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Building Lgv Méditerranée

Discussion in 'Dovetail Live Article Discussion' started by DTG Natster, Nov 11, 2020.

  1. GothicMatt

    GothicMatt Active Member

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    Do you ever quit complaining? or you ever happy?
     
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  2. GothicMatt

    GothicMatt Active Member

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    Excuse me but Alan Thompson isnt a grumpy gentleman, he happens to be quite a nice person who tells it how it is
     
  3. stujoy

    stujoy Well-Known Member

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    Oh, I’m certain he is a nice person and I like him and his videos but I would happily let him join my club of grumpy old men, not that he’s particularly old either. Telling it like it is is one of the things we love to do.
     
  4. SHINO BAZ

    SHINO BAZ Well-Known Member

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    There seems to be no shortage of complaints found here,don't act like you have never complained about anything in your life,so don't judges others for doing it to.
     
  5. taybarker20

    taybarker20 Active Member

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    Is there a depot on this line we can use
     
  6. Sharpe Serana

    Sharpe Serana New Member

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    Same bad catenary as the one in Train Simulator... that doesn't bode well.
    Come on DTG ! Try to really improve the line !

    As I said previously on Steam, if you need information, you can rely on the French community which I am part of. We can give you (official) information about the railway systems used in France, how it is supposed to work. We can give you feedback if you need it. If you do things alone, you will most probably release a product with a lot of bad reviews from the French community.
     
    Last edited: Nov 14, 2020
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  7. MYG92

    MYG92 Well-Known Member

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    If they reused the same catenary I’m scared about the 1.5KV DC catenary which was awful
     
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  8. masse2

    masse2 New Member

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    Hello I think I will give my opinion that when I have driven on the line but bravo DTG for your achievements I found the pleasure of driving and if the LGV Med is up to the German line I will be satisfied and see the total overhaul TGV I have no doubt about the quality of the LGV Med. Bravo again
    Jean Pierre
     
  9. SHINO BAZ

    SHINO BAZ Well-Known Member

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    Well the one up side for this route is it will make the ultimate high speed rack track,(Assuming there are not any really sharpe curves to derail you.
     
  10. masse2

    masse2 New Member

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    The line was very well done on TS . A simple superposition of Google map you will have allowed to see the reality of the route

    Jean Pierre
     
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  11. londonmidland

    londonmidland Well-Known Member

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    Not only have DTG used the wrong type of catenary but they’ve also used the reduced clearance variant i.e when approaching bridges with limited clearance for the entire route.

    This just shows how much research DTG actually does on the catenary and how little they care about it.

    The two comparisons below show the difference between the two:

    F0B17F07-6B8C-4E4E-ADDF-C0511DD1D3AD.jpeg
    upload_2020-11-14_20-16-32.jpeg
     
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  12. SHINO BAZ

    SHINO BAZ Well-Known Member

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    How will the lgv train lenght compare to the ice3 or the hst?
     
  13. Monder

    Monder Well-Known Member

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    Train length is either 1 or 2 units which consist of two engines and 8 shared-bogey cars between them (so train length similar to both ICE3 and HST). Line length is supposed to be 105 km, which would make it the longest TSW route... but with speeds up to 320 kph a pretty fast trip.
     
  14. 7orenz

    7orenz Well-Known Member

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    All the francaise trains has and operate with the same gauge (high speed and traditional). So I suppose for techical reasons (air flux when 2 tgv crosses "itself" at 300+km/h) also the car width is approximatively the same.
     
  15. Anthony Pecoraro

    Anthony Pecoraro Well-Known Member

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    Huh?
     
  16. vogelm10

    vogelm10 Well-Known Member

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    Is it only the dedicated lgv or will there be options to run on a standard line with actual wayside signals?
     
  17. byeo

    byeo Well-Known Member

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    It's self explanatory if you read what he said.
     
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  18. fabdiva

    fabdiva Well-Known Member

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    The final few km into to Marsellie is on conventional lines with signalling.
     
  19. MYG92

    MYG92 Well-Known Member

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    The coaches are less longer than the one from the BR406 as it’s on Jacob bogies + double decker
     
  20. Anthony Pecoraro

    Anthony Pecoraro Well-Known Member

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    I don't see a difference in the pictures.
     
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  21. byeo

    byeo Well-Known Member

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    The catenary poles are different. Not hard to see really.
     
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  22. BR125

    BR125 Well-Known Member

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    You must be pretty bad at spot the difference.

    the size of the arm, the angle of the arms, the cable structure to name 3 things wrong/different
     
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  23. vogelm10

    vogelm10 Well-Known Member

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    Honestly as thrilled as I initially was with finally getting some SNCF lines, this to me seems like it will be a remarkably boring experience. If it's just go fast and in a straight line with 3 stations and one train I can't imagine it won't get old after the first round trip.

    It'd been nicer to me personally if they chose a route where they had the standard line and an lgv both going to the same city, then you could do conventional trains on the one route or tgv for the high speed one.

    I just can't get myself worked up to pay ($30 if going by normal charges for other dlc) for a line with such little diversity.

    If you want to know why I think it will be boring youtube has some cab view videos of this line and once you get out of the interlocking for St Charles and onto the lgv it's just tunnels and straight lines. Yes it's fast which is sort of fun, but the ICE and GWE trains are fast too, and they get boring after a few minutes sitting at top speed going in a line. Sorry for being a downer but DTG doesn't fill me with confidence that A) the line won't be buggy, and B) that it will be priced fairly.
     
    Last edited: Nov 15, 2020
  24. byeo

    byeo Well-Known Member

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    I see this route as a learning exercise for DTG in how to make longer routes more efficiently.
     
  25. vogelm10

    vogelm10 Well-Known Member

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    If that's the case keep it an internal test and then if it works give us a more complete project. I feel like everything they do is a test with how buggy and incomplete things are once released.
     
  26. stujoy

    stujoy Well-Known Member

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    There is a difference. It’s a small difference. The angle of the top beam is greater in the screenshot of the game. That’s the only major difference. The other differences are negligible - In the two pictures in post 111 the post on the left has the same suspension system as the one on the right in the opposite picture and vice versa (they would be the same if one of the pictures had been taken from the opposite side).

    What the people who are complaining want is the exact catenary for every part of the route. What DTG have done is use the best variant they have to cover the route efficiently (a couple of variants instead of 20) and they will be largely automatically placed. Not good enough for those with their protractors out, comparing one screenshot with one of the four pictures available via a quick Google search but completely unnoticeable to 99.5% of players when they are driving the route. I’ve had my protractor out comparing the pictures and I fail to see why people are so wound up over such minor differences. It’s very close to the real ones, just set up slightly differently. Maybe worth mentioning in passing but not slagging off DTG for.
     
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  27. 749006

    749006 Well-Known Member

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    I wonder if this version for TSW2 will have the same faults and lack of function as the Train Simulator 20xx version?
     
  28. MYG92

    MYG92 Well-Known Member

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    Haha like the pantograph way to up the catenary or the wrong enginesound ? They put the enginesound of the Dasye Duplex on the Duplex 200 series
     
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  29. 749006

    749006 Well-Known Member

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    Screenshot_1 - Test TraK_51.11672-6.22406_12-08-01.jpg

    Yes
     
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  30. londonmidland

    londonmidland Well-Known Member

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    That’s a very wild and dubious claim. Just because YOU might not be interested or bothered about it doesn’t mean others aren’t.

    If it was such a minuscule amount of users that are bothered about it, then there wouldn’t have been as much discussion amongst the community when the screenshots of the Bakerloo Line came out. Which clearly showed the wrong type of OHLE.

    Also, products like this wouldn’t exist if there was little interest in it.
    86EF0CD8-E6E4-4875-9677-5AAB24133EF0.jpeg
     
  31. SHINO BAZ

    SHINO BAZ Well-Known Member

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    Well finding collectables placing signs,trash cans or vending machines and putting up painting(this is france)shouldn't be to much of a chore with only 3 stations to explore.Yea?...
     
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  32. docsnyder1911

    docsnyder1911 Well-Known Member

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    Very nice to see the arrival of the iconic TGV at TSW2. And with the later arrival of the Javelin in South Eastern Highspeed we will have 5 high speed trains in TSW2. The new technology for partially automated routebuilding sounds promising for longer routes at TSW2 too. And perhaps we will see people outside of the stations like in main article picture.
     
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  33. mclitke

    mclitke Well-Known Member

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    I see it similarly, I am excited for french content overall but if this route comes with standard DLC price I might want to wait for at least the first sale. The route being an experiment for their new route building technology does not justify it being rather bland gameplay wise.
    The ICE routes have at least one other train to have a somewhat different driving experience and thus I think it is okay if you want to be 30 min in an ICE sometimes, or see the route with other eyes with the more stop lines.

    I guess we will see closer to release if DTG found a way to make the experience more diverse.
     
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  34. SHINO BAZ

    SHINO BAZ Well-Known Member

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    Dtg wanting to test new tech,programs and systems to make a new rail line is fine,charging players 30.00 for there test project results isn't.
     
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  35. breblimator

    breblimator Well-Known Member

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    Again, discussions before the premiere, how much are not yet existing products worth ... gg
     
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  36. SHINO BAZ

    SHINO BAZ Well-Known Member

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    Nearly every route goes through this before and after release,and it's potential value is up to the each person who might buy it,so for some 30.00 might fine for others it might be not worth it,is sad that those who aren't bothered in the slightest paying full price have to give those who don't feel it's a good deal at full price a hard time.
     
  37. krustynuggets

    krustynuggets Well-Known Member

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    Reading this thread is like watching people sharpening their pitchforks and shiv's just waiting for stabbing time.......
     
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  38. MYG92

    MYG92 Well-Known Member

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    Nobody force you to buy the route mate
     
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  39. vogelm10

    vogelm10 Well-Known Member

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    If they said pay $60 for a season pass to get all dlc that would be great. But when each dlc costs as much as the base game and you don't really get any vast changes in the overall game play experience it sort of makes you a bitter person when they try and hype a new dlc. Like when I play this game I want to be making trains in yards, navigating complex interlockings, having to be put into sidings to wait for other trains to pass etc. Straight line with all clear signals from A to B is just boring.

    Hopefully now that they have the rights for SNCF they could build some more traditional lines which allow a more immersed game play. It's too bad I was really looking forward to this too, but seems like it all is recycled from earlier games and isn't truly new.
     
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  40. SHINO BAZ

    SHINO BAZ Well-Known Member

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    To quote a youtuber who reviews trains "it's value for money" make a dlc route or locomotive worth it and you'll be raking in 20.00/30.00 everytime plus test the route or locomotive fully,because to many flaws will kill sales potential.fixing it later is not always a great business strategy.
     
  41. FD1003

    FD1003 Well-Known Member

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    30€ is not that bad in the grand scheme of things, it's pretty clear you guys never tried to get into serious flight simming ;)

    Jokes apart, for the price DTG's add-ons are good enough to justify the purchase in my opinion, while I agree this and IoW for example have less value for money than MSB, it doesn't mean it's completely awful.

    You still get 100km of decently detailed and true to real life representation of a high speed line and a very accurate and well made representation of a high speed train (if everything goes well).

    I've played the TS2021 version and I think this will absolutely smash that (not like that's setting the bar really high considering that in the TS2021 version the track work is so bad you wished to be in TSW's RRO).

    Also this is more of a personal problem, I don't really enjoy yard work and shunting for example and a route full of yards and such would be less attractive to me, I'm more of a commuter/medium speed person but I enjoy some high speed from time to time so, although I am eagerly waiting for some french traditional rail I think I'll pick this one up.

    It's obvious the amount of content in this route, compared to ECW, SKA, HMA (with all layers) is abysmal but the one thing it does (high speed) it does it REALLY well.

    If you are looking for poor value for money than look no further, the Br204 and 363 have less than 20 timetable scenarios combined... they do one thing (shunting) and they don't do enough of it.
     
    Last edited: Nov 16, 2020
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  42. stujoy

    stujoy Well-Known Member

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    I don’t think the route is a test for their new route building tools it’s just the route, or one of the routes, they are using those tools on first. They try new methods out on nearly every route because the engineering team are always working on something or other. They built the same route in TS so it’s a legitimate product, even if it’s not going to be everyone’s idea of a great route. I just hope they sort the core of the game out so these fast routes (and the others) can run properly.
     
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  43. SHINO BAZ

    SHINO BAZ Well-Known Member

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    If this is based on a TS version,which is fine,does the ts version have anything the tsw2 version won't?
     
  44. Luke8899

    Luke8899 Well-Known Member

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    I am feeling progressively more excited about this route. The gradients and speed changes look to be very interesting, the train itself not as easy to handle as it might seem, and there is an alright stretch of conventional French railway at the Marseille end that will be a nice introduction to conventional French signalling, as well as the changeover between 25v and 1,5v.

    I'll obviously wait for streams and a few user reviews first, to see what the lay of the land is regarding the quality of the route and how well it works on console, but having now seen videos of the TS version and the real life line, it doesn't quite fit the profile of a boring A-B route for me, it looks like a challenge, new signalling systems, new train dynamics, new high speeds, new type of line, but without being too much effort to learn.

    When DTG say a lot of their customers have an average play session of around 30-60 mins, that rings true to me, and why I understand lines get capped where they do, and it makes sense they see demand for high speed rail and conclude the TGV is something people would want. I don't know the LGV system particularly well but this seems like a decent stretch to have picked. The downside I see mostly will be the lack of AI services in Marseille other than other TGV services, which means probably look and feel quite dead.
     
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  45. 4-COR

    4-COR Well-Known Member

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    with the scenario planner being so limited on some routes I'm not sure if it's even worth that
     
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  46. Monder

    Monder Well-Known Member

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    Especially here, where the probable starting point is one platform in Avignon, one in Aux-de-Provence and maybe a couple more in Marseille. There probably can't be any starting points in the middle of nowhere, so you're limited to there spots meaning if you create a scenario, you will probably be able to only meet 2 trains in the opposite direction.
     
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  47. ronaldix

    ronaldix Active Member

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    That's where you're wrong, 95% of the catenary on LGVs is like in the picture, the others types are only on bridges, neutral sections and stations so thats about 5% of the catenary in total.
    And DTG has made the right models in TS only the feeder is different because it's the model for the Avignon TGV station, but they could easily change the 3D model, an experienced 3D modeler could do it in 15 minutes I reckon.
    upload_2020-11-16_14-51-52.png
     
  48. deki32

    deki32 Well-Known Member

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    This has been an issue here since the beginning( Certain users were just ungodly obnoxius). Some people just seem to think that the general community gives a duck about their purchasing habits or opinions. No matter how many times we tell them that we don’t care, we are still here listening to such stuff. It got a bit better with DTG staff being more active, and you also have a wonderful option called “Ignore”. It works wonders, used it a couple of times. Never had issues ever since. Cheers
     
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  49. vogelm10

    vogelm10 Well-Known Member

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    Hey when they are notorious for dropping subpar products and the answer is to shut up and deal with it I think I won't be quiet about it.

    Know the solution to this whole problem of buggy incomplete messes of a game being released into the world? Label this game as Beta (because it is) and then when things are broken I'll think to myself "oh hey beta game so still a work in progress." instead of thinking "damn just spent $60 for two lines I can't even run a train on without it crashing in 10 minutes."

    Enough said. So either give us complete products or label the game beta.
     
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  50. speedjones1

    speedjones1 New Member

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    Hello,
    What Generation of the TGV Duplex will be developed?
     

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