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More Variety And Realistic Overhead Line Equipment

Discussion in 'PC Discussion' started by londonmidland, Jul 21, 2020.

  1. londonmidland

    londonmidland Well-Known Member

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    Whether this sounds niche or not, over head line equipment is done to an absolute basic level in TSW and has shown no signs of improvement.

    The way it is done for the majority of electrified routes in TSW is that it is auto placed, meaning the game will place catenary automatically. The downside to this is that it only works on lines with no complex junctions or areas. When it is used in these areas of complexity, it fails massively.

    Catenary is often placed far too far apart from each other in complex areas, meaning wires will quite literally go off track as the support for the wire to stay in tolerance to the track is simply not there. There is also still no terminating masts with tension weights, to terminate a section of wire. So wires in TSW will literally stop in mid air.

    The final issue I have is the lack of variety of overhead line equipment in TSW. Often catenary is reused from other routes, when it looks nothing like it in real life. The most recent example is the Bakerloo Line for TSW 2. The WCML goes parallel to it, and was electrified in the 1950s and 1960s. Yet DTG recycled the OLE from GWE, which visually looks and uses completely different equipment. It was first used in 2016 on the GWML.

    I’m not asking for 100% like for like reality, but I do think that visually there does need to be improvements as well as being more aware of what type of equipment you’re using when modelling electrified routes.
     
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  2. robski

    robski Member

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    It would bring a lot more detail to the game, if it gets improved it's a lot more "life" like. Not some magic wire hanging above the tracks.
    Very good idea londonmidland!
     
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  3. Dinosbacsi

    Dinosbacsi Well-Known Member

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    Yeah overhead wires are definitely something that could use a little bit more work.

    I remember in Trainz even back in 2009 you could have different catenary models and people built proper realistic overhead wire systems, with the wire zig-zagging, separated sections with the wires chaning and tensioners at the ends, etc.

    Even if not 100% detailed, but a more realistic system would really make things look a bit more interesting. But for starters if at least the catenary poles would look like in real life, that would be good enough. Like you said in the catenary on the Bakerloo line looks different from the real one. Sure it's a small detail, but for a train simulator that's pretty significant.
     
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  4. praxidike.meng

    praxidike.meng Active Member

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    Excellent point. I was hoping for a more realistic catenary on the new Koln to Aachen route, but was disappointed to see it's the same as in all German routes in TSW, which is very simple in its design.

    I find the catenary to be one of the defining symbols of rail technology and think it should be recreated as close to reality as possible. Maybe one day it will be.
     
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  5. londonmidland

    londonmidland Well-Known Member

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    Regarding the Bakerloo Line, here is the issue:

    The below picture shows what we should expect for final release. Notice the gantries they've used are recycled from GWE, and aren't even used on this section of the WCML in real life. For all you technical nerds out there, these are called MK3 headspans, which are most commonly found on the MML & ECML.

    (I don't expect this to change despite it stating work in progress)
    [​IMG]


    The below picture is what is used in real life, in the same location. Notice how different it looks visual wise. A lot more bulky and almost dominates the skyline looking into the distance.

    These are called MK1 Portals. Found along the majority of the WCML. They're very distinctive in their own way as they come in a wide range of varieties and are instantly recognisable for anyone that knows their electrification infrastructure.
    upload_2020-7-22_21-21-4.png

    Arguably overline line equipment (OLE) is an important asset and should be treated just like every other important asset on the line.
     
  6. Rob39

    Rob39 Well-Known Member

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    Does it need thicker wiring to avoid the aliasing issues?
     
  7. Northerner

    Northerner Well-Known Member

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    On the latest Bakerloo Line screenshot, which appears to have been taken further up the line, the WCML is electrified using portals and not headspans. I'm not sure whether DTG has changed this or have just used different types of OLE along the line.
    Here is the screenshot:
     

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  8. londonmidland

    londonmidland Well-Known Member

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    Unfortunately this is once again recycled from GWE. It’s a portal structure, however it is totally inappropriate if you want any type of accuracy.

    The portal above represents a modern design, and is seen and used on the approach to Paddington as well as other areas across the rail network. It’s used for upgrades on pre-existing electrification as well as on new electrified lines. So it certainly isn’t classic BR 1960s WCML infrastructure.

    Notice the WCML portals are naturally weathered, corroded and rusty. As well as featuring its classic ‘zig zag’ support design in the top posts.

    Below is a diagram of the said portal found on the WCML:

    upload_2020-7-23_0-48-24.png
     
    Last edited: Jul 23, 2020
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  9. londonmidland

    londonmidland Well-Known Member

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    If this doesn’t scream British Rail WCML 1950/1960 electrification, then I don’t know what does...

    Hence why something like OLE design may initially be something relatively minor and not important at first, however when you look deeper into it, you see how different things looked back in the day compared to how they do things now.

    This is why it’s equality as important to get these things right, as it shows off British Rail’s original designs.
    upload_2020-7-23_1-1-38.jpeg
     
  10. kylel2036

    kylel2036 Well-Known Member

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    I found this thread a bit weird but TSW2 is about accuracy & I find it a bit weird they did this
     
  11. fanta1682002

    fanta1682002 Active Member

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    very good photo
     
  12. Scorpion71

    Scorpion71 Well-Known Member

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    Very good point OP. I myself was very disappointed to see recycled OHLE from GWE used on the WCML. DTG say they want immersion, well this is NOT the way to do it, infact it's just lazy. Obviously too late to change it now for release but would be nice to see the proper OHLE in a future update?
     
  13. theorganist

    theorganist Well-Known Member

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    Interesting thread, I hadn't really thought about it before but now it has been mentioned I can easily see the difference.

    If they used joined wooden track on a modern mainline (Fife Circle I am looking at you) we would notice, so I guess it would be good if the OHLE was correct too.

    The older equipment is certainly more noticeable, maybe they don't want to draw attention to it as there will be no trains running on it!
     
  14. londonmidland

    londonmidland Well-Known Member

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    I doubt they will change it in a future update as they’ll only say ‘the WCML is there just for scenery wise, therefore details don’t matter’, or something like that. Despite the fact that it is part of the whole route, and we can see it very clearly from the trains we are driving...

    Though I will be seriously disappointed if they built an electric route and recycled the assets from GWE, yet again.
     
  15. londonmidland

    londonmidland Well-Known Member

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    I wouldn’t be surprised if they used that as an excuse, because there’s no AI trains running on it.

    I wouldn’t be bothered if it was a distant line or whatever, which had little to do with the Bakerloo Line, but this goes RIGHT BESIDE the Bakerloo Line, so the visuals are very important, as it reflects the whole route as a whole.

    Below is a picture of how much the WCML has an influence on the route;

    upload_2020-7-23_13-45-47.jpeg
     
  16. fanta1682002

    fanta1682002 Active Member

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    very like class 390
     

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