Dark Signals, What's All That About?

So towards the end of last night's (Kassel-Wurzburg) stream, Lukas showed a dark signal that they stopped at. If I remember correctly, they had to wait at it because it was dark, and then a white light came on and they could proceed.

Why do they do it that way? Aren't dark signals hard to see at night?

Thanks.

 

In real life, you are supposed to learn signal locations as part of route knowledge.
In the sim, the HUD supposedly helps to know where they are.
Dark signal means a problem. The most casual one is the red bulb dying (but then it could show green), but it could also be intentionally offline due to maintenance.
In the German ecosystem it's a bit easier due to frequent "mileposts" (km/100m boards)
The white light is "shunting allowed", normally shown alongside the red.

In TSC there are occasions where certain aspects (diverging warning / advance, Kuju UK) fail to show, leaving the signal dark (alternatives are red, or my favorite at Carlisle which shows all lights on). Depending on implementation TSW could inhibit the same behavior. Hopefully TSW doesn't have it.

 

But not in this case. The dark signals are LZB related. Simple description is, when a train is running under LZB guidance, all signals are basically irrelevant to the driver, except Hp0 (Red). On some LZB equipped routes the signals were set to dark then. It's way more complicated than that, but i just want to correct what triznya.andras said.

 

Thanks for the replies. So Maik, last night I think they were waiting at a dark signal. Was that a pre-release quirk? (Or maybe a misunderstanding on my part). It was at 1:38:05 in the stream upload.

Thanks.

 

No, he stopped manually just to show what such a dark signal does. There is a train in front somewhere and when the ICE passed the signal as a LZB driven train, the signal falls back to normal then. I think this is what he wanted to show.

 

I did check what Maik mentioned. Both my curiosity and to show openness
From here: https://www.sh1.org/eisenbahn/shlzb.htm
A bit more detail so I copy it here.
Technically, said signal is clear under Lzb (and would be danger under Pzb but is temporarily off), which the driver should know about, and clearly has the indication on his dashboard. If Lzb says danger at the signal and the signal is off, then...

LZB and Signals
As said above, LZB is an overlay system, i.e. the traditional main & distant signals remain in place. When a non-LZB train passes through, signals operate as usual. When an LZB train passes through, the signals still operate as usual showing their proceed, caution, and stop aspects. The (almost) only difference is, that the train is notified of the signals' aspects way before approaching the distant signal, permitting longer brake distance and thus higher speeds.

Now on some new lines where almost only LZB trains were expected the installation of many signals could be avoided. On these lines signals are only provided at LZB starting and end points, crossings, and as entry and exit signals. The line itself is still divided into blocks (the so-called LZB blocks) which are not delimited by signals but marked by the LZB block markers.

So on such lines you effectively have two overlaying block systems: the LZB blocks and the blocks delimited by the signals. The latter have to be observed should a non-LZB train pass through.

There is a special case: suppose a non-LZB train has passed a signal, and is on the line already a few LZB blocks away, but still before the next fixed signal. Consequently the signal in rear shows stop. Now an LZB train is scheduled after the first train. Since the second train is governed by LZB and the next LZB block is free, it could safely pass the (red) signal into that unoccupied LZB block.

However DBAG doesn't want to stress their drivers by having them to pass red signals, and so on these lines signals are switched dark when an LZB train approaches.

 

Thanks for that. I think I'd previously read about some PZB details on sh1.org.

Maik Goltz It could be fun/useful if someone at DTG wrote an article or devoted part of a stream to the new parts of LZB that have been added on the route. Thanks.

edit: This is referencing Lukas' comments on how LZB has been redone on the 185.2. Thanks.

 

Something like that, yeah I haven't bother me with LZB signalling a lot. That's on Lukas to do. I'm just happy when my train that i setup is driving in any sort...

 

I think there is an in game tutorial about them.

 

I noticed that Matt as Lukas was scrolling around. It is 15 minutes long so should give a detail understanding of LZB and the dark signals.

 

Thanks TrainSim-Matt, I noticed last night in the stream, as Lukas was setting up AFB that there are a number of options to do it. He even seemed confused momentarily as to which button to click on. Hope there is some instructions on this aspect of AFB.

 

It's quite simple.

There are 5 options to select:
- VSoll (alwayss preselected)
- 25 km/h
- 10 km/h
- 5 Km/h
- 2 km/h
... and there is the AFB on/of button. Switch it on and it uses VSoll as AFB mode. That means you can select a speed between 0 and 280 km/h and it reacts to LZB VSoll. The other modes are doing what they are called, at least. The limit the speed you can select and spread it to the speed lever. So, for example, when you select 5 km/h then the lever lets you select 0-5 km/h over its whole range. Same for the other modes.

You need to know that you can only select a speed mode that is lower than the current selected mode when AFB is already switched on. If you want to select a higher speed mode, you need to switch off AFB first (be sure the throttle is in 0 position when doing it), switch it on again and then select the desired speed mode and set a speed with the lever. That's all, basically. You should not do that while on high-speeds for obvious reasons.

Also take note, that, when you switch on/off AFB with the throttle not in 0 position, the AFB does not go off or on but remembers the new targeted state and does it at soon as you have the throttle set to 0 once. You should take that in mind when you switch it on and the set speed is lower than your actual speed. It will brake you immediately.

Ah, and remember that the AFB on/off button acts reversed. Pressed in means OFF, released means ON. Same for the safety system buttons there. They are fault-mode switches. Pressed == fault mode. AFB is meant to be used always on that train. So there its the same, its a fault-state when pressed.

 

Thanks Maik, so those lower speeds are great for use when shunting.

 

You might need to translate it by yourself please:

- 2 km/h (Waschgang)
- 5 km/h (Einfahrt Hallengleis)
- 10 km/h (Ausfahrt Hallengleis)
- 25 km/h (Rangieren)
- Vsoll frei (frei wählbarer Einstellbereich der AFB-Sollgeschwindigkeit)

 

Let me attempt to practice my German...
-2 km/h (going (through) train wash)
-5 km/h (entering siding "Hall track": storage siding?)
-10 km/h (leaving siding)
-25 km/h (shunting)
-Free speed set (freely selectable range of AFB speed settings)

 

I think I need to bookmark this post.
Thanks Maik.