[poll] Dtg Update - New Hst Camera Position

Discussion in 'TSW General Discussion' started by Spikee1975, Nov 1, 2023.

?
  1. Yes

    37.2%
  2. No, the old one was better.

    62.8%
  1. Spikee1975

    Spikee1975 Guest

    Just curious - according to DTG, the community asked for a raised driver position on the GWR HST. I am not aware where they got this feedback from. They raised the viewpoint by 10 centimetres.

    I will revert this in my next cabview mod update, but I'm curious for your opinions. If the majority's fine with the new cam, I'll offer the mod as a standalone. If overwhelmingly not, then I'll include it in the full package.

    Edit: Just uploading new mod update. You can now use the left / right arrow keys to switch between camera heights. I have modified the secondman's view therefore, which is still available by sitting in the secondman's seat.

    OLD / NEW
    43old.png 43new.png

    Standalone mod that reverts it for PC/Steam is attached. Note: if you use my All-In-One mod, delete this file.
     

    Attached Files:

    Last edited by a moderator: Nov 1, 2023
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  2. matt245621#2075

    matt245621#2075 Well-Known Member

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    For some reason I can't see the image, what you have attached.
     
  3. Spikee1975

    Spikee1975 Guest

    It's not an image, it's a mod :)
     
  4. matt245621#2075

    matt245621#2075 Well-Known Member

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    Oh my fault.
     
  5. matt245621#2075

    matt245621#2075 Well-Known Member

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    But I haven't even got the update for the HST on console because we are alway last.
     
  6. Myron

    Myron Well-Known Member

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    it's a .zip file
     
  7. BeastyBill88

    BeastyBill88 Well-Known Member

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    I have never seen this community feedback on adjusting the height of the HST view, surely you'd think a actual bug would take priority over this such as the broken wipers *facepalm*
     
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  8. Spikee1975

    Spikee1975 Guest

    I can make a mod that satisfies both by adding a camera view, so you're able to switch between two heights using the arrow keys.

    Personally, I prefer the laid back lower position in high speed trains vs raised position in commuters.

    Edit: Can't add a camera here for technical reasons, but I can sacrifice the secondman view (which is still available if you actually sit in the secondman's seat).

    Done. Will include this for GWE and MML in my next update - you can choose your desired height now.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Nov 1, 2023
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  9. jack#9468

    jack#9468 Well-Known Member

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    I've been waiting for a fix on SEHS (full and reduced timetable) where I get a crash at Stratford (all Javelin and TGV services unplayable) since June. Bugs are not their priority.
     
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  10. AtherianKing

    AtherianKing Guest

    This is the new one on console in my opinion the inferior one (Series X)

    upload_2023-11-1_16-18-2.jpeg
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Nov 1, 2023
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  11. Spikee1975

    Spikee1975 Guest

    FOV is the same, 90 degrees on all systems. :)
     
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  12. AtherianKing

    AtherianKing Guest

    I see now, slightly looking down shows the cab controls better, as on the pc pictures it doesn’t show the blind on those pictures :)
     
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  13. shaun.jobson

    shaun.jobson New Member

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    I don’t mind it but see it as unnecessary when the wipers don’t work.

    And the MML HST has the DSD on / off reversed and can’t be acknowledged by a controller, fun times.
     
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  14. AtherianKing

    AtherianKing Guest

    kind of shocking they would miss such an opportunity of these rare release windows to not fix that locos most pressing issue..
     
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  15. Spikee1975

    Spikee1975 Guest

    The way I see it DTG have troubles setting priorities.

    The last TSW3 update introduced Livery Designer compatibility for the HST. That required a rework of the mesh - breaking the position of the precipitation removal glass material. TSW3 players are left with that broken HST (though you can rollback that patch using the Steam console command "download_depot <gameID> <depotID> <manifestID>" to download a specific version of any DLC).

    They probably now fear the backlash that will happen from creators when a wiper fix will break all liveries designed so far.

    But correct simulation should always have higher priority! Sheesh, I'm driving around London - it just HAS to be raining.

    But then I remember Matt streaming a TSC scenario on Marias Pass, where you could clearly see that one broken wiper which was never officially fixed, and you had to copy the animation .ban files from the Sherman Hill ES44 to Marias Pass' assets.
     
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  16. AtherianKing

    AtherianKing Guest

    I agree but I think if they feared fixing wipers would break liveries then they would have feared changing seat height could do the same, which they don’t seem to have done.
     
  17. Spikee1975

    Spikee1975 Guest

    No, camera height is just a value, doesn't affect the 3D model at all. LD does, as the 3D mesh needs defined areas where LD applies to, completely changing the model structure.
     
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  18. jack#9468

    jack#9468 Well-Known Member

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    To all those who wanted HST livery designer, are you happy you got it?
     
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  19. AtherianKing

    AtherianKing Guest

    yes. I have a bit of project going on with it, even better with 1000 layers per coach

    those who enjoy livery designer don’t ask to have the wipers stop working, it’s not having the livery designers fault otherwise it would be on all trains with livery designer.
     
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  20. jack#9468

    jack#9468 Well-Known Member

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    I was more poking fun at the fact it came, but then broke something else that was working.

    I can see the benefits though.
     
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  21. AtherianKing

    AtherianKing Guest

    all fine :), it’s quite often a feared case for different features aswell, I have often read posts about how they hope DTG bring no updates in case it breaks a working loco etc
     
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  22. Spikee1975

    Spikee1975 Guest

    So I still do not know why DTG did this, not a big deal for me using my mod, but still puzzled if there was some sort of miscommunication with that apparently non-existent "community feedback".

    If you look at the GWE Class 166, that's the one that would have needed a raised camera. I've adressed that in my CabCam mod.

    DEFAULT / NEW
    166old.png
    166new.png
     
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  23. AtherianKing

    AtherianKing Guest

    also one what could do with a little wider FOV like the 465
     
  24. Spikee1975

    Spikee1975 Guest

    FOV is always the same, 90 degrees. Altering it fundamentally changes your perception of speed. Zoom in for example and everything appears to be slowing down. Zoom out, everything will appear to move faster. Also wider FOV will limit visibility, as the window view size will shrink.

    Speed is measured as way divided by time. Increased FOV means you'll have more "way" in your view, thus perceived way/time=increased. Lowering FOV means there's less way in your view, lowering the result, which gives a lower speed perception. This has nothing to do with camera placement.

    Higher FOV (same camera position, where your eyes would be in real life)
    2023-11-05 23_27_55-Train Sim World 4®.png
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Nov 7, 2023
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  25. AtherianKing

    AtherianKing Guest

    The 166 from my perspective always seemed a little low on the camera, and a little side view restricted similar to but not as much the 465.
     
  26. sam5166

    sam5166 Well-Known Member

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    I had no issues with the Class 43 camera view and the 166. I'm confused as why DTG decided to change the camera position.

    I think what we really need is to have the player be able to adjust the camera view to their liking in the settings. Many Games do have this as an option so I don't get why TSW 4 doesn't have an option
     
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  27. Spikee1975

    Spikee1975 Guest

    Well, the 166 is definitely too low, as seen in the screenshot in rainy/snowy conditions - that's why I have raised it myself.

    Just as a reference, in real life the middle of the parked wiper lines up with your eyes (and thus the horizon) on the 166, if you're seated correctly. If I put it that high, the speedo would be out of sight (approximately having you look down by 60 to 70 degrees), so it's a compromise (but very close in my mod). In reality you would move your eyeballs (not your head) down to check the speed, this can't be done in the game.

    Game FOV is always smaller than your eyes', else you'd have distortion as monitors are not spherical like your retina but flat (or slightly curved). (Set a FOV of 200 which matches the human eye in any game and you'll see it's unplayable and probably makes you feel motion sickness pretty soon - which can also happen at the moment you're close enough to the monitor so the game FOV and your FOV (angle between eyes and left/right monitor borders) suddenly match up and the brain perceives it as real. Try it, play the game and slowly move closer toward the screen, there'll be a moment when it suddenly feals very real).

    12.png
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Nov 7, 2023
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