One never talked about on these forums is the C2C network, at around 70 miles we could have a full network, very busy at that too and with a good freight working with London Gateway and Tilbury docks on the route. The only issue is the London Underground district line, I think it would be unreasonable to expect DTG to make the full C2C network and include a fully working district line with S7 stock. What are everyone’s thoughts?
Would be pointless having the S7 as it only runs up a small section of the LTS. I'd be quite happy with the same arrangement that the remastered GWR had where the Class 484 was reskined and reused... Always thought the LTS would be a lovely and complete route for TSW. The 357, with the whole route out to Shoeburyness. Would be amazing.
Indeed, one that's been suggested many times before. I've been cheerleading this for some time. None of the options in this poll include the Class 720, which for me is a mistake. If this route ever comes out, my ideal would be the whole route with both the 357s and 720s, with S7 Stock layering in if anyone ever develops a Tube line with S7 (District, Circle, Hammersmith & City) or S8 (Metropolitan).
A potential candidate when their contract expires next year though, seems that the DfT aren't opposed to licensing at least with LNER and Southeastern.
If you want to get traction for your suggestion you may want to refer to where the route is rather than assume everyone knows where the train operating company C2C operates.
We just don’t get 2 trains though and last time we did with MML it was a disaster at release and so much so skyhook haven’t released a route again so I think we have to understand that for a standard price it’s a route and 1 train hence why I didn’t list the 720
C2C is a Train Operating Company in the UK operating out of London Fenchurch Street out east to Tibury, Southend, and Shoeburyness. Map: They operate Electrostars... And Aventras None of these images are mine.
To be fair, there has been an increase in demand for South England content & I think DTG are likely to bend to it, whilst I’d rather see another region expanded more, or something NSE if we just go back that end, I think a C2C route would be my choice, since their electrostars have some peripheral vision going on for Drivers.
Except that we have a similar train in game already, the 710. Yes it's a different carriage length and the interior would need to be remodelled, but there's a base to work from.
They used the c2c house colours in the signs at Barking on the Goblin route. Not that if that falls within a licence issue as it doesn’t say c2c anywhere. Long championed this route. Would love to see it at the time when the 357s were introduced but 312s were still running up and down. Modern would give a lot of additional freight potential though.
I do think the freight potential with full on intermodal depot work is massively underrated so I think you’re spot on with that point
Got to be modern really, as it would layer with the Suffragette line - set it any earlier and that wouldn't work, and would need remodelling. Ditto with SEHS if you set it earlier than that route.
LTS rail wasn't a good era, the 357s always had problems back then and the slam door 312s were horrible
Getting the 484 Underground and a debranded c2c 387 would be something I'd like to add to Goblin some time in the future once GWE is out
Anachronistic though, since neither D78 Stock nor 387s were running through Barking by the time Barking Riverside opened. But better than nothing, until hopefully one day we get 357s, 720s and S7 Stock.
Anachronistic for sure. I wouldn't have considered it before but now we have layer control in timetables I'm more open to 'era bending' and giving the players the choice of a busy timetable vs fully accurate one. If we ever did get the right stock then it would be minimal work to switch out the stock on the layers to the correct type.
Sounds good to be able to layer the route to have different services. I hope DTG one day surprise us with the LTS. I think it will be very well received.
Well the parent company isTrentitalia, who are involved with the WCML, so it's a possibility as they've done the Avanti license.
I disagree. The section of District Line that runs beside the LTS (sorry, I'm old fashioned) is just over 13 miles and has more stations than the GOBLIN, Glossop and IOW lines. I don't thing it would be pointless at all. The alternative is 13 miles of no London Underground trains which will be worse than the limited AI alongside the surface sections of the Bakerloo Line. I also disagree with others who say this should be in the Suggestions section. It should be a DLC already because it's an ideal network and is one of the most requested routes. We've had the lines on the Kent side of the Thames in so many iterations in TSC and TSW, that it's bonkers they've only ever created 1 DLC in their neighbouring county.
Network South East era it is then. Perfect. Class 312 and 317 and a remade proper D stock from Rivet. Edit. Both the 312* and 317s worked on the WCML so they, the 313s, the silver TS72s and the class 87 could make a great backdated 1986/87 version. *I think there were only 4 x 312s on WCML and made infrequent journeys to London amongst the very similar-looking 310s.
They're not the majority shareholder in Avanti though, First Group are. I imagine that's why we got it.
And your point being? They still have to agree to the licence, and c2c is a sole Trentitalia owned franchise, so going by the laws of probability, they'd go for it. Unless of course you work within the licensing team at DTG or Trentitalia.....
That because First are the majority shareholder in Avanti, the whole idea of granting a license would've likeky come from them and they'd have convinced Trenitalia of its potential benefits to the Avanti brand.
I wondered if c2c might be more interested given it’s likely the last year of the brand before more formal nationalisation next year. They have sponsored Southend United this year and must of supported on the work for Barking station in the Goblin DLC. Likewise I am old fashioned and hope to see the LTS name come back next year as a bit of nod to heritage like with LNER. also love the Network SouthEast idea. Oh for a class 312 to take me back to school days.
While they didn't quite have the pure comfort, refinement or 100mph top speed of a Class 309 the 312 were lovely trains. Loads of seats, decent luggage racks, excellent heating in the winter loads of fresh air ventilation in the summer. And those compressors made a wonderful sound. So sad that a full unit wasn't saved for railtours but preservation of electric traction is somewhat onerous and expensive.
i mean its not a bad idea as we could get the 312s even though they were terrible, with that famous noise that was distressing I think we can live with that again, and would have the 357s in the blue and might be easier to get the licensing
Dreadful sounds on a 312? I assume you're talking about the LTS ones. The Great Eastern ones got a full refurbishment in 1997/98 and were still in good condition when they were withdrawn.GE sent the LTS their oldest units and kept the newer ones for themselves. LTS then appear to have just run theirs into the ground so maybe they were making some odd noises by the end. I mean, just look how bad the 302s looked by 1998. I left the LTS in 1996, standards slipped after that.
312’s were essentially the evolution of the earlier Class 310 (AM10) EMU’s,, with higher top speed, through gangway in the unit and slightly different cab front (no wrap around windows). Sounds could be an issue but ISTR the DB420 in TSC sounding not unlike a 310 or 312. There’s certainly probably a few reference recordings kicking around that could be listened to prior to synthesising something.
Some good videos on YouTube capturing arrival, the compressor and that lovely bass and whine as it pulls away.
And there's a Driving Car that's been saved which will help with source material/cab sounds. I've mentioned this before but AP took some Class 508 recordings last year not only in case they want to make a 508 pack but because they have the same compressors as the 312. So either a 312 or a 508 or both are possible future releases in either TSC or TSW. As OldVern says they were an evolution of the Mk2 based 310s but better suited to long-distance commuter traffic with a higher top speed than the 310s. They were a direct result of BR concentrating development on suburban units (PEPs) and expresses (HST and APT) so when two lines needed more mid-range units there wasn't a modern design available "off the peg" so in a move that was criticized by insiders, the drivers, passengers and the railway press at the time, BR ordered yet more slam-door stock when other countries were getting sliding door commuter trains. I loved them though.
I could cope with that. I mean the interiors would need to be rebuilt, the 720 coaches are 3 metres longer than the 710s hence the additional window bay, but I could cope with a touched-up 710. It's not like the latter units' top speed of 75mph will be an issue on the LTS as I'm pretty sure that's the top speed on the whole LTS network.
I would love to see this in TSW... but only the whole thing, not with half of it missing. But I don´t think it will ever be done (at least properly). Would have to model Docklands Light Railway with rolling stock between Limehouse and Fenchurch Street and big parts of the District Line between Bow and Upminster. Of course the players would expect the District Line stretch to be fully modeled and playable. It would be a massive job... the only thing they got is Barking and the stretch up to about Purfeet from SEHS.
Doesn't need DLR at all, it's a very small part of the route. Just pretend it's broken down for the day. As for the District and Hammersmith & City lines, could make do with the same 'fix' as the GWE remaster; unbranded 484s as pretend D78 Stock. Not ideal and anachronistic, but better than nothing until somebody makes a route with S7 Stock.
