Hello all, and welcome to this suggestion for the East Coast Mainline, and Specifically the Doncaster <-> Peterborough section - featuring the Newark - Lincoln Line! Let's get straight into it: ECML - Peterborough <-> Doncaster The East Coast Mainline section being suggested here is the 79½ mile section between Peterborough in the south, and Doncaster in the north. This section has three intermediate stops. With distances measured from Peterborough, these are: Grantham (29mi) Newark North Gate (43¾ mi) Retford (High Level) (60¼ mi) These three stations are served by London Northeastern Railway (LNER), and occasionally by Hull Trains. Let's look at them, individually. Peterborough Peterborough, the primary station for the town, is the southernmost station in this suggestion. The station sits at the top of the Thameslink network, with regular services to Horsham via Redhill, as well as Great Northern and, of course, regular LNER Services. Peterborough acts as the southern terminus for this route. EMT serve this station as well, with most branching off the ECML instantly, but the daily Liverpool - Norwich service sticks with the line until... Grantham Grantham is our second ECML Station. Located almost 30 miles from Peterborough, you'll be able to get up to decent speed along the line running between these stations. EMT serve Grantham regularly, on other lines, however you can pick up the (as mentioned above) Liverpool - Norwich service and race down the line. Most LNER services stop here, as well. Newark Northgate Newark North Gate, alongside Newark Castle, is one of two stations serving Newark-on-Trent, Nottinghamshire. Located 120 miles from London Kings Cross, as measured by the ECML, this station is served regularly by East Midlands Trains and LNER services. The station is comprised of three platforms - with P2 and P3 on an 'island', and P1 opposite them, and is a Grade II listed building. Tracks 1 and 2 are at full ECML Line speed, whilst Track 3 - and the adjacent bypass - have a lower speed limit. Immediately north of the station, Track 3 diverges towards Lincoln, before the Newark Flat Crossing takes the Nottingham - Lincoln Line across the East Coast Mainline. This is the only flat crossing remaining on the entire British Standard Gauge network. Retford Moving north and we now have Retford. Retford is split into two levels, with the High Level serving the East Coast Mainline, and the Low Level is situated on the Sheffield - Lincoln Line. Served by LNER, Hull Trains and Northern, the station also provides for passing ECML services, with two 'fast' tracks adjacent to the High Level Platforms. Doncaster Doncaster is one of the UK's most important stations. Located at the meeting point of many local lines, the Penzance-Aberdeen 'CrossCountry Route', and the East Coast Mainline - the 9 Platform station (featuring one of the few Platform 0s in the UK) is served by seven operators, equalled only by Leeds and Edinburgh Waverley. This suggestion would only see three of those - Northern, East Midlands Trains and LNER featured, but those are, minus CrossCountry, the most important ones anyway. The station is rarely skipped by LNER Services, with only a select few Edinburgh services doing so. EMT: Newark Castle - Lincoln In addition to this sparse section of the ECML, I would like to suggest the Newark Castle - Lincoln Line be included with it. Utilising the Class 158 and HST (in the 222's absence) from Midland Mainline, this would provide extra value to the MML DLC's available trains, and would enable the London - Lincoln LNER services, which offer a much different pace to the ECML Electric runs, to be represented in game. This section of the route comprises of an additional 5 stations - with some services diverging to Newark North Gate from Lincoln - and runs for 16¾ miles. A bit like what the Dartford extension is to Southeastern Highspeed. As the pictures will show, as well, the stations are what you would expect from a rural route - quite nice, small, almost cozy stations with little buildings to go along with them. Newark and Lincoln are obviously more urban than this, but nonetheless, it provides a good change of pace. The maximum speed on this section is 70/50 mph. The stations are as follows: Newark Castle Newark Flat Crossing + Junction Collingham Swinderby Hykeham (Staggered Platforms!) Lincoln Rolling Stock With this route being two different routes that are connected in one place, the trains on offer here are, naturally, quite varied. I'll go by TOC. Included London Northeastern Railway BR Class 43 'HST' The LNER HST - related closely to the GWR HST - was the backbone of ECML Diesel services prior to the introduction of the Class 800 'Azuma'. This would offer the player the Lincoln Services, as well as any London - Northern Scotland services. Class 91 + DVT 'Intercity 225' (Class 91) The Class 91-lead 'InterCity 225' units, like the HST, were the driving force of the ECML until the introduction of the Azuma units. Capable of 225kmh (140mph), these locomotives have raced up and down the ECML day in, day out, for 22 years (and counting). (Mark 4 Driving Van Trailer) East Midlands Trains Class 153 'Sprinter' The Class 153 'Sprinter' is a single-carriage railcar built from the Class 155. Designed to serve rural lines and/or boost capacity on busier lines (where there isn't room for more services, but room for longer trains), the 153 has been a servant of many operators - today only in service with ScotRail, Transport for Wales, and helping out Network Rail. This would substitute with the Class 158 on services in this proposed add-on. Layers Class 43 'HST' From: Midland Mainline TOC: East Midlands Trains Taking the role of the 1tpd London <-> Lincoln Class 222 service. Class 158 'Express Sprinter' From: Midland Mainline TOC: East Midlands Trains Substitution on all Newark <-> Lincoln Services, additional AI available around Doncaster. Class 700/0 'Desiro City' From: Class 700/0 DLC TOC: Thameslink Layers at Peterborough, on Horsham Services (see below) Class 66 Railhead Treatment Train (RHTT) From: Rail Head Treatment Train Add-on TOC: Network Rail, technically. Class 66 (Regular) From: Southeastern Highspeed TOC: English, Welsh & Scottish (EWS) For all things freight, I guess. Class 37 From: Rail Operations Group 37 DLC TOC: Rail Operations Group (ROG) Could perform some 'drag' services along the ECML. Class 323 From: Glossop Line: Manchester - Glossop & Hadfield TOC: Northern The Class 323 could appear at Doncaster as a substitute for Class 331 services between the station and Leeds. Services There are plenty of services to enjoy here, despite the lack of stations. Services with AI next to them would be, well, non-playable. Tpd - Trains per Day Tph - Trains per Hour Number of trains is each direction (eg, 1tpd = 1tpd north, 1tpd south) London North Eastern Railway LNER Service Map, Leeds - Aberdeen services edited out. London KX <-> Lincoln • 6tpd Peterborough, Grantham, Newark N Gate, Lincoln Class 43 London KX <-> York • 6tpd Peterborough, Grantham, Newark N Gate, Retford, Doncaster Class 91/DVT London KX <-> Leeds •1tph Peterborough, Doncaster Class 91/43 London KX <-> Leeds • 6tpd Grantham, Doncaster Class 91/43 London KX <-> Harrogate • 6tpd Grantham, Doncaster Class 91/43 London KX <-> Edinburgh • 1tph Peterborough, Newark N Gate, Doncaster Class 91/43 AI • London <-> Edinburgh • 6tpd Peterborough (Every 2nd Train) Class 91 London KX <-> Bradford • 2tpd Grantham, Retford (Northbound Only), Doncaster Class 91/43 London KX <-> Skipton • 1tpd Peterborough, Newark N Gate, Doncaster Class 91 London KX <-> Hull • 1tpd Peterborough (Northbound Only), Grantham, Newark N Gate, Doncaster Class 91 London KX <-> Glasgow Cent • 1tpd Peterborough, Newark N Gate, Doncaster Class 91 AI • London KX <-> Middlesbrough • 1tpd No Stops in this Section Class 43 AI • London KX <-> Sunderland • 1tpd Peterborough (Southbound Only) Class 43 AI • London KX <-> Aberdeen • 3tpd No Stops in this Section Class 43 AI • London KX <-> Stirling • 1tpd No Stops in this Section Class 43 AI • London KX <-> Inverness • 1tpd No Stops in this Section Class 43 East Midlands Trains EMR 2023 Service Map, displaying EMR (EMT in-suggestion) services (Purple), and the ECML (Grey) London St Pancras <-> Lincoln • 1tph Newark Castle, Collingham, Lincoln Class 43 (EMT, in place of Class 222) Liverpool Lime Street <-> Norwich • 1tpd Grantham, Peterborough Class 153/158 ^ The only service with EMT on the ECML. Leicester <-> Lincoln • 1tph Newark Castle, Collingham, Swinderby, Hykeham, Lincoln Class 153/158 Newark Northgate <-> Grimsby • 1tp2h Newark N Gate, Collingham (Limited), Swinderby (Limited), Hykeham (Limited), Lincoln Class 153/158 AI • Lincoln - Peterborough • 1tph Lincoln, Peterborough (DIFFERENT LINE) Class 153/158 AI • Lincoln - Doncaster • 4/5 tpd Lincoln, Doncaster (DIFFERENT LINE) Class 153/158 AI • Matlock <-> Newark Castle • 1tph Newark Castle Class 153/158 AI • Nottingham <-> Skegness • 1tph Grantham Class 153/158 Northern AI • Doncaster <-> Leeds • 1tph Doncaster Class 323 (in place of 331) Thameslink AI • Peterborough <-> Horsham •2tph Peterborough Class 700/0 In Conclusion I suggest this route because, in my opinion, the East Coast Mainline shouldn't be waiting any longer to appear in game. I've set it in a 2019 era to make as much stock as possible appear; The HST for LNER can be reworked from the GWR HST, The 158, EMT HST, 700 and such are straight up layers, So really only the Intercity 225 and Class 153 would be brand new. And it wouldn't be too bad to have the 153 as a DLC later, and just use the 158. Suggestions for the ECML tend to just look at ECML North and ECML South, but the mix between rural diesel running on the Lincoln section, and the fast-paced electrics of the ECML mean that the route can appeal to everyone. It's also in a modern era, which many people enjoy, but using more "vintage" stock, which appeals to another demographic, as most of it dates back to the British Rail era. It may be 96¼ miles with 10 stations, however I think it would, truly, be worth the effort. That's all I have to say. As always, thanks for reading this suggestion.
If I could have any route, any route in the world, added to Train Sim World, it would be exactly this suggestion. I really want the ECML in the game, but not Peterborough to London King's Cross, for me it would be too boring and predicable after a short amount of time. Having Peterborough to Doncaster allows for a much better run at the ECML, and a much more varied service pattern, having non-stop services, ones that call only at Newark Northgate, and ones that call at all stations. Also adding Newark to Lincoln to the route would enrich the gameplay so much, allowing a different ECML experience to give variety to the main line, alongside letting the Class 158 onto a new environment. I really, REALLY, hope this suggestion is seen and considered by DTG, or Skyhook, or anyone who can make this a reality. I am concerned that we will get the ECML, but only King's Cross to Peterborough, which frankly in my opinion is a waste of such an amazing opportunity. Having Doncaster to Peterborough, alongside the Lincoln branch, would be absolutely perfect. Please, Please let this route, exactly as it is suggested, become a reality!
I suggested this route last week in fact, it is a good route to consider for the TSW franchise as it offers an alternative route to the obvious ECML link between Doncaster and Peterborough
Copy an image link and then use this: (I would recommend opening an image in a new tab, and copying the link from the tab. Works more often)
might as well do it to york, it’s one station and 32 miles, or the line up to selby which is i. Train sim classic, as Newark to Lincoln is only 16 miles
The entire thing in the suggestion is over 96 miles, so it's probably at the upper limit of having a realistic chance of being made.
Mmm, I recognise this from somewhere! A great suggestion mate as I said in the other thread (I think) and also as I said it would be a nice change of pace from the usual ECML runs and what a lovely section of track it is between Newark and Lincoln, a very relaxed and chilled feel to it. To put the cherry on the cake I will also be able to take a HST down there again which would be great. One thing to note however is that during the times before Azumas on the line (October 2019) we only operated one service each way from Lincoln to Kings X and then Kings X to Lincoln so either we deal with that, let DTG use some artistic license, have the 225s and Azuma (class 800) included but this would be 3 new trains including the 153, or include the Azuma (class 800) and HST (which would narrow down the time period greatly) and leave the 225s for dlc so we get more LNER services going to Lincoln.
Personally I find it a very dull section and would take Lincoln over York everyday. I do see why it appears so appetising though!
Bring It On and I can see this happening down the road maybe adding in class 800 and 801 Services if applicable to do so
i would rather it go to york, and we get it with the leeds lines and the lines to selby rather than the lincoln lines (one giant DLC)
As I say I can see why York appeals but the section of line from Doncaster to York is actually rather dull especially in an 80x so Lincoln would add a lot more interest and variation to the DLC. Having Leeds and York down to Peterborough isn't going to happen any time soon (if at all) but would certainly be a good DLC if it were to happen.
i’m quite fond of doncaster - york, probably one of the longest stretches of 125mph running north of grantham, but yes a lincoln line is a good idea, because if we get 800s, it opens them up to flexibility and we can do the daily 5 car lincoln services which is my daily commute
there is only 7 stations between doncaster and leeds, and York - Peterborough is 6 stations (incl. Selby if it gets added is 1 extra station) so in total 15 stations, that’s less stations than dtgs new route, and we get a new larger station (leeds) with a few extra layers
15 stations, 142 Miles. Far too long for that amount of stations. I suggested what I suggested because it stands a chance of happening.
Yes the constant 125 limit is why I say it looks appealing but I can promise you south of Doncaster is more interesting. Also there are 6 daily services to/from Lincoln thesedays (though in the time this suggestion is set it was still one there a day and one back.
I would suggest that DTG are a bit loose with eras on this end and just have the 6 services, otherwise the selling point of "slow paced LNER Diesels" is pointless.
Yes I wouldn't complain about it because, as you say it would be a bit pointless just having one LNER train in the morning and one in the evening use the line.
This gets my vote big time, it would be nice to see Nottingham to Lincoln and Doncaster to Peterborough added to.
I can see Doncaster - Leeds as its own DLC, hopefully with some branches too. Would also be great to have Doncaster to Darlington or even Newcastle if we're ambitious for a proper stretch as an extension to this one.
