Dynamic Events Suggestions List

Discussion in 'PC Discussion' started by londonmidland, Dec 8, 2020.

  1. londonmidland

    londonmidland Well-Known Member

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    I've always found service mode to feel a bit 'repetitive' and 'bland', mainly due to the fact that each service is EXACTLY the same as the last one, due to there being no dynamic events available.

    I strongly believe dynamic events will make service mode feel a lot more alive, interesting as well as more realistic. Quite ironically as everything is always on-time to the second, it makes it somewhat feel unrealistic, as no train always arrives and departs on time to the exact second in real life.

    Below, I will list a suggestions list of possible dynamic events to take place within TSW, to make it feel more varied and realistic:
    - A broken down train
    - A derailment
    - Signalling issues
    - A fallen tree
    - Obstruction(s) on the line caused by (reason)
    - A landslip
    - A points failure
    - Trespassers
    - Vandalism
    - Adverse weather conditions
    - Animals on the line
    - Emergency engineering works
    - Emergency services dealing with an incident
    - Overhead wire issues
    - Electrical supply issues

    Of course some of these aren't possible to re-create, however a message could pop-up mid-way or at the start of our journey, informing us of these issues. Causing the player train to be late, or terminate short of its destination. Making it feel like the issue has occurred down the line, without us having to actually see it.

    Things like adverse weather, a landslide and an obstruction on the line, could be linked to the weather conditions you chose beforehand. Which could trigger one of these dynamic events at a variable chance of happening. So it'll only happen sometimes, randomly.
     
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  2. geloxo

    geloxo Well-Known Member

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    I like the idea as this is something I always wanted to see. In American Truck Simulator you have random events generated at the roadside and they are very basic, but removes the monotony of driving long distances.

    I would be happy to see at least track workers spawned randomly near boxes or trackside elements. Just a couple of guys with a van are enough or with some machinery as in the scenarios. Indeed they can include them in the routes and just make the layer visible or invisible randomly.

    A cool addition would be to include the foreman role in game, so that you needed to request permission to enter a working area controlled by a foreman, the same way you do it to override a stop signal with the dispatcher menu (TAB).

    Cheers
     
    Last edited: Dec 8, 2020
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  3. ZeenozPlays

    ZeenozPlays Well-Known Member

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    - Passengers Holding doors
    - Door Failures
     
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  4. nberneck99

    nberneck99 Well-Known Member

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    Track maintenance causing you to have to use the opposite mainline with a speed restriction, and perhaps then also stop at the opposite platform or maybe even the inside track to let passengers board. this could also cause other services to be delayed upstream due to the bottleneck.

    it would be really cool to have detectors that you have to stop and walk your train if It goes off, but I think that’s far far off in terms of feasibility.
     
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  5. tallboy7648

    tallboy7648 Well-Known Member

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    I would most like to see faulty signals and track works which would fall under emergency engineering works. Honestly if the game gave the player the OPTION to have all these random events happening, it would make the game more immersive and realistic because driving a train isn't always smooth sailing from A To B or back and fourth
     
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  6. ZeenozPlays

    ZeenozPlays Well-Known Member

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    The option to have it happen would be great. Maybe you can remove certain events you don’t like. There can be a 45% chance that one (or more) of these things will happen when you play a timetable or journey service.
     
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  7. tallboy7648

    tallboy7648 Well-Known Member

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    I agree
     
  8. LeadCatcher

    LeadCatcher Well-Known Member

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    DTG Protagonist discussed dynamic events on one of the streams not too long ago. I do not think you would have liked his evaluation of such a feature. It has been discussed in other threads and I do not think they would be a great feature. Many flight simulators have such options and usually that option is seldom enabled. I have made my thoughts known on other threads so will not repeat them here, but if they are ever included, which I highly doubt, it will a feature I would seldom if ever use.
     
  9. wxtr7

    wxtr7 Well-Known Member

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    IIRC his thoughts were something of: "having a service terminate because of random event 90 min in near the end wouldn't be a great experience. 'But what if you add an option to turn them on/off?' well then they wouldn't be random now would they"

    I think having disruptions would be a great feature, but it would have to be implemented very carefully. I will agree with having a long service terminate without completion to be not ideal. On the latter point, if each type of disruption has a probability of occurrence with an option to enable/disable, we still won't know whether a given service will have it occur, thus it still remains a 'random' event. Nothing is actually ever random anyway, there's always some algorithm behind generating it.

    Of course, disruptions would mean the dispatcher would need a complete rewrite to make it dynamic (which I already think needs to be done, but anyway...). As for things I think could be feasible, have a disruption where you have to run on the opposite line (from some random event) which, if ensured it occurs early enough, would still allow you to complete the service. But you'd at least have to slow down (or stop if an AI train is coming that way already), change tracks, etc... which adds a little to the adventure. For passenger specific runs, let AI trains run late from things mentioned in other posts. These are general things I think would add value to services that wouldn't have an effect on completing a service.
    Other things like mechanical failures, derailments, air hose separation, bad weather, etc. that alter the service where you'd terminate early or have the objective change is more a niche thing. It might be fun now and again, but not all the time.

    One thing I think would help is if we had more than 5 scenarios that come with every route (or 2-3 for loco DLC), as those have variety. The scenario planner lacks too many features to make up for all this.
     
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  10. ZeenozPlays

    ZeenozPlays Well-Known Member

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    The option to have it happen would be great. Maybe you can remove certain events you don’t like. There can be a 45% chance that one (or more) of these things will happen when you play a timetable or journey service.
     
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  11. Cramnor

    Cramnor Well-Known Member

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    I really like this idea and fully agree. However, also concerning what was said before, the events should not be of a nature that leads to an early finish of the scenario (e.g. trees on the line are not good). However, things such as delayed trains ahead, waiting at red signals or passengers blocking the doors (something along those lines) would be really enjoyable, hopefully for everyone. And having a switch for turning those events on or off is no bad idea either, they would still be random (you don't know what is going to happen, and not in every run something needs to happen :) )
     
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  12. Jamy

    Jamy Well-Known Member

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    AT the end of the day people wouldn't be asking for such a thing if the Scenario editor did it's job
     
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  13. davidh0501

    davidh0501 Well-Known Member

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    First you have forgotten being ejected from the train for being drunk and disorderly.
    To say nothing of being arrested for impersonating a train driver and recklessly endangering passengers lives.

    I would actually resent the devs wasting their time to create such incidents, and would definitely turn it off.
     
  14. stujoy

    stujoy Well-Known Member

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    Most of the events listed in the OP are things that would just end a service early. I don’t think many people would want that. Events that delay you slightly would be okay, as they would lead to some more instances of adverse signals and AI trains wouldn’t pass at the exact same time on every run. Enabling such short delays would probably only be possible in very sparse timetables so that they don’t end up causing the route to stop working. The dispatcher isn’t able to handle complicated things happening out of order, or more tricky situations, like when a train gets stuck somewhere.

    TSW is based on a full timetable of services and without a human dispatcher to sort out disruptions the only real possibility for this at the moment is for a random text popping up occasionally saying something like ‘fallen tree at such and such a place, service terminates at next stop’, as suggested. That would be as unfulfilling as everything running like clockwork. It doesn’t add realism, it just takes away part of your gameplay.

    If DTG could add a system where timings can be flexible to slightly alter the experience on repeat services without the potential for the kind of head to head issues we already see on the single line sections of the S-Bahn lines on SKA, or similar, then I’d be all for it. As it is, those head to head situations, which would never occur in real life, need Adam to go through every service to ensure fixing the issues experienced, which are likely only caused by the timings being slightly wrong, don’t cause any others. Random timings added on purpose to improve realism would probably cause the same snarl ups unless they were all testable. So, I don’t think they will ever happen.
     
    Last edited: Dec 8, 2020
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  15. hightower

    hightower Guest

    Again, if we had dynamic real world weather then that would add a level of realism and variety that doesn’t currently exist.

    I agree also that random events happening ALL the time would be no good, because it needs to be realistic.

    However, randomly late running trains would be a nice addition. Additionally DTG could add, on a monthly basis, engineering works on routes closing certain lines or platforms etc. (with the necessary graphical changes). They could even mimic previous month real world works with temporary speed limits etc. That sort of variable extra would be really nice to see, something to mix things up a bit.

    My fear, though, is that this sort of thing would be impossible to implement easily as the dispatcher doesn’t appear to be in any way dynamic, with even stops at signals being scripted. By that, say they closed the up fast on GWE and added some workmen & machines, would the dispatcher be able to simply route all traffic on other lines, or would every single service need to be altered by a human to make it happen? The robustness of the dispatcher is absolutely key to adding variable elements and based on the evidence thus far, it’s just not capable of it. As always, I would dearly love to be proved wrong.
     
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  16. davidh0501

    davidh0501 Well-Known Member

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    Train driving is a job and jobs are basically repetitive.
    If your job becomes boring, change it.
     
  17. ZeenozPlays

    ZeenozPlays Well-Known Member

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    IRL, it’s not boring most of the time. Lots of things happen all the time to keep you on your toes. Passengers are always trying their best to annoy you.
     
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  18. davidh0501

    davidh0501 Well-Known Member

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    Hah Lower the blinds!
     
  19. Mr JMB

    Mr JMB Well-Known Member

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    I can't imagine sitting at a red signal for five hours waiting while someone clears the line ahead being very thrilling tbh. I agree with Sam's comments about "random events" it is better to cover these in particular scenarios, where you can choose what happens and deal with the consequences in a pro-active manner e.g. towing a failed train away from a station.
     
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  20. tallboy7648

    tallboy7648 Well-Known Member

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    But what would be the problem to give the player the option to have something unexpected occur. If the player doesn't like it, they can turn it off. It doesn't have to be extreme but I wouldn't see the harm of giving the player the option to have that happen in the timetable
     
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  21. tallboy7648

    tallboy7648 Well-Known Member

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    The dispatcher would need some serious upgrades to add these features because the dispatcher seems very scripted. When I do a bakerloo line service, when I get close to Elephant and Castle, there can be a free platform in the station yet im stuck at a red light because the dispatcher is putting me in a platform where a train is sitting instead of putting me in the free platform which I don't think is realistic and just makes it scripted and not dynamic
     
  22. LeadCatcher

    LeadCatcher Well-Known Member

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    If you have to turn it on, then it really isn’t random is it? It becomes which of the “problems” will I face this time from a list of things that could go wrong.

    Just like when I took my ship and crews through refresher training, you knew at some point you were either going to have to go to General Quarters, Fire, man overboard or some other drill so it was a very artificial environment to evaluate the readiness of the crew. Or going through a check ride for your pilots license... you know the evaluator is going to close the throttle on you at some point.....

    I am all for creating scenarios where things go wrong like you have in TS20xx, but not a fan in timetable mode
     
  23. Mr JMB

    Mr JMB Well-Known Member

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    If you turned random events on and nothing happened in a run you would think it wasn't working because you were expecting something to go wrong, but that is what random is.

    If it was programmed so that these things happened very, very occasionally - if ever - and you got an achievement for experiencing it then that might be interesting.

    Once you are expecting something to go wrong though...well you might as well load a scenario that deals exactly with that issue.
     
  24. heyitspopcorn

    heyitspopcorn Well-Known Member

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    I know this was what Sam said in a stream, so I'm not directing it at you, but... this is a bit of a bifurcation fallacy, is it not? Implying that the options are either a random event must occur, or a random event must not occur. That's not really what anyone in this thread is asking for. The whole idea of a random dynamic event is that it is, well... random. So even with dynamic/random events turned on, much of the time, perhaps most of the time, no random event will occur.
     
    Last edited: Dec 8, 2020
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  25. OldVern

    OldVern Well-Known Member

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    I certainly support random delays, maybe signal failures or something similar or on GWE getting a "weave" onto the relief lines due to a problem on the mains. This would probably not devastate the reduced timetable running on most of the routes, compared to what happens in real life where you have to take an axe to the train service to avoid racking up 1000's of delay minutes.

    Certainly you can already do this to some extent on NTP where the DMU services turn round to form another back working, without going to the route's invisible staging area.

    Track gangs appearing randomly is a good one. Mucho bonus points for spotting them and sounding the horn. 500 points off if you fail to do so.
     
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  26. LeadCatcher

    LeadCatcher Well-Known Member

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    Not just going on what Sam said in the stream, but my own experiences with flight simulations over the last 30 years as well as my real life experiences in providing training and evaluations for military units. FSX had the option for random events to happen during flights and I know that I and several others that I corresponded with over flights never engaged that option for the reasons listed.

    But go ahead and suggest it, I doubt it will ever be implemented and if they do surprise us and implement it, I will always have the option to ignore it as I have in the flight sims. I just see it as a very low priority of all the other things people are asking for in these forums.
     
  27. ghall59

    ghall59 Active Member

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    I think it would be too hard to introduce, the poor dispatcher has problems as it is. If it were to be introduced I think a slider with percentage chance of something happening may be the go.

    I would just like things like track workers & machinery spawning in random places (not on the running roads of course), I think that would add to immersion.
     
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  28. tallboy7648

    tallboy7648 Well-Known Member

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    But things don't always go smooth sailing in a timetable service in real life so it would add some immersion if a passenger held the door or a door gets stuck and add some realism. It doesn't have to happen all the time as well if you had it turn on
     
    Last edited: Dec 9, 2020
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  29. heyitspopcorn

    heyitspopcorn Well-Known Member

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    They may very well never implement such a thing. For all we know, one or more of the licensors in the game, or potential future licensors, could even refuse to let DTG represent anything other than a perfectly smooth, flawless running of the timetable.

    There already is a little bit of randomness in the German DLC, actually, as a DB BR 143 may sometimes be substituted in for a 146 or 185. The slower acceleration does change the timetable a little bit; freight that would ordinarily have to wait for the line to clear after a 146 passes, may be able to go first. Or, alternatively, a service may be behind a 143 and encounter more caution signals

    I don't think there should be anything that causes a service to be interrupted or ended prematurely. Delays to the line (particularly during adverse weather--AI services at present do not have the same adhesion issues as player-driven trains), temporary line speed restrictions, maintenance-of-way, or track switches to bypass delayed/broken-down consists, however, could be interesting. Assuming the dispatcher can, or is upgraded, to handle such maneuvers.

    The best suitable alternatives would be to either a) include more scenarios that cover more interesting and adverse events instead of predominantly being full or partial runs, or b) improve the functionality of the scenario planner and incorporate community sharing so that likeminded individuals could work together to create fully-featured scenarios, perhaps even with radio voiceovers, and share them in a Steam Workshop-like environment where others can download them.
     
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  30. LeadCatcher

    LeadCatcher Well-Known Member

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    We are in full agreement, the best way is to have scenarios with such things as rescuing failed units, having to take alternate pathing to avoid failed units etc. As you point out, a more robust scenario planner would be needed, but such scenarios work well in TS20xx to add a bit of spice to driving trains..
     
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  31. flyingpaul

    flyingpaul Member

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    I agree with almost your complete post, but in my opinion the alternatives aren't really great alternatives (I mean, maybe they are the best thing we can hope for in the future), but for me the problem with scenarios is, we know exactly that something won't go smooth and that there will be some kind of problems on the ride. So this means, like Sam said, that it won't be random but we know that something will happen. For me it is very different to have some random events, like little delays (things you described perfectly) in the timetable mode or that we have a scenario where something will go wrong.
    In FSX and other flight simulators I had the option for random failures always on "on". Did something happen? No, never, but it could have happened. And that's the fun part, it can have happen at any point, but I don't know if and when it will happen.
     
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  32. montes_1234

    montes_1234 Well-Known Member

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    It will make TSW more live.
     
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  33. tallboy7648

    tallboy7648 Well-Known Member

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    I agree with you. If you put these things in the scenarios, you will expect something to go wrong because it's scripted in that scenario. It wouldn't be an unexpected failure. In flight sim you can have random failures on but you wouldn't know when a failure was gonna happen. Heck, they may not happen at all. That's what tsw2 needs in it's timetable service. Something unexpected to happen when doing a timetable service such as a delayed train stuck, maybe doors randomly getting stuck out of nowhere and they don't have to happen all the time or at all if the option was there. It's simply not realistic for train drivers to drive from A to B all the time without something unexpected to happen. It would make the game more dynamic and make it more fun as well.
     
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  34. ZeenozPlays

    ZeenozPlays Well-Known Member

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    I think the ones that end services, should stick to scenarios. (Tree falls over, landslip, etc.), the other ones, such as; Passengers Holding Doors, Track Work, and Faulty Signals can be used on services.
     
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  35. LeadCatcher

    LeadCatcher Well-Known Member

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    I can hear the complaints when one loses points because of a random event causing the player to get a silver instead of gold ...

    . “ DTG should have adjusted the schedule because of the random events so I could still get my Gold!! :)

    You all know that will happen.... :)
     
  36. montes_1234

    montes_1234 Well-Known Member

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    Medals should be made much harder to achieve. Dynamic events would just add to that.
     
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  37. tallboy7648

    tallboy7648 Well-Known Member

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    Well if they don't want that to happen, they can turn it off. Besides it's very easy to earn a gold medal on a lot of the routes and there is no challenge. Dynamic events would add a challenge to earn a gold medal if the player had it on
     
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  38. LeadCatcher

    LeadCatcher Well-Known Member

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    Still -- you know it is going to happen ...
     
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  39. tallboy7648

    tallboy7648 Well-Known Member

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    You are correct mate. It wouldn't be suprising but the game needs to make it harder to earn gold medals because it feels so easy once you understand how things work. Dynamic events would add a challenge
     
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  40. argyle_smurf

    argyle_smurf Active Member

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    I don't think it needs to be nearly that complicated. Add a 5% chance at each station that an AI train will leave 1-10 minutes late. That will randomise the trains enough that you might get caught riding the yellows for a bit, or might not
     
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  41. geloxo

    geloxo Well-Known Member

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    Random failures do not need to be apocalyptic disasters preventing you to terminate the service. I played today one scenario with class 377 that had a failure in one door. That´s a good example, relatively easy to implement and it happens many times in real commuter trains. Other case is the scenario with BR185.5 that has a pantograph failure. You can just have some of those things or failures in the train systems that allow you to use the existing features that are already there but never used. For instance a failure in the electric/dynamic brake on german trains or in the Peninsula Corridor ones could allow you to use the brake isolation feature which exists in those vehicles. Others can be related to a panto that fails and forces you to raise the other (quite common also). Others can be related to compressors or fans that don´t work in auto mode and need to be reset and forced to manual mode, train line broken or a HEP shutdown that requires a reset. I mean.. trains have a lot of systems that we usually don´t even care about in the services. Why not to use them more frequently?

    The other thing are the scenery/trackside related events. Failures in signals, broken trains, track workers, etc. It they are scenery related, like wild animals spawned near tracks or a fire then more or less that´s transparent for gameplay but if they are trackside related the problem they create is that, if not properly planned, they can impact the exisiting AI services timetables, as using a siding to bypass a broken train affects the overall traffic during the rest of the day for instance. But yes, it´s a degraded situation. If all services have problems then welcome to real life. That happens many times also. I once spent 12h in the middle of nowhere because our test train got stuck in a catenary failure in the whole area. They had to sent a rescue loco from the nearest base to pick us once the whole traffic was rescheduled and rearranged. In game you just load a new service and problem is gone.

    Cheers
     
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  42. tallboy7648

    tallboy7648 Well-Known Member

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    Yikes 12 hours. My word
     
  43. ZeenozPlays

    ZeenozPlays Well-Known Member

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    That's insane.
     
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  44. tallboy7648

    tallboy7648 Well-Known Member

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    I remember getting stranded in a train for 2 hours. But I don't know if I could survive being stranded for 12 hours
     
  45. ZeenozPlays

    ZeenozPlays Well-Known Member

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    Longest I've been stuck on the train is an hour and a half. There were major delays.
     
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  46. tallboy7648

    tallboy7648 Well-Known Member

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    Ooof
     
  47. ZeenozPlays

    ZeenozPlays Well-Known Member

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    Damn 5 Train.
     
  48. geloxo

    geloxo Well-Known Member

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    Hahahaha. Yes, that was a hard time at work. As a test train we were the last monkey on the list. The passenger services had priority over us, as you could imagine :D

    Cheers
     
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