Asside from tall buildings and landmarks. Surely the number 1 priority would be, to get everything close to the trackside looking spot on. Then work outwards? Ie, make these prioritised areas make sense. Make sure buildings dont have squeaky clean textures. If the panned 150 from WCL is making a comeback, make sure the improvements are instantly night and day noticeable. I dont get it. Short networks are well received when the world is immersive, like Goblin and like Mildmay. If the route has little going on visually, the train is sub par to average and its 20 miles of stopping. Ofcourse this will flop.
I think DTG are banking on not being able to give the 150 a good run to fully test its physics. I still haven’t given the stream a good watch yet. So I’ll happily be corrected.
If only the 153 was the main loco, the only good thing about the route really. Although some scenery is terrible.
The issue there though is tracks & trains make much more noticeable noise at slow speeds. It’s less whooshing & more distinctive clatter & squealing. Also the whole stop start nature introduces the need for varying levels of feedback from the train, which the 150 is totally lacking. If anything I think a route like this is going to make the 150 sound & feel much worse than something like WCL.
The issue is, without the 231/756 (which will eventually go to mainline ops when the 398s come in and 150s go) the main traction for these routes is the 150s…. The 153 just go wherever they’re needed. Much like the 150s I guess. But the 150 is the main traction for better or for worse.
The one thing I'd like to get across in the event it doesn't sell well (we don't know how it will sell yet, that is something that will unravel from next week), is that it isn't because people dislike the type of route, it's because they don't approve of the quality. I feel to some extent players are held at ransom if they don't buy content like this, because we get the "oh it didn't sell well so we won't be doing anymore", much like steam or the BR era... It's not that people don't want to buy them, it's because of quality issues and the two should never get mixed up. I think a clear distinction between content not selling well because of quality issues VS players not buying content because it doesn't interest them. DTG seem to have left the BR era stuff because it didn't sell as well as they'd like, but Just Trains seem to have really put the effort and work into a BR era routes and made a success of it. So I'd argue quality sells, bad quality doesn't.
OH I’VE JUST NOTICED! THEY GOT THE SIGNAL ROUTING CORRECT! Pukka. 10/10, day one purchase. I’ve changed my mind!
Hopefully fps should be good, hopefully it's not anywhere like Mildmay as i hope the fps is closer to 60 than 15 Edit: 15 fps will result in consoles crashing
Thats me right there. This was announced on the back of Goblin. Which was an impressive and well received Network route. The announcement of something similar with diesel, and the potential for a proper 150 had my interest straight away, but I couldnt be less interested in what its turned out to be.
Sadly combine that with the element that spread the gospel that, "Oh but we must buy it because otherwise the developers will be upset and go off in a huff no longer visiting the forum." Or, "If this route fails DTG will run out of money and TSW will collapse." Then it will probably shift enough copies to hit the break even or projected Month One sales, so they will carry on pushing out mediocre routes outsourced to Rivet, and trains where a five minute conference call with the party making the other one could have given both excellent physics and sounds instead of one being a travesty.
Punters were a bit confused, can tell you that much. I was more worried that control would send it up to aberdare at the time hahah
SierraOscar95 Very well said. I agree 100%. I love network routes! Most of my time in TSW lately has been on Mildmay/Suffragette occasionally branching onto WCMLS (would do more here if route hopping from WCMLS to Mildmay was enabled and the timetable was less buggy lol) or SEHS. Also recently a lot of LIRR 2, which is a great network now in its improved form. Cardiff just doesn't look like quality right now. Please don't take my lack of a day 1 purchase as anything other than a reflection of that particular work.
This is what frustrates me. I've sat down to try out WSR rail and the 33 after the update. And it's absolutely beautiful and I had a great time (until I spad because I was too busy admiring the scenery but I digress). There couldn't be a more stark contrast between the work of Art WSR has become thanks to Liam and Mattel (lol ). But seriously WSR just seems to get better!
Watching the stream (finally) with my AirPods - I don’t think the 150 sounds as atrocious. It could still be better, definitely. But it’s not gut wrenchingly bad.
AWS is completely wrong though. That needs fixing. Don’t know why that couldn’t have been reused from the 153…. But I digress….
Yeah I thought that. Still using the old aws sounds for some reason. Surely they have a catalogue of aws sounds by now
Just managed to watch the stream. I buy most UK routes if not all, and a nice commuter, stop-start route is right up my street. Even better with a DMU, something we haven’t really had for a long time in TSW! One of the comments on the stream by Matt was they looked at Realtime Trains not just for the timetable (which is busy) which is a positive but for good start and end points. I think it’s a big miss not to have ended up going to Caerphilly - more journey opportunities and you could have ended up with Coryton-Penarth and Caerphilly-Penarth and return as two full end to end timetabled runs (yes I know the line doesn’t stop at Caerphilly carries on to Bargoed and Rhymmey) both similar length 35 minute runs. I think that was a let down. But apart from that I think the network style of the route works well. The 150 sounds are still not up to scratch, a lot better than West Cornwall, so there’s a definite improvement, I noticed it had the 153 brake release sound. Thankfully the model is really good. The 153 is the star of this route. The whole Rivet discussion is irrelevant to me. I think the negativity towards them on here is frankly a huge overreaction / bordering on a weird obsession with them. I’m embarrassed when I read some of the comments towards them, there’s real people behind that company that have feelings. I think the constant Rivet bashing, and jokes at their expense became old and boring a long time ago, it’s wore a bit thin now. For the record, I love WCML South and Fife Circle two of my top routes I play. Whereas, West Cornwall Local to be honest one of the few DLC’s I’ve regretted buying, I make up my mind on an individual route basis, not just because it looks good to be seen to fit in to bash Rivet. There’s a few clues that this is a Rivet timetable, although I’m happy to corrected. The 30 second station stops even at Cardiff Central and Queen Street were a giveaway. All I’ll say if the feeling against Rivet really is that strong, vote with your wallet. It’s a Day One purchase for me, I’m quite happy with what I saw. As I said in another thread, look at forum users who have said that they aren’t getting it and or constantly bash Rivet and then look at the feedback thread on the first day, you’ll find the same users in there!
still think that there is *some* valid criticism of rivets work, and given Matt’s reluctance to say their involvement only confirms that. IMO. I agree people need to be voting with their wallets. I certainly will be. I’m not picking this up. Not at full price. There’s just too much wrong with it to justify the price. (Yes, I know, inflation, inflation) I do like the route, but there’s just so many frustratingly missing details. Some of the route looks spot on, but some of the mistakes that I’m seeing shouldn’t have been made. Matt mentioned beta testers were from the area, what input did they have? Why didn’t they bring up the issues with central not being properly modelled? Why would they not bring up the teleporting to opposite platforms? Did they bring these up, if they did, were they shut down? Who knows. it’s frustrating because I want to get this day one, I just can’t justify it.
If it's anything like WCMLs, based off what was being said at the time, lots of issues were raised and logged, and then not actioned ever/for a while. Liam then came in and saved it - whether there are still Jira tickets to action or not, I wouldn't know
Absolutely, there’s nothing wrong with valid criticism at all. I do myself when I provide feedback in that part of the forum. But I can restrain myself to be constructive and not abusive. My personal bugbear is timetables, I like them to be as realistic and perfect. That’s what fuels the realism of TSW for me, for others obviously it’s different. DTG aren’t going to tell exactly what tree Rivet placed where, what building they placed where. And I’m happy not knowing. It doesn’t bother me to that extent. However, what we are seeing against Rivet, is targeted abuse, not only that but at individuals at the company. That’s out of order. You see it on the TSC Discord server, whenever Rivet is mentioned, unnecessary comments. It must be seen to be cool to jump on that bandwagon and be part of that running joke and that clique that does it. I, personally don’t get it. It’s unnecessary, nasty and vindictive. Maybe I need a sense of humour transplant.
If people want to defend Rivet you're welcome to do so that is your right and your welcome to have an alternative opinion. What I personally won't stand for is saying it's targeted abuse or bullying on here. If you build sub standard content and make no attempt to improve your work which is full of issues, constantly make the same mistakes even when people take time to tell you what the bugs/issues are, and don't strive to improve your issues and intentionally bury your head in the sand as a developer and charge people a fair amount of money for your content, then quite frankly you bring it on yourself and people are within their rights to vent such frustrations. If people want to lap that up, that is entirely upto them. But don't start labelling people bullies or call them abusive for venting valid frustration. The misconception that the comments come from a malicious and unwarranted place on the forum really grinds my gears.
Oh there are plenty of munchkins roaming these virtual halls trying to make others believe their own warped logic that they have convinced themselves is true when in truth know absolutely naff all, it's great watching them screaming into the void thinking that the voice they can hear is everyone agreeing with them, and then getting drunk on what they think is power and influence over everyone else only for the bubble to burst and it finally dawns on them the only voice they heard was the echo of themselves screaming into the void, just another reason to never base any decisions on this game from what you read on here and only use your own mind and opinion.....
Yes and as usual it’s the same old names coming along to inflame discussions. Don’t like the points people are making? Discuss the good ones. Make the feedback relevant. The only comments you’ve left is about wanting to antagonise people.
Not at all, just saying what I see with my own eyes, you see claiming I can't give my opinion of what I see but you and many others can vent because you don't like what what you see or things like Thomas coming to the game, just proves the comical hypocrisy of people roaming these virtual halls.....
Not everything needs to be said with a literal word, context and phasing can say more than a thousand words.....
There’s always bad on both sides of the coin, you have those that will bash EVRYTHING DTG does, no matter how good it is. But you’ll have those that defend DTG to the very end, no matter how bad the content is. again, CC for instance, Matt said it was “far too much work” to model the concourse. Why? Like, I’m sorry, but that’s just pathetic. The route is based around this station, this station is the MAIN station in Cardiff, and wales for that matter. To leave out the main concourse because it’s “too much work” just shows the mindset that went into the route. You’ve done 95% of the station, why not just finish the main entrance and make it complete? It’s just a big hall with a couple of retail units, a ticket office and a stairs/lift up to platform 0. The retail units being M&S by the stairs to 0, WHS, UpperCrust and a bakery. now, I’m no modelling expert, but when you’ve already done this much work, is it that much harder to add the concourse? I suspect not. I’d imagine this came down to time, money, and “can’t be bothered” attitude.
Agree. A small route gives you the opportunity to go to town with the detail. I mean look at JT and WCML Shap, they packed an insane amount of detail into an 90+ mile route, even signalboxes you could go inside. This is not some freeware effort but a payware route being sold at a premium price compared to others of that category. DTG should be ashamed of defending these shortcuts and sadly indicates to me a complete lack of pride or interest by those who built this thing.
The kicker being, the building itself would’ve been modelled… they just had to add an interior… corner cutting at its finest, I fear about this teleporting feature.
Your post was clear based on what I saw with my own eyes. You accused people who "vent" of hypocrisy for not allowing you to not have an opinion when nobody said that you couldn't have an opinion.
Oh, canton is also barebones… but I guess it’s acceptable… but that’s the bar that’s been set… still peeves me though, that canton has been utilised as an “everything” depot. Only TFW stock is maintained there. Nothing else. Why they didn’t use the sidings outside is beyond me. it feels like the “research” trip was more of an all expenses paid holiday for the DTG staff.
Routes like the Suffragette Line is another example of a good quality route. With DTG is just quantity over quality
I am yet to watch the stream still, however from what I am reading here it is not looking great. I can understand that things won't be perfect, but some things pointed out here are just unacceptable. DTG's last release were WCCL which were questionable in multiple ways, so its not like they have not had time to knuckle down and focus on this DLC, they can't even use the old excuse of fixing core issues because that is no better either. Anyway I'm going in with an open mind...
I seen plenty that looks great - but some really glaring issues. definitely watch it and make your own mind up. But Matt did use the “fixing core issues” excuses….
