We've already seen what happens if people don't buy DLC'S, looking at Flying Scotsman, Peak Forest and Spirit of Steam. As a consequence of not many users purchasing the routes, they decided to hold future developments of any steam locomotives. When in reality, the main issue was just not getting the physics right. All they seemed to care about if the income went straight to its pocket, that is it rather than looking at the main cause. By using this logic, if people let's say stop buying commuter routes. DTG may as well say 'oh, this didn't make money, well just hold or stop developments for commuter routes'. Instead probably focusing instead on regional or high speed routes to try if they make income. It's sadly all about if it goes into the pocket or not rather looking at the bigger picture from all the patterns we've seen in the past. As much as how many times players have been giving feedback to DTG on how they can actually do better.
Quite a statement. I thought it was because they couldnt get simugraph to simulate steam well enough. So to clarify- you think people should carry on buying substandard products because.......? Ive got no problem if people want to buy stuff. But I can pretty much guarantee the same people will be back here next year, saying the same old 'how could they do this' routines. Its that which Im frankly struggling to comprehend tbh. I bought TSW2020 and TSW3. I see no reason to part with any more cash until the main issues are fixed or DTG suddenly up their game. I feel pretty well vindicated by that approach post release of TSW5(4.1).
It does seem there might have been a bit of gaslighting on behalf of DTG to try and blame the lack of sales, as the reason for abandoning it. As TSC demonstrates there is a healthy demand for properly made steam traction and period routes to run them on. Seems more likely as you say they just couldn't get Simugraph to do it properly and/or persevere to find a solution.
Technically their withdrawal is by the 1st October, so they could decided to run a special between now and then.
If you want to know who has been working on the game, just roll the credits, it’s a big old dev team and no mistake. Do some of those work for Rivet? I wouldn’t know, but I’d imagine so. Like others, I find it remarkable that a route that was so heavily requested by the community has been so badly produced. Out of the three core routes it’s definitely the one that will have most players, I’m sure. As a console player myself, I’m saddened we do not get mod support, so it’s even more important for us that the game is patched and timetable improved. I’m sure sales have been excellent, but there’s no contest on console-yet. DTG take their player base for granted and this release is yet another example of this. There is no excuse for shoddy workmanship, maybe it’s time they ditch Rivet and maybe subcontract to Just Trains or TSG some more, even if there are old school loyalties to Rivet with them being an offshoot from DTG years ago.
Never saw that bug and got the content before DTG pulled it. From memory it was due to the timetable being empty.
Just popping in to add my voice to the calls for the timetable to be ripped up and started again from scratch. I’m not interested in who or why, I’m only interested in the final product being of a certain standard. If we are to compare what a reasonable person would expect from the flagship UK route with the shockingly bad timetable we actually got, then we see why the feedback has been as it has. The gap is huge, as huge as the gaps in the DC lines service pattern. I expect much better from DTG. Players deserve better. I actually struggle to load up the route as I’m just drawn to better content where I know I can enjoy myself. This was the most requested route but what we have is not what we envisaged when requesting it. DTG have messed up, and I know that sometimes these things can happen, but now it’s time for them to fix it. Only a new timetable will suffice.
I remember in the preview stream that the doors opened when they shouldn't have, I think it was they would close then reopen and get stuck/ bugged out
I know many have commented on the state of the timetable on WCML. I have a serious question after doing a 390 run from Liverpool Lime Street to London Euston time table run. During the run I encountered 16 active services during my journey (didn’t include in the count any static consists ). So how many services should I have encountered if there was a complete timetable? Not being from the UK, I felt it was a satisfactory run with the encounters I had, even had a few cautions along the way… as well as doubles yellow changing to clear well with in my line of sight giving the feel of other traffic in front of me. Not trying to start an argument, just curious how many other services should I have encountered.
There are detailed summaries earlier in the discussion but essentially, between all the rolling stock (minus freight - slightly more complicated to work out), it’s around 300/400 services short over the day. Personally I’d be happy to just get the DC line TT sorted, the 390 & 350 is well within acceptable standards for TSW.
thanks —- so if there are 300 to 400 a day missing would add about 12 to16 per hour if we make the assumption of them being evenly distributed over a 24 hour period (which I know they aren’t) so an additional 6 to 8 more over my 30 minute run …
Like I say the biggest gap is the DC lines which span between Euston & Watford, so the distribution would be much more concentrated into the first 15 miles of the route - it would be around 20-30tph in that area, for the 72stock & 710 alone. If DTG sort out the 350 consists too, that should have a good effect on the general feel to the route.
honestly if rivet don’t improve I believe they should be left behind. They were the first third party to come into TSW, and have already been overtaken by everyone from DTG to JT (the most recent). Whether it’s tight deadlines, cutting corners or poor management, something needs to be done about rivet games as they just keep releasing subpar content. The only somewhat decent route from rivet has been berninaline. Uk rivet content is a joke and arosaline? We don’t talk about that. But it’s getting to a point where DTG need to step in and address what’s going on with rivets poor quality in comparison to the standard tsw route and get to the bottom of the issue, instead of getting rivet in to mess up routes like these
Don't know when the timetable was set but until June there was a limited direct Southern service between Hemel Hempstead and East Croydon on weekdays only. This is formed of departures towards East Croydon at 07:31, 11:38, 19:38 and 21:37. Services arrive from East Croydon at 07:26, 11:28, 19:30 and 21:27. It was a limited extension (additional 7 mins journey time) of the all-day service from Watford Junction to East Croydon (Hemel Hempstead is the next stop from Watford).
Yep and it's hated by freight drivers as it causes massive delays due to the way the signalling is around Hemel Hempstead (double blocking). As mentioned above it runs fast from Watford to Hemel, missing out Kings Langley and Apsley.
Has anyone else noticed that some off the stopping markersare way off you on the marker and only half the train is on the platform
Another problem I found last night whilst trying to do some free roam runs. Dc trains don't work on the dc platforms in euston either!
When I started a 350 run from MKC to Eus, the 4 car unit was right back at the north end of the platform. This route needs a serious rework from the ground up.
If anyone wants to know how busy the WCML is, just have a look at the live traffic on here > Signalbox - Live Train Map You'll immediately see that in real life it's significantly busier, I'm not expecting real world volumes of traffic, but I've done a Euston to MK route in game, where I've passed two AI trains total.
Most rush hour services in real life are 8 cars. Some peak services are 12 car. However this timetable is so broken, I doubt whoever built it was aware of train running and what actually runs on the line.
Just a rant i think it's crazy they put a playable tube timetable in here and give no tutorial on how to drive them I understand it's park off the bakerloo dlc but we shouldn't have to buy that just to learn how to drive them i k own there's videos YouTube but that's not the point rant over
Both really useful pieces of feedback to DTG and whoever else but then you blunt the power of your message by throwing in a needless final sentence which, to some, can seem like repetitive whining. I think this kind of thing is often the cause of conflict in these forums. Can you at least kind of see what I mean?
Not really and I don’t regard it as whining. We paid good money for this and DTG have now gone utterly silent on the issues and any fixes. If I want to whinge and whine a bit, I shall (within reason).
You know what’s repetitive? Rivet giving us LOVE timetables. If they want to do that then that’s fine - it’s why I don’t buy Rivet content, but DTG passed this one to them & still sold it as their own. If DTG (yes DTG, not you) find it repetitive then im sure the community team will address it as such.
Missing quite a bit of 390 services i believe and stopping patterns on some 350 services are incorrect
We've known you are unhappy for ages, even though you bought it anyway. Why keep repeating yourself? The feedback of what's wrong is helpful but the rest is, frankly, boring and repetitive.
Mainly the AI ones, I be going on RTT Making sure it is a week day and for example lets say I am at Euston, So I put the time in on RTT for the time it is in game and I will often find lots of missing AI services, not sure about the driveable ones.
Well if you're referring to my final sentence, I don't think an observation on the lack of variety in formations and consists across this timetable is whining.
The loudest whine gets the oil.. and if I may be permitted to thoroughly mix up my metaphors, when the screaming goes silent, that's when to really worry..
There's actually a strong case for whining and persistent complaining. It got us the restoration of the save game, the revision of the NYT timetable, signal improvements to BPE, just to name a few examples. The cadre of apologists on the forum may not like it, but what have they ever done to solve problems or advance the game. I can't think of any business that responds to consumers who simply accept and enjoy whatever's given to them. As someone pointed out, the squeaky wheel gets the grease.
AI Pendolinos dont go 125mph, they look really slow when I pass them which annoys me, also the timetable, especially for the DC line with Underground and Overground is so poor. The route is so dead.
Think it becomes quite apparent that DTG handled the Pendolino scenarios as there’s so much more AI traffic all over and even 8 car 350s (just done the Pend No Lean O scenario). Compare this with the 350 scenarios, in one of which I saw precisely 2 other AI 350s on motion and nothing else (the one where you form a 12 car formation).
