London Overground Mildmay Line: Stratford-willesden Junction (richmond Extension) Discussion Thread

I was thinking the same thing. I mean I have no intention of buying this truncated short route, but nevertheless interested to see what others are saying about it. Sorry for ping, but DTG Harry or DTG Jamie ?


Edit: Thread now live.

 

I watched the reviews of this route and like most of the UK routes the freight services are incorrect. Wrong wagons and wrong freight companies loco.
When they do get it right there is insufficient wagons in the formation. Just watched a review of the route with a freight service passing with empty container flats, when it real life it's an unloaded aggregates service(Chelmsford Recp.to Wembley Receptions 1-7). In DTG's preview steam Matt had a Peterboro Maint Shed Gbrf to Tonbridge West Yard Gbrf which is a light Gbrf loco, depicted as a ONE liveried Freightliner loco hauling shipping containers. If the developers don't know then they could just stick the service into Youtube and see what it is. Loaded or empty Realtime trains will tell you, the Chelmsford service is 400 tonnes leaving Chelmsford and 1600 tonnes arriving. Please get the freight services correct and full length, and if you have not got the correct stock in TSW don't do the service.

 

Is there no xbox achievements for this route

 

It is for me but only in very small doses

The only 2 things i'd say for this is to be route be extended as it's very short
but it's very fun and immersive great route to play to be honest!
& for the Camden Road bridge to be a bit more iconic for the route as it is in real life to be honest great work i can't say anything majorly bad at all!

 

Once again, I found the ambassador streams do the route more justice than the DTG stream.

This was a day one purchase for me regardless but it looked a lot better on the ambassador streams, maybe the choice of weather helped!

I have to say though I was alarmed at the FPS on TheBritishAce stream!

 

There are currently no plans for an extension to The Mildmay Line is what we've been told.

The general feeling I've got from the stream is that the developer has got a new project. Did anyone else get a hint it could be some part of the South London network? Blackfriars and London Bridge to Dartford with the River Beam loop would be excellent, as would a branch on the BML to Blackfriars with Thameslink services added to the mainline.

Back to the extension to Richmond, they've not ruled it out as a future project/upgrade.

 

Initial reports from the consoles in the official feedback thread do not seem good... Performance issues, texture issues, the 378 bouncing like a pogo stick and outright game crashing. Will be interesting to see the reports from PC players post 6pm when it goes live on Steam. But for now, it seems even taking into account all the other caveats this is one to avoid, whether it's the route or train itself causing issues or the ongoing core problems.

 

It does seem more to be core issues at fault rather then the add on itself.

The suspension and 378 speedometer are an exception to the core faults though.

 

played the route and honestly, for a first attempt, Johannes has done a good shot at it. Certainly putting rivet to shame.

 

I agree MrSouthernDriver. I am very pleased with the route too, it goes to show how poor Rivets work was in comparison to this route, the Just Trains route and all the TSW5 routes by DTG.

l have completed the collectables following Neal8TVs’s excellent video, however while l completed 25/25 Route Maps and 25/25 Defibrillators, l could only find 24/25 Newspapers Stands but did find 26/25 Fire Extinguishers. Is this right? I hope Johannes will be reading the forum, perhaps he will reply please. Otherwise the route scenery is absolutely first class, a really quality route and well worth the money. Working my way through the scenarios now.

 

Well I had a nice first drive, the scenery and traffic on the route is superb. As I expected my GPU saved me from the low textures and frame rate problems I have seen other people having. The train just seems to bounce so much though in areas, its ridiculous, I feel like the train is going to derail at any moment!

 

I'd say from a console player's perspective the route is let down by core issues like the blurry texture glitch and performance hiccups, there's also Kuju assets like this one which look really out of place compared to the mostly great scenery. I could understand if this asset is placed away from player view but this is right next to Hackney Central

 

The blurry texture issue is still present even on this route

Im on Series X and this REALLY kills the immersion, when is this going to be fixed ?

 

Kuju assets still being used in 2025 is a let-down, especially not so close to the track, but I will say the blurry textures are not doing that screenshot any favours, although it definitely looks slightly better than that on my game I must admit.

 

I hear you I'm playing ECML now and its been like that on the last 3 trips they won't doing anything about just banging out route after route and hoping that we will get used this shabby performance.

 

Hello,
I'm interested in this route but I play exclusively with the RailDriver on PC Steam. Is it supported?
Thanks

 

Very good route overall. Many of the faults I am finding are core issues rather then issues with the route itself.

A few observations that need to be corrected on the Class 378:

1) Whilst the 378 has traction motors that run in sync, it does not appear to have running sounds during driving giving it an incredibly quiet cab.

2) As others have observed the speedometer is for the 377. The 378s speedometer should only show a maximum of 90mph and also is completely different to the 377 one it currently has.

3) As others have pointed out, the suspension is quite, overly noticeable should we say. Only a small error, but not as rigid as what a 378 should be.

4) One the the fans on the equipment underneath the trains is placed next to the cover it should be retained inside and is fully exposed.

 

Do TFL Class 378 still rarely run on Watford DC line? If not then, some of these services shouldnt be here.

Please do correct me if im wrong.
I have attached sceenshots. PS i dont think having a Class 378 for service "5Q54: Northampton - Willesden" is correct as why would TFL go outside its confort zone

 

378 at milton keynes i dont think so. North London Line aka Mildmay Line tampers with WCMLS euston to milton keynes routes. is anyone from DTG aware of this??

 

They rarely run on it, yes.

As for services you’re seeing there, that doesn’t necessarily illustrate what the AI runs, just what you can run. I’m not sure what the substitution chance between the 710 & 378 are, but it’s unlikely to be anywhere near 100%.

 

RightieOh. Thanks for the update. Didnt know whether this was a so-call bug or was meant to happen.

 

Stand to be corrected here, but in the 710 timetable on WCMLS there are 'test run' trains to simulate the testing of the 710s, these test services run upto Milton Keynes. These only appear on certain months of the year. My guess is the 378 has substituted itself on one of these test runs. So it's probably intentionally timetabled to be their and has subbed in as a replacement for the 710.

 

Well, i guess ill have to disable "Mildmay Line" when playing WCMLS euston to milton keynes otherwise, it will clash with my setup I.E natual look for both player and ai services.

 

You don't need to turn it off entirely. If it is not something you don't want to see change it to different months of the year.

But just to clarify, the tests are meant to simulate the 710s prior to them entering services on mile accumulating test (I believe), the 378 has rightly or wrongly subbed in for it in this instance by the sounds of it.

Unless Johannes has added 378 services going under their own power towards Wolverton for attention?

 

lets see what happens. Ive yet to test WCMLS with the inclusion of North London Line PAK being installed.

 

I bought this route for one reason and that is to show support for a one man developer. The route is not perfect, but as I stood on the Willsden green Platform seeing all the trains going by I don't feel I have been short changed. But it suffers from WCML problem in regard to performance and this highlights that DTG haven't been investing in the game as they should, they are starting to do it now, but it is going to be a while to get TSW up to where it should be. Mildmay line is good for train spotting alone.

 

Why is there nothing on the WCML Overground??

 

I have the Mildmay

Achille Xbox Series X

 

It’s suffering form tech debt that hasn’t been addressed because it’s all about the money money money.

They should pause the releases and spend several months fixing the core issues otherwise it’s just going to mount up to the point they won’t be able to dedicate that time to every piece of dlc.

 

I have exactly the same fears for Cardiff and the Dutch route for that matter, both of which unlike Mildmay, I am thinking of getting. But the core is getting worse by the week. Yesterday evening, even Maintalbahn which used to run sweet as butter was struggling a bit and dropping in the sound distortion. I’m not paying £25 -£33 on DLC for a game which isn’t running properly and the EP and programming team have their heads in the sand (or fingers in ears going “la, la, la, la” ) in denial about the whole thing.

 

I think that point was passed long ago.

 

Maybe but since TSW5 the blurred and no passenger issue has been added to the list

 

It’s of special interest for me as I’m a Principal UX Designer - I talk to customers first hand about IT software.

I was recently made redundant because the company I was working for was in threat of liquidation. Why? Because they kept adding new and unfinished features rather than addressing customer concerns. They lost a lot of revenue and a lot of customers over the last few years. We went from being a well run company to a mess. That’s just what a few decisions can do to a company.

I’ll always advocate for the customer and the user because without them you have no product to sell.

 

And the sound squelching... We had stutters before going back to London Commuter but it didn't hammer the sound so much. And not just on PC, PS5 too. I took BML out for a spin on that version the other day and was getting the drainpipe effect on sounds. Oh and don't forget the splash screens that now sublimate occasionally when driving and afterwards kills your keyboard input!

 

The ones that run on the WCML are from the work Fawx and Liam did to enhance the timetable at the end of last year. They are supposed to be 'test runs' for the Class 710 (which may well have happened when they were first being brought into service). As the 378 can now substitute for the 710 you can run them with a 378 too. I did one from Milton Keynes to Willesden TMD in the 710 which was good fun to drive at the max speed of the loco and also has a few adverse signals when you get closer to Willesden.

 

You might need to own the Suffragette Line too as the the 378 is just a substitute for that layer.

 

I first noticed the blurry textures on the southeastern high speed upgrade, back in tsw3 or 4 was it? The passenger problem has been around from the start I think.

Even though I have 100s invested in tsw, I think if dtg would wipe the slate clean and start over with something more stable and less taxing on hardware, it would be a good thing.

The sound squelch is definitely annoying. Definitely so if you have just reinstalled tsw and compiling shader cache!
Why dtg don't do pre shader cache compiling, like many other developers do is a mystery.

 

so you need the sufragette line to own the 378 on the WCML

 

Yes, the 378 is a substitute, the actual layer is from the 710.

You need to be on PC, PS5 or an Xbox Series S/X to get those layers too.

 

Yeah, same, I done about a year ago saying the same thing, but some wanted DLCs regardless, but it has come to ahead now.

 

I am no longer rushing out to buy DLCs until the core game is sorted and I am really looking forward to the Wales DLC, but no.

 

Same. I will probably buy the Dutch DLC, but not straight away. If the performance issues are too much, I'll wait.

The Dutch DLC will be the last one I'll pay full price for anyway, if the core issues are not sorted. Will be skipping TSW6 day one too.

 

I was really worried about this route after my first run. The performance was genuinely unbearable in places, and sometimes the textures in the cab just gave up, and didn't come back for several minutes. It needs fixing asap.

However, for my next two runs I disabled all the layers for trains I was highly unlikely to actually see during the journey, specifically all the ones for the Chiltern, Midland and ECML, as well as the Jubilee line (why does it even exist when that part of Stratford is inaccessible?). The difference is night and day, performance is as smooth as you can get in TSW. Even Stratford becomes fine, and you can still keep all the layers there apart from Jubilee.

If anyone is worried about getting this route because of the performance I promise it runs well if you disable the layers I did.

That being said, it does raise the question of whether all the background layers were necessary to begin with. There's so many that you're hardly ever going to see. Surely someone must have noticed the hit it would take on console performance.

 

I think Johannes has absolutely knocked it out of the park to be honest.

This isn’t just ‘good for a first try’. Save for a few scenery niggles and some enthusiastic suspension/track roughness I’d say this is fantastic, right up there with the best. I absolutely LOVE seeing those AI non-branded trains doing what they should be doing. Just brilliant. james64 Those background layers are absolutely necessary, immersive and really add to the route. At least we now have the best of both worlds where those that don’t have the machinery can disable them

 

It's not just for Stratford. There's a section of Jubilee & Metropolitan line track that crosses between West Hampstead and Brondesbury.

 

i sent n a series f screenshots f Goblin graphical object placement errors ... thecsameverror repeated many times along the route. Hopefully Harry took note. The Mildmay line i have not yet walked end to end as i will only buy this for PS5 and the route crashes TSW5 and the textures become uselessly blurry anyway.

What a disappointment on day one.

 

Is anyone playing on xbox if so are any xbox achievements for this route

 

Right I’ll start off by saying this was a route I adored in TS Classic! And was also one of the first Steam Workshop scenarios I uploaded so this was always going to be a day one purchase.

Pros:

Detailed throughout, stations and Class 378 modelled beautifully

Lineside scenery and clutter, very very detailed which is excellent to see. Personally I think to a standard we’ve not seen much in TSW

Plenty of AI with a very busy feel to it, a proper commuter route!

Performance seems really good on PC, whether that might be due to JetWash enhancement pack and Lossless scaling.

Cons:

Not so much negatives but bugs as I’ve mentioned in the feedback

AWS magnets around Navarino Road Junction (between Hackney Central and Dalston Kingsland) as well as by Canonbury I had no indication, now it was night time so couldn’t see if they were completely missing.

378 running sounds, very quiet while coasting.

Stop markers at incorrect locations

Track unevenness pretty much throughout the route.

WSP, I went into notch 3 as 5mph and thought it was nearly going to come off the rails, it bounced that much when getting WSP activity.

Timetable timings aren’t exactly clockface with arrival/departure times at xx:05/xx:25. A minor annoyance to me but not game breaking!

Overall: An absolutely incredible effort from Johannes as a solo developer, it just needs a bit more polish and bugs ironed out and to me it’s “complete”







Overall score: 7/10

 

To be honest, I believe what impress me most is the amount of service layers on this route: five mainlines (WCML, ECML, HS1, MML, GEML), four overground ( Watford DC, the Gobin, East London line and Lees valley lines), three tubes (Bakerloo, Central and Jubilee), Elizabeth line, Chitern line, even the DLR, and all thse layers look awesome.

Johannes used some reskinned and unlicensed AI layers, which I believed DTG and other developers should really take a lesson from it. They can use reskinned existing-loco to represent those trains or TOC not available in TSW to provide more service layers , enhance players' immersion and fill the major station. Hope that using reskinned AI layers can become a common thing in future TSW routes.

PS: what service layers we can expect if this route go all the way to Richmond
1. GWML services near Acton Central (using HST and 166 from GWE, and reskinned 387)

2. District and Piccadilly line service near and at Gunnersbury station (using reskinned 484 and 72 stock)
3. SWR services on Waterloo–Reading line and Hounslow loop (using reskinned 350)