What people seem to fail to understand, is that Fife Circle is being developed by Rivet. Skyhook is updating their EMT 158 to a ScotRail one for the route, and there are major differences between the two. Given they are two separate parties in their own right, who only up to now have developed their own content for DTG, perfectly reasonable to understand why we're paying for another one. Skyhook won't just give Rivet their 158 for free, they're competing with each other to produce content for DTG.
So you answered your own question in the last sentence. Skyhook are doing the 158 not rivet. So how have rivet TOOK skyhooks 158 ??
Any guesses on what the second train could be, if any? An Inter7City HST is the obvious choice but part of me reckons a Class 800 could be in the running, and I believe DTG already have sounds for this type when they were researching for the ECML route. Class 68 with Mk2 coaches could happen, but more likely to be a loco DLC as both the loco and coaches would need modelling from scratch, and I don't believe Rivet would do this in addition to the Class 170.
I have seen this mentioned a couple of times, now, but can't actually think of the hint which may have implied a second loco/unit. Would you be able to remind me?
Rivet only tend to focus on 1 train per dlc since they spend a lot of time focusing on 1. Exception being wcl but the 37 was still a 37 with a radio
It's a con in the sense that they are selling it as if it's a new product, that will be marketed and then sold when in reality it's simply a rehash of an pre existing product - if you see what I mean.
Assuming Skyhook do the changes to the 158 to make it accurate to the ScotRail model and it’s priced sensibly, can’t really see an issue.
not being defensive just highlighting your error in your comment which you just confirmed. Have a wonderfull day.
Mate you could tell them 100 times they will still come out with the same old "its not new" argument. No point waisting your time with them they will get bored when no one replies to them and go pester another games forums.
TSP what football ground is this? I am not from Scotland so would like to know please. Is it Raith Rovers?
Realistically what updates is there for the 158 apart from the livery. Few changes in the cab, revised front cowling design. They even have the same seats just the material that differs. Hardly major updates to me.
go ahead and make it yourself and if you can release it before they do you will make alot of money then.
There's a few changes needed done the cab is different and the front is different has a small snow plough on the front plus different headlights
The same people who are complaining that the 158 Scot pack is a "con" were oddly silent when the 66 Engineering ONE and DRS pack was released..
I’ll refer to my earlier comment which is wrap the arguments please guys I really don’t want this thread closed by petty arguing it’s a game we all enjoy playing for once just agree on something thank you
Agree with above comment No one has to buy anything, no one is getting conned. If it’s not for you move on. I do think some spend more time on here arguing with strangers then playing the game. It’s just a waste of precious time. We only live once. Go and enjoy it rather than bathing in all the negativity.
What criteria does justify an additional commercial value is appropriate? The cowling modification, minor cab changes, the different seat material on the same frame?
So you want someone to modify a product legally belonging to another entity. Modify it without permission and then demand a financial reward for such an unauthorised modification?
Jesus Christ can we just go one day without people having to act like children on both sides. Again nobody is obligated to buy ANYTHING, but it doesn't make it immune to feed back or critism. If you think the 158 is a con/you don't wanna buy it great that's perfectly fine, but to those who don't think that don't bash others just cause YOU don't like it and that goes for the same on the other side as well. Again nobody is obligated to buy anything they don't want too. Just let people believe what they wanna be believe. If you disagree with someone's opinion let them know your feelings and be polite about it
Fair point and I admit I get into discussions I should probably keep out of . However, con is an emotive word, it is technically and grammatically incorrect in this situation, in no way is this a con as you know what you are getting, there is no deceit. A newcomer to the sim and the forum, reading comments like it is "con" might well take it literally and go away with the impression that people are being deceived and ripped off. If people moderated their language then it probably wouldn't result in half the heated discussions on here. Anyway I am going to go and drive some trains!
a lot of people forget about the passenger interior too - scotrail opted for ironing board style seating etc and they'll have a different layout to other 158s in service. It's one of those things they need to do because people will complain otherwise.
The slightly amusing thing is that it's not even out yet but people are getting quite cutthroat about it already... I agree with you though.
Here is a better idea before you come on here spouting your silly little comments do your research. You will find it will stop EVERYONE who has replied to you with your comment about the 158 disagreeing with you.
Absolutely this! I will be the first to admit that when a route developed by Rivet comes out, I am the first to bash them because it's a case of their mistakes preceeding them. Have Rivet made bad routes? They have not made bad routes but they have made routes that come out with mistakes and inaccuracies and the thing that gets me every time is they don't put the hands up and say, yeah, we screwed up, we'll fix it You look at other developers for routes and, Skyhook is a fantastic example to use here, they got the bridge at Loughborough wrong on the MML route, what did they do? They went back, they looked again, they fixed it and off we go, everyone gets their route right, everyone is happy (well 95% are but close enough) I will admit that I bought every Rivet route and DLC on the game (because at the time I was a gullible [insert favourite word here]) and I believed that they could turn it around but it was disappointment after disappointment after disappointment. That is what stopped me buying the BerninaLine because when I saw the preview stream, I saw so much wrong with it that I was like, we're not gonna waste £30 on this and play it on the channel, forget it. But then I was reading some of you guys and what you said and turns out, it's not a bad route, it's not their best either but they tried Now do I want to buy the Fife Circle? You know I want to buy it but look at Rivet's track record with Scottish routes so far (and the worst thing is they are based in Scotland as well so it's hard to get it wrong when you live on the doorsteps of the route). So I will be waiting until I see builds, I will be waiting until I see streams and the mind will be made up then but if it's not right, if even something is a smidge out of place, Dovetail should listen to the fanbase and tell Rivet, no, fix it because at the end of the day, who's going to get the flak if it's wrong? It won't be Rivet, it'll be Dovetail So let's not argue here guys, let's all wait until the builds and the streams and let's all try to get along because anyone makes a decision
What is the definition of silly? Someone that does not participate in groupthink? Can you explain what is substantial about a different cowling, seat material and minimalist cab changes?
I think whether or not I get this route will depend solely on how good the 170 is. It's a unit I'm very familiar with, and it's one of my favourites so it's vital they do at least a decent job. If it's anything like the 150 or 385 in terms of quality then I'm not interested. On the topic of the 170s, will they get a chance to stretch their legs on this route? It's been several years since I've been north of Edinburgh on the line to Dundee so can't quite remember the line speed. As for having to pay for the 158, it depends on the pricing. I at least know it's of good quality but if it's anything more than £7 or £8 then I don't think it's worth it when I could just download a livery from creator's club. Are there many differences between EMT's and Scotrail's sets? I know the Scottish sets have different snowploughs but is there anything else apart from different interiors/ seating?
It’s far from a ‘simple change’, there’s still a lot of work which needs to be done for the ScotRail 158, despite what you think. So, how does this differ from the EMT 158 you ask? - Different headlight cluster design - Different front snow plough design - Different cab layout - Different interior layout - Different seat design (no, it’s not just a moquette change) - Different vestibule layout - Different internal and external PIS systems - Updated DDA compliant door sounds I’m sure there’s a few others I might have missed. But sure, it’s just a re-skin according to some people, which of course should be given out completely free of charge(!)
It don’t really matter either way to you really as you said you won’t be buying it anyway. So no point in you getting worked up is there.
There’s some 90 mph running (and even a brief stretch of 100mph) between Edinburgh and South Queensferry. Once over the bridge going via Burntisland it’s maximum 75mph with quite a lot of lower intermediate restrictions, before a final stretch at 80mph after Kirkcaldy. Via Dunfermline is slower - maximum 65mph before it re-joins the other line at Thornton Jn.
