Cane Creek, Preservation Crew Or Skyhook?

Discussion in 'PC Discussion' started by KoeleKoen, Aug 30, 2021.

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  1. KoeleKoen

    KoeleKoen Well-Known Member

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    2 questions
    Are the issues with the rolling stock and route getting a fix or do we have to take it as is?

    If yes, is this up to skyhook or the preservation crew?
     
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  2. Cameron's Gaming

    Cameron's Gaming Well-Known Member

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    It would be up to Skyhook. Of Rivet, Matt said "It's not for us to just go in and make changes", although there are some exceptions; I think DTG did the major work in upgrading 3rd party stuff to 4.26 this time (Rivet had to do it themselves for the upgrade to 4.23), and they also did the update for RailDriver, so I think unless it's game breaking (or potentially game breaking), DTG won't touch it.
     
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  3. KoeleKoen

    KoeleKoen Well-Known Member

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    I'm not familiar with skyhook's ethic on this, i know rivet fixed some stuff on the 204,you expect skyhook to fix the 4400?
     
  4. Rutger Luiten

    Rutger Luiten Member

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    If DTG only fix "game breaking bugs", perhaps they should change the "sim" in the name to "game".
     
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  5. Inkar

    Inkar Well-Known Member

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    I will do the same that I'm doing with Rivet. If they don't fix the big issues I will not buy more DLC from them.
     
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  6. MatsH

    MatsH Member

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    Dovetail Games is listed as publisher of these addons. I don't know if that makes them responsible in any way, but wouldn't it at least be in their interest to get fixes done for these products? I mean, it's their name on the DLC as well. And who would like to have their name on a broken piece of DLC? :o

    And also, fixing these problems now is still doable. Wait a couple of years and TSW will be in the same position as TS20xx; broken DLC left, right and center and with no hope of EVER getting them fixed. :(
     
    Last edited: Aug 30, 2021
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  7. Monder

    Monder Well-Known Member

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    At least something could be done, right? Like lowering the loco to the correct height? Maybe?
     
  8. KoeleKoen

    KoeleKoen Well-Known Member

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    I was hoping for that especially, lowering it and make the second truck's wheels turn, cause now they don't, how they missed that god knows, but just a little clean up on the 4400 would go a long way
     
  9. ShodanCat

    ShodanCat Member

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    I thought I read here somewhere that Skyhook did the route, scenarios and time table services, and DTG did the locos. So basically the loco issues (like the 4400's ride height and truck problems) should be tackled by DTG and things like floating rocks in the scenery would be in Skyhook's purview.

    All that being said, the consumer shouldn't have to worry about this one way or the other and should simply expect that fixes will be forthcoming.
     
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  10. Cameron's Gaming

    Cameron's Gaming Well-Known Member

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    Skyhook modified the locos that came with Sand Patch, so technically DTG did do the locos, but Skyhook then took them and modified them. Either way, it's still Skyhook's product, so Skyhook's responsibility.
     
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  11. chieflongshin

    chieflongshin Well-Known Member

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    I personally was interested in both iow and arosa. I have chosen not to buy either of these routes on the basis rivet appear to have left both broken without acknowledging or fixing them either. Now I hold my hands up that I have this opinion based on what I’ve watched and read on the forums but I do consider people with far more understanding of trains, timetable, real life and experience a good temperature check. Much as I’d like Penzance with it being a Uk route ink will hold off on this too
     
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  12. BladesAndRazors

    BladesAndRazors Member

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    No matter who would fix the issues it will only happen in a few years.
    There is no staff assigned to fix problems after a release quickly it looks. So frustrating.
     
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  13. chieflongshin

    chieflongshin Well-Known Member

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    I think there comes a point where people stop asking and it is what it is, that’s how I perceive rivet
     
  14. KoeleKoen

    KoeleKoen Well-Known Member

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    I was hoping skyhook might be different... If this is their standard for model quality and fixing errors i'm skipping their next dlc's
     
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  15. erg73

    erg73 Well-Known Member

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    Not to worry, I am enclosing to you the progress on the hard work Rivet is doing with Arosa Linie.
     
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  16. redrev1917

    redrev1917 Well-Known Member

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    IMO DTG should give any TP developer notice to fix issues and if they aren't fixed in a reasonable timescale remove the DLC from their store. Ultimately the vast majority of users won't differentiate between Skyhook/Rivet & DTGs. And if they buy broken DLC this will reduce the sales of future DLC that may well be produced by DTG themselves
     
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  17. chieflongshin

    chieflongshin Well-Known Member

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    Last edited: Aug 31, 2021
  18. Monder

    Monder Well-Known Member

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    I don't want to defend them too much here, but this proposal is a slippery slope. The very first problem is the definition of "issues to fix" - what is broken, what is not? The height of the AC4400 is a problem, but it is not a game-breaking bug. Sounds are annoying, but not very fixable from Skyhook's side when it comes from DTG's loco ("Here, have our asset for your route... SIKE, NOW FIX THE SOUND").

    And DTG would also shoot itself in the foot with this - why do 3rd parties have to fix their stuff when DTG doesn't fix its own? Don't get me wrong, they fix something, but the backlog is still chunky.

    Broken 3rd party releases are solely 3rd party problems I guess. We've seen Rivet's approach, we've cautiously watching Skyhook. If you're not satisfied, the only way is to actively avoid their content (I like the look of Penzance, but no, Rivet is not getting my money after Arosa).

    The best thing DTG can do is to check the content produced by 3rd parties themselves - see if it matches the expected quality. Which IIRC Sam said they want to do after Arosa. Then again - their own QA seems to be lacking a lot.
     
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  19. Monder

    Monder Well-Known Member

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    OOOOF, that's a serious low-blow. "Nah, we're working on other things, deal with it." That is another one for my "Rivet-Counter" collection :D
     
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  20. tbaac

    tbaac Active Member

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    It does bring up an interesting point though. It is great (on the whole) when DTG upgrade the UE version. And we'd all love more 3rd party devs to be producing content. But if changes to the UE version and/or core TSW result in things not working properly, then is it fair to expect 3rd party devs to fix issues around those forever?
    Maybe devs could release a very cheap paid upgrade? Not ideal but I'm not sure how else they can sign up to maintain content on an ongoing basis when the simulator is improved on a regular basis? (So, the paid upgrade would be to make an existing non-DTG addon compatible with a new version of UE (e.g. 4.26) you'd paid say £1.50 for a compatibility upgrade).
    Maybe not, just thinking.
     
  21. chieflongshin

    chieflongshin Well-Known Member

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    It’s a no for me
     
  22. tbaac

    tbaac Active Member

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    Nevertheless, it would be good to have a policy from 3rd party devs. Somewhere between "We'll always update everything to the latest TSW version asap" through "We'll always try and update, but sometimes there may be a small charge involved" through to "This is only guaranteed to work with the version of TSW available at the time that our product is released".
     
  23. redrev1917

    redrev1917 Well-Known Member

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    In the case of rivet, things on arosalinie wasn't working before the update.

    While I agree the simple answer is vote with our pockets not everyone will understand the difference and you have to consider the casual buyer who's first DLC is a rivet/skyhook/A.N.Other DLC find it poor and decide never to buy another DLC again and parks up TSW as a whole due to the poor standard. I'm not referring to details like the wrong ride height here ofc as most casuals wouldn't notice that.
     
  24. Cameron's Gaming

    Cameron's Gaming Well-Known Member

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    If I'm understanding this right, that's a subscription service, where you have to pay every year just to keep playing the game?
    If I'm reading that correctly, IDK about anyone else but I love being charged money in order to keep a product that I already paid quite a bit of money (in the eyes of a student) for, and if I don't cough up then sorry but everyone else is on the new version and getting support but I'm not... no I don't.
     
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  25. tbaac

    tbaac Active Member

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    Okay so imagine that Rivet are really enthusiastic about TSW and in a couple of years have created 30 addons for it. Now also imagine that DTG decide to move TSW to UE5 at some point after that. Will Rivet support all the needed upgrades for free? Will they not bother?
    (And I'm not trying to pick on Rivet here, it could be another developer instead)
    Ideally there wouldn't need to be any upgrades for it, but neither Rivet nor DTG will know whether TSW will ever moved to UE 5, and if so then fully what that will involve, it is difficult to be sure on that.
     
  26. chieflongshin

    chieflongshin Well-Known Member

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    Surely it should just be in there interests to do if they want to stay relevant in the same way DTG have?
     
  27. Cameron's Gaming

    Cameron's Gaming Well-Known Member

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    I think if/when they move to UE5, DTG will just start again from scratch with TSW3, or under a different name, with no cross-compatibility.

    I seem to remember Matt saying DTG did all the upgrades to 4.26 including for the 3rd party routes, and then fixed most of the major issues so it was like it was in 4.23 (with the 3rd party doing other fixes/changes if needed/desired), because all the add-ons had to come out on 4.26 at the same time, unlike 4.16 --> 4.23 where Rivet did the upgrade of its loco (was it the BR363?), as they could be staggered because TSW2020 and TSW2 are separate pieces of software, but I may be misremembering.
     
  28. tbaac

    tbaac Active Member

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    I hope that DTG don't decide to do that. I like new functionality in TSW as much as the next person, but it would be a shame if all the existing DLC stopped working (as was the stated plan when TSW2 came out until DTG had a rethink).
    There isn't that much available for TSW2 as it is. If we press the reset button every 3 or 4 years then it may never be any more than that.
     
  29. FeralKitty

    FeralKitty Well-Known Member

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    I'd hope not! I have so much invested in German routes and locos and would just stick with TSW2 instead of TSW3.
     
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  30. dbrunner#4864

    dbrunner#4864 Well-Known Member

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    To funny man ! And 100% accurate.
     
  31. ottselmaster

    ottselmaster Active Member

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    Sorry to come in late but what are the issues with this route?
     
  32. Dinosbacsi

    Dinosbacsi Well-Known Member

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    Issues with the locomotive models, like the rear bogey of the locomotive being the other way around, wheels not rotating on it, and the whole loco also sits higher than it should and other small issues.

    The route itself I believe also features many floating scenery pieces and some trackside stuff, like the level crossings, are really ugly.
     
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  33. ottselmaster

    ottselmaster Active Member

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    Jeez how do these clowns get to keep making dlc?
     
  34. Inkar

    Inkar Well-Known Member

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    Also, the alerter light does not work on the SD40.
     
  35. meridian#2659

    meridian#2659 Well-Known Member

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    Did we ever got response from skyhook because their poor customer service?

    I read so many posts about the route issue with its rolling stock, and now the desaster with the 187.
     
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