Evidence Of Rivets Involvement With The Cardiff Network Route

Well surprise surprise this photo is in my opinion evidence of rivets involvement with cardiff network here is a photo of the cardiff central entrance building in tsw and below that a photo of it in real life of what it's supposed to look like

 

Shocking! That’s why I didn’t pick this route up. It just felt underwhelming to me.
Certainly a lack of an attention to detail in a lot of areas including what you’ve shown too. They want £29.99 for this. On your bike!

 

It's 29.99 it should of been 24.99 and it's not all that bad most of its fine but yeah get where your coming from it's not awful

 

There's been people who have been completely critical of the route and then have gone out and bought it none the less knowing of Rivets quite extensive input of this route... And then they act surprised at it's clear quality issues. Voting with your money is the only way to let DTG know this quality is not acceptable at this stage in the games life. It is highly moronic behaviour to be highly critical of content like this and know it has extensive flaws and mediocre quality... But then not to stand by your principles and go ahead and purchase it anyway, only to moan it's not good enough?!

To those who bought it, fully knowing of Rivets involvement and quality issues not just from this, but from WCMLS, FCL, WCL... "Fool me once shame on you; fool me twice shame on me". Enough said!

 

I know this has a lot of Rivet hall marks.

But I don't think it matters who did the scenery. It just needs to be better for a £30 route.
It could be a lot better in some areas and it shows those patches where it's not been great which TrainsimTV also picked up on. But then some parts of the route are beautifully modelled? I don't really understand it myself. If it was all done to that high standard it'd be amazing

 

Agree with Coursetim, the fact Rivet did the route is not the problem and should not be what is focused on. The problem is the fact that Rivet have done aspects of the route poorly and DTG Towers have happily signed it off and released it under their name. Ultimately if you are looking for blame it is on DTG, but pointing a finger will not achieve anything.
If we are being asked to pay 30 quid for something I expect it to be worth the money, no matter which of DTGs various out-towers had something to do with it. Certain aspects seem to be at this £30 standard, others don't and that is what needs fixing and improving on going into the future

 

Did we really need yet another thread to discuss the same thing?

 

I haven't bought it and don't intend to unless there's improvements that entrance building is appalling shows how rushed it was its insulting to charge £30 for things like that

 

It would be different if dtg didn't work with Rivet

You can thank dtg for annoyingly to continue to work with rivet

 

People love to criticise dtg for their approach to fixing stuff, but there’s no arguing with the fact that since tsw4, dovetail have made consistently solid routes. So so obvious who’s made this one

 

I’m glad there are people on here that find this stuff because I honestly wouldn’t notice a lot of shoddy work unless I really went out of my way to find. It really baffles me that DTG released the route in this state though, clearly more attention goes into testing than actually going through the route with a fine tooth comb to see if all the surrounding assets are at a acceptable quality and real to life.
I mean whoever modelled that monstrosity of a building at Cardiff central really should be reevaluated to see if they quality for their job title.

 

It was obviously rivet there are plenty of significant signs of them being involved with scenery stuff

 

As I said in the other thread, sloppy and lazy route building accompanied by indifferent quality control, just rush it out to boost the coffers. I am no 3D modeller but the bits I did for my MSTS freeware routes, I couldn’t bring myself to leave a centrepiece structure of the route looking like that. These are supposedly professional artists and route builders getting paid for doing a job.

If DTG had any conscience or credibility, they would pull the route, refund those who bought it and throw it back at whoever built it with a not good enough warning. And whoever greenlighted this for publication should seriously consider if they are in the right job.

 

For the people saying you should vote with your wallet, I did, I threw it at them and said take everything that's in there, in fact I'll take multiple copies and give them to my many friends that live in my head. You see I feel I have to do my part in keeping everyone that worked on the Welsh route in business......

 

It's like sitting by a pond in spring - rivet, rivet, rivet.....

 

But we knew Rivet were involved, Matt confirmed it on the preview stream.

 

Am I right in thinking… DTG decide on a route, what length is feasible and with a set budget a time limit to achieve this?
If this is the case it’s no wonder that content will likely be released in a rushed unfinished state regardless of who’s involved in the project.

This would also seem a bit of a false economy as DTG then have to deal with providing numerous patches post release, responding (or not) to unhappy customers or in the future even providing a remaster for free! This doesn’t seem a very logical way to go about things but I could be way off the mark also.

 

Right... I mean if you want to act like a lighthouse for developers with rushed content and buy multiple copies of something, that is your right as a paying customer, even as absurd as that is. Even joking aside, that just seems a 'cut your nose to spite your face' type logic, just buying something to take a dig at the rest of community? No one loses out other then you financially.

You know thats your right to buy something without needing to justify it? You don't need to parade it around in an antagonising manner, in some poor attempt at 'rage bating' people?

If you genuinely enjoy it, as I've said with others I'm sincerely glad it brings you joy, but equally respect the fact people can take the opposite stance without feeling the necessity to be antagonising.

 

Wouldn't this also apply to people loudly parading about in sackcloth and ashes rather than simply not buying something that doesn't suit them?

 

I've said many times before, I truly don't care what people think or what their opinions are on things, If I want it I buy it, so it's not me getting on my moral high horse claiming that because I've bought something that you don't like or isn't up to your standards is an invitation for developers to push out more content. So just as i fully respect your view and also don't care about it, the opposite of that is you have to accept that I don't like being very serious about stuff that I really don't need to be serious about. It's a game, if I want the realism you crave so bad, I leave the computer and live it in the real world.....

 

Yes, it does apply to them. But the difference with what I see in my own statements at least is not aiming or going out of my way to antagonise others. My criticism since the release is those individuals who slated the route into the ground before the release and then didn't stand by their word and proceeded to buy the route only to surprisingly continue to moan and act shocked at the quality...

I respect that, and I mean this sincerely in the politest way, but you've got to remember sometimes messages don't translate in the way they were intended. I do see it as antagonising and maybe I've misunderstood your intent, but I've noticed this on a couple of threads now, so it's just a friendly reminder, make sure the intent is clear as it can rub people up the wrong way even if not intended too. Maybe that's just me though I can only speak of my own perception...

In terms of realism, unfortunately there's no way on earth I'm going to be able to drive back 1986, or the modern era of the railways, this is where I use the technology of the simulator to gain some of the things I'll never be able to experience in real life. I know it's capable of those things and of producing high quality content. But the last few UK add ons have been real dampeners... GOBLIN was fantastic but since then, it's taken a real tumble...

 

Again fully respect your opinion, but I speak fluent sarcasm and definitely won't be changing the way I post messages, so will say sorry in advance and trust you will be happy to respect that, but less of this serious rubbish, roll on Thomas visiting Wales tomorrow after work......

 

Well I'll offer you a cyber handshake and acknowledge that going forward. No hard feelings and all that.

If Thomas is on sale the only thing I'll be doing is using the ROG 37 to simulate a move of Annie and Clarabelle going to CF Booths for scrap and equipment recovery!

 

Wow, that's a pretty minimal-effort job.

 

Yup

 

I’m gonna say this but don’t lynch me. Rivet do some good work.
Problem is they aren’t good at everything, so producing a full route trips them up. They should be utilised for what they are good at and the rest done by other parties.

 

In fairness to them they did a great job with IOW 2022 but since then it's not been to good

 

Folks, in your anguish, remember if you've got a PC that TSC will always take you back.

 

Yes, the prodigal sons and daughters will always be welcomed there!

 

I think they do some nice stations and trains. The Fife train, the bridge and some stations and line side detail are good. But it’s like they run out of steam or time and then just throw together the rest.

 

The Forth Bridge on Fife Circle is brilliant. It's clear they spent their time on it.

In respect of Rivet I'll repeat what I've said elsewhere (paraphrased because I can't remember exactly what I said):

They're not bad developers, but they obviously don't have the resources for the workload they've been given. They seem to be there to fill a quota and nothing else. Hence why their routes are always lower quality.

Now, if they were given a year to produce one route and nothing else, maybe things would be different.

 

it will take me back but its kinda like moving from a nice appartment that has an ant investation to a dirty collapsing shack in the woods somewhere

 

I would say a better analogy is moving from a badly built incomplete modern apartment, that had so much promise, to an older unfashionable block of flats that the occupants and other tradespeople have made beautiful through their own work.

 

Question, as I don't know the area and I don't have the route. This is the back side of the building, right? Not something one would actually see while driving, correct? Just trying to understand the impact it has during gameplay and not sleuthing with free camera around the environment. TSW was dreadful with this since forever, some of the things I found on Rapid Transit or Northern Trans-Pennine was just dreadful, but when I stuck to driving none of the areas were really visible, so... I stopped sleuthing as it didn't do me any favors.

 

I sometimes read here and think people are sat facing a greenhouse they really want to love, but constantly throw stones at it.
Imagine how good life would be if you looked at a greenhouse you didnt need to throw stones at instead.

If though, you don't see any other greenhouses you like the look of maybe stop throwing stones, being antagonistic and whinging and feed stuff back constructively. How many times do DTG invite a support ticket. I use them frequently.

All this shouldn't be released stuff is yawnful..... Nothings perfect. I'm not saying accept lower but this is one product any of us can buy where things do get updated. Does everything, no. Is it within an hour, no. I'd rather play something which gives me an experience I will never have, if its only 80-90% of way there in my world its better than nothing which seems to be what everyone is hoping to achieve with their moaning

But from an enjoyment perspective, go play it more rather than keep whining on every thread. Think how many players toxicity drives away. This is supposed to be a community of rail fans, but its horrendous lately. 145 pages on one thread of absolute toss.

Using simple logic, we support, we feedback, let DTG attract more players, then hopefully the knock on is bigger dev budgets, more routes, more artists etc etc.

Instead, all half the people do here is p"ss in the pool and make less people want to jump in.

Reflection people, reflection.

 

No it is the main frontage of the station and an iconic recognisable location for anyone who has been to Cardiff or even walked across the plaza by the station. At minimum they could have put a flat texture on the front of it. The people building these routes are supposedly accomplished 3D modellers and graphic artists. It should be a matter of pride not to leave the main station on this tiny overpriced route in such a half finished state.

 

Why are you worried? Surely if the product is good enough it can stand on its own two feet.

You sound like you just want acceptance for the sake of not losing it in the future. Reminds me of Dr Who fans who couldn’t bring themselves to critique the show for fear of it being cancelled again. As it stands it’s poor quality from lack of listening by the makers is doing the job for them.

It’s actually an easy fix and it’s something the business world fails to understand because all they care about is money.

Make less products, but make them better. Stop rushing stuff to market to meet business deadlines, it’s a false economy and is just harming your business.

Face up to issues, diagnose them and fix them and build a relationship with the folks that care. Don’t go chasing folks who are casual, because those folks will leave you in the dust (yes I’m talking Thomas stank engine here).

It’s better to have fewer products per year at better quality for slightly higher pricing than a model that’s the opposite - too many products at lower quality and high pricing as it will eventually erode away your audience.

 

Stank is a typo btw it won’t let me fix it

 

The other key point about the Cardiff building in particular is that is supposed to be Train Sim World. As we are frequently told, the reason routes are shorter and take longer to make plus more expensive, is because of the requirement to create an immersive and accurate setting not just visible from the cab view. I mean you have the guy who did Mildmay, yes probably went a bit OTT recreating half of London but he went the distance and put in the work to give the whole thing authentic surroundings. This is what’s supposed to set TSW apart from MSTS and TSC. So I really don’t know what the hell Rivet or whoever created this abomination were thinking, or the EP when he signed off on release. Probably preoccupied with the Thomas caper…

 

Berninaline was good as well. But the rest is meh and very low on my play list.

 

No, we didn't. All of this could have gone in the Cardiff City Line Discussion thread.

It's bad enough that DTG don't close off 'Coming Soon' threads in the Dovetail Live Article Discussion forum when a new 'Out Now' thread is started. What with the actual Feedback thread, there's often the same discussion spread across 4 or more threads.

 

Who cares what the front of the building looks like? I can't think of a time when I have left the station and looked at the front of the building. Look at Preston Park, it looks nothing like the station the platform 1 side Is completely wrong.

Making the actual route as perfect as possible is my priority IMo

 

But to those who know the area, the station front being correct is what they want.

 

If I'm being fair and honest I'm sure the same could be said for a few routes in this regard...

However I do side on the "if you make it visibly explorable it should be detailed authentically". and quite frankly, regardless of who made the route, that's a pretty abysmal and lazy attempt at such a distinctive looking station front...

 

Agreed. If you're going to put a station into the game, do it properly. I'll be seriously peeved if my local (small) station ever gets misrepresented in TSW.

 

Just Trains are so good because they get almost a year to bring out a new route. Imagine if Rivet were given the same time frame? Just a thought.

 

Local to the bml, I was peeved. Preston park no railings opposite platform one. Haywards heath no bridge to the car park. No bridge at Keymer junction or south Croydon, the list does go on.

The lack of use of ardingly, purley and Crawley still gets me. Not to mention Newhaven marine which shouldn't really have any layer issues

Unfortunately we can expect these things and the Cardiff building won't get fixed. Nothings perfect and Cardiff being an example, bml being another