Hopefully Only On Gen 9 And Pc

I really hope that the new game will only be for gen 9 and pc. It’s 2023 and we really need the game to show the real potential and it can only be done without the old hardware so that’s my biggest hope for tomorrow

 

https://forums.dovetailgames.com/threads/time-to-go-for-8th-gen.71923/
Not everyone can afford gen 9 and it was say alot of time that gen 8 is not a problem

 

The problem with this thinking is that a lot of people bought XBox One X as recently as 2019, as a big upgrade from the original XBox One, only to find out a year later that their console, albeit quite capable, is now "obsolete".
Anyway, DTG already know how many players they would lose if the game was not available on gen 8 consoles.

 

But it's 2023, four years from 2019!

 

Unfortunately, gen 8 will still continue to be supported because it still makes up a significant player base of tsw. Dtg have the statistics on who plays it on what platform. Buying the newest consoles is not cheap and with everything rising in costs including buying necessities and paying rent/bills, they have to choose between essentials vs gaming. The most affordable is a series s, but that's about it. Even that seems to have problems due to low memory which is why the sehs reduced timetable was created. So unless the next gen consoles are more affordable, players would not buy it.

 

But then people shouldn't complain about bugs and how its running. Of course it cant run properly when they also have to make it run on very old hardware. Gen 9 is almost 3 years old already so people on gen 8 can play TWS3 and people on gen 9 can play the new game and use the power of gen 9 to make the game better. They can also lose a lot of players if they continue to make the game so buggy so either way they will lose players. PS5 it not that expensive and people have had 3 years to save up for one so maybe its time for people to upgrade to gen 9?

 

Why don't other games suffer from this unique console era? We all know why this time around last gen is being supported so long in to the cycle. Other games don't struggle with making their games run good on gen 9 and still keep supporting gen 8.

 

This could be slippery slope, just taking PC in isolation. What if DTG decided to code for Windows 11 only and dropped Win 10? Many of us are running olderWin 10 PC’s which cope perfectly adequately with TSW but totally fails the Win 11 compatibility test, as both my PC and laptop do.

I am planning to replace my PC in the next couple of years but would not want to be forced into it.

 

Also Win11's UI is absolute GARBAGE and not so much "not user-friendly" as "actively user-hostile". The usual Windows rule applies of always skipping a generation of it. 98, XP, 7, 10, never touching ME, Vista, 8, or 11.

 

Do I understand it correctly that Windows 11 can be considered more like gen 9 and 10 as gen 8. I know you can't compare it but if gen 8 was to be dropped Win 11 would be mandatory on PC?

 

No. I think the only reason you would feel the need to upgrade to Win11 is if DTG added DirectStorage support to TSW.

 

DTG aren't going to drop support for Windows 10 until MS do. And even then it likely wouldn't be for a year or two after.
Windows 11 doesn't really offer anything that TSW would use that Windows 10 doesn't, and hardware isn't tied to operating system. So that wouldn't happen.

The main hardware requirement for Windows 11 is the TPM security module, which doesn't affect gaming performance in anyway.

 

It’s not cheap, but it’s not expensive either. Amazon were recently selling the PS5 in a sale for ~£350. You can still get one for £389. In the grand scheme of things that is not expensive (particularly if you look at it from the purchase price vs number of years use perspective) unless you are a child living at home and relying on your parents to buy one for you.

Anyway, this argument has been done to death. I strongly disagree with DTGs view on it but they have made it clear (for now). Gen 8 is here to stay, even though it is detrimental to the title overall.

 

Not another ridiculous post. I think you'll find gen 8 arent the problem. Its gen 9 causing the problems.

 

With all the evidence of a PS5 slim on the way it's smart to wait a little longer. I already have buyers remorse once I read it the PS5 slim is a real thing coming this year

 

Well, that’s wrong. It’s both Gen 8 and whichever of the Xbox consoles has stupidly low memory (what on earth were Microsoft thinking?!). It’s nothing to do with the PS5 or the other Xbox

 

Gen 8 is definitely the problem, it's just the Series S being weird in Gen 9 as well.

 

Which is fine. It doesn’t alter the fact that in a world where a tank of fuel for a car is £60-70, £350 for a console you’ll likely get 7-10 years use out of isn’t really that expensive.

Anecdotally I’d have said that when inflation is taken into account, games consoles have probably never been cheaper. You can still buy a second-hand PS5 from CEX for £350, which is definitely less than I paid for my PS4 back in 2013. You can trade a PS4 Slim against that for close to £100, more if you include games etc.

 

That’s not the same thing.

We talking about hardware capability not software. I agree with the original poster, they need to move forwards now.

Concentrating on next gen only might bring about a better product, whilst offering support for older gen titles, but DTG are not massive and don’t have the resources of say an EA or Asobo/Microsoft so it’s going to be a balancing act, even more so if they are developing for all platforms.

Alternatively you don’t bring out a new product and you concentrate on improving and refining the current one.

Bringing out tsw4 has to offer significant advantages or what’s the point? Performance is the biggie here, pop in, shadows, scenery, passengers etc.

Let’s hope it isn’t something nasty like a subscription service or what not.

 

The problem is that people also need to fill their tank and also need to eat food that has become way more expensive. The cost of living becomes higher for a lot of people so it doesn't matter for them that a PS5 is almost the same price as a bread

 

Looking at it entirely dispassionately and from a pure business point of view, I’d counter that with the point that if people are so hard up they’re having to choose between eating and buying a Gen9 games console, they’re likely not in a position to be spending £30 a go on DLC for a game near enough every month. Assuming that is the case then it comes down to revenue generation.

Even if Gen8 makes up a decent size of the player-base (let’s say 50% for arguments sake), if that sector of the player-base only contributes 20% (as an example) of the revenue return for each DLC release because of the socio-economic status of the Gen8 demographic then it makes zero sense to keep supporting the platform.

So it’s one or the other, it can’t be both. Anyway, it’s a moot point. I’m sure whatever is announced today will support Gen8 consoles.

 

Don't people decide for themselves what they are spending their money on? There are probably a lot of players who are just not old enough to decide what the family income is spend on.

When I hear you talking it almost sounds like this is an elitist game exclusively for the happy few

 

It is hardware related as Windows 11 will not install on PC’s older components such as the motherboard and CPU. Anyhow it was kind of academic but just pointing out if we are pushing to ditch older hardware, the PC user is not immune.

 

Not at all, that’s not even close to what I’m saying.

 

So, which is it? Do I have to upgrade after 3 years, or should I expect 7-10 years of use?
This was exactly my point: most people are not able to upgrade every few years, and probably expect to get 7+ years use of a brand spanking new console.

 

Gen 8 has been out for 10 years. They have had 7+ years of use.

 

I can only talk for myself. People on Gen8 consoles will generally have had 10 years out of them by now. I got my PS4 in 2013 and sold it a year or so ago.

 

I know but you sound very rigid in your thinking. Like "if you owned a gen8 you can afford a gen9 otherwise you shouldn't have had a gen8 machine in the first place" is what I read.

Peoples lives aren't static.

 

Nor is the development and advancement of technology.

 

I would call the development and advancement of technology rather static in some areas like computers and smartphones. Really not much happening on that front. Gen 9 isn't that huge of a jump compared to previous transitions

 

Gen 9 is a massive improvement over Gen 8, on memory alone.
Technological progress is far from static in computers, it's advancing same as it always has. Smartphone advancement is mostly constrained from batteries currently.
The point is Gen 8 is 10 years old at this point, how many more years must an out dated console be supported? 15? 20?

 

Yeah the TPM requirement for Windows 11 is holding it back, it's massively limited the uptake. You can skip the requirement if you install Windows 11 from scratch however, rather than upgrading an existing install.

 

See! Even someone that works day and night can't justify upgrades financially. If the big man at DTG can't afford a NASA PC I bet a lot of employees at DTG are still on gen 8 consoles (sarcasm)

 

I dont think there is a reason to jump to Win11 until games support DirectStorage or Windows 10 reaches end of support in october 2025.

 

As someone on Windows 11 currently (built new pc two months ago). No, not really lol. Nothing that Windows 11 has currently that 10 doesn't, other than better support for Direct Storage.

 

Your math only works for people who bought a Gen 8 console in the first few years of the launch.
In my previous post, I raised the possibility of someone upgrading from XBox One to XBox One X as recently as 2019. To someone like that, the One X was a sound upgrade at the time, and will not look to upgrade to XSX right now. Still gen8, but only 4 years ago.

 

There is a big difference between cant afford and chooses not to do it.

 

TPM support is a must these day. It allows for better security I think TMP support alone is worth the upgrade (this is an elitist statement made by me, I admit)

 

Then they still got 4 years out of it. You're seriously suggesting we should be keeping gen 8 support for another 5-6 years? The console manufacturers won't even be supporting them at that point.

Someone could buy a Gen 8 Console today, still doesn't mean they are entitled to new games being released for another 7+ years.
The consoles are ancient, they can't be supported forever. It's happened with every console generation. People on the Playstation 2 eventually had to accept that there wouldn't be new games. So did people on an Xbox 360. Technology moves forward, that's the reality of it.

 

An elitist statement would correctly spell TPM (Trusted Platform Module).

 

I'm not suggesting anything. The support will be dictated by the numbers, and I don't have access to the numbers.
Microsoft/Sony and DTG know how many players are still on Gen8 vs Gen9, and they will decide when Gen8 should no longer be supported.

 

No-one seems to have grasps a major issue with this post. We don’t actually know until this afternoon whether there will be a new game or whether Dovetail Direct is merely an update to TSW3 (as per previous ‘odd’ years.

 

Well I'm not used to referring to it as as TPM as I'm used to calling it the Secure Enclave on my platform. I don't think there are any Macs even sold without a Secure Enclave these days

 

We're like 99% sure TSW4 is being announced this afternoon based on leaks.

 

Well Stray struggled a bit but only in the denser areas like The Slums and Midtown.

Generally transport related games - even Snowrunner - run very well and Mrs V. has basically stated it gets replaced when it goes wrong...

 

I mean, if you consider losing all your easy right click access, ugly fat bars of nameless icons at the top of every explorer window, longer travel distance between "start" and your programs, and the baffling decision not to place useful functionality at the corners of the screen where they can be accessed without looking directly at it "cool features"...


Win11 made a lot more sense to me once I learned how they focus grouped the UI in isolation, with zero consideration given to UX.

 

First thing I did with Windows 11 was to turn off all the ‘Windows Experience’ features that insisted on giving me personalised news that I neither asked for or wanted. Second thing was to install Start 11 to make it behave like Windows 10. Quite happy with it now!

 

One of the #1 requests for tech support I get from friends is installing older versions of Windows for them when they get a Win11 machine.

It used to be Win7, which got harder and harder to do as more modern CPU/Mobo combos came out which didn't have dedicated USB2 ports for hooking up the install stick (Adding USB3 support to the Win7 installer is an absolute faff, I keep a PS/2 keyboard around for some of those installs, as if you're lucky they have one USB2 port and one PS/2 one, if not you have to make a custom AFK installer)

Nowadays I've convinced most of them to go with a custom Win10 installation with Classic Shell so they have the Win7 start menu and explorer windows. Makes my life easier and means they can play DX12 games, without losing functionality and usability in their operating system.

I've been playing around with potential options for Win11 but it's really just not there yet. Even with the likes of OpenShell, it's still an absolute mess, as touchscreen interfaces still default to the Win11 start menu (A nightmare on Windows handhelds like the Ayaneo 2), and loads of the Explorer functionality is just gone and customising it is much more locked down.