Will More Dutch Routes Come In The Future, Or Will It Be Just Like France

Like the title said. I hope the Netherlands will be expended in the future so it is not something like the TGV route being the only french route

 

I have popped this question in the stream Q&A. Of course the standard answer likely to be, “If it’s not on the Roadmap…” However it would be a waste of creating two new trains and going to the trouble of setting up Dutch signalling etc., if there weren’t any plans. It probably also depends how well this route sells, if it meets or exceeds the projected revenue target.

 

I reckon if anything that the Dutch routes will be more like Austria. It had its first release to form the baseline of the fleet and infrastructure, then there were two more routes featuring it (granted one was pretty much just a short hop across the border while 90% was still in Germany), then DTG returned their Euro focus to Germany and left Austria for others like TSG to work with. In terms of DTG's own work, Austria was pretty much a thing contained to just TSW4, and I reckon this Dutch route will be something similar. This route will release, then perhaps the European core route of TSW6/the summer bundle/whatever will be a second Dutch route, then somewhere there will perhaps be one more before the focus either returns to Germany once again or another country is picked up instead.

 

I think there will be more Dutch routes. Everyone is pretty hyped for the Netherlands routes. I prefer German Routes but I’d still love to see more France in TSW. Actually it’s a bit strange they haven’t done more French routes. I fair enjoyed the one we currently have but it’s a bit of a short run which is a bit sad.

 

Well DTG do love a ‘one country wonder’….I guess time will tell….

 

I think it depends on how well this upcoming route sells. You have to wish that DTG had gone for a route in the Amsterdam-Rotterdam conurbation which would probably have done better.

Then again the LGV route apparently did very well but no French routes have followed.
Licensing issues perhaps! Well that's not the case here, so we'll see. I'd certainly like to see more Dutch routes.

 

I get the feeling it's the rather inflexible mentality of SNCF that is stopping more French routes, I mean you have so many interesting scenic lines so having even 20 French routes would be a blast but sadly I cannot even see LGV Nord being done.

 

If the route is a success and the NS is willing to help in the future then I don’t see why we won’t have more Dutch routes. I’m personally super excited for the ICM and I’m confident it will sell like hot cakes. The problem with French routes is simple, the SNCF is not interested in giving licensing at the moment, who knows it might change.

 

France is crying out for the classic line along the Riviera, too, but sadly unlikely to happen.

 

There’s a private competitor who will operates very soon along the French Riviera I think you’ll be happy as… nevermind it’ll be operated by brand new double deckers EMUs

 

Such a stunning route, I recently went there on holiday and I was thinking how fun it would be to drive the double decker units between Grasse and Menton.

 

The fact that dtg have picked a rather boring and run-of-the-mill route indicates that they have plans for more Dutch routes, but want to see how the community takes to this one

 

That’s a shame but hopefully they will change their mind later down the road. Would love to see more France.

 

I remember Matt saying that the LGV route was made because it was a TGV route, not because it was French, and it was the only section with a decent-ish run with the TGV while being short enough to fit in TSW2's development schedule.

I also remember Matt saying that the Dutch route was a means for DTG to get their hands into the Netherlands with a fairly simple route with the intention of bringing more Dutch routes in the future.

I can't provide sources because I forgot where they came from...

 

I think a better measure of the community's interest in Dutch Railways would have been to build the Amsterdam to Rotterdam line which is only 36 miles but vastly more interesting.

Releasing Zwolle to Groningen is like building the ECML from Peterborough to Doncaster to see if there's any interest in UK rail in other countries

Having said that, I might pop for the Dutch route to see how the trains perform rather than to drive the flat and largely featureless straight track.

The price, though, is still a barrier.

 

I would at least expect this to follow the Metrolink model, where DTG got access and was able to produce two routes with two locos and a cab car, a gameplay pack, and a loco pack. Austria also got two routes from DTG. So, based on this, and the apparent popularity within the community for the Netherlands, I would be very surprised if we didn't get at least 2 Dutch routes. I agree with others who have guessed that the next Dutch route will be included with TSW6. And if it is, we know that the "base routes" are usually the ones that get the most attention post-release.

All in all, I think that there is a future for even more Dutch routes in the game, barring any disaster which totally tanks this first route.

 

Yes that would have been more of a crowd pleaser. In fact I would say rather than ECML, this route is more akin to building Norwich to Peterborough for the UK (actually nearly as flat scenery wise!). And I agree about the price, think it’s a bit cheeky to push £33 as so far as we know it is an in house production so no extra royalties to a third party. They should be pitching it for the hook, to get people who might be unsure about NS to take the plunge and buy it. That will lose them some sales as will not having a 10% prerelease purchase discount.

Will make my decision after seeing highlights of the stream and what the console buyers say, maybe even wait until later in the week. Don’t let the money burn a hole in my Steam Wallet!

 

I'm always a supporter of new countries, especially Holland. Since DTG has now become familiar with Dutch signaling and train control systems, why not more Holland DLCs in the future? I'm thinking of large train stations like Amsterdam or Rotterdam, where the TGV or ICE3M could also stop. In DTG's fishing game "The Catch," Rotterdam was implemented very well, just without the station and trains.

If you look at all the TSW DLCs of the past few years, there's always a connection, meaning a station is used as a starting point multiple times. With the introduction of the route hopping feature, one could imagine further connections in Holland from Zwolle or elsewhere. Two new trains have also been modeled; it would be a shame to see or use them in just one DLC. Besides, the TGV now also runs in the UK and Germany.

 

Could this be the start of a move towards a more European-focused Sim? In line with many companies who no longer see the US as a reliable trading partner. There have been issues with operators in New York and California that have led to delayed releases and products being withdrawn from sale.

If DTG are finding European operators easier to work with (especially if there are promising noises coming from Great British Railways that could lead to them having a licencing agreement on GBR English routes) then maybe there will only be occasional US releases from US developers like High Iron or whatever they're called. If TSW6 includes (for example) a French or Dutch route along with the usual German and UK route, I'll be very happy.

 

I think you have mis-quoted Matt…I’m sure he said it was ‘DTG’s aspiration to bring more Dutch routes in’….

 

I would hope so. I mean to be frank, I haven’t bothered with the second MBTA route and only got the SBO because it was in the TSW5 bundle. I find the US commuter to be a bit slow and cludgy, with those interminable slow approaches to the termini and relatively slow paced running. Freight side is adequately catered for by TSC and Run 8.

So yes, I would like to see more variety from Europe. They need to attempt a rapprochement with SBB and SNCF, along with looking at countries like the Czech Republic (for a Grump 749 or tiny 810 rail bus into the forested hills), or as suggested several times maybe Italy or Scandinavia even.

 

What I have played so far, its a nice route. tad flat (lol). Just getting used to the ATB and hopefully some of the other Ambassodors will release tutorials on how to use / utilise and understand ATB. The Koploper is bloody awesome and great to drive.
Would love to see some more Dutch routes as well as French.

Hentis

 

Yes I am very happy for the dutch route as well y'all replying (sorry for bad grammar I am dutch)
Hope my poor fx 4300 + gtx 1050 can run it

 

All well and good. I understand you're just dipping your toes in the water of a new country. Choosing a less well-known provincial route may make sense.

So might I suggest a more attractive introductory price and/or a pre- release discount might have ensured a sturdier take-off.

For US buyers DTG is crossing the $50 red line, if that matters to DTG at this point.

 

Thanks Matt and Tony, it is looking like this will be a Day One purchase barring anything unforeseen. However I must agree with Crosstie and what I said elsewhere, pitching the price at or above many customers’ red line for content may prove to be a mistake as is not having a prerelease discount price.

 

It may sound maybe strange to allot of people and i dont want to offend anyone. But i am willing to pay for future Dutch content. I am looking forward to much more Dutch content after waiting all these years. And i hope this first route is really good and many more to follow.

 

Depends on whether NS demands from DTG to dumb down the trains to prevent tampering with systems like LIRR and/or trainjacking/acts of terrorism like SNCF?
When operational safety and passenger security gets compromised it will be either dumb down from 'the ultimate in train simulation' or end-of-license.

 

The latest price rises are bad enough, please don't encourage them to think about making DLC even more expensive. Charging that for a route it would be lucky to sell 50 copies - the £30 we have just seen for Cardiff Network crosses my red line for a small route and what DTG are asking for Zwolle has nudged over the line too, but I will make an exception if the stream etc. demonstrate the quality is there - bearing in mind all this content is going into a core which still has many issues that need to be fixed or improved (like the save game with more slots and not bugging out when you save on a second run).

 

agree. I am dutch, but I am NOT gonna buy this route without sale. Or I just ask it for my birthday lol

 

I think a good next route would be Zwolle - Amsterdam via Lelystad. It allows re-use of the expensive Zwolle station, freeing up dev time for the massive Amsterdam Centraal area. The scenery through the Oostvaardersplassen is very beautiful and there is also an interesting service pattern, with trains stabling at various times of the day at Almere Centrum, Almere Oostvaarders, Lelystad Centrum, or Lelystad Opstel. If there is any dev time left after that they could even have a go at developing ETCS as it is technically available on (part of) that route although not used in day-to-day operation.

 

I understand where you're coming from, but I've been waiting a decade for a Dutch route, and it always seemed very unlikely to happen. So I'm very hyped it actually happens and want to encourage DTG to make more Dutch content. So, I'm voting with my wallet and make this a day one purchase (unless the preview stream really dissapoints me, obviously). I'd happily part with a few more euros to increase the chances of future Dutch content.

But yeah, not too happy with the price increase in general, I buy most of my stuff during sales anyways. Plus I understand the US price is on steep side compared to EU and UK prices. So I totally get your point.

 

Although that would be my local route, I don't really understand the appeal of that route. Looks a tad boring to me, although I'd buy it in an instance as I live in Almere.

Personally I think Amsterdam/Schiphol - Amersfoort is a much more interesting route with a more diverse landscape, albeit shorter in distance. Drop a like on my suggestion if you like it. Link in signature.

 

Do you have a map of this route suggestion. I'm not familiar with thee area. thanks. disregard I saw the google map link ; )

 

There's a Google Maps link in my suggestion, I don't know what else I could do for you?

 

That would be nice too; I was just thinking how to expand on what’s already there. Whatever they do, it must include the VIRM. Such an icon of Dutch railroading.

 

I had replied back

 

Best chance to get more Dutch routes is to buy this one. I think introducing an new and quite different country is a serious investment. It is normal business practice to do more similar if it worth the money.

 

I understand making a route that includes Amsterdam would be awesome, but probably not as the second route.

How many different trains are needed to make the station justice so it does not feel like a ghost town? 6? 8? 10?

Looks to me it needs to be the 4th route or beyond.

 

I've often wondered about the "we'll see the feedback and make a decision" concept around new DLC.

Matt has said many times that TGV was one of their best selling and most played DLC but where did it go? nowhere.....

All the work on the signalling and the modelling of a very good train, kinda a bit of a waste, which I would understand if it didn't sell and nobody played it but that was not the case

 

In fairness, TVM430 was later used on SEHS and the TGV itself layers onto several other routes so I wouldn't say it went nowhere and was a waste.

 

Amsterdam Centraal is actually not that diverse in rolling stock. if the next route includes a Virm it would pretty accurately represent it. Only really missing an SLT and eurostar stock. the randstad region is mostly just Virm, SNG, ICM and SLT with not much variation. Once you go out of that area you see more different operators and trains

 

It’s almost criminal the way French Railways have been ignored.

 

I'm not sure what you mean by "boring;" the Netherlands aren't exactly known for their stunning mountain vistas. But if you mean "Why not a major center like Amsterdam"- I think DTG has caught enough flak over empty terminus stations not to do something as big and complex as Amsterdam with only two trains to run in it.

 

AIUI, SNCF was willing to license the TGV, but only the TGV.

 

Interesting: the mastery bonus for Groeningen is "A special Poster for use on Dutch routes." Notice the plural?

 

I hope so. I think the fact that we have two common trains for the network right off the bat will be helpful. With France we only ever got the TGV which limits re-use considering they basically run on their own network.

 

The TGV, the whole TGV, and nothing but the TGV

 

Amsterdam - Rotterdam is a no brainer.


More Dutch routes is definitely something to look forward to. Maybe TSW should become more Europe focussed because it almost feels like a breath of fresh air having a route with a yellow blue livery scheme instead of the usual red ones. Also both trains feel very unique in the way you drive them. I did not know the Netherlands had the most fun to drive trains in the EU. Probably because I don't have to translate all the words in the cockpit.

 

We'll see more Dutch routes as they are cheap and easy to knock out - long straight tracks with flat featureless landscape. Not for me.

For DTG it is always about finding the lowest cost route to sales. Steam was complicated so it was dropped. 1980s required extra research, so it was dropped.

And that's why we had the ECML north of Peterborough rather than the much more interesting and complex southern section to London.