Dovetail Games Berninalinie Preview - Q&a Thread

1. Why is this so expensive when only part of the line is depicted?

2. Why was the section to St Moritz including the major hub at Pontresina not included?

3. Are there intentions this will be Stage One early access and the route will be extended to its logical destination later in the year?

4. What if any assurance do with have that Rivet have pulled their socks up given the dire state some of their previous titles released and been left in?

 

Why do developers for TSW struggle to set up materials correctly? Yet again, 7 years into the games development, we are getting another DLC where (as an example) the passengers hair is incorrectly set up such that their hair glows in certain lighting conditions? Some may dismiss this as a ‘small thing’ but it is basic stuff and that this is still happening just isn’t good enough, especially at £30 for a relatively scant DLC

 

1. Are the sounds of the Allegra and passenger coaches recorded from real sources and properly implemented
2. Are there plans for future DLC for this route with other trains that are not just reskins of existing ones ?

 

Guaranteed most of these questions won't be answered but I'll try anyway

1. Why end the line at Ospizio and not a more logical end point?

2. Why does the PIS in the video say Ospizio despite the fact no train ever terminates there?


3. Why is the observation coach from Arosa there despite it never being used on the Bernina Linie?

4. Have any lessons been learnt when it comes to building a Swiss route after the poor reception to both Arosa Linie and Luzern Sursee?

Edit: Removed Question regarding Timetable as it appears to be accurate

 

if the route release is successful, can we expect:
1. to expand this route in the future;
2. to the remaster of the Arosa route;
3. if a remaster of Arosa is not planned, could it be improved to TSW4 standards and a new schedule with the participation of Alegra.

 

The availability of the public editor debunked that particular myth. Not if they keep an uncooked master copy which they have to do anyway to (maybe, as it's Rivet) fix any issues once the route is released.

And with respect, this thread is for questions we want DTG and Rivet to answer, not other forum members.

 

What's wrong with 49 services? From what I've been able to read from wikipedia, it says 1 train per hour each direction so sounds about right. Railroads aren't running the full 24 hours.

Also I've found on google that there are panoramic cars in bernina line. The arosa line observation coach is really the only one there is in tsw so that's probably why it was included

 

How many days until tsw5 is announced?

 

It seems my initial research into service numbers on Bernina was inaccurate and will remove that question. Multiple people were telling me the service number for Bernina was wrong but having checked again it does seem mostly accurate so I will admit I made a mistake.

Regarding the observation coach I still think it's weird to include it, it might not matter to most people but I find it strange, fortunately I do not own the RHB Anniversary Collection so it won't appear in game for me but I'm generally not a fan of adding fictional stuff to routes.

 

- Is the timetable with real life timings, or AI-generated?
- The PIS on the Allegra, is it a texture (like for example the Flirt) or is it text-based and dynamic (so using the data from the route. That way, it could show correct destinations on future routes)
- Why does the PIS in some shots show Ospizio, when no train terminates there?
- Are the BEX seasonal as irl?
- Can you say anything about potential future DLC for the route? (ABe 4/4 III with BEX-coaches would actually be the perfect DLC for this)
- Any chance of ever getting Ospizio Bernina-St. Moritz, as just those 22 km alone as a route don't really make much sense (imho, those should have been included here too, to have a complete route. Yes Arosa was also only 25km, but at least it was a complete route)
- why no 3D-snow? you mentionned it hiding the details of the mountains, but that is what happens irl too
- do the trains have end of the train devices? street running trains need to have a red light at the end, when it is dark outside.
-The observation coach we have is not allowed at all to run on Bernina, so why layer it there?

 

will be keeping an eye on this, as I have been burnt badly with Luzern Sursee - did play a bit of it, as I liked the train itself... until I ran into the really broken ETCS... which was my main thing when deciding to buy it, and since it is still broken, I still dont play it... only have it installed so I can have nice 523s passing me by occasionally in Vorarlberg

 

1. Why are you guys at DTG blatantly hiding from the recent uproar of your fan base and the state of the game? *Hint* Stop ignoring us in recent posts, read the replies and actually show us some respect with answer and reasoning**

 

What can they say? Whatever they say, players wouldn't be happy. If they say no plans or we don't have an update, players would not be happy. They'll just think dtg abandoned it and call them lazy or something along the lines. If they apologize, players would say they don't buy it. If they acknowledge issues exist and explain why things are the way they are, players would be unhappy. If they are honest, players get upset. If they don't say anything, players get upset. Even if they said that they are overhauling the game and fixing all major bugs, players wouldn't believe them. So what do they say?

 

So you think its appropriate as a small studio like DTG to ignore their players who support their work? Its not like we don't play the games they make. I still support them just like everyone else does. But its the flaws that go unacknowledged that gets to the loyal players. Almost all of us here have bought every iteration of the game. Its a good game with flaws that need attention. Because the flaws are doubling every new game that comes out.

 

Now this sound like an entitled rant. And if they do say anything, they will be trounced on no matter what they say because there are so many different points of view and preferences that they can’t possibly please everyone.

I will confidently state that the people that frequent and participate in these forums are a very small percentage of overall fan base that you speak of. And even this small percentage of players are not in agreement as is evident from some impressive threads like “enough is enough” which is offset by some long running threads on Awesome TSW Service Mode Runs, Free Roam - Your Ideas, and Spirit of Steam A Realistic Challenge amongst others show many are enjoying TSW. Are there bugs, yes, are there things that can be improved - Sure, but is isn’t the train wreck as many would have the world to believe. (Excuse the pun)

And one final thing I have learned from my near 7 decades on this rock - respect is earned - not given . The way you ask questions goes a long way in the manner you will be responded to.

best

 

I don't see how it's a rant. More of a question that has nothing to do with the route itself although it is a fair question in the wider context of the game.

Heck, it wouldn't suprise me if legitimate questions pertaining to the route that was asked here like some of the questions above wouldn't even be answered by DTG even if they are in a "respectful" manner which most tend to be in the time I've been here. They seem to avoid the critical but fair questions. Heck when people were asking questions on the roadmap q&a thread a few months ago about bugs and other fair questions, a vast majority didn't get answered

 

Gosh they are going to struggle to find anything on this thread they can actually use on air... I will assist:

What is your favourite train?

 

Not a rant --- - sorry that you can't see it - but "blantantly hiding" "Uproar" "Stop ignoring" "Give respect" not usual terms used in polite discourse when asking questions... but hey call it as you see it, I sure will

Have a great evening

 

Given the seeming disappearance of most of the DTG senior staff since Christmas, this thread seems the only possible guaranteed means of getting answers to some of the issues raised in the last few weeks.

 

My question: why no soft transition between the snow on the track and the terrain, as the other route?

 

It would be nice if Rivet answered the posted questions. But are they really bothered. Rivet make me feel that they are not a customer caring developer!

 

Sorry if you feel that way, definitely not the image we're trying to draw! But as we understood these questions, they're meant to be answered in todays livestream (or at least a selection of these)!

 

Well Jasper that would be brilliant. Thank you for your response, but I do feel that you and Rivet should read your customers concerns and address the points raised, including those about the inaccuracies in your route designing. Jasper please before releasing another route after Bernina, get to work and correct all the glaring omissions on all your routes released so far please, starting with WCL!

 

Well TSC just got this beauty...

https://live.dovetailgames.com/live...5366.95522191.1685637895-513666309.1624220210

Which goes all the way from Wernigerode to the summit terminus at Brocken Mountain. So I again put it to Rivet and DTG, why do you feel it was sufficient to exclude nearly half of the operational Bernina Line and charge £5 more than the above mentioned title is selling for?

 

They also have had a uk route on the roadmap right after their swiss route in the 4-6 month category

 

I don’t think Rivet should release any more routes until they sort all their released routes they have already bogged up!!

I will be interested to see the stream tonight and l am sure the incorrect red roofed house near the loop won’t have been changed as many mentioned that they were totally incorrect. Something Rivet seem good at!

Also as of the December 2023 timetable change, the following only services that stop at Ospizio Bernina: is the RegioExpress / Regio: hourly service between St. Moritz and Tirano. I cannot see the sense of Ospizio as the finishing point!!!

 

Since we won't see the entire route in the stream, there's a walkpath next to the line when it's next to Lago di Poschiavo (lake) above the Miralago station, my question is are there people walking there?

 

Is the PIS screen usable in the Allegra cab ?

 

Is there a timetable screen on the right panel?

 

It’s a Rivet route - keep expectations low to avoid disappointment

 

Can we access the cargo yard in Campocologno?
It's been answered thank you

 

1. Is there a possibility that the route will be extended to St. Moritz?

2. Is there a reason why the tracks are little bit elevated like on a small embankment where the train runs through the plaza after Tirano?

3. This is like a little bit of a suggestion but I know that the smaller snow amount makes the scenery look better but is there a chanse you will ever make even more realistic snow effects like piles of snow around the tracks because it has been plowed to the side?

 

They're are no plans to extend. If there were, it would be on the roadmap but there isn't.

 

Yes very much a rant, but people see what they want to see. Some perspective would go a long way.

 

Asking this question in this way isn’t really fair. It is perfectly acceptable for them to offer this at that price and the comparison you have made to make it sound like it isn’t is not a fair one, as it is for a different game.

You must know by now that TSW routes are more expensive to make than TSC routes and comparisons between the two regarding route length will usually turn out the same. It’s not really a valid comparison. Rivet could have quite easily made this shorter than it is and it would still have been fine as a DLC and maybe it could have even been a bit cheaper then.

After I found out how long the services are, I’m thinking it may actually be a bit too long as it is. Around 1.5 hours is plenty long enough and I can even see it getting tedious after a while. The prospect that it could have been the full route scares me somewhat. That’s why I don’t understand the many repeated complaints about it as it’s long enough. I know it’s not “the full route” but how many people would actually want to drive the full length anyway? It’s quite a haul.

I’ve watched most of the stream and it looks quite nice and the train seems pretty well made but there are also a few things that don’t seem to be working properly yet and maybe it will release like that. Those things may concern me but the length won’t.

 

When are Rivet going to answer all these questions? The community deserve some answers.

 

It is also way past their bed time right now, so don't expect answers tonight

 

With all the complaints here I had assumed this was a 30-35 minute run.
The services are an hour and a half? And that’s too short? Sounds like plenty of gameplay to me.
Looks much better than Arosa (despite still having some of the odd core TSW visual wonkiness), has steep grades. Idk, I’ll wait to see if there are any game breaking bugs but ngl this looks right up my alley

 

Actually 1hr 45 minutes

 

I pretty much agree but would also agree to the same with DTG, they are pretty equal in that regard.

 

Who did the marketing for this route and why don't they know how to spell the name of the route?

 

Only the “I”, easy mistake to make, it’s not the most simple of words to someone it’s very foreign for.

 

To people saying it's long enough as it is and that a full route would have been too long;
With the full route you still have the option to split a full service into two parts. You always have the option to save and resume.

So the drive time is not an excuse. For a line as short as this, the full line should have been made.

Could you imagine if they cut Peninsula Corridor in half because the drive is longer than an hour? Would be ridiculous.

If you don't mind the shortness and stillfind it enjoyable, there is nothing wronf with that. But please, at least don't try to defend it. It's like saying "I am glad they didn't include more rolling stock, because then I couldn't choose ebetween them!".

 

Exactly this. If you take the apologists to the extreme you could build half of a 12 mile branch line with a 5MPH speed limit and use the excuse we didn’t build the full length because what we offered will still take over an hour to drive. And as I commented earlier or in another thread, the save game works quite adequately most of the time on the original player service.

As regards TSW taking longer and being harder to create for, er so what? This is not some freeware project we should be grateful for and fawning over. Rivet are a professional (hmmm) software company and should know exactly what they are getting into with a project like this. They have produced several routes now so should be well acquainted with the vagaries of the UE4 process and a library of generic objects to call on for less important scenery. So, no excuse for not going the whole distance.

 

By this logic, the Antelope Valley Line shouldn't have gone to Lancaster then but instead should've went as far as Vista Canyon because the time to get to L.A Union to Vista Canyon is quite lengthy?


Why does it matter if making dlc in TSW is "harder?" This ain't Rivet's first rodeo in making routes. They should have all the experience by now to know what they are getting themselves into. Considering the short length, the full line should've been made. If some players don't have the time, the services could've been split into two parts or the game could just be saved.

 

To be clear about what I was saying, Rivet could obviously only make the route so long within their budget and timescale to recoup their costs with their projected sales numbers and not make a loss. Understanding this is how you understand why they didn’t make the full route. Then, considering the actual length of route you get, it is still a lot of drive time and not at all too short for a good experience. If people can’t understand that then I am not here to work through it in more detail with them.

I think me saying I think it may be too long service wise is just as justified as anyone saying it is too short and that is an opinion about the play aspect of it and not about the development decision but I won’t mention that again because I don’t feel the need to go on and on about it in several threads.

My reply here was only because Vern asked an unfair question in a poor way that was never going to be answered. TSW is not TSC so comparisons on route length or development are not fair comparisons, as Vern et al should know by now.

 

Asking a unfair question? That question was hardly unfair. It's the most liked question on the thread as well. He wasn't the only person who had a similar question in nature. Are questions that you may not want to hear all of a sudden unfair or not right?

Also if Rivet weren't able to make the full line when they were in the planning stages, the simple solution is to not make it at all and perhaps make something else. There are many routes that can be made besides routes in the Swiss Alps. This ain't their first rodeo

Sure the service may be long, but it is still a one train one with little service variation for $40 dollars. I can get a self contained route with alot more to do for less.

Of course if you see value in this, then that is alright, but arguing that they didn't have time or the budget just reflects poor planning on their end and thus the criticism should hardly be surprising. I don't see why you feel the need to defend their actions.

 

It's not a mistake. "Linie" is german for "line". The route is called Berninalinie. No mistake.

 

Hello : I haven't noticed that stop on demand (request on the train or at the station) has been implemented?
(this was the case with TSC)