PC Dynamic Events Are A Must For Tsw

I'm guessing this is part of the dispatcher AI, depending on what's happened on the service and what order the lights are requested in is how long you'll be held for. The only issue is when certain trains stop or get held and then the AI breaks down is when you get the red light issues, because rather than resetting or whatever, the whole thing just grinds to a halt

 

Yeah I've been in a couple of situations where everything has grinded to a halt and I lve thought that's it game over. Then I've left the game running to find out eventually that the dispatcher has stopped everything apart from one service for some reason is given priority over everything. With 2 outcomes, if it has a clear path it will eventually cross the junction ahead of me and everything starts moving again or it gets stuck behind another ai service and nothing gets moving.

I remember matt saying that on kassel wurzburg, if you are running a freight service you will be moved aside for high speed trains to pass where necessary. But I guess that's scripted also.

 

I agree and wanted to expand on this thought. Timetable mode already offers a great experience. For me, a lot of the fun comes from selecting a service and seeing what happens. Sure, many of them will be similar. But, the fun of discovery comes from the unexpected, interesting things that can and sometimes do happen. Occasionally, I have even been able to post these runs on the forum, which is extra rewarding. This sense of discovery is what makes many games fun to play.

This is not to say that I am specifically against dynamic events, or any other additions to game play, per se. However, take LBN as an example. This route certainly has one of the best timetables. Rather than dynamic events, I would much more strongly prefer just bringing LBN up to standards, and after that giving it the upgrade treatment a la SEHS. For me, DTG, while developing new DLC to make money, should put any further new features on hold until the majority of what we already have is excellent, because the gameplay is already there, but the execution is, relatively, not.

 

Well main problem is that a lot of new features will be added only into the new routes so once that random events is added it will work only with routes released with it and after... we all know how fast they can add new stuff into the older routes right

 

Sorry if the mention of Zusi touched a raw nerve, but for many of us it is the grail of German railway simulation. Admittedly I haven't bought Zusi 3 yet (a situation I intend to remedy in the Xmas sale) but I put many hours into Zusi 2.

And yes I'm aware the system is not infallible - one of my favourite routes in Zusi 2 is the Schnuntertalbahn across from Wolfsburg to Braunschweig and Carsten set the timetable up for a busy evening when main line services were being diverted across the line. More than one of my runs ended with a signalling lock up, or trying to work out which train(s) to delete in order to get traffic moving.

 

Hi, Matt -- One way to test dynamic re-routing might be to use me as a tester, since I tend to drive freight runs at least 2 mph below the speed limit and to send my train down to very low speeds when the grade gauge abruptly changes from upward to downward. I couldn't help with passenger runs, however, since I'm absolutely incompetent when it comes to sticking to a station stop schedule.

 

I agree with everything you completely said.

 

Not for me. AND i played ZUSI 2 and 3 for thousands of hours. I played every train in ZUSI2 that was available, until a certain time 10 years back or so, once at a minimum. I know exactly what ZUSI (Hobby) can do and what not. Compared to TSW, simulation wise, TSW is better in that WHEN it gets set up correctly by the setup-team. Example? ZUSI can't simulate a real tap changer until today. TSW can. ZUSI has no distinct simulation components that i can use like a Lego set to build what i need. TSW has that. ZUSI is a pure number cruncher. You put in a result (a curve for example) and it will put out the exact numbers from that curve then. TSW does not eat curves for results. It generates results based on real physics calculation. ZUSI and TS1 needs TE curves, TSW does not have such things. You have to put in power supplies, electrical components, motors, axles, boogies etc. pp. to get a result. It's so much more configurable that ZUSI ever could. ZUSI is mostly hard coded stuff. When you want to change something, you need to wait for years or even decades to get the changes. It might be the better learning simulator since it's more reliable on safety systems, signalling and brake distances (because it knows the results and dont have to generate them in real time). And don't get me wrong, i don't dislike ZUSI. It's good in what it does. I personally do like TSW more now (not since the beginning). It has so much more possibilities. At some day TSW will show all it's capabilities to the players. It's still in development and growing. ZUSI does not really grow since a lot of years. It's the same today as it was since i left it behind me.

 

I’ve often thought that a simple way to vary the repeating timetables that TSW routes have would be to build in some times when things get a bit congested. I thought that was what Rush Hour was going to be like from the pre-release descriptions but it was just busier timetables that still ran perfectly. With a regular hourly repeating timetable it could be that some trains are set to depart a little late or dwell at stations for a bit longer which would cause delays on subsequent services or passing services but it would all be designed in and fully testable. Where the ‘normal’ timetable doesn’t really allow for that, for instance because a slightly late train here and there wouldn’t cause significant delays, extra AI could be added that does delay the players trains.

The services that get held up would always be the same ones but unless they research it because someone puts it on the ‘awesome services’ thread then the player wouldn’t know when starting a service whether it would be delayed or not. Where there may be 20 services that leave at 5 past the hour throwing a couple in that don’t go to plan would give the illusion of randomness as far as the player is concerned. It would take a bit of working out but a genuine rush hour where many trains get delayed could be created in one of the 24 hours of a day, and a few other seemingly random, but totally deliberate, delays could be scattered about the day too. I’m sure Joe could easily make that a reality.

 

Another advantage of this idea, as you alluded to, is that you can still share great services with others. Of course, with truly randomized dynamic events, this wouldn't really be possible. I would also say that your idea is already implemented within TSW to a small degree. For instance, there is a sequence of trains heading into GCT on HAR that converge and cause congestion where the Hudson and Harlem lines meet; this is referenced in the great services thread. You also have to wait sometimes when approaching Victoria on LBN. It does seem to me like the routes from Rush Hour and later have more of these possibilities, although I agree that overall Rush Hour did not live up to the promise/hype.

 

How about policemen waiting on the platform, who then enter one of the coaches.
After an extended delay a malefactor is escorted off the platform and you as the driver try to catch up with your timetable.
Two of you under the cosh so to speak.

 

The one thing that Zusi does and TSW doesn't is add that unpredictability. For those of us with years of playing railways sims and also real life railway operations experience having a completely scripted run using the same platforms, sidings, points etc just isn't real enough or immersion as some say. The physics in TSW are great and your work Maik is excellent. I am personally at the point were for a more random experience I am happy to put up with the fast forwarding and timetabling of Zusi plus the outdated graphics etc. I know not all feel the same but it's the only way that I enjoy train sims right now. The DB content for TSW is great but ultimately after a few runs even in more interesting stuff like the DB612 it's the same route every time etc.

The other thing I am working on is a quick drive for TSC using the joined up West Highland route. It's working OK so far with random traffic in front and passing.

 

Good idea! But DTG might make this happen too often it might not work very well. Also, It would need to be clear that the police are taking someone away and it doesn't just say “Wait until X time”.

 

Another idea which I touched on in Suggestions a while back, is to offer a weekend or Sunday timetable. That brings the possibility of two track sections of railway on 4 track main lines such as GWE or single line working on double lines, where not fitted for reversible working. Also the possibility of taking engineering trains in and out of possessions. Some of this would probably need to be scripted but it would add a different experience to the weekday running on greens all the time.

 

There is firstly a need for more maintenance of way trains, and engineering diaramas, at least one set for each of the three main countries covered. These could then be used in TSW3 without being tied to a specific route and allow for the scenes to be created causing diversions or additional speed limits etc.

Then several different sets of works could be programmed per timetable, with the work-around routes etc and then each time you spawn, it could either have none of them or one of them active and you would be given a warning about track works, diversions, speed limits etc.

There is a scenario on Koln-Aachen where you drive the ICE and there is a small diversion at one point, you end up running on the opposite line and going through a different platform, something like that, but scripted to occur randomly inside the timetable would be cool. I guess it would have to fit into the simulation though so whichever one is active, the timetable still runs effectively.

 

They might be a must to some of you but imagine getting all the way to near your destination only for a random failure to happen and then that's it, service over. You have to do it all over again. If that's the case at least have it as an option that we can toggle on or off. I remember years ago when ITV (UK) were showing the Formula 1 onTV I had a F1 game Pre Codemasters and EA rip offs and it was for the PS1 or PS2 that had random events on it. 95% of the time I did a full race with in 75 -100% completion, I would loose a wheel, have engine failure, puncture or just stop on track because of random events. Absolutely annoyed as hell s it would be only my car that suffered and not the AI. So Yeah if Random Events go in so must the option to have them enabled or disabled.

Hentis

 

This is ultra obvious, Hentis, my friend, mentioned milion times. BR

 

The addition of an audio warning. After all, the locos do have radios for communication, why not actually use them? At least on the game side of things as audio instructions.

 

Agreed 100%

Fix and update all the existing routes first for better play-ability and yes with a few loco / rolling stock / route extension add-ons for added existing route play-ability. Worry about new routes later. It's not like there's a shortage of routes to play... but there is a lot of bugs and issues and possibilities that exist on the current routes.

 

Which would then have to be localized in a dozen or more languages. Unlike station announcements which can stay in the host nation's tongue, these communications would have to be understood by the player

 

Yes, the part I overlooked but... realistically they would only have to be localized by route really. No need for more than that if being a true simulator. ie: UK and North American routes in English (unless in Quebec Canada where it would be French - but there are no Quebec routes yet anyway). German routes in German, &c, &c. Example: a person who may have emigrated from Germany and working as a loco engineer in North America would not be given instructions in German, nor in the opposite situation... I get why the game would need to do this re: world-wide player play-ability but that is not really realistic. And aren't simulators suppose to mimic reality? That is their purpose if I understand it correctly.
Don't get me wrong, I fully understand your point, and the point to world-wide player compatibility, but in reality wouldn't it be much less "compatible" with the various languages?
Having said that, I would certainly expect the game to be player friendly for all those no matter of language. Which in its entirety would negate audio warnings as a viable option.

 

Besides it's not like there is 1001 phrases a dispatcher is going to use.

 

As I have said before, you are comparing apples to oranges here. You work with TSW's developers. I presume you do not work with Zusi's developers. By this logic Openrails is the best train simulator since I can download the source code and completely rewrite it to fit my needs.

 

I'm comparing capabilities of two train simulators. Doesn't matter how the content gets in. But if you want to know, i have made content for at least 5 different train simulators in the past 12 years or so. I made own test content for ZUSI to get the idea what it can do and how it is done. The fact that nothing of it ever has seen the light is the way how content for ZUSI is being handled to get released and the fact that you cant make money from it (yeah, that's utterly important to me for reasons). But it is way way easier to make a train for ZUSI than for TS1 or TSW or even TRAINZ and MSTS. Until TSW was there, TRAINZ was my favorite in terms of capabilities (not simulation wise). ZUSI needs just some basic data, a really low poly model, a good photo of the cab (right, no 3d cab there, just a photo), some work on that photo to get the few levers movable (mostly Photoshop work if you are able to do it, otherwise you need more photos with different lever and switch positions then what is a really awful way of doing it), some basic audio, that's it. Most things you can't change as a content developer as it is all core manifest. You need the grace of the ZUSI core developers to get involved what is a rare gift. But we need to say that ZUSI was never made for anyone providing content freely. So, it's ok how it is handled. But it's also way easier to get into the dev-zone of TS1 or TSW if you are a experienced person in terms of making trains for train simulators.

 

Haven't read all answers yet but basically i would like the Idea of random Events. But if i could choose, i would love to get all the necessary fixes for the game before the developers prioritize stuff like this.

I guess that faults, caused by the players themselves, would be the next thing for TSW after those fixes. I could imagine that this is way easier to implement that rondom events that have effects on the hole rail network / route you are in.

Just for an example : on the DB 155 you have to manually enable the fans for the traction motors, if you forget to put them on the Loco will eventually overheat and thats resulting in the power cutted out. So you would have to wait for it to cool down before you can continue. Operating a Train would feel way more realistic as you really have to watch what you are doing with it, instead of just accelerate and brake.

I mean they sort of did it with the DB 110 where you can overpower and its cutting its power. Than you have to close the circuit again (?) and you can continue.

This would be my way to go.

 

No, "how the content gets in" is of the utmost importance when discussing a game's "capabilities". Again, when you have access to the game devs anything is theoretically possible.

 

Didn't they go on to explain how the content gets in? I think you're arguing with the wrong person... They know how to make and implement this stuff more than most given they have worked directly with DTG

 

But that's my entire point. He's saying TSW is so much better, but that's only because he has access to DTG.

 

He's also stated he's built for the other sims (the ones with freely available dev tools so you don't HAVE to work direct with the companies themselves) and TSW is still the better sim

 

But that's my point. TSW has no freely available dev tools, so judged based on that it's at the bottom. But as he works with DTG - and doesn't work with the devs of other sims - he has a lot more power. But my point is he would have more power compared to the free dev tools if he worked with the devs of other sims as well, so it isn't a fair comparison.

 

You totally missed my point in the comparison. I compared the actual state of the simulators and what they can do actually without getting any core-dev involved. I personally have not really any impact on what TSW can do and what not. I have to use it as it is. And even if the tools were freely available and i would not have access to a dev there, TSW would be the number one for me in what it can actually do in its current state.

 

That's your opinion and that's fine. Personally I don't see public tools giving a higher percentage of good development

I take it you mean he has more power than the people who would work with public tools. Given he's a professional developer he would likely have "more power" anyway as he would have more knowledge than most

Of course it is.
He devs for the various sims so can compare between them
He has more knowledge than most people so is better placed to compare
And he would produce better output than most people even if they had the access, purely because he does it professionally (and is acknowledged as one of the best content creators in both TS1 and TSW)

 

Yes, that is clear.
But as to my comment, was in the case you got stuck due to problem with the sim, in order to have an alternative an complete the drive.
This weekend, I have some situations were I got stacked by red lights. I waited more than 15 minutes and nothing changed!.
Which is frustrating!
Then make some switch, could solve the situation, providing the chance you can solve the issue, being creative also.
Of course it is just an idea.

 

Except you don't know what Zusi can do without getting core devs involved, because you don't have that level of access.

A direct contradiction within two sentences. Very impressive.

What does the percentage have to do with anything? What do public tools take away from you?

What on earth is the point you are trying to make with this?

This is a false equivalency. With one sim he devs using the limited public tools. With the other he devs using the private internal tools, while being in contact with the devs themselves. Of course the latter is going to give him more power.

What the hell does the quality of his output have to do with anything?

 

Hmm, besides your nit-picky commenting on all we say: what do you really want to say?

 

That your comparison between a game where you only have access to the limited public tools and one where you have access to the private internal tools is not a fair one.

 

That simply shows me, that you did already not understood what i wanted to tell. Anyways...

 

In the other games you mention the public tools can produce exactly the same as the dev tools (especially in TSC), so I think the one missing points here isn't me

 

[removed by Protagonist - argumentative]

 

From this...?