London Commuter: Very Poor Performance

Discussion in 'PC Discussion' started by matthew.lee.02, Oct 7, 2021.

  1. matthew.lee.02

    matthew.lee.02 New Member

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    Starting at London Victoria, the framerate dips below 30 fps. running along the route, the experience is quite stuttery and the framerate floats between 20-50 fps. I am able to get a smooth 60+ fps on all other routes. Is anyone else experiencing this kind of performance?

    *This issue exists both before and after the 13 GB update
    **I have tested with and without mods. No difference.

    Intel Core i7-11800H
    Nvidia RTX 3070 Laptop
    32GB RAM
    Game installed on SSD
    Windows 10
     
    Last edited: Oct 7, 2021
  2. Cameron's Gaming

    Cameron's Gaming Well-Known Member

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    I had mine floating around 30 but with massive lag spikes lasting in some cases up to 10-15 seconds starting from Vic. Started from Brighton on a peak run and had 60 until about three bridges, where it dropped to around 45, then 30-40 until just outside victoria when it became a slideshow (in fact, I exited that run 15 minutes ago and it just crashed in the loading screen going back to the menu which is fun).
     
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  3. thatsn0moon

    thatsn0moon Member

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    I'm seeing the same.

    FPS locked at 62 on most routes with dipping to the mid to high 50s in dense areas. On London Commuter however I get sustained dips into the 20s for several seconds, usually around the more densely populated areas such as the approach to Victoria. Its also quite bad as soon as I can see the Battersea Power Station, particularly so when the red lights are illuminated.

    I also get particularly bad stutters where the FPS is happy at 62 (eg in the less busy parts of the route) but then dips to 40-50 for about 1-2 seconds causing an awful stutter.

    To an extent I think we can expect worse performance on this route, particularly the busier areas, however any optimisation would be appreciated.

    My specs:
    i7 8086K
    Nvidia RTX 2070
    32GB RAM
    Game installed on NVMe SSD
    Windows 10
     
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  4. Cameron's Gaming

    Cameron's Gaming Well-Known Member

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    Ironically I found Dresden worse, as it ran at a constant 20 in Dresden itself, and outside last time I ran it (before the meissen update) when I was away from Dresden itself, I got around 40-50 with constant drops for seemingly no reason at times.
     
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  5. matthew.lee.02

    matthew.lee.02 New Member

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    The performance issues are quite disappointing. I was really looking forward to this route.
     
  6. OldVern

    OldVern Well-Known Member

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    I haven't checked frame rate but there are some horrible stutters and sound drop outs, even once clear of the London suburbs. More noticeable at speed in the 387, the external track/train sound keeps cutting out every 10 - 15 seconds.
    I7 4770 @3.5Ghz, 24Gb RAM and a GTX 1650 GPU.
     
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  7. Cameron's Gaming

    Cameron's Gaming Well-Known Member

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    Though with somewhere in the region of 4000 services and 7 different types of train, I do think it was somewhat expected.

    In fact, for all I am complaining of the frame rate up there, it runs better than I expected it to on my end.
     
  8. dhekelian

    dhekelian Well-Known Member

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    There has been a big patch dropped on steam, anyone know what this for? Fix for BML?
     
  9. Cameron's Gaming

    Cameron's Gaming Well-Known Member

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    It's probably this:
     
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  10. Jinoss17

    Jinoss17 Well-Known Member

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    Every RH route has performance issues in terms of stutters. Every time something is loaded FPS drop significantly more than older routes. Even in open countryside.
     
  11. OldVern

    OldVern Well-Known Member

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    I don't mind a lower frame rate so long as it is constant. What ruins the immersion is the stuttering accompanied by the sound going out. I just had a quick run from Gatwick to Redhill in a 166 and same thing occurred, so not traction specific either. As I said above, it's really a core issue that needs to be addressed.

    A couple of other notes (and BTW I am quite enjoying the route)…
    Still no audible reverb effect going through tunnels or under tight bridges.
    The timings seem rather slack, I arrived Brighton about 6 minutes early on my run from Victoria and am currently approaching Redhill roughly 4' early with the Turbo.
    And someone needs to tell that pilot to land his plane at Gatwick. The passengers can only take so many missed approaches... :)
     
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  12. Cameron's Gaming

    Cameron's Gaming Well-Known Member

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    I think this is because gaps have been left to be filled by a potential Class 700 DLC.
     
  13. Callum B.

    Callum B. Well-Known Member

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    I agree. Given the amount of services, I was expecting to only get around 20FPS in London Victoria, so I was pleasantly surprised when I was in the 40s.

    Cheers
     
  14. jmhdc812

    jmhdc812 Member

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    I noticed this on my first playthrough as well. This is after my typical pattern after an update, which is generally, update complete-click play. After re-booting my system, which is typically my second step to just let things clean up and settle in, I did another run and the issue seems to have disappeared. Keeping my fingers crossed.
     
  15. Callum B.

    Callum B. Well-Known Member

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    I noticed that I only get severe, lasting stuttering and poor framerates when my VRAM has maxed out and my GPU has begun to page information in the shared VRAM (which I believe is the primary disk drive as opposed to the onboard VRAM). Restarting the computer would completely flush the VRAM and so the game may have more headroom to cache information, hence why framerates are more consistent after a reboot.

    This same principle applies to regular system RAM as well, particularly for systems with 8GB of RAM or less.

    Cheers
     
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  16. jmhdc812

    jmhdc812 Member

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    I should probably have been more specific in that I was referring more particularly to the sound dropouts rather than the stuttering and such. With 32gb of ram, I really don't have a huge issue with stuttering and my frame rate is locked at 50FPS and stays there pretty consistently.
     
  17. Arpadiam

    Arpadiam Member

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    having bad performance

    the issue lays on the amount of active service it bottleneck the engine and the CPU, UE4 is not meant to have so many Active AI running and will drag down the performance and will bottleneck the cpu

    i think the solution is to tone down the amount of active services running or give us an option to set the amount of active AI trains so we can adjust to our PC's

    was looking forward to this route and cant play it since its runs pretty poorly even on DX12
     
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  18. meridian#2659

    meridian#2659 Well-Known Member

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    On my 11 year old pc its running with no stuttering, just a bit of lower framerates when there are 6 trains driving to the same time.

    Ram upgraded from 8gb to 64gb & graphics also upgraded.

    There will be other routes with stations like london victoria in future where a giant amount of service layers terminate or going through. Im not assuming dtg goes back to empty main railway stations like in older routes, so to improve performance for high frequent routes is definetly well spent time.
     
  19. davejc64

    davejc64 Well-Known Member

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    No noticeable problems for me, actually I was just thinking how smooth it seemed to be running.
     
  20. davidh0501

    davidh0501 Well-Known Member

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    I don't mind the lower frame rates, as I'm not shooting back at anyone, but stutters can be annoying.
    Fortunately they don't last long, and disappear after Clapham.
    (That's Claam to our foreign friends...)
     
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  21. MisterV

    MisterV Member

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    Been running mostly fine for me, get a few hitches when I assume It's loading in tiles but nothing worse than any other route and better than Risa-Dresden.
     
  22. LeadCatcher

    LeadCatcher Well-Known Member

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    People wanted realistic levels of traffic and immersive levels of details, then complain that performance has been affected…. really?? Just love the irony of these forums.

    Yes I am having FPS around the mid 20s around Victoria on the few runs I have had time to complete, but once past that, the route runs smoothly and by gosh how I have enjoyed the amount of AI and the hustle and bustle at the stations… great job on that aspect.
     
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  23. OldVern

    OldVern Well-Known Member

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    As I said earlier, it’s not low FPS per se, I could work with 25 to 30 if constant and smooth. It’s the jerkiness, stuttering and associated sound drop outs which completely kill the experience and show the UE4 engine as adapted by DTG may be struggling with the task.
     
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  24. Jinoss17

    Jinoss17 Well-Known Member

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    That's exacly the issue: Stutters. It's an issue since the very first release of TSW2 and it seems to be worse since RH.
     
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  25. 5cip

    5cip Member

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    maybe it helps
    i post my launch options:

    -dx12 -USEALLAVAILABLECORES -malloc=system -refresh 60 -maxMem=13000 -NOTEXTURESTREAMING

    and engine.ini:

    [SystemSettings]
    r.ViewDistanceScale=4.0
    foliage.LODDistanceScale=3
    r.BloomQuality=3
    r.TonemapperGamma=2
    r.SkylightIntensityMultiplier=0.5
    r.EyeAdaptationQuality=1
    r.ToneMapper.Sharpen=0
    r.Streaming.FullyLoadUsedTextures=1
    r.Streaming.HLODStrategy=2
    r.DefaultFeature.AutoExposure=1
    r.DefaultFeature.AutoExposure.Method=1
    r.DefaultFeature.AutoExposure.ExtendDefaultLuminanceRange=0
    r.TextureStreaming=0
    r.LightMaxDrawDistanceScale=50.0
    r.MotionBlur.Scale=2.0
    r.MinScreenRadiusForLights=0.00
    ts2.CameraMotionSway.EnableUprightCompensation=0
    ts2.CameraMotionSway.KSitting.Y=200.0
    ts2.CameraMotionSway.KSitting.Z=200.0
    ts2.CameraMotionSway.LSitting.Y=40
    ts2.CameraMotionSway.LSitting.Z=5.0
    ts2.CameraMotionSway.SittingPivotOffset=-200
    ts2.CameraMotionSway.LSitting.X=50
    ts2.save.CheckpointsEnabled=0
    r.Shadow.RadiusThreshold=0
    r.SkeletalMeshLODBias=0
    r.AmbientOcclusion.Method=1
    r.GTAO.FalloffEnd=300
    r.GTAO.SpatialFilter=0
    r.GTAO.NumAngles=2
    r.GTAO.UseNormals=1
    r.GTAO.ThicknessBlend=0
    r.Shadow.DistanceScale=1
    r.Shadow.TransitionScale=1
    r.Shadow.CSM.TransitionScale=1


    the light version is:

    [SystemSettings]
    foliage.LODDistanceScale=3
    r.Shadow.DistanceScale=1
    r.Shadow.TransitionScale=1
    r.Shadow.CSM.TransitionScale=1
    r.AmbientOcclusion.Method=1
    r.GTAO.FalloffEnd=300
    r.GTAO.SpatialFilter=0
    r.GTAO.NumAngles=2
    r.GTAO.UseNormals=1
    r.GTAO.ThicknessBlend=0
     
    Last edited: Oct 8, 2021
  26. Shaun123

    Shaun123 Well-Known Member

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    I was getting 50-60FPS throughout the route (RTX2080 Super @ 4K) with drops around East Croydon and Selhurst (around 30-40 FPS) and around 40-50 around London Victoria.

    For such a busy route, I don’t have an issue at all with the lower FPS in places. It’s to be expected it’s just a shame it’s not buttery smooth.
     
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  27. Arpadiam

    Arpadiam Member

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    have the same issue, massive stuttering, laggy mouse camera movement and frequently sound cut-out ( the sound issue is know since a while, happens too with the bussy services on the M7 were your train doesnt have sound when there is more that 3 or 4 AI near you )

    [​IMG]
    This is my Framepacing, horrible, and this happens only in this route, also as you see in the pic the CPU is maxed out meaning that is being bottleneck by the ridiculousness amount of AI running

    https://i.imgur.com/QqvJMqb.png



    we have to thanks to denuvo for that, is well know that denuvo cause stuttering on games that's depends on Texture streaming and on low / mid range pc's up to 25% performance loss and increased loading times in general
     
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  28. 5cip

    5cip Member

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    i have this in my engine.ini too which deactivates mouse smoothing

    [/script/engine.engine]
    bEnableMouseSmoothing=False
     
  29. Arpadiam

    Arpadiam Member

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    is not that, i'm having cpu bottleneck and stuttering cuasing the mouse to act yanky and laggy
    it goes away after leaving the bussy area
     
  30. Jinoss17

    Jinoss17 Well-Known Member

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    I think I have an "above-average spec" computer (I7 10700K, RTX2070S, 32GB RAM etc...) but stutters are still an evident issue. Maybe it's not as bad as low-medium spec computers, but it's still quite noticeable.
     
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  31. solicitr

    solicitr Well-Known Member

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    Heresy!

    The solution is to buy a bigger computer.
     
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  32. meridian#2659

    meridian#2659 Well-Known Member

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    Holy Crap, TSW2 isnt running on my 1992 MS DOS Computer, lets SHUT down the entire TSW Project.
    No seriously:

    TimeMovesOn.jpg
     
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  33. Jinoss17

    Jinoss17 Well-Known Member

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    A powerful computer doesn't solve the stuttering issues.
     
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  34. solicitr

    solicitr Well-Known Member

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    Try putting this in your engine.ini

    [SystemSettings]

    r.TextureStreaming=0
    r.Streaming.FullyLoadUsedTextures=1
    r.Streaming.HLODStrategy=2

    Some (not all) stuttering is caused by tile load-in
     
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  35. thatsn0moon

    thatsn0moon Member

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    Unfortunately doesn't seem to help stuttering at all for me.

    Any further tips? FPS is doable its the stuttering thats the big killer.
     
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  36. solicitr

    solicitr Well-Known Member

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    Do you have an SSD or a HDD? Windows page-files like mad in RAM-heavy apps, and a HDD can't really keep pace.
     
  37. meridian#2659

    meridian#2659 Well-Known Member

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    Thats true. Highly suggest an ssd for better performance.
     
  38. thundergaming11

    thundergaming11 Well-Known Member

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    My crappy potato of a pc that has had no major issues with any DLC so far (obviously stutters but not making it impossible to play) has decided that the BML is too much for it to handle and decides it wants to take 5 minutes just loading at Victoria :D. I literally can't play any service from Victoria, yes I have all the layers. The scenarios worked fine. I think the time has come to get a new pc anyway... (I'm too lazy and incompetent to upgrade parts).
     
    Last edited: Oct 8, 2021
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  39. thatsn0moon

    thatsn0moon Member

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    It’s on a M.2 drive. A Samsung 970 Evo I believe. I have 32gb of RAM so I would have thought it would be alright.
     
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  40. solicitr

    solicitr Well-Known Member

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    Whew! RAM (physical and virtual) is definitely not your problem then.

    Have you run any diagnostics to see where the performance bottleneck is?
     
  41. Speedster

    Speedster New Member

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    Ran 1W30 Victoria - Brighton and didn't have any performance drops other than the usual stuttering that happens with all routes. PC is a 5950X, 32GB with RTX3080. Game running off a Sabrent PCIe 4.0 SSD. System memory in use is about 12GB and VRAM 7GB.

    I have all DLC for layers installed and getting 50-60 FPS at Victoria and Brighton, getting up to 90-100 when out on the route. Running at 1440p with 150% scaling.
     
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  42. davejc64

    davejc64 Well-Known Member

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    I haven't got a powerful computer yet it seems to run fine for me but then I am only relying on my eyes to tell me that and not fretting about FPS.
     
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  43. solicitr

    solicitr Well-Known Member

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    Look, guys, my Lamborghini Huracan can do 80 no problem!
     
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  44. LWDAdnane

    LWDAdnane Active Member

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    In all fairness he should be getting a whole lot more fps with that hardware. In a way yes, it's like he's doing 80 in a Huracan, but only because the road is too bumpy to go faster :)
     
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  45. Speedster

    Speedster New Member

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    Jealous scorn aside, my specs aren't too far above the OP's, so presented them for comparison. They shouldn't be getting frames as low as they are.

    Everything on High/Ultra with ini tweaks and an effective 4K resolution (1440p @ 150%), those framerates seem on par with others, but I'd really love more. :)
     
  46. davejc64

    davejc64 Well-Known Member

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    Makes me wonder why my lower spec pc seems to be coping better, like I said it runs very smoothly.
     
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  47. gary dean

    gary dean Member

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    Having the same problem as everyone else poor frame rates plus stuttering on the london to brighton rush hour route.
    It also has made the trees popping in and out problem even worse.
    All in all not a very nice stable route its a shame as it looks very nice .
    Gary
     
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  48. dhekelian

    dhekelian Well-Known Member

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    I'm sure there was a thread here somewhere explaining the stuttering doesn't necessarily rely on what hardware you have hence why some lower spec machines perform better, obviously with the higher spec machines you will get more options. I'm sure he went onto say there are many software changes that can be done. Nvidia control panel, ini tweaks and more, Wish I could remember where it was.

    I'm sure he said something about the stuttering being a frame sync problem.
     
  49. ASRGT

    ASRGT Well-Known Member

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    While not saying there are no issues, this is one of the few routes that I have had no issues with, its smooth does not struggle with constant hitching and has been overall more performant than most of the other routes defiantly more so than Dresden has been.

    And that is with all DLC and ini tweaks as shown below on an i7 9700K @ 5.0Ghz, 16GB DDR & RTX3090 @ 3840x1600. Game is installed on an NVMEe

    Code:
    r.MaxAnisotropy=16
    foliage.LODDistanceScale=7
    r.StaticMeshLODDistanceScale=0.25
    r.TextureStreaming=0
    r.CreateShadersOnLoad=1
    r.ViewDistanceScale=12
    r.LandscapeLOD0DistributionScale=3
    r.LandscapeLODDistributionScale=3
    r.HighQualityLightMaps=1
    r.LightMaxDrawDistanceScale=150
    foliage.DitheredLOD=5
    r.Streaming.Boost=0
    r.Streaming.PoolSize=0
    r.Streaming.LimitPoolSizeToVRAM=1
    r.Streaming.HLODStrategy=2
    r.Streaming.FullyLoadUsedTextures=1
    r.Shadow.DistanceScale=2.0
    Again not saying there are not issues but as a contrast the majority of comments in this thread the above system with the above tweaks are yielding over 90fps with only Clapham Junction causing noticeable lows in the 40s - 60s but I honestly don't find that unreasonable based on the sheer amount of traffic and lines been rendered in that area.
     
  50. batrasian63

    batrasian63 Member

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    I don't think we can do too much either (hopefully I'm wrong). It's just a very poorly optimized game (and buggy all over the place). FPS is not a problem, I am between 75 - 110 in 4K (locking at 30FPS solves nothing, with and without GSync)

    My rig is decent, capable of running cyberpunk, red dead redemption 2, msfs2020, etc. in ultra, raytracing, etc. without any problem or stuttering. All of them with physics (real or not) much more complex than TSW2, including the number of objects to handle (very small in TSW2) ... about the graphics, it is better not to talk ...

    However, I can't get a game with simple physics and graphics like TSW2 to run smoothly.

    I9 9900K (no overclock) , 32GB RAM, RTX 3090 (no overclock), Samsung 970 PRO 1TB (OS) NVMe + Samsung 970 PRO 512GB NVMe (TSW2) + WDC 4TB SATA (All other games)
     
    Last edited: Oct 9, 2021
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