossible on TSW. (The bare "9" map, real FreeRoam using any stock, inline editor, trackside cinematic camera, coupling camera, and whatnot) And the overall ETS2 reviews are positive, because if the game really is good and delivers what it promises, those extremist bad reviews become irrelevant.
I feel bad for the stores. When DTG comes to them and says they're releasing the same game under a new number yet again... "Oh no, not you guys again"
Train Sim World 4 currently has a review of Mixed on the steam store page. If anyone wants to read the reviews, then here is the link... https://store.steampowered.com/app/2362300/Train_Sim_World_4/
Funny enough if you read these forums and comments elsewhere the review score is oddly accurate. A lot of positive and negative voices out there. Mixed sounds about right to me.
