Do You Think Just Trains Products Are Expensive?

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by Blazin, Jan 16, 2022.

  1. Craigie-C

    Craigie-C Well-Known Member

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    Couldn't agree more, the JT MML in my opinion is up there with some of the best.
    The build quality is good and I also like the way you are e-mailed to inform you of fixes & updates which are released pretty regularly.

    I admit I possibly wouldn't be so happy if I had bought Derby - Sheffield from Steam as a standalone but buying direct from JT.......
    Leicester to Sheffield via Derby or Nottingham & the Erewash Valley Line / the Derwent Valley to Matlock (which is to die for) oh yes nearly forgot you can also continue from Nottingham to Lincoln and any day now the Hope Valley line is being released.
    Oh and the Barrow Hill Roundhouse.
    [EDIT] Totally forgot to include the amazing Radcliffe on Soar power station with coal transfer etc.

    To me that is one pretty long, comprehensive network of rail, offering everything from high speed IC lines to single track branch lines, throw in the Toton Freight Yard & a Museum for good measure...... ticks all the boxes for me.
    Doesn't come in the bargain bucket admittedly, but I feel it is good value for money.
    It has put a smile on my face many a time.
     
    Last edited: Jan 22, 2022
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  2. inversnecky

    inversnecky Well-Known Member

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    It just all needs to be on a decent sale :)
     
  3. Cyclone

    Cyclone Well-Known Member

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    Yeah, that. I decided to get Derwent in the last sale (using my points, too!) since it works with the base route. I have been waiting out a better price on the Nottingham portion, and then after I find Erewash on a sale I will be able to utilize the free scenario pack.
     
  4. Blazin

    Blazin Well-Known Member

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    Well now I know what my first Just Trains purchases will be. :)
     
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  5. PhÜnKî_Rø0sTā

    PhÜnKî_Rø0sTā Active Member

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    Is there really a difference between buying a route from JT direct compared to buying the same thing from steam?
     
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  6. Blazin

    Blazin Well-Known Member

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    Yes, sometimes it can be a huge difference. Because on Steam, the route will only include stuff that is on the Steam Store, on Just Trains, it has a lot more scenarios sometimes because it features DLC from lots of different websites. Yes it costs more to get all the requirements, but it's worth it!
     
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  7. R3dS41ft

    R3dS41ft Active Member

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    Not all routes are different. I believe Malmesbury branch and Bristol to Exeter are the same. Read the description in both steam and just trains to compare before you buy.
     
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  8. Reef

    Reef Well-Known Member

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    Just Trains direct bought content will receive updates/fixes quicker and more often than the steam bought versions, not to mention you cannot merge the steam versions of the MML routes like you can the JT direct.purchased ones (same goes for the WML too)
     
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  9. mr2mark

    mr2mark Member

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    Does the western mainlines collection go all the way from paddington to penzance?. Can see there is 4 routes and one larger collection which says it includes them all.
     
  10. Cyclone

    Cyclone Well-Known Member

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    The routes are as follows:

    - Brtistol to Exeter )I know, why buy the other one unless a freeware route needs it or for UKTS scenarios)
    - Cardiff to Paddington
    - Cardiff to Exeter
    - Paddington to Exeter
    - Bristol to Avonmouth (a removed route IRL finishes the loop onto the SWC line, excluded here too)
    - Bristol to Paddington via Chippenham
    - Cardiff to Penzance (requires South Devon extension to Plymouth, Cornish extension afterwards)
    - Penzance to Paddington (requires same two expansions)
    - Paddington to Paignton (requires South Devon and Paignton expansions)
    - Paddington to Bicester via Oxford (requires Bcester expansion)

    All Penzance routes are also simulated on BHBP as far as Bristol and Reading (via Westbury I believe) and then some with only the Western Mainlines and Southwestern Expressways. Other DLC is required such as the OHLE pack starting around Newbury heading to Reading. The extensions are not needed. However, some scenery is still missing since those sections are rebuilt. BHBP is actually in the process of adding Paddington now. Cardiff is not on the route nor is the path through Swindon, which WML includes. Oxford is also missing. Paignton is there, as is the Falmouth area. I believe BHBP also goes to Kingswear.

    Hopefully this helps. If I missed any routes, someone please add on.
     
    Last edited: Jan 20, 2022
  11. TimeSlicedDanny

    TimeSlicedDanny Active Member

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    Yes.

    The base route goes Paddington to Exeter, with scenery, signals, scenarios, etc. It also has track but nothing else to Penzance. The add on packs then give you the scenery etc to extend down to Penzance.

    While some enjoy the ultra long drives, I find the scenery rather samey and not as well done as their later offerings.
     
  12. Cyclone

    Cyclone Well-Known Member

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    Wait. The base route was included without the scenery previously?

    No wonder the extensions are not needed for BHBP...
     
  13. TrainsAreBest

    TrainsAreBest Member

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    Uh? The base route (Western Mainlines) has always had scenery between Paddington and Exeter.
     
  14. Cyclone

    Cyclone Well-Known Member

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    Let me rephrase that. The base route includes the track to Penzance without scenery? This is something I never knew, if true.
     
  15. heardturkey

    heardturkey Active Member

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    A grab of Penzance from the Steam version of Western Mainlines. Penzance Unfinished.jpg
     
  16. jklimentowski

    jklimentowski Active Member

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    In my opinion JT are little overpriced, especially the older products which lack quality. Still some of their stuff is among the best on the market for example South Western Expressways, not only long and beatiful route but with amazing scenarios, QD for all possibile routes (with and without avoiding some stations) and even some random red lights!
     
  17. 749006

    749006 Well-Known Member

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    I did not realise Western Mainlines was released on Steam - do you have a link?
     
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  18. heardturkey

    heardturkey Active Member

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    My mistake:(. It is from the Just Trains Shop. I forgot that I'd actually bought anything directly from them.
     
  19. jklimentowski

    jklimentowski Active Member

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    upload_2022-1-21_19-31-35.png

    Penzance from JT looks just fine. Whole WML is not of the highest visual quality because it's pretty old already but the distance! Along with GWEX it's probably the best route for long express driving. Another one being London to Edinbourgh but that requires different routes with freewares and it's not merged...
     
    Last edited: Jan 21, 2022
  20. Cyclone

    Cyclone Well-Known Member

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    Beat me to it. I was going to say the same thing. :D
     
  21. martschuffing

    martschuffing Well-Known Member

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    The later routes By Tom and Mark yes, definitely.
     
  22. jklimentowski

    jklimentowski Active Member

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    The problem with JT is that they often offer very expensive routes without stock to drive them. Not a big problem for me because I buy stuff seperately, mostly from AP, but for some people this may be a problem. I'm still thinking about buying Metropolitan line but this is metro and I have no stock for it and buying it seperately from JT only for this single route puts a high price tag on the whole product...
     
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  23. Cyclone

    Cyclone Well-Known Member

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    It was nearly a full third off with the train bundled during the Winter sale. I feel this was done at the time to capitalize on the Virtual District Line while its Phase 3 was a major discussion element, as the version with the train is a requirement. I'm sure a few copies of Metropolitan sold during that sale.

    Do not get the one from Steam for this, though. I've heard of issues with that version.
     
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  24. 749006

    749006 Well-Known Member

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    But the picture was from Western Mainlines - not Cornwall only or Devon only.
     
  25. Craigie-C

    Craigie-C Well-Known Member

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    Apologies for playing the dimbo card but could you please divulge what BHBP stands for.
    I currently own the below and just wondered if BHBP was anything similar. Cheers
    JT-Western-Lines.jpg
     
  26. Cyclone

    Cyclone Well-Known Member

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    https://www.ontracksimulation.com/bhbp.html

    Also available at Vulcan Productions. Produced by High Speed Tracks regardless of where you get it. https://www.vulcanproductions.co.uk/berks--hants-to-bristol--penzance.html

    The route combines The Railways of Devon and Cornwall, once available at UKTS and still available way back at version 3 there, with the South Western Expressways to Reading route (specifically, the freeware Reading add-on to the old SWE). My understanding is that all SWE assets are in the new payware SWER, but you may wish to download and install the Assets section of the old freeware Reading add-on to SWE (the route folder is not necessary in that case) to ensure all assets are held.

    Also, you have the full WML. So yes, the Cardiff section gets dropped from Bristol, but you will go to Reading and anywhere on the SWE map. The route doesn't go to Paddington yet, but it is a future update. ATS OHLE pack will be required for anything from Newbury to Reading, and to Paddington.
     
    Last edited: Jan 21, 2022
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  27. Craigie-C

    Craigie-C Well-Known Member

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    Cheers Cyclone, much appreciated, will have a look at that.
    [EDIT] Just have, and wow, at first impression that looks so much better than the JT equivalent.
    Thanks for the heads up
     
  28. inversnecky

    inversnecky Well-Known Member

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    I always wish these routes with big lists of requirements would have links for them…..
     
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  29. Blazin

    Blazin Well-Known Member

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    I certainly agree! I haven't purchased anything from third party developers (Except a couple AP products) and I would probably get very nervous wondering if I got the correct requirements.
     
  30. inversnecky

    inversnecky Well-Known Member

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    I think I’ve installed all the UKTS packs, Vulcan grass and trees, various types of signs, but it hard to keep track now. I should have maintained a list from the very start.
     
  31. inversnecky

    inversnecky Well-Known Member

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    ‘Bristol to Exeter’ - I think I have this from Steam, but it’s listed under JT in the requirements. Presumably the Steam version is ok?
     
  32. Blazin

    Blazin Well-Known Member

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    I'm honestly not sure if they are the same thing, because in the images for the route on the Just Trains website there is a Class 43 in Cross Country livery, but on the steam version I can't see any Cross Country livery, but I don't know if the Cross Country livery comes with the route or was just used for images, and on compatibility for the route on the Just Trains website, it says "Railworks 3" and not "Train Simulator 2022" which makes it sound like it won't work if you install it from their website anyway
     
  33. trev123

    trev123 Active Member

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    Just Trains are expensive for me in New Zealand as they force you to buy in US dollars and when converted to NZ dollars the exchange rate stops you from buying from them so I just wait for them to come on Steam and purchase in NZ Dollars. Most online sites these days show prices in your countries currency or if not give you a list of all countries to select your one.
     
  34. jklimentowski

    jklimentowski Active Member

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    I've just did this route a moment ago: 1C85 PAD-PGN

    upload_2022-1-22_0-59-47.png

    JT might be a bit overpriced but worth the price anyway :)

    I wasn't aware of BHBP. It looks amazing. Definitely I'd like to have it but I lack a lot of requirements so it would be pretty expensive to me :/

    They do. You can go from Paddington to Penzance via Bristol (either via Bath or Parkway), Exeter, Plymouth and you also get Paignton branch. Unfortunately London to Penzance via Bristol is not a real life route, you would need South Western Expressway to go via Newbury (as shown on the map), but it's not merged to the collection and require route switching in the middle.

    Still the whole collection is pretty useful because if you own Bristol to Swansea, you can drive another nice real life train from Cardiff to Penzance with route switching in Bristol.
     
    Last edited: Jan 22, 2022
  35. inversnecky

    inversnecky Well-Known Member

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    There’s one or two threads in the forum that talk about it and its requirements in more detail.
     
  36. Cyclone

    Cyclone Well-Known Member

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    They are exactly the same thing. Usually buying direct is recommended, but the scenarios are exactly the same, all use basic stock. This was before AP started developing trains and even pre-dates the 321. Not sure if the 142 came before this route, but it's not used in scenarios.
    Funny you say that. BHBP lets you go via Newbury. Have the OHLE pack from AlanThomsonSim if you want to avoid a bunch of milk bottles between Reading and Newbury. By the way, that new Dartmoor Railway that opened on November 20? It's been in here a while, you can make up those actual services and nearby trains in the real timetable now. Services originate at Exeter and go to Okehampton, sharing the same initial area as the Barnstaple route (but they don't operate as two way track, which is peculiar, maybe that's changed now?). Note the part to Barnstaple after the split is not sceneried ATM, you need to run that on DPS's individual Barnstaple to Exeter route for now if you want scenery.
    I looked up one of these services! The Double Stack, I believe, and it was a 6 p.m. service. Imagined making this as a single run, to allow for trainspotting or for a player to take his own coffee break.
     
    Last edited: Jan 22, 2022
  37. jklimentowski

    jklimentowski Active Member

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    Unfortunately BHBP goes only to Reading. But anyway as I said BHBP looks amazing but it requires some payware. While Somerset lines is something I will probably buy anyway I have serious doubts on buying Riviera, while I already have Paginton extension from JT. I will have to think about it. I want to have BHBP as hell but such an urge is usually a bad advisor especially when there is sale around ;)

    Chiltern is a very nice route. Maybe not a top notch but very solid. Steam reviews are mostly negative due to the Mk3 coaches which don't load up. Here I honestly can't say amything about it because I drive only DMUs there but the descriptions says that the route gives only a reskin for the Mk3, not the coaches themselves, maybe this is the problem?

    Frankfurt U-Bahn is amazing but I would suggest to check Frankfurt S-Bahn too. The route is amazing, the EMU is great, it's the best S-Bahn route out there.
     
    Last edited: Jan 22, 2022
  38. Blazin

    Blazin Well-Known Member

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    But what about the fact that the compatibility says Railworks 3? That surely means it doesn't work anymore or am I wrong?
     
  39. Cyclone

    Cyclone Well-Known Member

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    Paddington is a future extension. Proper services will be fully playable. And maybe he'll put in Swindon in the future since that needs to be completely redone anyway; some UK players who used that map tracking utility note that the track is misaligned, so a correct one would not be bad.
    That is definitely the issue, then. If you don't have the base model, the coaches will not load. I'm guessing the Class 7 is the source of the coaches that are reskinned, and it's a shame that JT considered it necessary to force someone to buy their own train in order to reskin their own cars. I mean, they could have just included the new model without being so self-serving. Of course, if the reskins are based on the Class 68 or Class 170 coaches instead...then why is the Class 7 even a requirement?
    Railworks 3 is Train Simulator 2012. And if you own Train Simulator 2012, you have been upgraded to Train Simulator 2022. No problem. :D

    https://store.steampowered.com/app/65224/Train_Simulator_BristolExeter_Route_AddOn/

    Note this same segment of route later appears in Western Mainlines as part of Paddington to Exeter, as well as Southwestern Expressways, SWE to Reading, and a portion in the South Devon Main Line. Oh, and BHBP covers it as well if you have Western Mainlines. And I know I'm forgetting one...but in any case, I believe all are redone compared to the old one, so scenarios remain unique to each route except for SWE being usable on SWER to my knowledge. There are packs for Bristol to Exeter itself on UKTS and other places, and JT itself sells one or two packs. And to the Riviera Line comment earlier, it's the most used route for scenario making historically at UKTS from what I've seen (London to Brighton, Marias Pass, and Munich to Augsburg I think are Workshop top three), so definitely worth getting. Wales is getting a lot of work today though, including in custom routes.
     
    Last edited: Jan 22, 2022
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  40. Reef

    Reef Well-Known Member

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    Yes, you are indeed wrong. :)
     
  41. jklimentowski

    jklimentowski Active Member

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    Yup, you can clearly see that on the map I attached above. East of Reading there is an enormous offset to the real map which is pretty annoying. I'm looking forward for the extension. I've got to know that something like BHPB existed just an hour ago and I already know it's a must have pick for me sooner or later.
     
  42. martschuffing

    martschuffing Well-Known Member

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    We are discussing JT's pricing, in general, are we not Peter? And Inver was asking if JT's routes were better than DTG's. And in my opinion, Tom and Mark's efforts are better than DTG's efforts, in particular all the MML routes and SWEXR.
     
    Last edited: Jan 22, 2022
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  43. class2ldn2801

    class2ldn2801 Member

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    I assume the steam version of newcastle to edinburgh would work ok for bhpb ? Its around £11 on steam at the moment.
     
    Last edited: Jan 22, 2022
  44. R3dS41ft

    R3dS41ft Active Member

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    I suspect it depends on whether the route has the same GUID on Steam and on Just Trains.
    ATS are having a similar challenge with Phase 4 of the missing link: that they need to get Crewe station from either the branded North Wales Coastal or the unbranded version of the route. They are talking about supporting both versions and having different downloads in the short term.
     
  45. class2ldn2801

    class2ldn2801 Member

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    Well newcastle to edinburgh is the one thing i need for bhpb , I doubt il use it much alone so the cheaper I can get it the better.
     
  46. inversnecky

    inversnecky Well-Known Member

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  47. 749006

    749006 Well-Known Member

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    In theory they should be the same but in the past people have had problems when the Steam Version did not provide the correct assets for use in a Freeware route. The VDL is one that requires the JT version of the Metropolitan line

    If you have the time to check you could purchase the Steam version of NCL-EDB and then run the BHPB thru TS Tools to see if it shows the assets as missing - if it did you could get a refund if you have not played any route in TS20222 for more than two hours
     
  48. inversnecky

    inversnecky Well-Known Member

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    I have the Steam version already, and will have a go at checking the other things needs for the BHPB and get back.
     
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  49. 749006

    749006 Well-Known Member

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    It does not matter if you don't have the other assets yet
    Just check the route with TS Tools and you would see if it shows the required Just Trains assets as missing
    Check to see if they are in an *.ap file first :)
     
  50. Cyclone

    Cyclone Well-Known Member

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    I wonder if the asset location is different depending on the version of the route owned, too. For starters, and I don't know if Edinburgh-Newcastle did this, most routes through Steam nowadays are in an AP file. TS-Tools likes to think things in AP files are missing. You have to unpack the AP file to take a proper look. LocoSwap will also show stock in AP files as missing.
     

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