Brighton To London - (lack Of?) Thameslink Services?

Discussion in 'PC Discussion' started by londonmidland, Aug 6, 2021.

  1. Cameron's Gaming

    Cameron's Gaming Well-Known Member

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    I think if they were to do the Oxted Line, then they'd do the bit up to London Bridge since I'm pretty sure all the Uckfield trains go there (with the East Grinstead trains to Victoria), if they do take that to London (East Croydon - Uckfield is 35 miles and the Grinstead branch is another 10, East Croydon - either London terminal is about 10 miles again, so perhaps would be really pushing it), or if they were to do the East London/South London Lines for the London Overground - though LO doesn't go to London Bridge, it'd make sense to round off the Southern Metro services so you're not giving them up one stop short at New Cross Gate.
     
    Last edited: Aug 9, 2021
  2. Tom Fresco

    Tom Fresco Well-Known Member

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    Just like noone was annoyed by the at first missing Thameslink Services on SEHS from gravesend to Rainham? Oh there were a lot of complaining posts and threads......
    The comparison with the HRR 101 services is a bit strange, given that they are ICs and could not be simulated due to the completey missing DB Fernverkehr rolling stock in the game by that time. That would be like letting a 166 do the HST services on GWE. But all that is a bit OT.

    We dont know how busy the Timetable will be, my guess is around 600-700 services (some not player driveable), according to the Screenshots in one article, where the Simulation of 650ish services was successful completed.
    Seems like a busy route to me......

    But for the truth we have to wait until the Preview Stream before claiming how busy or dead the route will be.
     
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  3. driverwoods#1787

    driverwoods#1787 Well-Known Member

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    Interesting and for Thameslink DTG got that from Govia the owners of thameslink Gatwick Express Southern and Southeastern.
     
  4. dhekelian

    dhekelian Well-Known Member

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    I don't know how much DTG plan for in future DLC but a TL link with the right trains would certainly go down well, mind you I think the 313 would go down well as well.
     
  5. TrainSim-Matt

    TrainSim-Matt Executive Producer Staff Member

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    There are no plans to add London Bridge (that's a huge project).

    If a Thameslink DLC becomes available at some point (there are no plans, but we have at least thought about it), it would be Brighton to East Croydon (if memory serves me correctly) with the train then going off as AI out to a portal bound for London Bridge.
     
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  6. Tay95

    Tay95 Well-Known Member

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    I for one, would buy that DLC even before it comes out if that was possible. It's good to see you have thought about it Matt, would fully make the route 100%
     
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  7. trainsimplayer

    trainsimplayer Well-Known Member

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    I knew that and didn't need telling that but thanks... I guess?
     
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  8. Mat_Jam_Ca

    Mat_Jam_Ca Well-Known Member

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    Just noting my interest (just in case you need to gauge demand). I’d definitely like the Class 700 in the game.
     
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  9. londonmidland

    londonmidland Well-Known Member

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    Yes, that’s right. East Croydon is where the London Bridge and London Victoria services diverge.

    Purely speculative at this moment but a Thameslink 387 wouldn’t be out of place, if the 700 isn’t viable.

    The model would already exist and I believe interior changes are minimal from the GX 387.
     
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  10. Haverknol

    Haverknol Member

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    To be honest, I wouldn't even care that London Bridge will never be included. A 700 would make the traffic on the (soon) existing part of the route so much more realistic and interesting. Same reason why I am really hoping for Southeastern AI services running out of London Victoria (I don't even own SEHS yet, but I'm probably getting it on the next sale).
     
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  11. First capital connect

    First capital connect Well-Known Member

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    I wouldn't mind if they brought in the thameslink 387s or even a 319
     
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  12. londonmidland

    londonmidland Well-Known Member

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    A 319 would be out of place during the era the route is set in, as they were no longer in service with Thameslink.
     
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  13. RobSkip

    RobSkip Well-Known Member

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    319s were in service later than 387s with TL.
     
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  14. bart2day

    bart2day Well-Known Member

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    Thameslink 319's and 377's ran on the route until September 2017 when they were fully cascaded by 700s. Thameslink 387's ran on it until February 2017.

    It all depends on what exact year the route is set, pre-2017 or post-2017.
     
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  15. DB628

    DB628 Well-Known Member

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    What make London Bridge so huge to build?
     
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  16. trainsimplayer

    trainsimplayer Well-Known Member

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    I'll let you guess. london-bridge-station-grimshaw-refurbishment-architecture-_dezeen_2364_sq_a.jpg
     
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  17. Cameron's Gaming

    Cameron's Gaming Well-Known Member

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    Also it's 10 miles away from East Croydon for, ultimately, little to no benefit.
     
  18. DB628

    DB628 Well-Known Member

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    Or to sell it with the Class 700 for 30€ as Expansion, so dtg worth the work for the London Bridge
     
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  19. Alex_m30x#7297

    Alex_m30x#7297 Well-Known Member

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    *POSSIBLY unpopular opinion*
    I would love the 700, but if we get it, that almost certainly screws any potential Thameslink modern day routes, as they wouldn't be able to use it at the flagship, new train.
    And possibly Thameslink might want a route with the flagship train, not the old 'hold over' trains
     
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  20. I must disagree on this one.

    While the sight of a TL Class 387 isn't necessarily immersion breaking, I think that the mainline looks slightly incomplete without any Class 700s, and I don't want to encourage DTG to go for the lazy repaint option again.

    The Class 700s could be added as AI to both BML and SEHS, and could be very useful for any routes out of London in the future, such as London - Bedford and London - Peterborough.

    I would hate to have my immersion broken by having to play pretend every time I see a TL Class 387 in the game, knowing full well that these no longer operate IRL, and that they were a rare sight even when they did.
     
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  21. Well, seeing that the Riesa - Dresden route in the game only uses recycled trains, I don't think it's completely out of the question to release the Class 700 before 2022 and then use it as a new route's flagship train.

    In this scenario, the London - Bedford route could come with say a class 700 and a class 222, which is what exists currently IRL.

    Saying that, I also wouldn't mind waiting for the Class 700 if it comes with a new route, just as long as I get to drive it in my lifetime.
     
  22. Oh yeah , that lamp on platform 5 does look quite complex :D
     
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  23. bart2day

    bart2day Well-Known Member

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    While true that they no longer operate in real life, they were by far a rare sight when they were in service between late 2014 and early 2017. Almost every Bedford-Brighton and Bedford-Three Bridges service was either a 377 or a 387 between those years. I used to travel on them to university.
     
  24. ARuscoe

    ARuscoe Well-Known Member

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    Between London Bridge and East Croydon you get 9 stations, 10¼ miles of track and a heck of a lot of services, but on top of that you also have to consider the surroundings, with London Bridge serving about 8 principal lines and serving 1500 movements today (data from RTT) from SouthEastern, Southern and Thameslink
    The lines coming into London Bridge from the East are 10 lines or more wide, with several being reversible. The station itself is divided into two, with the SE and TL services being from platforms 1 - 9 (1,2,3 being almost exclusively to and from Cannon Street; 4 & 5 being the Thameslink platforms and 6-9 to and from Charing Cross)
    Platforms 11 and higher are all terminating platforms used by Southern Services

    Immediately to the west of LBG the lines to Cannon Street bear North, and about half a mile further on the Blackfriars lines also bear north.

    So with LBG itself being almost as complex as Victoria, but the inbound and onward lines being MORE complex than VIC (Victoria has no through platforms and serves 5 lines to Kent and Sussex with 1291 movements a day) it would be a BIG project to take on.
     
  25. First capital connect

    First capital connect Well-Known Member

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    If the route was set around 2017
    A 319 wouldn't be bad would it? I wouldnt mind having a 319 just to make the route not just electrostars Or do we just want a cl 700
     
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  26. Haverknol

    Haverknol Member

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    I really would like a Class 700, yes :)
     
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  27. DB628

    DB628 Well-Known Member

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    Class 700 is sexy :love:
    upload_2021-8-11_21-43-13.jpeg
     
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  28. First capital connect

    First capital connect Well-Known Member

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    upload_2021-8-11_21-29-42.png
    But I mean like you really wouldn't want this absolute beauty
     
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  29. Tay95

    Tay95 Well-Known Member

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    700 over that anyday
     
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  30. trainsimplayer

    trainsimplayer Well-Known Member

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    I don't know what's more conserning here, calling a train "sexy" or calling a 700 "sexy".
    It's an "Aye!" from me. A 700 is also nice but I liked the 319 on TS, so I'll take that one.
     
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  31. chieflongshin

    chieflongshin Well-Known Member

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    I would love to see a class 700, I would sell my mum for it
     
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  32. First capital connect

    First capital connect Well-Known Member

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    I am extremely worried
     
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  33. ARuscoe

    ARuscoe Well-Known Member

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    I hate the 700s, but then 319s were always cattle class on thameslink (and never ran out into the North Kent region)
    Either way, anything differentiating thameslink from Southern would be good
     
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  34. Fair enough, I suppose they kept the good trains for you guys, because all the 319s that TL removed from the mainline at the time were then used here on the Sutton line, so we never got the Class 387s at all, only class 700s towards the end of the replacement period.
     
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  35. Tank621

    Tank621 Well-Known Member

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    I'd love a 319, though of personal preference I'd choose to have one in the North over the Thameslink variant. Then again, the more the merrier!
     
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  36. I understand that many (older) people here don't like the Class 700 and would prefer to see the 319 in the game, but you at least have to admit that the class 700 is far more fitting to this route and time period than the aging 319s, which almost never ran at the same time as the Gatwick express class 387s.

    To the fans of the 319, I propose a Brighton Mainline retro pack. It could include the Gatwick Express Class 442 and Thameslink/FCC Class 319. I am not saying that DTG is going to do this or anything of that sort, I'm just saying that it is the only way to get Class 319s on London - Brighton in a realistic way.
     
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  37. ARuscoe

    ARuscoe Well-Known Member

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    Oh, I'm not saying I would prefer the 319s (maybe as part of a Northern pack) but the 700s are plasticky, boxy, awful things with whiny motors and the light on top that doesn't turn off... I know it's for catenary monitoring but there's no catenary in Kent, if the panto is down, turn the damn light off!
    (yes, it's the little things, first world problems et al)
     
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  38. First capital connect

    First capital connect Well-Known Member

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    I definitely would want a class 700
    But I don't see DTG releasing one any time soon
    And can't a 3rd party make class 700s as an add on
     
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  39. james64

    james64 Well-Known Member

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    I think the 700s are brilliant! They're quick, reliable, and very spacious and airy. The 319s were always stuffy and sluggish (compared to a 700 anyway), and always felt somewhat dirty. Why are you getting hung up over the light? It's on the roof and you can barely see it most of the time. And how can you not love those UFO sounds when under third rail power??
     
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  40. trainsimplayer

    trainsimplayer Well-Known Member

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    Regardless of who makes it they need a license.

    The 700 itself has to be licensed - similar to the ICE - and clearly they haven't got that. (They do seem to have Thameslink, judging by it being in the game files)
     
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  41. dhekelian

    dhekelian Well-Known Member

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    Never been on a 700 class so have no idea how it sounds but if it has sounds that set it apart then I'd love to see it in game. I'll admit I'm more of a fan of the Diesels but love sound on trains that are different or stand out on UK routes especially.
     
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  42. Tank621

    Tank621 Well-Known Member

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    Part of my desire for a 319 is entirely motivated by a want for more overhead electrics. Either way, I'm a big fan of Mark 3 based units, having grown up on the GEML and gone to Uni in Manchester, the likes of 321s, 319s and 150s are very familiar to me and I have an attachment to them.
     
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  43. Tay95

    Tay95 Well-Known Member

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    The sounds are quiet unique, the motors sound like an alarm when it starts to accelerate (best description I can give).
     
    Last edited: Aug 12, 2021
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  44. ARuscoe

    ARuscoe Well-Known Member

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    Oh they're all that, but the front looks like it's been hit repeatedly with a shovel...
    The motor sounds are definitely unique... next time I'm in video mood I'll go get some sounds and post it
     
  45. james64

    james64 Well-Known Member

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    I actually think the front of them adds character. I showed a photo of them to my best friend (who knows nothing about trains) and he's affectionately referred to them as "claw trains" ever since!
     
  46. ARuscoe

    ARuscoe Well-Known Member

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    Certainly stops anyone having a thought of climbing on the front (like the 465/466s)
     
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  47. Similarly to the DB BR 442, the front shape of the train is designed to minimize damage to the train in case of a collision. Not sure how it does it, but I'm pretty sure this is the case.
     
  48. Alex_m30x#7297

    Alex_m30x#7297 Well-Known Member

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    For those who don't know what they sound like, here is a video of the trains leaving and departing with tones!
     
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  49. 4-COR

    4-COR Well-Known Member

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    I wouldn’t really say that sound is unique as it’s heard on probably at least 200 other units in the uk
     
  50. ARuscoe

    ARuscoe Well-Known Member

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    Didn't think the UK had 200 different types of units...
    Certainly I've heard a lot of EMUs and DMUs and the 700s are particularly whiney
     
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