Armstrong Powerhouse Wip Dlc News

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by Blazin, Apr 6, 2022.

  1. 390001

    390001 Member

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    Looks a really nice interior they have done a really nice job. But the seats do look a bit thin but that’s just a minor visual interior detail is superb
     
  2. martschuffing

    martschuffing Well-Known Member

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    I'll wait for the vid. But they do look good so far. Plus you get good sounds.
     
  3. Wivenswold

    Wivenswold Well-Known Member

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    Looking forward to this pack. Does anyone think they should re-engineer their HST Enhancement packs to work with the newer DTG version?
     
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  4. TundraFire

    TundraFire New Member

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    Re-engineer is putting it nicely. It needs an exorcist.
     
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  5. Pookeyhead

    Pookeyhead Well-Known Member

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    The newer DTG version.. I assume you mean the LNER one... is terrible. AP/Waggonz need to build a new one from the ground up.
     
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  6. Doomotron

    Doomotron Well-Known Member

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    In what ways?
     
  7. Pookeyhead

    Pookeyhead Well-Known Member

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    Sound is terrible.
     
  8. Blazin

    Blazin Well-Known Member

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    Armstrong Powerhouse has announced that they will be including brand new variants of the Mk3 coach not previously included in the GEML Class 90 DLC, The variant in these screenshots is the RUB variant.
    8668C30F-5EC7-4ABE-BEEE-35E5C233C796.jpeg
    4937B163-DE12-43D7-AA6D-2BB9B1252D3A.jpeg
     
  9. Pookeyhead

    Pookeyhead Well-Known Member

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    I remember those on the sets that were 87 hauled on the WCML in the early 80s. Now all we need is for Waggonz to hurry up and complete the 87.
     
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  10. USRailFan

    USRailFan Active Member

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    Crossing fingers for a BFO as well...
     
  11. Cyclone

    Cyclone Well-Known Member

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    “We didn’t finish the job before, pay us more to complete it” is how I read a statement like that. To be fair, it would have cost more at the start if it were complete, so eh...
     
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  12. Mack Winston

    Mack Winston Active Member

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    Meh. I'm waiting for a Class 47. The most numerous BR-era mainline diesel. If they can do the same for the 47 as they did with the 37, then they can take my money.
     
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  13. theorganist

    theorganist Well-Known Member

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    Yes I agree, a new class 47 is much needed, also I am still surprised a new class 165/166 hasn't been made. There are several locomotives it would be good to have up to date models of, the class 25, 31, 33 and 45 spring to mind. Plus many first generation DMU's and EMU's have yet to be brought to life.

    However, I will definately be getting these mark 3's as they will be very useful for the WCML routes we have.
     
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  14. Cyclone

    Cyclone Well-Known Member

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    I know I keep calling for a replacement to the IHH 26, but it seems like it won't happen as there may not be enough interest for a 24/25/26/27 pack.

    A 421/423 pack has been expected for some time with the removal of the sound pack. It has never materialized.

    A 166 pack with variants would sell quickly.
     
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  15. 390001

    390001 Member

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    Class 166 pack has been requested for years sadly one has never appeared :(
     
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  16. Cyclone

    Cyclone Well-Known Member

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    I am aware. Just saying it would sell quickly. Think of how many old scenarios would find swaps very quickly.
     
  17. theorganist

    theorganist Well-Known Member

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    I think one of the problems is that some companies like AP only cater for commercial routes and therefore produce stock they can use on those routes and then discount all those who also use freeware routes. Obviously they wouldn't supply scenarios for freeware routes but I imagine many who use freeware routes make their own scenarios.

    A Sulzer type 2 pack would suit a lot of routes, even several payware ones, some with a little imagination due to the period they are set in. Routes like the South Lancashire and Cheshire route would be definately be somewhere you could use a nice up to date class 24 and 25, or at least an enhanced one. And off course there are several Scottish routes where the class 26 and 27 would be very welcome additions.

    I also assumed a class 421/423 pack would be released, otherwise why remove the sound packs. I doubt many would have not purchased his class 411/412 pack because they can get the class 421/423 sound pack if that was the reason. Also why withdraw the class 47 sound pack which is very useful, many freeware add-ons use it which surely might be the reason some would purchase it.

    The class 165/166 baffles me as for many years on this forum and others I have seen it requested, so seems to be a no brainer.

    Caledonia Works make many steam engines for which there is no suitable payware route and obviously sell them so I am sure developers of BR classic and also post privitisation add-ons could do the same.

    The South Lancs/Cheshire route could definately do with a class 104/108/304 if any developers are reading this!
     
  18. TrainsAreBest

    TrainsAreBest Member

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    Why do you assume Caledonia Works sells enough for these to be an example to other developers? I suspect they sell less than you might think and making a profit isn't the most important thing for them.
     
    Last edited: May 11, 2022
  19. theorganist

    theorganist Well-Known Member

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    I never stated that making a profit is the most important thing for them, I never even mentioned profits, it is obvious that he does it as a labour of love, that is obvious from his Facebook page, although I imagine he must at least cover costs. All I stated is that they do sell so it must be worthwhile enough for them to make them, I would imagine if he only sold five or ten of each he wouldn't carry on, but I could be wrong of course. So, for some developers the lack of suitable payware routes isn't necessary a barrier to their choice of project.
     
  20. TrainsAreBest

    TrainsAreBest Member

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    I don't know his sales figures, but even if you sold 500 of a loco that probably wouldn't give you a viable commercial return on the time and costs spent developing it. Most of his catalogue looks very niche to me. I don't think he's running his business to give a good income, it strikes me more as a lifestyle activity.

    AP on the other hand seem to be a commercially astute business who do want to have a decent income. I'm not surprised they stick to mainstream subjects matched to commercial routes. Sorry, but I don't think you're ever going to get a Sulzer Type 2 pack from them.
     
  21. andy.malcolm

    andy.malcolm Active Member

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    AP have talked about viability of certain products on ATS twitch streams, especially about the 166. I don't want to say exactly what as I don't have the quotes to hand so will probably get it wrong, but it's always interesting to hear.
     
  22. Cyclone

    Cyclone Well-Known Member

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    I do not believe it's legal to sell scenarios designed for freeware routes. Example: let's say they did a train that runs on the Crouch Valley, to Southminster, coming off of the GEML. It's a freeware route on UKTrainSim and therefore not possible to use as a route for scenarios sold as part of a loco package, nor could the scenarios be sold, I believe, on their own. However, anyone can make a scenario and post it freely. AP could post free scenarios for the route without charging money for them, but since they want to charge just for planting a few trees (Wherry Lines 2.0 reference, being mostly a scenery upgrade, and let's not fight about semantics because I know it's more than new trees), they won't post free scenarios. It's not in their business interest of making money on everything they produce.
     
    Last edited: May 12, 2022
  23. 390001

    390001 Member

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    You will find it is quite a bit more than "planting a few trees" on the wherry lines route upgrade. It was a really good remake of the route with new assets created and added etc. Here is a full log.


    What has changed in version 2.0?

    [​IMG]New custom scenery assets for Lowestoft station, Lowestoft signal box, Brundall signal box, Brundall Gardens footbridge, Acle waiting room and large roadside Lingwood station sign

    [​IMG]Manual gated level crossings now open and close with sound

    [​IMG]Ballast colour has been changed to match our Track Enhancement Pack and sections of continuously welded rail (CWR) now use the track also found in our Track Enhancement Pack

    [​IMG]Grass has been laid between the ballast shoulder and boundary fence which previously looked a little bare. This helps provide a seamless transition between the track and surrounding environment.

    [​IMG]All overbridge embankments now have grass to improve visuals

    [​IMG]Signals Y55 and Y56 controlling access to Great Yarmouth station now display a yellow aspect when pulled off and not green

    [​IMG]Whether track is jointed or not is now based on the state of the route in 2015 (the rough era of our simulated route), and not 2007 which was previously used

    [​IMG]In reality, a section of track between Buckenham and Brundall (heading towards Norwich) produces the classic 'roaring rails' sound caused by rail corrugation, something not heard too often on today's rail network. This has now been simulated.

    [​IMG]Miniature stop light level crossings with audio added at Bungalow Lane and Girlings Lane, either side of Whitlingham Junction.

    [​IMG]Oulton Broad North level crossing replaced with a higher quality model and prototypical ringing bells when barriers close

    [​IMG]Lowestoft landmark, Ness Point wind turbine, added

    [​IMG]Reedham and Somerleyton swing bridge visuals improved with rust and higher resolution bricks

    [​IMG]Level crossing stop sign, modern speed signs and whistle board visuals improved

    [​IMG]User worked level crossing gate visuals improved. Whether they are the older wooden type or newer metal type is correct as of 2015.

    [​IMG]Post and wire fencing visuals improved with finer rusty wire

    [​IMG]Higher resolution brick overbridge visuals between Reedham and Reedham Swing Bridge

    [​IMG]Numerous minor scenery improvements

    [​IMG]Skies from our Sky & Weather Enhancement Pack now packaged with the route

    [​IMG]Additional ambient audio



    If you dont think £4,99 is worthy of that change then i question how much you would have charged.
     
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  24. Cyclone

    Cyclone Well-Known Member

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    No, I don't. Because it's all scenic elements. But I bought it anyway. Why, you ask? Because I own the Steam version and this is a decent upgrade to that. It adds the five missing scenarios and gives you alternative versions of the other twenty using AP stock. So in the end, it adds up to a nice scenario pack with new graphics throughout the route.

    Like I said, let's not argue about semantics. Anyone who knows me by now knows I look at gameplay more than visual beauty.
     
  25. 390001

    390001 Member

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    No one is arguing was just pointing out It is MORE than just a "few planted trees"
     
  26. Cyclone

    Cyclone Well-Known Member

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    Yup! And I conceded the point earlier when I said let's not argue semantics. ;) It was merely a reference to the intent of the pack being a scenery pack. It's actually got higher value to original Steam buyers, who also may have gotten the route cheaper to start with. The glitch is the extra scenarios (and alternates of the original 20 included) need the enhanced stock, so value will vary for Steam buyers as well.
     
  27. Pookeyhead

    Pookeyhead Well-Known Member

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    So why say that?
     
  28. Blazin

    Blazin Well-Known Member

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    Armstrong Powerhouse revealed that in their upcoming Mk3A-B Enhancement Pack, it will include 20 individually named InterCity coaches. Also teased in this post is that a feature is on display in this screenshot, according to people theorising on the replies to this post, the special feature is that not all the doors are opened, meaning you can possibly open individual doors or open the doors on each coach individually instead of opening every door on the train at passenger stops.
    A8038F6B-05ED-47BD-8595-4A04D95D21FD.jpeg
     
    Last edited: May 12, 2022
  29. andy.malcolm

    andy.malcolm Active Member

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    I think there was some other stock that had doors open and close at a random time interval after you press the button, so it could be that.
     
  30. Cyclone

    Cyclone Well-Known Member

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    I guess sometimes trying to make a reference to something as a scenery pack in a slightly witty way is not allowed. :|
     
  31. Reef

    Reef Well-Known Member

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    It didn't come across as witty, it came across as the standard default Cyclone moaning about paying more than 1 C$ for anything TS related irrelevant of whether that item has taken 200 man hours or months of research and asset (sounds) gathering, the purchase of diagrams and or blueprints.

    But you know the important thing here is not that Cyclone cannot afford to buy these things because he invariably states in every whinge that "not that it matters to me because I've already bought it" it's that he justifies (to himself I assume) spending that money by complaining about the... wait for it... the lack of scenarios.. :|
     
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  32. Pookeyhead

    Pookeyhead Well-Known Member

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    I guess when you have a history of making disparaging comments about anything AP it's pretty easy to assume you were complaining about it. Besides, it would only be witty if there was any truth in it.
     
  33. Cyclone

    Cyclone Well-Known Member

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    Where did you miss my saying I actually bought it?

    Well, it's true that - other than the missing scenarios and alternate versions - it's a scenery update, which is the point I was making; for owners of the route through AP, that's literally all it is. Steam owners find better value, but of course they have to then look for the other stock, so value will vary from user to user. I already own the stock, so it seemed like an easy buy once I realized the missing scenarios get added. I suggested a scenario pack for Steam owners in the past as an upgrade, so this serves that purpose nicely.
     
    Last edited: May 12, 2022
  34. SJA

    SJA Active Member

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    In fairness though, scenery is pretty important. If you want to drive HUD-less or just feel immersed, accuracy of scenery is incredibly important.

    It wasn't a big deal to me personally as I live pretty close to London and the price of that upgrade was a pint of beer or a couple of salmon fillets at prices here. And that copy is mine now, for so long as I shall live. A beer is down the toilet in 45 minutes. Plus the update had some extras.

    Obviously I appreciate different people have different budgets, but when I look at the hours of quality engagement I've had for the prices I've paid for AP stuff, it probably comes in a lot cheaper per hour (for me at least) than the prices people pay to watch high profile plays, pantomimes, football matches at The Emirates Stadium, Gaucho restaurants, or to stay in luxury hotels.

    We all get to define value in our own ways. But there's no way this simulator would have the player base that it does without AP, IMHO. And Richard charges accordingly. I don't think he should charge more, but I don't think he should charge less either.
     
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  35. Pookeyhead

    Pookeyhead Well-Known Member

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    If you completely rebuild every asset in a route from the ground up, you could conceivably call it a "scenery update", sure, but it would be a little misleading, not to mention mean to do so. It also had sound updates and also includes sky from the sky and weather pack even if you do not have that installed. It has signalling updates and track updates. In total there's a massive list of improvements that 390001 listed above. If you already own the old route, even the steam version it represents really good value for money considering the work that went into this "scenery update".
    I'd like to ask a serious question: Seeing as you always say you own these AP products that you routinely lambaste in one way or another... why do you buy them if there's so much to complain about? You say their business model is a rip off.. the products are too expensive.. that they force you to update other stock because they update their scenarios to include their new products, yet despite your constant complaints, you seem to buy them regardless. Why do you do that?
     
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  36. Cyclone

    Cyclone Well-Known Member

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    Sales, my friend. I have no problem getting payware trains from them; they just seem to be very high in price at retail, and I would never buy them at retail. We'll ignore the fact I still haven't touched many of them, particularly since my reinstall, as I've been focusing on other research projects; for instance, I've been trying to figure out all of the problems with Just Trains products in Steam form and how things are broken with certain combinations of DLC installed. Very revealing project. I definitely will get to the AP trains as I do have some scenario video projects planned for certain standalone models, plus I'm recording my ECML (00000003) content in order to upgrade the HST to the AP trio (plus MJW enhancements) for another project I have in mind. Sooner or later, they'll all be running in my library.

    Don't get me wrong, though. I still do not like them constantly changing the scenarios in the installs. I have to go out this weekend and buy an HD enclosure for my old 1 TB drive; if that doesn't do the job, I've lost my installers from mid-2021 and those scenario copies forever unless I can grab those older versions from someone else. So yes, I don't like being told that I must now get the ATS 185, or the new 700, or something else, when it wasn't needed before. I have seen that swapping a train can break things firsthand, so not supporting the older versions really is a bad step by them. Just being honest, not picky.
     
    Last edited: May 12, 2022
  37. Reef

    Reef Well-Known Member

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    I didn't, read my post again, do keep up at the back there.

    Anyway, at this rate we'll have a swift intervention from the DTG staffers (well, in about a week and a half when everyone has moved on, going by normal form) about keeping it friendly and on topic and other such stuff so...

    [addition by Protagonist - you're clearly aware of that your tone is too severe, please try to set the right example]
     
    Last edited by a moderator: May 13, 2022
  38. Cyclone

    Cyclone Well-Known Member

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    Hey, I'm keeping it friendly. :) Haven't yelled at anyone yet, nor do I intend to. :D
     
  39. Blazin

    Blazin Well-Known Member

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    Armstrong Powerhouse has revealed another new coach variant which will be in their upcoming Mk3A-B enhancement pack, this being the BFO variant. Also mentioned is that scenario creators will be able to choose if they want the traditional tail lamp or the integral lights on the coach. However they have also mentioned in this post is that the Mk3A Sleeper and Day coaches used on the Great Western Sleeper will not be featured in this upcoming enhancement pack. They also stated that eventually they would like to make another enhancement pack to include the Sleeper and Day coaches.
    6C036D05-1981-4C40-8A35-425EEA014B2D.jpeg
    C3EB94A7-B585-4CD0-AB73-A3B6489D3172.jpeg
     
    Last edited: May 12, 2022
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  40. IronBladder

    IronBladder Well-Known Member

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    They said the same thing about a second pack for the Mk 1s, but there's been no sign of it since.
     
  41. USRailFan

    USRailFan Active Member

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    OH HELL YES
     
  42. DTG Benjamin

    DTG Benjamin Staff Member

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    We're always watching. Let's keep things kind please.
     
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  43. 390001

    390001 Member

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    seems certain people like to try and push the boundry then TRY and cover up there tactics. Good to see you respond to reports ;)
     
  44. Pookeyhead

    Pookeyhead Well-Known Member

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    So you have nothing but complaints about AP, yet buy AP products, and once you've bought them, you don't even bother using most of them, yet for some reason, value for money seems to be your main concern. Am I the only one scratching his head with confusion?
     
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  45. IronBladder

    IronBladder Well-Known Member

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    Maybe he's a collector, not a player? That's also a legitimate way to enjoy this hobby.
     
  46. Reef

    Reef Well-Known Member

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    And certain people like to stir the pot..

    Exactly my point mate.
     
  47. hayward.john48

    hayward.john48 Well-Known Member

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    All this wind and effort into something already in the game, where is the same push for the missing stuff? There are no class 05, 06, 11, 15, 16, 17, 21, 22, 23, 26, 28 etc. in the game. Then is the time for improvement when all the bases are covered, just as in OO/HO modelling.
     
  48. theorganist

    theorganist Well-Known Member

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    I remember back in the 80's when building a OO gauge model railway you were very restricted to what first generation DMU's were available, unless you could kit build an MTK kit (which I certainly couldn't). In those days your choice of ready to run choice of first generation DMU was the old Triang Met-Camm (modelled on the lightweight 79xxx series so very niche), the Hornby class 110 (very limited in scope of operation) and the Lima class 117 (incorrectly modelled). Now you can get a sizeable amount of the first generation DMU fleet.

    I see the same problem with TS1, DMU's in most areas were as varied as the diesel locomotives and I would argue as important if not more important, they were the backbone of un-electrified lines. It would be lovely to see some of the loco's on your list above released, in fact DTG probably have some of the if they have the old IHH catalogue but they clearly don't plan on releasing any more of his models. However I would say we are far more in need of many of the missing multiple units as there are very many gaps missing. The class 104 and 108 were very numerous and worked in many areas, class 116 similar. Class 304, 308, 310, 312 EMU's have many routes available to them if someone was to release them. I think if IHH were still making TS1 models we would see a lot of these covered. We need a classic diesel enthusiast version of Caledonian Works.
     
  49. hayward.john48

    hayward.john48 Well-Known Member

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    In essence agreed, add the Derby Works 114, very useful on the Netherfield route and the first dmu I ever travelled on (coincidentally) from Netherfield & Colwick
     
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  50. Pookeyhead

    Pookeyhead Well-Known Member

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    I genuinely do not get the lack of 1st gen DMUs in this sim at all. I mean, they were the backbone of the network for the best part of 50 years and there are hardly any. There's the Metro Cammell units, and there's a Derby lightweight, and a Craven, and that's about it I think. Makes no sense. This also applies to the lack of AP's interest in making any. Are they just considered crap by most people? I think they're fun to drive. I mean.. you have gears! What's more fun than that?
     
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