Enough Is Enough!!! The Ongoing Saga!!! 2 Year Anniversary

Are we done guys? That's so unnecessary.
Now we know who's the 10 years old kid here. Stop being childish please.

 

Both of you pack it in. It’s getting tedious.

 

Oh my goodness. Just let it go and move on.

 

Enough is Enough!!!
Stop arguing

 

Stop baiting each other, this is 1 thread I don't want to see locked

 

Absolutely.

The forum has run quite well with minimal moderation over the Holiday period but obviously the cracks are now starting to show. As stated, if they want to have a keyboard duel take it to private message or Discord or something. Or grow up.

 

You could also do the same, last time I looked, you didn't have the authority to decide who, or what, gets posted.

 

All you're doing is adding fuel to the fire.

Also, quoting me is asking for a response, and I'm telling people to stop because it's gone far enough and the last thing we want is for this thread to get locked.

I give up.

 

Back on the topic, the mother home of DTG, Focus Entertainement ! I checked all those complicated graphs and it's still going down. But the all time low was passed apparently the 20/12/2023 right during the sales. Then it is going up a bit after the sales (Maybe what some of us buyed) and then falling again. What is surprising is that Ubisoft also had a big low around the same period as Focus. See below :

And Ubisoft add a low the 12/12/2023 and then goes up a bit during the Steam Sales like Focus

 

This 1000%. It really isn't a difficult thing for that individual to comprehend

 

Agreed.

 

I think focus will have a turnaround this year. The main reason why Focus stocks declined was due to low sales of Atlas Fallen.

Perhaps the low stock is also why DTG have been releasing gameplay packs and short routes like the Maintalbahn and now the Goblin Line as a way to get some money in the bank

 

Saber/Focus also just recently announced a new Mudrunner game coming early next year. That could be part of the reason for the recent improvements.

 

You don't HAVE to respond, to quoted post, or otherwise.

 

Can, y'all just drop it?

You're derailing this thread more than Norfolk Southern Derails trains IRL......

 

I think at this point it's probably wise for everyone to just put Jack on ignore, like I just have.

 

Why are you incapable of taking your own advice? Talk about hypocrisy when I didn't even reply to you. And enough with what is essentially whataboutism.

I never have put anyone on a ignore list before, but frankly I've had enough of you (as one user rightly put it) acting like a 10 year old child

 

What I find strange about Focus it that they had a super big license like Farming Simulator for 7 years but then they don't have it anymore... How can you loose such a big thing ? If they lose a big game like that what else could they also lose ?

 

Me too, i've had enough with that guy.

 

I hope the thread doesn’t get locked because of the nonsense that isn’t related to the topic. Everybody not talking about TSW, DTG or Focus needs to stop posting.

This thread may seem all doom and gloom towards DTG and Focus but is a valuable outlet for the general feelings of dismay towards them and the direction TSW may be heading and needs to be kept open as that outlet to keep such feelings from taking over other more specific threads. It’s a valuable resource for people to post their feelings and supporting evidence and also to counteract that with some optimism if there is any.

 

I think Giants decided to self publish after there was some issue with publishers, one being Focus, being involved with breaking EU law.

 

That is what I think... -> From Wikipedia : "At the end of 2020, after much criticism from gamers about the franchise's lack of renewal, GIANTS Software announced that it was ending its annual release system to focus on adding content to the latest opuses. On April 22, 2021, the publisher announced that the next edition would be released at the end of that year."

I guess that the "annual release system" part is Focus and the "adding content" part is not Focus. A situation a bit similar to what we know with TSW.

Edit: Clarification

 

Venturing slightly off topic (but hopefully in a good way), Farming Simulator peaked with FS17. Couldn't get on with FS19 or the latest version. Some of the mod farms created for 17 like Oakfield or the Irish one where you had to drive a vehicle ferry were utterly fantastic.

 

I can't remember where I saw it, but apparently farmers are or were using FS to trial new equipment before purchase the real thing. A bit like pilots using simulators as part of their proper training hours.

 

Yes, I think it's important to look at the sector as a whole rather than focusing (no pun intended!) on one stock and making assumptions from just that. One adage to consider, especially in tech stocks, is "buy on the rumour, sell on the news".

 

Interesting but strange as I always found the physics rather poor, more so in 19 and my brief foray into 22. No inertia at all, you had to keep the throttle pushed continuously or the vehicle just stopped. Similar to Snowrunner in that respect.

 

As far as TSW5 is concerned - I fully expect it to come out this year, being announced in August and releasing the following month. That is unless DTG start reading the room and start treating their customers with a bit of respect and/or realise that recompiling their work multiple times, each version with separate bugs is simply not sustainable. I do not expect this to happen though. This will be my final post on the matter, at least in this thread.

 

Not entirely, I don't think. Focus was only ever the publisher for FS; it was Giants' IP and they got to call the shots- and eventually decided that publishing in-house was more lucrative (it always is, once your studio has sufficient heft and name recognition). Whereas DTG are an outright subsidiary of Focus and have to do as they're told.

 

I think it is fair to say TSW5 will come out at some time but no-one really knows when yet but if Focus are struggling do you think they would invest the resources in such a niche game?

 

Do they invest a lot of ressource with ctrl+c and ctrl+v ? Because that is what will probably happens

 

Anyone else slightly worried about this focus thing? It's nice to have a decent rail sim, especially on consoles and I know I've been critical of DTG the past several months, but I am "looking over my shoulder"

 

Just two of the sites I look at for a quick snapshot of how things are looking.
Train Sim World® 4 Steam stats - Video Game Insights (vginsights.com)
and
https://steamdb.info/app/2362300/charts/#48h
I do believe they will Have TSW5, I say this as I looked at the release dates/intervals for TSW1, TSW2, TSW3, and TSW4.
I would rather it be A Core update and major bug fixes and just expand TSW4 now that we have had it this long.

 

I am not worried, I will worry when it is clear there is something to worry about. I suspect there will not be something to worry about, I am convinced some on here just want to create drama for the sake of it or some kind of agenda.

Just because the forums armchair CEO's and accountants say it is so, does not mean it is so. You can prove a lot of things with figures and statistics in isolation. Lies, damned lies and statistics.

I also think it is unedifying, and frankly disgusting speculating on a companies future on the very forum run by the company in view of the very staff whose futures are being speculated upon.

 

Yes and no, because some people on the forums want the best for DTG

 

I am sure most of us (not all though) want the best for DTG.

In what way does speculating over the future of a company in front of their staff (the very people who would be affected if the worst was to happen) demonstrate wanting the best?

There is already someone above "looking over their shoulder" due to this speculation. If lots start doing the same, how is that going to help?

 

People see that Focus stock price is down. In any industry, when a stock is low, that fuels speculation. It is quite common. Now I don't think it's doom and gloom as I expect Focus to have a turnaround, nor do I want TSW to fail, but it's not surprising that there are those speculating. It's just that, speculation and nothing more.

As for the staff, I'm not sure why that matters. This is a forum where many things are said. There are things that are said that may not be pleasing to some. If staff can't handle what is being said, that isn't our problem. They probably don't even care as it is just nothing more than speculation.

 

Speculation leads to rumour, the internet is great for rumours spreading. "I saw on DTG's forums that Focus stock price is down" then becomes "I read on DTG's forums that Focus are in trouble".

I have worked in industry for over 30 years, I have seen untrue rumours become "fact", something which can actually end up doing damage to a company where there wasn't even a problem before.

It might sound over the top but it can happen, probably unlikely, but can happen.

Just because you can do something doesn't mean you should. Maybe staff members don't care but no-one knows whether they do or not. I wouldn't want to read stuff like this, even if I was convinced there was little to worry about.

A "free" society shouldn't mean that thought to individuals should be ignored in pursuit of the desire to assert those freedoms.

Maybe DTG don't care and are laughing at all this, no DTG moderator has made a comment after all. However, as I said before, comments have been made from DTG staff about DTG staff not wanting to visit the forums or finding them hard to read.

 

Whilst there are those that can't handle certain comments, that's for those staff to deal with themselves. If that is indeed true, then that is a choice they made and doesn't really concern me as a player. I do understand why you are more sympathetic to that.

Also I don't dispute what you have said. There are people who's reputation have been tarnished by false allegations or ridiculous comments, but DTG are doing fine as a business. Focus Entertainment are fine. Just because there are those speculating doom and gloom is just speculation and there is no need to worry about what some random people have to say on the internet about a companies future. I don't think inviduals who are saying that DTG will fail or Focus will collapse will result in that actually happening.

I may have my issues with some of DTG'S business practices, but it's just better for employees in any business in general to just carry on with the work you are assigned to do rather than let negativity bring you down. Also use the criticisms to make improvements which at the end of the day is what most players want.

 

You are very right on that point !
(Is that correct english ??)

 

If their plan is to milk TSW as much as they can (which it almost certainly is), any way to make money will be exploited.

So should we just ignore it? Pretend it isn't happening, never will happen, and wasn't even a thing to begin with?

It is a thing that needs to be talked about. We are talking about it and will continue to do so.

 

Giants probably figured they could stand on their own and take their franchise forward the way they want rather than being dictated by an overlord corporation. Seems like they are on the right track sticking with FS22 for an extended period and flushing it out. It's paying off too. I didn't really like FS19, but 22 seems to be a far better build that I enjoy playing from time to time.

 

Yeah I agree, the physics in FS games seem way off. Like tractors filled with helium tumbling down a hill. These are huge vehicles yet lack the feeling of weight. Although I do find an improvement from FS19 to 22, but it's still lacking.

 

Doesn't take much resources to release a game patch and slap a number 5 on the cover graphic

 

I disagree on some points.

I find that this discussion is led in a very objective and civil manner. We're discussing publicly accessible numbers, risks and future outlooks, while your arguments are very subjective and emotion driven. ("don't want to read this")

Even if you do not want to read this, you could just stay away from this thread. It's a good sign we don't have censorship that some may want, almost in a "woke" or communistic fashion. The individual is nothing, the mass is what counts. Focus are a capitalist shareholder company, and the brutal laws of the market apply to them too.

If you want the best for DTG and are convinced everything's fine atm, there's only one thing you can do: buy a lot of their stock NOW, because following your estimations, the prices will rise. You'll help Focus and DTG, and also make a little fortune if things are as you think. If you don't, you'll not be helpful for DTG. They don't need kind words, they need cash. They are in debt more than their company is worth - that's just a fact and no rumour. TSW2 has even been put back on the shelves.

If you think these rumours are "lies", I could as well apply Hitchens' Razor and say the same about your point that "everything's fine". Not going anywhere. The rumours are not coming out of nowhere, it's just analyzing and seeing the whole picture. Bugs, premature releases, missing promised features, and market analysis. Selling RailSimulator.com to Focus.

I also think it's not fine that GWR don't want to be featured anymore in the game.

Nobody here has an agenda. But some in here may be shareholders (then having a positive agenda towards Focus naturally), and in the end speculation is a natural thing on the stock market. A dollar bill only has worth because you have trust that you will get something in return for it at that value.

There were big companies, Commodore, Nokia, Blackberry - who all said the same. Everything's fine. Let's not look at what people are thinking.

And I wouldn't worry if DTG staff are having a hard time reading this - be sure there are meetings now where of course they will have to discuss this for their own sake. (And the forums are not that relevant, according to Alex 83% of communication takes place on Discord nowadays. Things just are not fine at the moment. Ignoring this will make it worse. Can't put your head in the sand - we'll you're free to do so, but not to ask the same from others. Even DTG Ambassadors like Felix der Weise pointed out that things are not going well.

DTG stated multiple times that it's absolutely ok to criticise them as long as you are not personally attacking staff - which is not what this discussion is about.

Expecting DTG staff to comment on this is also not realistic, you're not supposed to talk about internals of your company on a public forum. Focus are obliged to present their numbers, but not DTG. DTG's comment is the Roadmap and the quality of their releases.

So again: You want to be helpful - buy Focus shares!

 

Might be slightly different than what you're talking about, but what comes to my mind with that sentence is the Embracer Group situation. They're going though major troubles of their own due to a failed deal with Saudi Arabia. 2022 year they were buying stuff left and right, then the next year mass layoffs across all divisions, the complete shut down of Free Radical which happened last month, and I believe there's rumors of Gearbox getting sold off that still have yet to happen.

 

Over the years my wife worked at several companies who told staff everything was fine, only to go to the wall a few months later. The last one didn’t even have enough money to pay final wages, holiday pay or redundancy money all of which had to be claimed from the government.

Even in my own railway career I remember going on a team event and being assured by the Line Manager everything was in fine fettle and the department was appreciated and well funded. Cue two weeks later when we all got called in and told a substantial reorganisation and downsizing was required, including compulsory redundancy for a few unfortunate people.

So never say never.

 

It's happened to me a few times, the last two, everything was fine up until the day they closed the doors!

 

No im not worried at all. I dont care. My wallet is closed for DTG and nothing will ever change that anymore.

Looking forward to support JT, but only if their next release has the same standard as preston blackpool.

 

so I'm in the wrong for feeling worried about it? I mean its not a secret, the financial issues are in the public domain and I don't see a "don't worry, dtg is fine" statement anywhere. I respect your opinion, even if it is OTT

 

It is more hyperbole, my arguments are certainly not emotionally driven, they are driven out of frustration from reading "armchair" experts prophesising on the apparent possible demise of a company where I feel it is innapproprate to do so and irresponsible.

Who mentioned lies, I certainly didn't? If you are going to look at a fall in their stocks, maybe wait six months and see what happens in the next six months, I guarantee if they have risen we will not be having the same discussion, "oh look how well Focus's shares are doing", it has never been an interest before on these forums. All is happening is that it is stirring anxiety, rumours and assumption.

I have no interest in buying shares in any company, all I am interested in is the development of TSW and TSC.

It is all assumption, how can you possible know that they are having these discussion in house and why would you think anyone who might not be expressing any angst about this are likely shareholders.

Anyway carry on if it makes you feel better, I personally think it is out of order, but obviously that is just my opinion.