More North American Freight Routes

Discussion in 'Suggestions' started by MattBarrick, Aug 14, 2020.

  1. MattBarrick

    MattBarrick Member

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    I would like to see a BNSF Needles Subdivision add on in the future or a Canadian National route!
     
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  2. rodgers.jayshawn4848

    rodgers.jayshawn4848 Active Member

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    It would be good if they add on to Sandpatch grade with a Amtrak route. Locos: Amtrak P42DC Heritage and veterans liveries. The new Chargers.
    Passenger stock: Sleeper dining cafe and coach superliners and baggage cars.
    Add on CSX: ES44AHs ET44AHs ST70AH SD70MACs ES40DCs and AC6000CWs and also y’all can do the new rebuilt AC4400CWs CM44AHs while y’all at it. Have a great day!!!
     
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  3. kennyjamesscott

    kennyjamesscott Well-Known Member

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    Please no. American freight is just boring. Itt bad enough that hey shovel tube line down our throats.

    I am willing to give some time to Sand Patch Grade thou but only because of scenery. Doubt I would like the actual gameplay on it.
     
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  4. Paulo_1997

    Paulo_1997 Active Member

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    I don't like american routes either, but since this is a game for all kinds of people and nations we have to swallow the pill, whether we like it or not.
     
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  5. docsnyder1911

    docsnyder1911 Well-Known Member

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    I would love to see the release of this routes. Like I often wrote I love that impressive northamerican mainline diesels.
     
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  6. grdaniel48

    grdaniel48 Well-Known Member

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    I respect your opinion.
    But have you tried to drive heavy freights before?
    For me heavy freights are really interesting!
    Of course it depends on the route. If it is flat and few curves, of course will be boring.
    But if the routes it have different grades, and different curve angles, so you will have constantly operating it, and pay attention to the signals, speed restrictions, horn - which on USA trains requires more use of it - and other situations, you will be really busy all the time.
    Furthermore you could do previously or at arriving some shutting with the freight cars.

    Heavy long trains are not easy to operate. You have to brake and accelerate at different times comparing to a passenger one.
    Even the weight train for each run, could be different according to the number of freight cars, and even if they are empty or fully loaded!
    The behaviour of the train will be different, for each timetables or scenery you ride on them.

    One of my favourite routes I enjoyed a lot, was BNSF Seligman route on Open Rails.
    It have all the mentioned situations. Furthermore as on Microsoft Train Simulator, you could make your own activity including all the AI trains movements, it was really challenging. Cajon Pass one also.
     
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  7. Stockton Rails

    Stockton Rails Well-Known Member

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    I would definitely like to see another US freight route added to TSW 2... any one of the busy BNSF subs out west would be great, but I guess DTG would then have to establish licensing with BNSF to make that happen (at a cost). They could also add a large UP freight route to the sim, and unlike with BNSF they already have at least some licensing established with UP. Personally, I’d vote for a new BNSF route, which would add a completely new line to the sim.

    ...link to BNSF network/subdivision maps (dated 2019):
    https://www.bnsf.com/ship-with-bnsf/maps-and-shipping-locations/pdf/bnsf-network-map.pdf
     
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  8. jedi247

    jedi247 Well-Known Member

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    BNSF is a must have for me. I really want the Seligman Sub, Cajon Pass, and Tehachapi Pass routes. SP, CP, CN, UP, D&RGW, NS, and WP are good ideas, too. I'd also love ATSF, PRR, Conrail, NYC, and B&O.
     
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  9. grdaniel48

    grdaniel48 Well-Known Member

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    BNSF licensing issue about only for US., it is also for the routes DTG already have on Train Simulator too?
    As on TSW, we could not modify or add our own trains, or even using photographs on the livery designer, may they try to convince BNSF to authorize them to use BNSF logos and download their trains. all over the world.!
    Also mention the DTG Community is really asking for this company routes, locomotives and freight cars!
     
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  10. Stockton Rails

    Stockton Rails Well-Known Member

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    ...interesting point about BNSF and licensing. I didn’t realize it, but I just saw that BNSF locos already appear in the older Train Sim 2020- so clearly DTG already has a license with BNSF for that content. Which then makes me wonder if that license would cover adding similar BNSF content to TSW 2 in the future- or at least make it more affordable to get a separate license for it.

    (DTG Protagonist- any comments on how licensing would work if BNSF routes and locos were added to TSW 2 at some point in the future? Is licensing any easier or less expensive since BNSF content already exists in Train Sim 2020?)
     
  11. Michael Newbury

    Michael Newbury Well-Known Member

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    I do not think that DTG would make a BNSF route in TSW2, considering it would only be able to be sold to US customers and no one else. If they did then it would have to be unbranded, not sure where their interests are when doing it that way..
     
  12. kennyjamesscott

    kennyjamesscott Well-Known Member

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    Shunting I like more than freight itself to be honest.
    Nothing wrong with it, freight overall is just not my thing.
    Before getting TSW I was thinking that I love it actually but now, not so much. Having said that, I'm glad that there are some freight stuff. Adds life to railroads and variety. So I do like freight in traffic and trainspotting in game because of it.
     
  13. Blacknred81

    Blacknred81 Well-Known Member

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    I say after Sand Patch, Cane Creek, and the Clinchfield, the next US route should be a higher speed route with max freight speeds appx 60-79mph, with not as many steep grades to contend with, even better if it can be paired with a commuter line or Passneger train too.

    Personally I would like to see the local freight lines included, but they would be roughly 100 miles between cities (Bakersfield to Fresno or Fresno to Stockton) so I'm ruling those out until I see a longer route Developed for TSW.

    -Tehachapi Pass could also be a good contender, with the line between Bakersfield to Mojave being under 70 track miles (But about 55 land miles) and it has the option for backdating too.
     
  14. TSWx

    TSWx Active Member

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    Totally agree. There are a lot of american freight routes (coming) and still some people want only US freight routes. So maybe a passenger route in the US with mixed up cargo. Or another country would be better towards increasing variety. (The 2nd option is my preffered option.)
     
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  15. TheShotte

    TheShotte Well-Known Member

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    My cup of tea is switching. I love yard switching and shunting. I am upset they haven't given us a proper switcher/shunter for SPG. In terms of gameplay, I have grown to like freight hauls in the new Sands Patch Grade. The new weight physics and traction mechanics make the gameplay have so much more depth. Moving a 7,000t train through SPG is now no easy challenge, and while doing the Powering America: Part 2 scenario yesterday, I have found myself (first time ever) having to use both the Auto Brake and Dynamic Brake in conjunction to keep my train at speed, Automatic Brake was just not enough. The way the trains handle now is completely different and in my opinion, actually quite awesome.
     
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  16. CC Johnson

    CC Johnson Active Member

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    I don't think I'd buy that. To me, US freight trains are slow and boring, and the drives nearly endless. Sorry. And for the people that like that, just do all the services on Sandpatch. See you next year ;)

    I'd like NEC back (a new version, as an extension to LIRR to allow changing in service mode), with lots more freight services on the tracks that were already there, and all the previously unused sidings (maybe add the Harlem (?) connection from NJ to LI), and much more switching, and only short runs.
     
    Last edited: Aug 25, 2020
  17. TheShotte

    TheShotte Well-Known Member

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    If you haven't played the Sands Patch Grade scenarios in TSW2, you're missing out. I am telling you it's a completely different experience. Like I said, my main thing is shunting/switching, but the occasional long haul isn't bad either, especially now that it's actually challenging.
     
  18. CC Johnson

    CC Johnson Active Member

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    Yeah, I'm not a "get good" guy, I'm a "have easy fun" guy. That's why I love my AFB ;)
     
  19. Dtl15

    Dtl15 New Member

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    Just to answer the question.
    >More North American Freight Routes<
    Ehm NO. Already get a total of 3 that's enough.
     
  20. Blacknred81

    Blacknred81 Well-Known Member

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    I feel like this is a misconception, mainly due to the majority of US and to an extent North American routes in both TS and TSW being based on a Mountain Grade or pass, or shortline/local freight, and not enough of the flatter higher speed lines.

    With TSW/2
    - Sand Patch Grade: Mountain
    -Peninsula Corridor: Local Freight & switching.
    -CN Oakville Subdivision: Switching
    -NEC: Local and Switching

    With TS
    -Yellowhead Pass: Mountains
    -Sherman Hill: Grade
    -Clinchfield: Mountains
    -Livonia: A flatter route, but some slow speeds in the middle.
    -Montana Hi-Line: Good example of a flat freight route
    -Granger Heartland: Higher Speed line plagued with bugs.
    -Wasatch Grade: Mountains
    -NS N-Line: Branchline
    -Raton Pass: Mountain plus some High Speed
    -Soldier Summit: Mountains
    -Peace River: Just slow
    -Canadian Mountain Passes: Mountains
    -Alaska Railroad: Mountains
    -Kingwood Branch: Branchline
    -Springfield Line: Flatter route
    -Feather River: Mountain
    -Chicago Racetrack: Flat Freight, but mostly a passenger route.
    -Stevens Pass: Mountain
    -Marias Pass: Mountain mixed with Flat plains
    -Donner Pass: Mountains
    -Cajon Pass: Grades mixed with flat running between Victorville and Barstow
     
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  21. damgreene

    damgreene New Member

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    Yea so North American freight is cool, but I'm thinking more along mixed/freight passenger services. I think it's a shame they didn't preserve NEC from the original game. That had a somewhat good mix of freight, consists building, and passenger services
     
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  22. LativaBoy

    LativaBoy Active Member

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    I'd really like to see some scenic mountain pass routes like in Canada or anywhere in the northern US, I would especially like it if it were set in the 20th century (anytime between 50s-90s)
     
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  23. CC Johnson

    CC Johnson Active Member

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    I don't think so. It's in it's nature. US freight works by building huge trains and hauling vast quantities of goods for quite large distances in one go. That's also because of the distances between cities (less so on the east coast, but everywhere else).
    And while there might be interested backdrops sometimes, the majority, I'd say, just go through forests or plains or deserts or by fields, so that's really not that interesting (for longer streches).
    Also, what it the fastest US freight line you know of? (serious question)

    Me too. I really like that one. But was also very frustratet as to how many rails and yards etc weren't used, especially in the NJ part.
    But I loved that you could do your freight thing in the dedicated track in eastern NYC, and some passenger trains went by from time to time (thought way too few for my taste).
    But I get that it had way too many technical problems to be worth the free update.
    Still hoping they bring it back as a new dlc, maybe a little longer, with the northern freight connection between NJ and east NY, so all the previously existing tracks and yards can be used, maybe some new train like the Acela, and ideally as an extension dlc to LIRR and not a seperate route, so one can change from LIRR trains to Amtrak and then to freight and back.
    Yes, I'm really obsessed with that idea. :cool:
     
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  24. Blacknred81

    Blacknred81 Well-Known Member

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    Speed wise I know its 79mph, where exactly, I think BNSF somewhere in the Southwest has a line that allows it, as the Southwest Chief has a max speed of 90 mph on Class 5 trackage on its route. (Class 5 has a max speed of 80mph for Freight and 90 for passenger trains) There may be a few other lines that allow that speed as well. I would assume most of them would either be in the desert or the midwest plains.
     
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  25. CC Johnson

    CC Johnson Active Member

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    Firstly, thank you kindly for the info. Though BNSF has been said to be problematic with licencing, so that would be very unlikely.
    And how much is that in rest-of-the-world scale? Sorry, couldn't help myself.
    It's about 127kph. That's nearly the same like in most european countries, in Germany for example the max speed for freight trains is generally 120kph.
    So one like this might be something. Especially since, like you said, all the previous routes were slow. So having a "fast" US freight route would be something different. But still, not sure if the location/backdrop/landscape would be interesting enough or rather monotonous...
     
  26. TheShotte

    TheShotte Well-Known Member

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    Hmm, funny enough no one has mentioned CN Oakville Subdivision, which is coming to TSW2 hopefully soon. It's a phenomenal route for switching and shunting (again, I wish it had proper switcher), and the mainline (IIRC) goes up to 70 Mph. Also, you can haul freight on Peninsula Corridor (albeit only aggregate), but you follow the standard track speed limit which is 80 Mph, at least that's what it is for MP15DC, I think the GP-38-2 UP has the same limit.
     
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  27. BNSF650

    BNSF650 Member

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    Yep I agree a BNSF route would be a killer for your US customers.. let’s make it happen Dovetail!!!
     
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  28. wargame99

    wargame99 New Member

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    While I don't own the route on TSW2020 I plan on acquiring it when released on TSW2. I did notice of YouTube videos there are passengers waiting on platforms to be picked up. Since its a legacy route, it is sad we are unlikely to get the appropriate passenger services.... The combo of freight and passenger would be nice to flesh out the route.
     
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  29. TheShotte

    TheShotte Well-Known Member

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    It would be sick if we could use Scenario Planner for this.
     
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  30. Blacknred81

    Blacknred81 Well-Known Member

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    So thinking about potential Freight/Passengers lines, here's what I can think off the top of my head

    -Caltrain Gilroy Extension
    Most obvious choice for one as we already have all the stock in game as part of the preserved collection, so adding the route to Gilroy wouldn't be too hard. Freightwise some UP trains still run down the coast line as well as the local branchline to Hollister. also if Dovetail pushed to both Watsonville and Salinas, it can open up the UP Watsonville yard, as well as Amtrak's Coast Starlight stop in Salinas (Appx 70 miles)

    -ACE
    Another possible route is the Altamont Corridor Express, which runs from San Jose to Stockton, and shares trackage with the Union Pacific thru Niles Canyon and Altamont Pass on former WP tracks. The full route is about 80 miles, so if it did come to TSW2 it might be shortened for route length purposes.

    -Amtrak Capitol Corridor & San Joaquins
    Another bay area possibility is the Amtrak Capitol Corridor route from Oakland to San Jose (Appx 50 miles) Which could include both UP lines south of Oakland. Oakland is also home to Amtrak's Maintenance Facility in the bay area. A Route could also explore north of Oakland which would put Amtrak's San Joaquin in play as well. Also awhile ago I suggested a Sacramento area based route as well, which would support Amtrak's Capitol Corridor trains, as well as the California Zephyr: https://forums.dovetailgames.com/threads/route-proposal-sacramento-area-davis-roseville.23340/

    Other possiblities could be Metrolink & UP, the northern part of Amtrak Surfliner with the Coast Line, as well as the Chicago Area.
     
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  31. brodeyness4

    brodeyness4 Member

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    Not enough... I hate all the british people thinking there routes are the best and that is the only thing everyone cars about
     
  32. TSWx

    TSWx Active Member

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    Why do you need ONLY freight routes so boooring. Getting mixed up with some passengers would be better, nothing against america but you are getting enough only freight lines (with cane creek spg and another one) and the more you get the more you want? I hate american people shouting for ONLY US FREIGHT ROUTES. Cmon honestly? Dtg is btw british.
     
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  33. brodeyness4

    brodeyness4 Member

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    I know DTG is british, but it is called Train Sim WORLD not Train Sim Europe...
     
  34. krustynuggets

    krustynuggets Well-Known Member

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    Even though I'm British and love the home railway stuff in TSW i still equally love the long freight drives of the US stuff, so no saying only 3 freight routes are enough is rubbish, more of everything is wanted, because you passenger loving people you get to drive trains on 99.99999% of EVERY ROUTE EVER BUILT, but for the freight loving bunch not all routes are designed for or have freight in the real world, so I'm definitely MORE FREIGHT ROUTES FROM ALL OVER THE WORLD. That's my view on this debate :cool:
     
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  35. CC Johnson

    CC Johnson Active Member

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    I don't wanna get into this discussion, but I do have an opinion :)

    I mostly like high speed passenger services like the ICE/TVG/HS1. But I occationally enjoy a service with more stops.
    Freight services are great for going a route without any stops and enjoying the environment.
    What that means is that I like more routes where all of that is possible. So doing freight only routes seems to me to be a bit of a waste of ressources as it only reaches a portion of the player base.

    For a US route this one seems to be an interesting idea: https://forums.dovetailgames.com/th...iego-or-los-angeles-goleta.24398/#post-169965
     
  36. krustynuggets

    krustynuggets Well-Known Member

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    As i said in my post more of everything is wanted that way you cover all bases, but passenger trains are found on more routes than just freight trains, but totally know what you are saying and see your solid point dude.
     
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  37. TSWx

    TSWx Active Member

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    As in Train Sim WORLD in Game. You can walk, discover, drive, etc ... Ever heard of variety like you getting 3 only US freight routes, variety = 0.
     
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  38. CC Johnson

    CC Johnson Active Member

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    Without trying to be offensive, but if Sandpatch, Oakville and Peninsular isn't enough NA freight in the short term, maybe you should stick with TS or check out Trainz.
    Many of us here find long and often slow NA freight only routes quite boring.
     
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  39. CC Johnson

    CC Johnson Active Member

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    Nice thing about german freight is that there are very few freight only routes IRL. So one can almost always have routes with mixed services.
    As for the immidiate future, RSN will be re-released soon and has freight. Furthermore, if I remember that correctly, Köln and HRR will get freight service layers with the release of other preserved routes - just can't remeber which ones.
     
  40. krustynuggets

    krustynuggets Well-Known Member

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    One thing you can definitely say about the German routes (and god i love them for it) is they always get so busy and intense with moving rail traffic, never a dull moment on them routes especially when all the preserved locomotives and workings land, literally something for absolutely everyone passenger and freight :D
     
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  41. KyleL

    KyleL Well-Known Member

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    At this time being there is 2 NA long freight routes on the roadmap. 1 of them being in the 1970s or 80s. So unless something changes I think we are fine for now. Not that I hate NA freight it takes to long
     
    Last edited: Sep 2, 2020
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  42. KyleL

    KyleL Well-Known Member

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    & thats the thing to love about German freight an ICE passing you & LZB slowing you down due to the freight in front of you. It's MSB & RRO that add services to SKA both add some freight
     
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  43. brodeyness4

    brodeyness4 Member

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    We also have 3 passenger routes... Same as the number of freight routes...
     
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  44. Anthony Pecoraro

    Anthony Pecoraro Well-Known Member

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    I'd like a mix of passenger and freight route.
     
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  45. TSWx

    TSWx Active Member

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    As in more countries > variety? Not only North american freight routes. ×You're putting it together what ya want× , I mean look at your statement. Btw it could be in any country in the world that i want to see a route passenger focus but also a little freight. But some of you only want North america freight routes, I am totally ok with that and you're getting already 3. So stop shouting for more. Youre not in US Train Freight World ...
     
  46. KyleL

    KyleL Well-Known Member

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    Oh god more arguing
     
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  47. krustynuggets

    krustynuggets Well-Known Member

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    MORE OF EVERYTHING, FREIGHT, PASSENGER IS WANTED AND DESIRED, that covers EVERYTHING AND EVERYONE so no need to argue, everyone has just won the debate :cool: :cool: :D
     
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  48. Challenger3985

    Challenger3985 Well-Known Member

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    Well at this point, I would see Protagonist locked up this thread for the Passenger vs. Freight debate that NOBODY CARES ABOUT. Not every routes in the world doesn't focus on passengers. And there's already 3 US passengers routes for you to enjoy (Minus NEC for TSW2). While SPG is the only route from the US to focus on Freight (and I'm not counting Oakville as it's from Canada). And don't forget, the other 2 routes (Cane Creek and CRR), are still in the Planning stage on the roadmap. So I'm glad there will be a balance to TSW so that way there will be a passenger route and a freight route for the US side of this game.

    Note: I know most of you are gonna say Peninsula Corridor has freight too. But it's more of a local branch service than a full-line freight. Same goes for Oakville as DTG focused more on Switching on that route, with half of the mainline included.
     
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  49. KyleL

    KyleL Well-Known Member

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    Well said
     
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  50. krustynuggets

    krustynuggets Well-Known Member

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    Dam right well said, but I'd advise buckling up, i bet the 2 camps are going to get ready to warpath on each other before the DTG overlords shut them down lol
     
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