With announcement of the new rules yesterday does this mean in future any leaks and rumours posts are now banned. So for instance another leak like the TSW4 french news article leak happened again or another instance of JD leaking something live would we be allowed to discuss that here or is it more of a blanket ban?
Sorry I'm a bit out of the loop, but I've seen many people talking about JD leaking stuff? Could you explain this to me? Thanks
JD leaked TSW3 was it? On stream or something along those lines. Basically went to his desktop and the icons were there lmao.
So we are not allowed to discuss anything about leaks? Even if it is public knowledge by this stage? Or am I reading the rules wrong?
That what I'm wondering this post is mostly a question to dtg and people to discuss what they think the new rules mean until we get confirmation from dtg
I think we should highlight the difference between malicious breaches of confidentiality and accidental leaks caused by a momentary human malfunction. And we are all capable of the latter. Whether DTG unveil something by accident or officially then it can surely be discussed here. If you decide to post information that is embargoed on here, then it's a problem and you'll likely get banned. The consequences for DTG are pretty serious, contracts with some train operators are likely quite restrictive and in a worst case scenario where, like the LIRR leak, DTG are still in negotiation with the operator, it could lead to projects being scrapped and therefore we ultimately lose out.
Official leaks and clues will be permitted (I presume), it's just the unofficial leaks from attention seeking individuals that will be banned...
I think this sounds right from how I’m reading it. I recall an accidental (though already known) screen capture of LIRR 2 accidentally shown from the “choose your route” screen. I think that was an honest mistake but the thread about it wasn’t removed if memory serves and everyone discussed that was exciting to see (with many other comments mixed in). the internet community is basically an investigative service these days. People are really smart and know how to find stuff. In many ways, leaks help a company especially with regards to companies/product. Apple products seem to always leak before their event, intentionally or not intentionally. From a business perspective, the issue is unauthorized persons sharing proprietary information. However we all know this leak had some benefits as well as negatives, the biggest negative is that DTG works very hard to announce their own new product themselves to the fanfare deserved. However, people speculating even with evidence doesn’t seem to be shut down here. I personally wish that we could hear the releases from the company that worked hard and deserves the credit for the announcement. However, in this case, I totally understand where they are coming from, though I doubt with the added excitement the feelings are 100% negative towards the leak. Either way, I’m one who enjoys everything DTG does to produce a product that I truly enjoy, faults and all.
I read it as leaks where individuals under NDA either directly (or indirectly through a third party) release information that is still commercially confidential.
At least he's been around for a couple of years. Most "new members" that do this sort of thing join the forums the exact same day, then post immediately after.
On a livestream, JD moved his camera, which in passing caught a quick flash of his screen, which contained a TSW3 icon. Total accident. Community heads exploded and a running gag was born.
I'm not brand new user I don't really post that often unless I have some thing to say or have a concern eg this very thread. For the most part I mostly just lurk and read through discussions
And if DTG stuff members make a leak it isn't a violation of the contracts with DTG's partners. Because that stuff won't be banned in the forum.
Oh it could be, but it's easier for someone at DTG to pick up the phone and say, sorry we messed up, than it is to apparently have no control over external leaks from beta testers, besides, dropping a hint over a new version of TSW by accident is some way from showing embargoed photos and essentially announcing a licenced product early. For those in business, how mistakes happen is important.
If the violation of the contract is such serious like you described in your last post, I don't think that a simple phone call from DTG would be enough. That shows, that the difference between a leak from the stuff and from beta testers is academical only.
There is somewhere a difference between accidentaly leaking something (JD moving camera, LIRR appearing on a ambassador straem by accident), opposed to leaking images and posting them with a fake account at their forums... Mistakes are human...posting them explciitly are against the nda PS: did anyone did tell DTG Harry that there is a tradition of new community moderators o accidentaly leak anything accidentaly ? (sorry, bad joke )
On the preview stream for IOW2022 JD tabbed out into teams and accidentally had it showing on the stream - something along the lines of "Sparks are a TSW3 feature." was the message which confirmed TSW3. Sparks were on the IOW2022 line but until that point they tried to pass it off as a Rivet innovation.
If you follow the rule that if you are not sure whether to post something, then don't post it, you'll be fine.
The first rule of Fight Club… But seriously, just blank it from your mind, wait for 20th August (not that far off really) and act pleasantly (or otherwise) surprised.
I really wonder how long this is going to hold up. A leaker just needs to post outside of the forum on a public space and then just act like they discovered information somewhere on the internet. DTG needs to start paying testers instead of using volunteers is my take on it.
Wasn’t it noted some time ago they were using a professional testing company in Eastern Europe or the Far East. I suspect the “community” testing is more of a play test than a full on beta test, where you have to go through the same process over and over again trying to break it or check if the fixes have worked. Internal beta testing probably also requires some knowledge of the code base. Without going into specifics of what happened, I guess so far as community testing is concerned they just need to tighten up the selection process, basically weed out the kids (if indeed it was a kid) who just want a bit of early access then go blagging some information to their mates. Get people in with a bit of railway background and/or have been round these games for a long time, who can be trusted to keep their mouths shut. And make it clear any breach of NDA, proven beyond reasonable doubt, will have severe possibly financial consequences in a civil proceeding.
They had a recruitment drive last year for beta testers. I don't know what criteria is used but I guess anyone could appear genuine and sign an agreement.
I applied but never got anywhere. Probably because I whinge too much, but seems 40 years in the real rail industry and involvement with train simming in one form or another since 1995 wasn’t sufficient qualifications.
I'm never going to live that down, am I? And I think this is probably the crux. We'd always treat circumstances individually, but in the case of last week, things were knowingly shared that were a direct result of someone knowingly breaching NDA.
I also applied but didn't get any further. Maybe even I moan too much (which would shock some people)! I don't think I'd have time to do it now on reflection.
A bit weird why you both (Vern and theorganist) never got selected, you both come across as being balanced and sensible with a heck of a lot knowledge in simming - surely it would make the sim a much better experience with your input? Makes you wonder what they actually need in a tester?
Seems a bit odd if that's the case, play testing is basically checking out if level design guides the player as well as should, or that everything roughly functions as it should. Where as bug testing is the more nitty-gritty items you're talking about. Things like running into a corner 100 times from various speeds and angles to make sure you don't clip into the floor. Granted, not that I'd think you'd want unpaid rando's to do the latter for a second, but I would think the former would be done by the time beta testers would get a hold of it.
Well I was in two minds as it would mean essentially shutting up on the forums for the duration and maybe beyond. Not just here but Trainsim dot com to avoid even the inadvertent possibility of making a slip. Though there is a world of difference between a gaffe and deliberately revealing the nature of content and pictures of same when under NDA. And these companies are very fickle. I remember in the run up to (Kuju) Rail Simulator being released, at the time I had my website and was in the PR loop. I posted one moderately disparaging comment about the graphics and that was enough to get me kicked off the programme. No explanation, the PR material simply dried up and I can’t remember if I emailed to discuss things but if I did, that got ignored too.
I would imagine that they would stick to testers that they have some relationship with, even if they are poor quality or make gaffes Cos it's true What they say Beta the devil you know (Beta than the devil you don't)...
There are some real downsides to " crossing over " and becoming a quasi- employee, aka beta tester. One is having to give up your freedom to post critical comments in this or other fora. I don't know the exact wording of the NDA they use, but you can bet your boots it's been tightened up after the recent leaks. Secondly, there would be a significant amount of time involved, though you would be compensated with free content. And thirdly, you would experience the frustration of finding perhaps significant errors and those errors being ignored by the development teams, which seems to be happening fairly often, given the number of bugs discovered by the " real " beta testers, aka forum members. Not to mention living in constant fear of accidentally revealing confidential information, and then having to explain yourself to a bunch of disbelieving lawyers. No thank you. Doesn't matter anyway because I belong to that select group of players known collectively as " the moaners ".
Right OK thanks for the response JD so as long as people aren't just blatantly sharing content that is under NDA the forums rhould stil be able to talk about future leaks.
Pretty much how I see it, TBH. Despite what I said, I think it just gives up too many freedoms in return for a bit of early access. Also once you commit to the programme you probably haven't got much time to play anything else. So if I fancy a week or two off TSW binging TSC, Run 8, OMSI2 or just about anything else I'm pretty much unable to. And in light of recent events, there remains the possibilty of being wrongly accused and I would rather not end up in court at risk of losing my house and pension over a train game.
I know Matt actually personally contacted me in the forum DMs asking to be part of the Beta team a bit ago, though I didn't really accept the offer. (I don't consider myself mentally stable enough to handle it)
Spot on. For example. Person 1. Makes a very human but negligent error - there could be recourse for DTG to seek a remedy (from a court order to remove the leak to financial damages). It's still a breach of an NDA but Person 1 apologised, removed the offending image immediately and I therefore suspect such a dispute would be resolved without legal action. If it reached court, a judge would probably look more favourably on Person 1 than....... Person 2. Who is behind an alleged deliberate and/or malicious breach of NDA. DTG would just need to provide evidence that it was Person 2 then a judge would rule on which threshold it meets (ie Malicious/Deliberate/Poor Judgement/Unproven intent) and award damages accordingly.
Im sorry but all this talk of leaks on this forum has reached the point where I can’t read it on the go unless I’m near a WC!
This thing (the alleged TSW 5), plus what happened with the leaks (unauthorized, but some small teaser from DTG would be welcomed by many users), is making me very nervous. Even though I'm a big fan of the German railways, I'm even thinking about postponing the purchase of the next BR 101 EL+ Steuerwagen (at least until I have certain information on the future of Train Sim World). Ultimately these too early announcements (Direct Live on August 20th) are ruining my fun. In short, this situation remained in my stomach like a Gargantuan dinner.
26:38 for context, but 28:27 for the event. If this post needs to be deleted, please don't hesitate to do so.
Still my favourite thing in this vein is that time Phil Spencer had an XBox Series S on his shelf as a bookend in a bunch of streams before its announcement and nobody noticed the tease until a different leak revealed it.
Ok holy. Well, yes, mistakes are human, but something like that should never happen but yea it is funny. and thx for info ^_-
