Ap Stock Discontinuation Updates

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by inversnecky, Jan 27, 2023.

  1. inversnecky

    inversnecky Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 26, 2020
    Messages:
    2,252
    Likes Received:
    841
    I’ve noticed that the AP Mark 1 coaching stock has been discontinued - anyone know why? [Pointed out below this is incorrect.]

    I know some items are discontinued if felt below par (such as the Class 40), or sound packs are removed if an EP or full train is in the works.

    But there does seem to be a fair few items that have disappeared without fanfare, such as numerous sound packs.

    Can we compile a list of AP DLC no longer available, plus reasons why?


    Below list updated with thanks to contributors below…


    ROLLING STOCK

    Locomotives:
    Class 40 Locomotive Pack

    DMUs:

    EMUs:

    Coaches:

    Wagons:



    ENHANCEMENT PACKS

    Locomotives:

    DMUs:

    EMUs:



    SOUND PACKS

    Locomotives:
    Class 20 Sound Pack (Pro)
    Class 33 Sound Pack (Pro)
    Class 37/9 Sound Pack
    Class 47 Sound Pack (Pro)
    Class 55 Sound Pack (Pro)
    Class 57 Sound Pack (Pro)
    Class 60 Sound Pack (Pro)
    Class 86/87 Sound Pack

    Multiple Units:
    Class 150/153/156 Sound Pack (Pro)
    Class 220-222 Sound Pack (Pro)
    Class 303 Sound Pack
    Class 360/444/450 Sound Pack
    Class 365/465/466 (Met-Cam) Sound Pack

    Rolling Stock:
    Mk3 Coach Sound Pack


    GENERAL

    Route Stability (for 32 bit)
    Lighting Effects Enhancement Pack
    Station Lighting Enhancement Pack
     
    Last edited: Feb 3, 2023
  2. USRailFan

    USRailFan Active Member

    Joined:
    Jul 2, 2018
    Messages:
    457
    Likes Received:
    125
    • Like Like x 1
  3. Cuddy_Man

    Cuddy_Man Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 16, 2020
    Messages:
    134
    Likes Received:
    253
    Their old DT origin Mk1 pack was removed shortly before their current Mk 1 pack was released. Not surprising, since it was comprehensively superseded.
     
  4. inversnecky

    inversnecky Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 26, 2020
    Messages:
    2,252
    Likes Received:
    841
    That will maybe explain it, as I was reading the requirements for a scenario in a manual and it listed various coaches with ‘Mk1 - discontinued’. Much be an error or referring to an old version.
     
  5. inversnecky

    inversnecky Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 26, 2020
    Messages:
    2,252
    Likes Received:
    841
    Wasn’t there a Class 47 Sound Pack that has been removed?

    Looking at what I have, compared to what’s available now, I see the following have been removed:

    Class 20 Sound Pack Pro
    Class 33 Sound Pack Pro
     
    Last edited: Jan 28, 2023
  6. 390001

    390001 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 18, 2018
    Messages:
    1,938
    Likes Received:
    1,259
    Yeah there was a class 47 sound pack i have saw a few liveries etc that call for that as a requirement
     
  7. R3dS41ft

    R3dS41ft Active Member

    Joined:
    Sep 18, 2020
    Messages:
    242
    Likes Received:
    69
    Wayback machine might help you find out what has changed on the site over time.
    I think there was a class 60 sound pack that was removed as well.
     
  8. USRailFan

    USRailFan Active Member

    Joined:
    Jul 2, 2018
    Messages:
    457
    Likes Received:
    125
    Class 86/87 sound pack
    All scenario packs
    The first freight car sound pack (was replaced with several separate ones)
     
  9. Reef

    Reef Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 27, 2018
    Messages:
    2,717
    Likes Received:
    1,772
    Yep.
    Image2.jpg

    Also Yep.
    Image9.jpg Image10.jpg

    Plus these others that I own which is not a fully inclusive list by any means..
    Image11.jpg Image12.jpg
     
  10. Reef

    Reef Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 27, 2018
    Messages:
    2,717
    Likes Received:
    1,772
    Cont..
    Image13.jpg Image14.jpg
    Image15.jpg
     
  11. inversnecky

    inversnecky Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 26, 2020
    Messages:
    2,252
    Likes Received:
    841
    Thanks for the update.

    Why so many sound packs culled, when there’s been no EP to replace them?
     
    • Like Like x 1
  12. Doomotron

    Doomotron Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Oct 24, 2018
    Messages:
    2,820
    Likes Received:
    3,383
    Because in their eyes they're 'not good enough' despite the fact they're still in demand and broke a lot of things when they were withdrawn. AP are one of the only companies in the world that removes products from sale even when people still want them.
     
    • Like Like x 2
  13. Pookeyhead

    Pookeyhead Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 7, 2018
    Messages:
    4,180
    Likes Received:
    2,607
    I guess he's a perfectionist. I'll be honest, the 47 soundpack was flaky. I often got no external sound when switching between internal and external views, and the sound was very quiet.
     
    • Like Like x 2
  14. USRailFan

    USRailFan Active Member

    Joined:
    Jul 2, 2018
    Messages:
    457
    Likes Received:
    125
    I think he said that those early soundpacks were recorded from stationary locos at museums/preserved lines and then edited to try to get a realistic 'at speed' sound, but now he has the ability to get sounds from properly moving locos those were considered no longer good enough?
     
    • Like Like x 1
  15. Cuddy_Man

    Cuddy_Man Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 16, 2020
    Messages:
    134
    Likes Received:
    253
    I found that track joint sounds in the cab were lost if you went outside and then went back into the cab. Not just the 47 either.
     
  16. bart2day

    bart2day Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 24, 2018
    Messages:
    872
    Likes Received:
    2,538
    You can add the Class 360/444/450 Sound Pack to the list.

    Also, Class 220-222 Sound Pack (Pro) is a MU, not a locomotive.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  17. paulc

    paulc Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 24, 2021
    Messages:
    1,334
    Likes Received:
    2,747
    I'm not happy about missing the 57 sound pack, Thanks to it's withdrawal I'm excluded from Pendolino drags etc as the Vulcan Productions Virgin 57 requires the AP 57 Sound pack pro! Shame as I would have found that a fun task!

    There is some hope as the VP site says this but no breath is being held here!

    "Skins of Armstrong Powerhouse Products may not work due to updates to the product since the reskin was released we are working finding and updating the skins."
     
    • Like Like x 1
  18. Cyclone

    Cyclone Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 29, 2020
    Messages:
    3,160
    Likes Received:
    1,051
    There was a 37/9 sound pack.

    F3355792-8DF1-4848-A6CE-C46348589A78.jpeg
     
    Last edited: Feb 1, 2023
    • Like Like x 1
    • Helpful Helpful x 1
  19. 390001

    390001 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 18, 2018
    Messages:
    1,938
    Likes Received:
    1,259
    Some more to the list

    Class 303 sound pack
    AP Route Stability enhancement pack (got withdrawn when we got 64bit)
     
    • Like Like x 1
  20. Cyclone

    Cyclone Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 29, 2020
    Messages:
    3,160
    Likes Received:
    1,051
    Yes, this angers me as well. Removing something vital for so many reskins without replacing it right away is just a nasty move.
     
    • Like Like x 3
  21. Blazin

    Blazin Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 12, 2022
    Messages:
    1,271
    Likes Received:
    3,282
    As much as I love Armstrong Powerhouse, their habit of removing productions for no good reason (that I am aware of) really upsets me! I would've loved to own the Class 40, and other removed sound packs. Knowing their habits for removing things from the store, when they briefly announced that the Class 142 would be being removed before saying that it will stay, I bought it immediately. And even when there was just rumours about the Class 90 Packs possibly being removed, I bought those as soon as I could too! I suggested this earlier around the time of the Class 142 removal announcement but if Armstrong Powerhouse wants to remove a pack so badly or to replace it with something else because now a DLC might be old, outdated or considered bad nowadays, just lower the price of said DLC so scenario players and creators alike can still use it for scenarios. Especially because it may be requirements for other scenarios! Their must've been an older version of the Mk1 Pack, because it lists as "discontinued" on the Class 52 Sound Pack (Pro) page. Which is a shame because I would like to buy the sound pack and play those scenarios. This leads me onto another complaint is that sometimes scenarios with discontinued products are not updated. Some scenarios use the discontinued Virgin Class 390, old Class 37 and Class 66 are some I've seen. However I can understand why some of these weren't updated because some of those scenarios with the discontinued Class 37 and / or Class 66 is because the pack is usually old now so it isn't probably a priority to update them. (For example, the JHA Wagon Pack scenarios use a discontinued Dovetail Games Class 37 and a Dovetail Games Class 66). It is a shame for me though, as I love having collections of DLC and then completing scenarios from things I buy. It's always fun for me playing something new I just bought. Because of this, it kind of bothers me that I may have a scenario just sitting there, unplayable. But I guess that's more of a personal issue. Sorry if I was too harsh with this as it kind of became a rant of sorts and don't get me wrong, I love Armstrong Powerhouse but this is an issue for me and I wanted to talk about it. My current hope for the Class 52 Sound Pack (Pro) scenarios is that maybe the old Mk1 Coach Pack had a type of Mk1 Coach not included in the current Mk1 Coach Pack which is Vol. 1, so maybe with the eventual release of a Vol. 2 this will be able to replace that discontinued pack.
     
    • Like Like x 2
  22. 390001

    390001 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 18, 2018
    Messages:
    1,938
    Likes Received:
    1,259
    If a scenario requires one of the discountinued packs simply swap the stock out with the newer release

    old 37 sound pack - Swap it for a 37 model we currently have
    MK1 Coaches - swap ut for the new coaches

    TStools and Locoswap are free to use and download and a haven for train sim users and honestly a must have.

    I dont think you need to say sorry for sounding harsh you do make valid points. However having multiple versions of the same content on a website would just become confusing and a headache for AP i imagine.
     
    • Helpful Helpful x 1
  23. 390001

    390001 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 18, 2018
    Messages:
    1,938
    Likes Received:
    1,259
    Another one.

    upload_2023-2-1_3-45-16.png
     
    • Like Like x 1
  24. Blazin

    Blazin Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 12, 2022
    Messages:
    1,271
    Likes Received:
    3,282
    I have TS-Tools but where can I get LocoSwap from? Also I'll probably need to search a tutorial on how to use both. :)
     
    • Like Like x 1
  25. 390001

    390001 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 18, 2018
    Messages:
    1,938
    Likes Received:
    1,259
    Loco swap is Really easy i really like it in actual fact it is the main one i use now it got updated last week and is FANTASTIC!!!

    here is a link to it
    https://forums.dovetailgames.com/threads/locoswap-tool.61882/page-2#post-595195

    the github link is in that post any help feel free to dm and ask or post on here
     
    • Like Like x 2
  26. Cyclone

    Cyclone Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 29, 2020
    Messages:
    3,160
    Likes Received:
    1,051
    I have seen LocoSwap terminate itself on some swap attempts. No word on the newer builds, I was using the last official build. Not sure if it carries over to this one or not. Ts-Tools has its issues, such as not being able to search inside an AP file, but every swap can be done. I use LocoSwap to check legit numbers for trains and cars if the format changes.
     
  27. 390001

    390001 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 18, 2018
    Messages:
    1,938
    Likes Received:
    1,259
    Never had a problem with locoswap i have been using it for months. Swaps easily and you can set up rulesets as well.
     
    • Like Like x 2
  28. inversnecky

    inversnecky Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 26, 2020
    Messages:
    2,252
    Likes Received:
    841
    Thanks all for the new additions, which I have added in.

    Yes, I was sure I read that in one of the manuals, which let to this topic. We can see a Mk1 pack is (still) available, so not sure if that was an error, or there was an old pack.
     
  29. KTL_Rob Powell

    KTL_Rob Powell Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 18, 2018
    Messages:
    216
    Likes Received:
    284
    Probably refers to the old Mk1 coach pack.(the DT one) rather than the current one.

    Old:
    old.png
    New:
    new.png
     
  30. inversnecky

    inversnecky Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 26, 2020
    Messages:
    2,252
    Likes Received:
    841
    Cheers, see the distinction now.
     
  31. Cyclone

    Cyclone Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 29, 2020
    Messages:
    3,160
    Likes Received:
    1,051
    I just want to add to this that "the old Mk1 pack" is now bundled with the Woodhead route. Therefore, they are still available. The AP-exclusive NSE skin is not included.

    Still waiting for a bundle of the old Mk2e pack, which still exists in many older scenarios (and even some newer ones).
     
    • Like Like x 1
    • Helpful Helpful x 1
  32. 749006

    749006 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 10, 2016
    Messages:
    8,420
    Likes Received:
    2,674
    Why do you think the coaches in the Woodhead Blue pack are from DT?
    There are a number of visual differences between the DTG coaches in the pack and the DT versions
    This is a Woodhead BSK
    Screenshot_Woodhead Electric Railway in Blue_53.47425--2.10866_12-00-19.jpg It correctly has two pairs of doors to the parcels area

    This is the DT version
    Screenshot_Woodhead Electric Railway in Blue_53.47423--2.10834_12-00-36.jpg It has only one set of parcel doors

    The end of the DT coach has the expected markings
    Screenshot_Woodhead Electric Railway in Blue_53.47429--2.10876_12-00-53.jpg

    And the end of the DT coach also has train heating cables
    Screenshot_Woodhead Electric Railway in Blue_53.47430--2.10837_12-00-56.jpg

    I tried to compare what is in the Woodhead Blue FK and SK - but DT only made an FO and a TSO

    And in the Woodhead Blue pack there is one livery and the DT pack had at 4, Blue, Chock & Cream,Green and Maroon.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  33. KTL_Rob Powell

    KTL_Rob Powell Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 18, 2018
    Messages:
    216
    Likes Received:
    284
    I'll direct you to this thread in which you posted several years ago that does indeed confirm that the DT coaches minus the AP exclusive NSE variants got bundled with Woodhead BR I believe

    EDIT NOTE - I misread and have been corrected directly below :)

    Railworks Mk1 Coaches | Dovetail Games Forums
     
    Last edited: Feb 2, 2023
  34. USRailFan

    USRailFan Active Member

    Joined:
    Jul 2, 2018
    Messages:
    457
    Likes Received:
    125
    It is bundled with the Class 76/77 loco pack
     
    • Like Like x 3
  35. KTL_Rob Powell

    KTL_Rob Powell Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 18, 2018
    Messages:
    216
    Likes Received:
    284
    Thanks for the correction - appreciated :)
     
  36. Cyclone

    Cyclone Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 29, 2020
    Messages:
    3,160
    Likes Received:
    1,051
    Maybe the best answer is in pictures from SteamDB itself, not in words from me:

    upload_2023-2-2_11-36-21.png

    upload_2023-2-2_11-36-44.png
     
  37. KTL_Rob Powell

    KTL_Rob Powell Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 18, 2018
    Messages:
    216
    Likes Received:
    284
    wow are they really that old, they aren't bad by todays standards for something from that era
     
  38. Cyclone

    Cyclone Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 29, 2020
    Messages:
    3,160
    Likes Received:
    1,051
    Just for clarity, this is also correct. You get this as part of Woodhead. Though the separate DLC itself is not included, which is very strange.

    upload_2023-2-2_11-41-8.png

    EDIT: I have figured out why the 76/77 is not bundled. It's three 77 liveries, one 76 livery (BR Green), and unique scenarios in that pack. The route only contains the original 76. So it can be said, perhaps as USRailFan indicated, that they were pairing it with the 76 and 77, and that means Woodhead got it due to one being included.
     
    Last edited: Feb 2, 2023
  39. 749006

    749006 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 10, 2016
    Messages:
    8,420
    Likes Received:
    2,674
    From what you have posted the coaches come with the Class 76/77 pack
    https://store.steampowered.com/app/65250/Train_Simulator_BR_Class_76__77_Loco_AddOn/
    And not with the Woodhead Route - either of them
     
    • Like Like x 1
  40. Cyclone

    Cyclone Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 29, 2020
    Messages:
    3,160
    Likes Received:
    1,051
  41. 390001

    390001 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 18, 2018
    Messages:
    1,938
    Likes Received:
    1,259
    The full pack of coaches is not included with woodhead though it is only the crimson mk1s
     

    Attached Files:

  42. Cyclone

    Cyclone Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 29, 2020
    Messages:
    3,160
    Likes Received:
    1,051
    For anyone wondering what comes with the package, here is a look at the folder. Each highlighted folder is a livery option. Crests includes the things that are emblazoned on each respective livery, from what I can tell. Passenger models seem to vary by coach, as well. Other files are seemingly common to all consists.

    You can also search the contents at https://steamdb.info/depot/24044/ to see what each folder contains.

    upload_2023-2-2_18-59-48.png

    EDIT: Forgot to check Woodhead itself. There is a Chocolate and Cream in there. So the store page appears to not list it, which is an error.
     
    Last edited: Feb 3, 2023
  43. 390001

    390001 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 18, 2018
    Messages:
    1,938
    Likes Received:
    1,259
    upload_2023-2-3_2-39-19.png

    Back to old packs

    we had a class 153,156,170 sound pack as well

    which got removed. Which is a shame as we have packs for 156 (excellent pack ap sell) and a 170 pack but nothing for the 153 by just trains.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  44. 390001

    390001 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 18, 2018
    Messages:
    1,938
    Likes Received:
    1,259
    Also we used to have previous enhancement packs for the sim "enviroment" as well

    upload_2023-2-3_2-40-37.png Lighting effects Enhancement pack

    And

    upload_2023-2-3_2-41-6.png Station Lighting enhancement pack
     
    • Like Like x 1
  45. Doomotron

    Doomotron Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Oct 24, 2018
    Messages:
    2,820
    Likes Received:
    3,383
    Just to add to the Woodhead/Mark 1 conversation, the DT and original AP Mark 1 and 2E packs are not the same; the AP packs included enhancements and obviously there own sounds, so getting one doesn't mean you have the other.
    I have heard reports that these packs caused problems with modern TS but I haven't tested it myself.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  46. 390001

    390001 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 18, 2018
    Messages:
    1,938
    Likes Received:
    1,259

    Just having a look at this myself Cyclone as i was intrigued. I had a look in the woodhead folder itself and it does not come with all the coaches you mentioned above default.

    These are the MK1 coaches that comes as standard with woodhead.

    Br Chocoloate
    BR Crimson

    upload_2023-2-3_3-45-55.png

    the Digital traction package you mention in #42 is going to have more coach liveries obviously because it is a coach PACK those coaches you highlighted in that post do not come with the woodhead route as standard. That is a DLC standalone.
    upload_2023-2-3_3-47-15.png
     
  47. inversnecky

    inversnecky Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 26, 2020
    Messages:
    2,252
    Likes Received:
    841
    They look intriguing, had never heard of them. I guess the Light Effects one is essentially a signal lights enhancement pack, which we now how from AP, with added functionality.

    What did the station lighting pack do? Looks like diffuse nocturnal lighting?
     
    Last edited: Feb 3, 2023
    • Like Like x 1
  48. eldomtom2

    eldomtom2 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 31, 2022
    Messages:
    1,622
    Likes Received:
    1,828
    No, you are confused. Purchasing the Woodhead route also gives you the DT Mk1 pack for free.
     
  49. KTL_Rob Powell

    KTL_Rob Powell Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 18, 2018
    Messages:
    216
    Likes Received:
    284
    Lets not forget there are TWO Woodhead routes so it is rather easy to get confused. I believe there is Woodhead released in RSC days and under the RSC assets folder (which according to SteamDB DOESN'T come with the DT coaches) and the newer WoodheadBR which was released after the transition to DTG and is thus under the DTG folder (and DOES come with the DT coaches.)

    As to this:

    The stability patch was removed because it essentially became obsolete with 64 bit and I believe the lighting pack got superseded by the sky and weather pack rather than anything breaking.
     
    Last edited: Feb 3, 2023
  50. eldomtom2

    eldomtom2 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 31, 2022
    Messages:
    1,622
    Likes Received:
    1,828
    No, WoodheadBR is Woodhead in Blue. It's unrelated to the original Woodhead.
     

Share This Page