München Augsburg Layers Suggestion

Discussion in 'TSW General Discussion' started by bobbobberdd, Feb 11, 2021.

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  1. bobbobberdd

    bobbobberdd Well-Known Member

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    How about a possibility to decide for yourself which layer we want on HMA. Example: If we want to drive RE with the 146, we go to the menu and switch from S-Bahn to additional layer. So instead of the 272 S-Bahn services, regional and freight trains spawn.That might be a good interim solution until you find a way to solve this problem (Presented by Google Translate)
     
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  2. junior hornet

    junior hornet Well-Known Member

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    I would imagine that this would be a major change to the program and may take longer than the optimisation that is currently in progress. (Yes I know it’s quarter to three in the morning but I can’t sleep).
     
    Last edited: Feb 12, 2021
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  3. joulz75

    joulz75 Active Member

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    I agree but for some reason they say it's difficult to do that (and in the meantime they say it's really easy to add or remove a layer)... But if we have to wait for many months before the optimisation (and no promises it will be ok on the last gen consoles), I'd rather have an option to add the layers I want. Let people decide what they want to play. And if for now their system doesn't allow them to run the layers, they stick to the base version waiting for the optimisation. I'm quite upset with the actual politics of dtg, they want the same product on all platforms, then why not remove the layers from the pc version if we follow the same logic (because not everyone has a powerfull machine). That's absurd !
     
    Last edited: Feb 12, 2021
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  4. pinxtonpaws

    pinxtonpaws Guest

    TSW on PC has a boat load of graphics settings to tweak for optimal performance whereas XB1 has nothing but volcanic heat spewing out of the rear vent because the default settings are maxed out to as much as the console will allow.

    The blatantly obvious thing to do would be to put a similar bunch of settings into the console version and give it a sporting chance to use the extra HMA layers (as well as turn off the horrific dusk/dawn solar flares) but I don't think anyone at DTG have thought of that.
     
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  5. Richard CZE

    Richard CZE Well-Known Member

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    I bought a DLC HMA with the promise that layers would be added. Otherwise, I wouldn't buy these DLCs. Now this railway is completely lifeless. It's a weird view of the empty Munchen hbf train station. In fact, there is very heavy traffic at this station. Also what bothers me are empty freight stations. These stations may not be there. DTG could easily remove them and replace them with a backdrop with parked wagons. It saved you console memory because you didn't have to load empty and unused stations.
     
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  6. pinxtonpaws

    pinxtonpaws Guest

    Not sure if they ever "promised" to add the extra layers but they definately said the performance issues surrounding HMA on consoles would at the very least be looked into. Only problem is, with nothing concrete mentioned since those initial comments as well as two more routes (each with their own individual sets of issues) added into the mix since HMA was released it's getting to the point that, where patches are concerned, not only is it becoming impossible to try fathom out what DTG class as priority fixes it's becoming equally as difficult to determine if something is actually going to get fixed at all.

    I don't personally have an issue with bugs and glitches providing they're not immersion breaking, but in saying that I would at the very least like still to be given a little clue as to when I'm going to be able to enjoy my investment in the way that DTG wanted me to enjoy it....especially where HMA is concerned because that route has enough immersion breaking bugs to be considered unplayable on consoles.
     
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  7. joulz75

    joulz75 Active Member

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    They said that on the route presentation of their official website. I'm sure we don't have the same definition of "very soon"... :(
     

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  8. pinxtonpaws

    pinxtonpaws Guest

    I think everyone is guilty of dodgy timeline guides at some point or other but yeah, it's still a fair point...and although it's probably an obsolete description (it's different to the one on XBox store) that was written before performance issues came to light it would still be nice to know either way - if only for a little closure.

    Edit: Ha, I've just noticed something... (D)odgy (T)imeline (G)uides. Spooky :o
     
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  9. solicitr

    solicitr Well-Known Member

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    As Sam has said time and time again, until they have progressed farther in the VERY VERY BIG JOB of optimization, they can't do the HMA layers for consoles, because the current code for all those extra trains would simply choke a console's little processor to death.
     
  10. JonnE

    JonnE Well-Known Member

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    I would it find very interesting to know what these optimization works consist of? Surely it's more than the usual route performance optimization tricks and I don't expect a fully detailed statement but some small explanations would be great... I'm just curious :)
    Are they comparable to the optimizations which were done when TSW was upgraded to TSW2020?
    And maybe it would help us a bit in understanding why this takes several months to do ;)
     
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  11. solicitr

    solicitr Well-Known Member

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    Rewriting huge chunks of core code and then debugging it? With a very small staff? Of course it takes months.
     
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  12. junior hornet

    junior hornet Well-Known Member

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    Really? I’m playing it without problems. I was given the impression that HMA was one of the best routes available (a view I tend to agree with), apart from the layers problem on consoles which would add to the experience but is hardly game breaking.

    I must say that there are some weird uses of the word unplayable on these forums.
     
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  13. solicitr

    solicitr Well-Known Member

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    Apparently some users can't play with missing fences or the wrong color ballast.
     
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  14. pinxtonpaws

    pinxtonpaws Guest

    Severe framerate drops, stuttering (of anything upto five seconds) as AI trains approach, pop-in (sometimes entire buildings). If you throw in the already poor detail and shadow draw distances, the lack of layers and near zero passengers then *depending on your level of expectation for a £25 purchase* there are more than enough immersion breaking issues in there for it to be considered as unplayable. If this were a racing game or FPS expansion then it would be a non-argument so just because it happens to be a train sim it should make no difference whatsoever.
    I'm usually a tolerant sort of person and aside from the truly shocking Micro Machines world series, HMA was the only other digital refund I'd ever requested (a request that ultimately failed so i'm kind of stuck with it) so in my eyes that speaks volumes for the overall quality this route offered - and you definately can't go down the "well, it's old hardware so you get what you get" path because it's been proven many times over that XB1/X1X is more than capable of much, much better quality than what HMA displayed.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Feb 14, 2021
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  15. pinxtonpaws

    pinxtonpaws Guest

    I don't recall one single person out and out saying that the above two points have lowered SEHS to 'cannot play' status so, sadly, I think your attempt at sarcasm has somwhat missed the mark. Besides, TSW is supposed to be a true to life (or as near as can be replicated) simulator so what's the harm in users passing comment about things which they feel have fallen short of being realistic? I think you're also forgetting that, based on user feedback, DTG changed both of the above prior to the launch of SEHS and although it perhaps still wasn't correct in the eyes of some, should you really be throwing sarcasm at these people for caring enough to want to offer suggestions that may invariably benefit every single owner of the route?
     
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  16. hypospray

    hypospray Active Member

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    I was lucky enough to grab a Xbox Series X right before christmas, so i would like to see some sort of "Next gen improvements" for the newer consoles. Be that missing layers from the PC Version, generally graphics upgrade whatever.
    However the issue for DT is, that they need to take care of those who cant affort the next Gen consoles, or just not lucky enough to grab one at all.
    They have to deal with the burden of carrying through 8 year old ancient hardware on the original xbox to keep TSW 2 playable on those dinosaurs as well.

    I had enough from this babysitting outdated console hardware to remain playability and switched for TSW 2 over to PC version.
    While the performance on TSW 2 is really good on XBOX Series X (60 FPS steady) the graphic on console look just awfull compared to PC.
     
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  17. junior hornet

    junior hornet Well-Known Member

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    I think that people are right to pull DTG up for issues that they consider that they have fallen short of, whether it is wrong colour ballast or problems with passengers, scenery or whatever else. This is the only way that they will know what is important to us and helps the decisions on what fixes to prioritise and what to concentrate on in future releases.

    It’s the use of the term “unplayable” that is banded about freely. It is not unplayable. It can be played. If people point out the problems that are causing them problems, it is likely that these problems will be addressed as has happened and is still happening with SEHS. In the case of the layers on HMA, it has been mentioned several times that DTG are working on optimisation to make this happen and it is a huge job that will take several months. Would you have preferred that release of HMA was held up until this is sorted? Personally I enjoy playing it now and will look forward to the experience being enhanced at the appropriate time (i.e. not before development and testing/QA has been fully and properly completed). However, if you feel different, the that is your prerogative.
     
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  18. bobbobberdd

    bobbobberdd Well-Known Member

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    Wouldn't it be possible to get a second timetable now. With regional train and freight train instead of S-Bahn. I mean with the Same option of a second Timetable like the one in Great Western Express.
     
  19. Richard CZE

    Richard CZE Well-Known Member

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    I DLC HMA play minimally. I certainly wouldn't buy this DLC without layers. I will have to be more careful with my next purchases. I believed that the layers would return in some months within two months. So far, I'm putting this DLC on the sidelines. They play on the PS4 pro.
     
  20. tallboy7648

    tallboy7648 Well-Known Member

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    I'm not sure if that would be popular
     
  21. L89

    L89 Well-Known Member

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    Yes, that has been said in some of the livestreams. Matt has said it was something the team were thinking about doing for consoles. There is no confirmation this is actually happening and the longterm goal should be optimisation (better to have all services running together to make it more lively).

    They could release a free add-on for consoles that gives this extra timetable with the other services (no benefit to those who don't own HMA) or try to update it into the add-on itself if possible. I hope we can play these services soon. I can't see optimisation happening for a while.
     
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  22. Richard CZE

    Richard CZE Well-Known Member

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    Why not? Services for S lines would disappear. The player could only switch traffic on the main line. It would be at least some solution than none.
     
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  23. tallboy7648

    tallboy7648 Well-Known Member

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    Fair point. I play on Xbox Series X and HMA runs like smooth butter on that so I wish dtg would just turn layers on for people who have next gen consoles because I'm sure the route would run just fine
     
  24. Richard CZE

    Richard CZE Well-Known Member

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    If they only released this modification for new consoles, it might be a licensing issue. It's a game for PS4 and xbox not for PS5 and the new XBox.
     
  25. bobbobberdd

    bobbobberdd Well-Known Member

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    Why? You don't lose anything and the developers buy some time because not everyone asks about HMA Layers anymore
     
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  26. joulz75

    joulz75 Active Member

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    Yes and it seems so easy to do this. I don't know why they persist in not allowing us to chose what we want...
     

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