Frankfurt S-bahn Discussion

With todays roadmap came the announcement of a new German route: Frankfurt S-Bahn.
This route includes the S1, S8 & S9 services between Frankfurt Hbf and Wiesbaden Hbf.
The route will be set somewhere between 2016-2019, as the new airport tunnel was still under construction but not in service yet.
Included trains are the familiar BR 423 (with reworked interior), the BR 430 (new train) as well as the BR 143 + Dostos for regional services.
TSG's BR 420 will also finally be released, both in a Frankfurt and a München version.
So what are your thoughts?

Cab ride videos of this route

 

Interesting route. With tons of stations. Looks to have a bit of variety as well. This is more like it!
Also something quite intriguing.

this route will be the first gen9 only route.

 

Good news, quite looking forward to it. Personally I would have liked DTG to include the long distance Airport branch as well, which would have allowed us to drive some long haul stuff between Mainz and Frankfurt. But I understand its not the focus of this add on and I am fine with that!

 

About time, as Gen 8 consoles have been struggling with the latest addons and user were usually pissed about either the bad performance or the reduced features. This will give the development team more time for focusing on Gen 9 and PC, which hopefully will make the experience on these platforms much better.

Would have been a nice addition, but it don't think there are really that many services that drive between Frankfurt Flughafen Fernbahnhof and Mainz (at least if there isn't a line closure). And as you've said, the focus is the S-Bahn.
PS: I've look into it: Except for some Nightjets, there is only one 2-hour headway ICE line that drives between Frankfurt Fernbahnhof and Mainz Hbf, as well as two additional once per day ICE services.

 

I also found that particularly interesting. I wonder if this is the next step in a move away from gen 8. Be interesting to see what the route looks like and how it's received being just made for gen 9/pc. Will it be much different? Timetable? Layers? Definitely an interesting experiment

 

Yeah, I do understand the omission as well. It's a really big, complex station where you'd have to custom model just about everything, most IC/ICE traffic from the airport goes onto the Köln high-speed line, not to Mainz, anyway. And even those services that you do get would be barely 30 minutes long, and those always get loads of negative feedback - see WCML south. Much better to just not do it and use the dev time somewhere else on the route.

If the map is correct, the one thing I'm disappointed to see missing is the Mainz Hbf avoiding line north of Mainz-Kastel. Including that would've offered a fourth path for freight trains, in addition to the ones that the S-Bahn services take, and would've been much lower hanging fruit than the second airport station.



Even with this criticism, an excellent route choice in my opinion! Aside from the S-Bahn, I'm really looking forward to giving the 612 a good thrash down the main line on a Frankfurt - Mainz - Saarbrücken RE.

 

Couldn't they atleast have done a proper RMV 423 this time around? It was excusable for FTF since it's only a side dish, but here it would've definetly been the right choice.

 

Fantastic pick for a route, will be spending a lot of time on this one.

 

This line is also used by the RE4 and RE14 services between Frankfurt and Karlsruhe/Mannheim. So there might be a chance this is included, if either the BR143 is used as rolling stock on these services ingame, or if we might get a Flirt 3 in the future, which actually runs these services.

 

They said in the roadmap, that the 423 will have a reworked interior:

So maybe they'll update the FTF 423 to this version.

 

Yes, I noticed that. A different interior doesn't mean the rest of it, though. Where are the rest of the details on the doors? Where is the blue/green-ish stripe? Where are the RMV logos?

 

Well, including the RMV logos and details means they would need another licence, which maybe wasn't possible. At least we'll be getting the correct model (looking at you MKN), putting the correct livery on it will be much easier.

 

Aren't those lines pretty new though? Did they already exist when the 420s were still in service?

 

I hope another version of the 423 is included with IGBT inverters (that’s if this S-Bahn used them at the time of this route of course)

 

yeah, seems that the siege continues to close for 8th gen consoles

 

I don't expect this to bring any improvements for Gen9 consoles, it just reduces the field of dissatisfied users to those from Gen8.
So DTG will have "minor problems"

 

If even, another version wouldn't be required. S-Bahn Rhein-Main only uses IGBT 423s, and always did. I can see them keeping the GTO sounds, though.

 

Do we know what year the tt is set? The Br430 is driving in Frankfurt since 2011. A quick look into the irl 2013 tt shows a total of 31 trains using the connection between Airport and Mainz. Some of them are double entries but it will be about 25 in one direction. Not all of them came from Frankfurt main station, however, there are also many long distance trains between Frankfurt main and Airport not going to Mainz. Those would also have been playable…

Hope the link works:
https://www.fernbahn.de/datenbank/suche/?fahrplan_jahr=2013&zug_bereich=&zug_gattung=&zug_nummer=&zug_linie=&zug_name=&laufplan_tfz=&ice_typ=&wagengattung=&wagengattung_suche=AND&bahnhof_name=Frankfurt+Flughafen&bahnhof_richtung=Mainz+Hbf&bahnhof_richtung2_modus=1&bahnhof_richtung2=&fahrplan_tage[]=1&fahrplan_tage[]=2&fahrplan_tage[]=3&fahrplan_tage[]=4&fahrplan_tage[]=5&fahrplan_tage[]=6&fahrplan_tage[]=7&reiseplan[]=1&reiseplan[]=2&ergebnisspalten[]=zuggattung&ergebnisspalten[]=startbahnhof&ergebnisspalten[]=zielbahnhof&fv_suche_detail=1#fv_suche_detail

But as stated, I am fine with what DTG will ship to us

 

The RE4 and RE14 started in late 2014 and were extended from Mainz to Frankfurt in late 2018, so it is in the possible time frame.

We don't know the exact year, but it is set between 2016 and 2019, as the new rail link to the airport was under construction but not in service yet.

 

Gen9 only is a red herring, at least for xbox users, they will be still hamstrung by the series S, see mountain-gate.

 

im surprised the br420 wont be layered onto koln aachen with its new timetable coming soon since s bahn koln also still uses br420s just like munich and they even went on the line to duren

 

I wonder if the BR 430 will substitute into Frankfurt-Fulda

 

I would think so, since (correct me if they’re wrong) they’re both four car units. So they should be able to substitute just fine.

In addition, I would hope that they replace the BR 423 currently on Frankfurt - Fulda with the new 423 from this route, because it was stated in the roadmap that the 423 is getting the correct interior.

 

Yes, the 430 and 423 are both 4-car units. And yes, they run on FTF, as the 430 is used on the S8, S9 and some S1 services. Only the S2 and the other S1 services are operated by the 423.

 

For those interested, here are two cab ride videos showing the two routes. Note that the S9 follows the route of the S1 out of Wiesbaden and then changes to the S8 route after Mainz-Kastel. The cab rides were recorded in 2009 and 2012, so they show the old route represented in this DLC, but there might be some details that have been modernised since then.

S1 Wiesbaden Hbf - Rödermark-Ober-Roden

S8 Wiesbaden Hbf - Hanau Hbf

 

I also believe the 423s during this era used IGBT motors, so they sounded way different to the current 423 we have.

 

Yeah, only the first construction series (423 001 - 423 190) used GTO-Thyristors; all other series used IGBTs.
Units in operation with the S-Bahn Rhein-Main are:
301-305 (2nd series)
325-334 (3rd series)
372-396 (4th series)
397-456 (5th series)

But I doubt DTG will replace the old sound of the 423. Sadly, that's not correct then, but it could be worse.

 

The route will definitely be bought... but two points could be improved. On the one hand, you could reconsider incorporating the long-distance train station at the airport. So you could take the ICE T Wiesbaden - Dresden. Then do route hopping in FFM. And you could use the S Bahn to Offenbach Ost to route hop there and take the FTF to Hanau.

but all in all a great route!! I just always prefer to drive a whole distance to get the right amount of time.

 

The BR 420 is my favourite train since I grew up with it. And even though the passenger windows and doors on the model are a little too big I'm very happy this finally will be released. The route seems great. So I can't wait for it.

 

Thank you so much for linking the Cab Ride Vids. Appreciate that.

 

I was incedibly amazed reading in the article that there will be S-Bahn Rhein-Main coming. Been hoping for that since the first S-Bahn route in TSW My anticipation escalated further while scanning over the article and reading "S1" there - the line I take since ... 10+ years with a stop here in my hometown. I thought "oh my god they will bring my town to TSW!!!einself" but clicking on the route map brought quick disenchantment - no City Tunnel, no Offenbach, the Route not going to Rödermark Ober-Roden (it's real termini) and my local train station will not be made nor included. But nevertheless an "most close to me" route is in the making and there is still enough in it to rejoice.

Continued reading about the rolling stock made me pretty happy since the 430 is missing since so long and glad it might substitute to Frankfurt Fulda. The 420 ... yeah waiting for that since TSW2 and everything is said. But seeing the screenshot from the interior brought back "good old memories" of riding it daily (and being thrown around by acceleration and braking when standing lol), no air conditioning in the summer, the windows halfway open, draft...

Don't get me wrong, it'll be day1 I've waited so long for this route I hope hope hope the signaling and PZB is without glaring errors upon release When there is a release date anounced, I'll apply for vacation!

 

Question mainly for those more familiar with the Frankfurt S-Bahn; does this route being cut off at Frankfurt Hbf mean that the possibility of a full S8/S9 run (one half on this route, the other on FFA) is dead in the water or do any of them regularly use the mainline station?

 

I wonder if the 420's sound is accurate enough...

 

Sadly, it means that you won't be able to drive a full S8/9 service, as the City Tunnel is missing. I wish they would have included it in the route, but then you would have a section with the complexity of Bakerloo in terms of moddeling, and there is no good termini station at the other end of the tunnel, meaning you would need to include the S-Bahn track up to Hanau from FTF, which would be too much.

 

I’m all for this let’s go Frankfurt!!

 

Looking forward to this route. And for the BR 420 as well.

 

Who says it won't?

 

I have been thinking about something... the reason the Munich 420 can't have its own timetable on MAG is due to memory issues, from what I read. However, since it seems to come out for 9th gen hardware only, shouldn't those still have enough memory for that, or is that not working either?

 

I think regarding HMA, there are also other issues, especially with the signaling. And that would be DTGs job to fix, not TSGs.

 

Oh yeah, forgot the signalling part. But last time I had a run on the S-Bahn network I didn't have many issues, but I only rarely used MAG at all, so I can't really say much about it.

 

Long time since I've been this excited for a new route!

But, please, please I hope this route works well peformance-wise i.e. so optimised with no video memory errors and especially no annoying blurry textures. This is the only thing that concerns me considering still just how poor Frankfurt-Fulda is on Gen-9.

 

I wasn't going to buy too much German stuff as I rarely use it. However, I'm a sucker for an electric suburban network. Looks very good, release within the next 3 months too! Nice surprise.

 

Now that I noticed it, by the looks of it the Frankfurt 420 will also have an RMV logo.
<-- roadmap screenshot
<-- real 420

 

Great route choice with both variants over Höchst and Airport. Finally a network style route for Germany.
But: It's really a pity that the city tunnel in Frankfurt is not included. The S-Bahn services are kind of defined by their tunnel section and now just around 9 km in-between are missing to have the complete S8 and S9... I understand the tunnel stations are difficult to build, on the other hand you wouldn't have to build any surrounding buildings etc. The only part between Frankfurt Hbf (in this add-on) and Offenbach Ost (on Frankfurt - Fulda) where the trains are running overground between Mühlberg and Kaiserlei is already included in FTF because it's running parallel to it...
Another route in TSW where we supposedly will never get the full route.
If they would have included the part to Frankfurt Süd too and the small missing section between both routes south of the Main river, you would have been able to drive freight trains and the occasional long distance service between Hanau and Frankfurt Flughafen over Süd too... So much more possibilities with a few kilometers more.

 

Has anyone figured out as to why they specifically chose an older timeframe for this route? Could it be linked to the Riedbahn?

 

Because a modern-day route couldn't feature the 420. So in order to reasonably use the 420, the route is backdated a few years.

 

Guess it's for the 420. The 420 were retired in 2014, so the route with Gateway Gardens would be wrong, since Gateway Gardens opened in 2019.
Still, the building of the new flyover started in 2016(?), so it's still not totally right, but okay for me.
Hope the Airport station is in the old design, since it was modernised between 2017 and 2020.

 

They chose an older timeframe so that TSGs BR420 can have layers on it.

 

Sorry for the intrusion, but I’m not sure where else to bring this up. Am I one of the few hoping the developers will add a northern semi-ring from Frankfurt Süd to Hanau Hbf via Frankfurt-Mainkur, Maintal, and Hanau Wilhelmsbad? I think even a small section like this would be great to have with a railway track, seamlessly integrated into the rest of the landscape.
Watching trains cross a field, stop at invisible platforms, open their doors, and then move on—leaving such a gap in the map—just doesn't feel natural.

In addition to this update, it would make more sense to add this section, as it would enable the operation of the HLB RB58 from Laufach to Rüsselsheim-Opelwerk and the RE54 from Frankfurt Hbf to Bamberg.


Since we're on the topic of the S-Bahn, these routes start from Hanau. Why aren’t the underground stations from Offenbach-Ost to Frankfurt Hbf (tief) mentioned? Or will they be added?

 

Depends on the references tsg has