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Game Optimizations

Discussion in 'Known Issues & Bug Reports' started by FileTrekker, Jan 30, 2018.

  1. FileTrekker

    FileTrekker Member

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    I've been investigating why Train Sim World is such a poor performing game, even on machines like mine with a high end Strix GTX 1070 graphics card and high end i7 CPU.

    Other Unreal Engine 4 games are much more performant.

    I am surprised to note that the game seems very poorly optimised? The game renders assets and scenery that the player is never going to see, and more importantly, is performing PhysX calculations on all sorts of guff completely unnecessarily.

    For example, why on Io is the game rendering the train exterior, and trying (and often failing) calculating the PhysX for break pipes, coaches and the such like, when in cab view? The game needs to despawn the entire train and leave only the cab in place, floating along happily in mid air. The player will not know the difference and you've removed a load of overhead.

    Removing unseen faces, despawning or using lower resolution / poly models in distances etc. is day 1 game development stuff so I don't need to insult your intelligence explaining that, well, you don't need to draw what isn't going to be seen....

    Are there any plans to address this?
     
  2. pschlik

    pschlik Well-Known Member

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    The real issue is SimuGraph which is a massive CPU bottleneck right now. If you were to look at the CPU, RAM, and GPU usage of very low FPS situations, you would probably find that none of them are maxed out considering a 1070 and i7. What that means is graphics are not the problem at all, as such, because UE4 is amazing at using all the GPU power you give it. When TSW is running good, you should see some really high GPU load as UE4 squeezes as many frames as it can out of the GPU. And all your talk of unrendering things not in use...UE4 does that already...so you are definitely trying to beat out the wrong thing.

    But graphics aren't everything; as SimuGraph is the interface between game files and the physics engine, it is not something that can be turned off, and it is the main source of lag because the entire game has to wait for SimuGraph to do CPU calculations before it can do anything else, which leaves the graphics card twiddling its fingers and the CPU being pretty bored with only around 50% of it in action. Ironically, much of what DTG has done to improve performance has been messing with graphics, while the real work needs to be done on SimuGraph. Notably in that it needs to be multithreaded. Trying to calculate 100s of numbers for each train car for multiple trains at once all using the same CPU core is a real drag on the rest of the game's threads. Just one thing goes slow, and everything slows down to match it...that's exactly what a bottleneck is.
     
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  3. FileTrekker

    FileTrekker Member

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    Is Simugraph worth it then?

    The bottleneck it introduces is by far in a way not worth it. I'd be much happier with the simpler vehicle physics of Train Simulator with the graphical fidelity of Train Sim World.
     
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  4. FileTrekker

    FileTrekker Member

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    Mass downvoting is great but nobody seems to explain why Simugraph is worth the utter destruction of the games' performance?

    What does it bring to the table?
     
  5. pschlik

    pschlik Well-Known Member

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    That is what SimuGraph has to offer. Real numbers, real wiring and piping, and no magic BS from nowhere, which is pretty much what TS2018 physics are. If you don’t value the ability to actually model complex stuff and the connections associated...you are out of luck, and many people around here would call you crazy. Because who on earth would want faked physics above actual realism?
     
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  6. Corvan

    Corvan Well-Known Member

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    Yep, it just needs more work done to it.
     
  7. FileTrekker

    FileTrekker Member

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    That video seems to be mostly buzz words.

    But personally, I think if you consider it more important for a brake pipe 10 wagons down the train that you can't even see or pay attention to to be moving perfectly correctly than to have a playable, enjoyable game, I think that's nuts.
     
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  8. pschlik

    pschlik Well-Known Member

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    There's a lot more than just the brake pipe though...
    With simugraph, you get...
    • working breaker switches and electronics
    • proper engine start ups
    • simulation of less visible things like temperature, electronic voltages, or even oil pressure
    • multi-mode locomotives that actually work like the real thing
    • real engine RPMs, even up to engine stalling
    • multiple unit operations
    • working EOTDs
    • proper master key simulation
    • objects that can be set to animate depending on anything that goes on
    • doors that can be opened with the push of an in-cab button
    • and anything else you can possibly imagine that hasn't been done yet...if you have an imagination
    ...and none of that requires bogus LUA scripting. If you like playing without that, then please, go to TS2018, as that has apparently everything you want to not be in a game. For people who actually give a pineapple, the difference in the way things work in TS2018 and TSW is huge. You aren't one of those people.
     
    Last edited: Feb 11, 2018
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  9. Corvan

    Corvan Well-Known Member

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    To put it another way; SimuGraph is putting actual simulation into the simulator. As I said before, it just needs work done to it to optimize it but the same could be said about half the game at this stage.

    Either way; arguing over whether it's worth it seems pointless. DTG are not going to drop it. Once they have it in a nice place the potential uses are enormous. If SimuGraph can correctly simulate a train then it could be use to simulate over vehicles instead, like a bus. Bus Sim World. ;)
     
  10. BailsBach

    BailsBach New Member

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    I don't understand how Simugraph bottlenecks so much when Simugraph is literally a script engine. It's literally just down to poor optimisation and probably lazy / rushed code due to deadlines.
     
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  11. Phunyun

    Phunyun New Member

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    It's a CPU bottlneck derived from lots of number crunching. Could DTG optimize it further? Maybe, but it's honestly hard to tell by how much they could without taking the "simulation" out of it (but then again, they do tend to lack considerably on the QA side of things).
     
  12. Kuu Lightwing

    Kuu Lightwing Active Member

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    I'm actually wondering if they bit more than they could chew with simugraph. On paper, the idea is awesome, and I really like it. But, since it's much more complex, it's also much harder to tune, and there's more points of failure (i.e. traction motors). Moreso, if the simulation does not provide the desired result, you cannot tune it directly like with a simpler model, you have to fiddle with various parameters until it works right, and doesn't break anything else.

    In short, I think it's a great idea, but at this point I have some doubts if DTG has enough resources to properly utilize it.
     
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