Having just looked at the new roadmap, I am super excited about the title of the dlc for GWE. Diesel Legends of the Great Western is a great title and opens up many exciting possibilities. The question now is what it will eventually include. The top three on my locomotive list are the Class 35 Hymeks, the Class 42 Warships and the Class 50 Hoovers. Then there are the DMUs, my choices being the Class 117/121 suburban, Class 123 express and Class 128 parcels units.
I would have thought it'd be a bit more interesting than simply giving us what we already have. Surely another new class will have to be included.
https://live.dovetailgames.com/live/train-sim-world/articles/article/tsw2-western-glory Nope. It's just a 101, 52 and 08 with a new timetable.
The class 101 didn't even run on gwe during that time period and it appares this is just a repaint of all these trains. It doesn't seem like it's worth $20
Without new classes, it is not worth paying for. The 08 only worked around Old Oak Common and Southall West Yard so very little to do. The 52 was heavily used until February 1977. The 101 was a rare visitor and remained so until 1992 as the Class 117/121 was the mainstay for local services on this route. Just reskinning currently available trains is not going to prove very popular. A missed opportunity if nothing new is to be included.
I agree that it would be a missed opportunity which begs the question as to why no new trains were made?
So you are saying that the information at https://en.wikipedia.org/.../British_Rail_Classes_101_and... is wrong? "From 1967, several 101 sets were transferred to serve the South West. Services from Reading to Gatwick Airport and Oxford to Paddington were common.[32] Diagrams expanded as more 101s arrived in the region with regular runs in the Bristol area. They were stabled at Reading and Plymouth, Laira depots, with the units serving until 1987"
That's just a "milk the cow operation". They just reskinned old locos from the '60s and '70s and put them on a 2015 scenery. It makes no sense to me...
I think it's probably they couldn't do a 117 and didn't want to postpone it till they could do one, or perhaps they only budgeted time for one loco and found they needed to rebuild the 52?
The article implies they were on suburban services ("it became a common sight on various services between London and Reading.", alos pointing out its services in game terminate at Reading as well as other places), whereas irl such services were given to the 117s which were much more common on the London-Reading section and until 1975 (which appears to be where the pack is based owing to the lack of HST) many of these services were based at Southall DMU Depot.
Not a DLC I'll personally be interested in, purely as I prefer more modern stock and liveries. BR Blue is before my time (Intercity Swallow is in my fond childhood memories), so that's something I'd be more likely to go for. For BR Blue fans, I can see it being of interest if it's at the right price. However, as it's been mentioned they are new models and a whole new timetable, I can't imagine it being particularly cheap. It's clearly something new DTG are trying, and the sales figures will tell how successful it is. I can't help but think that this might not be a great seller though.
I'm sad to say there are no new trains for this DLC, its only trains from Tees Valley Line and Northern Trans.. Surely this has to be free for people who already brought Tees Valley Line and Northern Trans?? if they are charging money for it then its totally wrong in my opinion, as we already own these locos
Yeah nope, nothing new. Just a cash grab. Although cash grabs are needed by small Devs like DTG so it's not bad.
In 1967, three class 101 TCL's were transferred to Reading to replace Hawksworth carriages converted to run as centre carriages with the class 117 units to strengthen them. In 1975 some class 101's were transferred to Laira, Bristol and I think maybe a couple at Canton there were no full class 101 sets based at Reading in the 1970's and therefore their appearance at Paddington would have been extremely rare, they certainly wouldn't have appeared as two car sets in blue and grey livery either! There were some sets transferred to Reading in 1987/88 ish, i.e. a decade after the last Western was withdrawn they operated in blue/grey and then NSE livery and even then were mainly used on Gatwick Airport services and wouldn't have been that frequently seen in Paddington where the class 117 reigned supreme on the local services until around 1992 when replaced by class 165's. That article is at best badly worded, it talks about class 101's being largely replaced at Laira by class 108's, that is wrong, they were supplemented by class 108's this was due to BR having withdrawn the class 118's in favour of the chocolate and cream class 142's which they then found unsuitable for the sharp curves of South Devon and Cornwall. These class 142's were transferred up to Heaton and Newton Heath and BR assembled a motley collection of class 101, 108 and 122 vehicles to replace them. Class 101's didn't appear on the Gatwick Airport services till the late 80's. This is badly worded, no sets were transferred till 1975 and as it says to the South West. In 1967, three centre cars were sent to Reading. I have the same book as Adam was showing to the camera, it shows in 1976 only four class 101 sets, which were all at Bristol. As most will testify on here, I am not generally someone who complains (maybe I should do more) but I am sorry to say that DTG have got this wrong in my opinion. They speak about providing a realistic experience, something I support, well they have missed the target with this pack I am sorry to say.
I think we really need to see it as the TSW equivilent of a scenario pack, similar to ones which have been made for TS1 to relative success, but with this you get the trains bundled with the pack and a full service mode. However, that doesn't detract from the fundamental problem - GWE in TSW looks nothing like how the GWML looked in the 70s. I think the earliest they could've gotten away with is NSE era, but then signals become an issue because it's still a very modern route.
Scenario packs I have purchased generally have the correct stock for the route and period it is representing and in the correct liveries!
Putting on my honest hat... So disappointed by the loco selection, here. I don't own the Class 52, but as for the 08 and 101...I definitely already have those. In fact, I got the 101 twice before from NTP and TVL. I think using the same loco three times is way too much. Twice, I can forgive, in case someone wants TVL rather than NTP and still likes the 101. Come to think of it, they've used the 08 three times now, right? TVL, WSR and this new pack. Again, too often. Upon hearing the name GWE: 1970s, I immediately thought we might get the original version of the HST (I think they're called Valentas, but not 100%), since we got the modern HST in GWE to begin with. Would have loved to get the 70s rendition with the authentic livery. Then you can use it on more routes, with a generic BR livery. Sadly...not what we got. No idea what other locos ran this route in the 70s, but this could've been an opportunity to introduce at least one brand new train. Then there's more incentive to get the pack. The only reason I'd ever buy the pack is to get the Class 52 without going down the WSR purchasing route. Doesn't mean this experiment can't work at all. Just means that there's been mis-steps and this should be a learning experience. I think this idea can work just fine if the locos are appropriate for the route and at least bring one new loco to the table. In this case, neither of those things happened.
Thanks for not having to make me explain to Easilyconfused why he was wrong. Maybe he didn't do enough research and got "Easily Confused". I had to throw the pun in there. I did watch the Roadmap stream and clearly they didn't do enough research on the trains that ran in that era. If they are gonna add a train that rarely ran on them hell maybe they should add the DB BR 101 to SKA even though IC services are rare on the route. This pack seems a bit of a cash grab. They added a loco that hardly ran on it in reality and they should've added the 117 or 121. Not adding a new train seemed like a missed opportunity. Not to mention that the environment of the route won't look like the 70s. I like the overall idea of having timetables in different eras but as long as the appropriate, most frequently used train is correctly added and maybe a new train is included. As well as maybe make the old era of the route feel like driving in the past. I don't see an incentive to get this pack as it's basically trains that could be used in railtour services plopped on a route that has no 70s feel whatsoever. I think dtg missed the mark on this dlc. "Authentically Recreated Routes and Locos" is clearly not in this pack
Unfortunately it has often been this way with DMU's. The class 101 is one of my favourite trains in TSW as first generation DMU's are my biggest passion. The class 101 hasn't been totally authentically represented in TSW since its release. On NTP they are all two car sets where in 1983 there would have been a mixtures of 2, 3 and 4 car sets, power trailer sets as well, but that is a minor point, although it is a shame the class 101 of TVL cannot be available in service mode.. On TVL there weren't any 3 car sets running from Heaton, in fact in 1989 the majority of services on TVL would have likely have been class 142's ex WR in chocolate and cream and the class 143's. There were not class 101 centre carriages at Heaton depot at the end of 1988. So they have got these the wrong way round. NTP should really have come with a 3 car set and a 2 car set for accuracy and TVL just a 2 car set. These might seem minor but when it is an area of interest it spoils the experience. And now this new pack which is just wrong on many levels. In model railways DMU's were an after thought until the mid to late 90's despite the fact that for over 30 years they were the backbone of local services on diesel routes on British Rail. The only sim where I have seen DMU's fairly comprehensively represented are the freeware routes for MSTS. With respect if you can see this as someone living across the other side of the Atlantic, why can't a UK company get it right. It might seem minor but if you are trying to relay a realistic experience to your customers then you need to get down to the finer details. I will say again, they would not have made these sort of errors with stock for the SEHS or ECW or this new Scottish route, they wouldn't have got the diesel loco's wrong so why put in less effort to get arguably the most important train in the route correct? I have to say I can now see why some get irritated when they perceive a lack of effort because this is what it feels like for this add-on. Maybe expecting a class 117 was too much but they could at least have got the livery and formation correct!
The Class 52 is a brand new model as well. and Yes there were some 101's that ran on the route. Nice DLC but you would have to include the class 31 for some freight services and and the Class 47 as well for both freight and passenger. Also add the TEA Tanks for freight. regards Hentis
Yep, I really worry about this kind of DLC but will withhold my opinion until I see official content (what the timetable actually is) and cost. I think they’ve missed a trick not adding either/ both 47s or finally the 31 with a rake (rather than the dead 101) Not really bothered about it being anachronistic although I can see why others will find the OLE jarring Pip
I think that DTG should postpone release until they have more realistic content to include. A reworked HST with original Valenta engines, a Class 117 3 car and either a Class 35 or 42 diesel hydraulic or Class 50. These i would gladly pay for as they would ALL be new to the game. What it seems is currently proposed is unnecessary duplication of what we already have, some of which was little used on the route during the 1970s. For this reason the current pack title is very misleading as only 1 of the included classes was a GW diesel legend, that being the Class 52 Western. Please DTG hold back this dlc until something more befitting can be offered.
Not in the 70's and if they did appear between Reading and Paddington it would have been rare, probably a failure or a special service, they were all allocated to Plymouth and Bristol. They also would have been 3 car sets in plain blue. Even when Reading had class 101 sets in the late 80's they weren't intended for the route into Paddington and would have been far outnumbered by the class 117 fleet.
Hey Iive across the Atlantic in New York City. Anyways even though I don't plan on buying the pack at all, I want dtg to do well. This "if you don't like it, don't buy it attitude" from Sam isn't 100% fair. There were people like you who were clearly passionate about this pack only to be disappointed afterwards. DTG claim they do research on things, but clearly here missed several marks on this dlc and past DMU routes as well. If Adam actually did proper research he would've known like you do that the 101s were a rare sight on the route and that the 117s regularly ran on this route during that time period. Now this pack will probably sell good to the casuals because they haven't done enough research on the trains that properly ran on this route however to the people who have done research, it may kill immersion a bit. Not to mention that the environment won't look like the 70s. Adding a reused train in the wrong color to me is pure laziness. Surely they could've added the 117s but as to why they didn't is anyone's guess. Also why is a company is based in the U.K can't get U.K content right most of the time but can get German content spot on. It's quite odd
Ha ha. When you said dtg should postpone the release of loco dlc, it made me laugh. We all know dtg won't even do that even though they missed the mark. I think what would have beem fair is Sam and Adam explain in the stream is why they added a train that hardly runs in the route in the 70s instead of adding a completely new train.
Well I don't think they recognise that it is an error, that was the impression I got yesterday on the stream! And if they do realise so in private, I suspect it will stay that way.
Well hopefully they read the feedback you gave and realize they made an error but they'll probably do all that in private instead of being honest with their customers. Yes the 101 ran on that route but it was rare and Im suprised they didn't realize that
Well I don't know, I don't think they will see getting a DMU as accurate as possible as being important, as far as many people are concerned one first generation DMU is the same as the rest which is far from the truth and the class 101 fulfils their "remit" in providing a DMU and who cares if it is correct to the route or period! Plus, I suspect I am coming across as somewhat obsessive about it now!
As I said, this dlc makes no sense at all. Is it a historical dlc? No, because the environment is still the 2015 version of this route. Is it an accurate rendition of the old BR rolling stock from the '70s? No, because there are classes not (or rarely) used on the GWR. As a GWE fan, I'd prefer to see a 2021 version, with improved stations and new rolling stock (Class 800...).
Honestly I agree. I've seen many requests for a electrified version of gwe with the 800s. It's been 4 years since we got any gwr licensed content for tsw as well. Maybe they should've just made a more modern day fully electrified rendition of gwe with the 800s and 387s instead of a incorrect rendition of it in the 70s.
DTG will definitely not get my money for...this. I'll save it for the three DLCs from TrainSim-Germany, which strives to bring us high quality content and uses all the time necessary to do so.
Definitely agree on this. DTG are certainly experimenting to see what the take up is. I don't think it will be a great success unfortunately. Had it been the route re-developed to be set in the 80s, I'd be more interested. However, that would be a lot more work and I suspect take up wouldn't be high enough to cover development costs.
To be fair, that is a loco used in almost every corner in the UK, it does make sense for anything from the last 2 decades in the UK to include it in some capacity or another
That one, too, yes. I have even less knowledge of German units, so I wouldn't know what they could potentially have used instead. All I do know is that using them three times is too much. Twice is acceptable, imo. I'm fine with the 52 in this pack, but not the 101 and the 08. 66 to me is fine, so long as they don't use it again. Same principle as above, really.
Well the 66 is sorta like the main freight train for all freight operations in the u.k. I am not aware of any other freight trains in the U.K
Lots of freight traction apart from 66s: 37, 57, 67, 68, 70, 86, 88, 90, 93 And then you’ve got engineering trains and multiple units that are used for freight such as Class 325 for the postal train. Rail Operations Group have just announced that they will be using Class 319, 769 and 360s for freight operations soon. Class 950 (converted 150), Class 97 (converted 37) and a HST set are used by Colas Rail/Network Rail for infrastructures monitoring. Freight companies in the U.K: DB cargo, Freightliner Intermodal/Heavy Haul, Direct Rail Services (DRS), Colas Rail, Gbrf, Rail Operations Group, probably a few more that I’m forgetting
We don't see all that excitement where I live sadly, it is just class 66's! Although I could hear the sound of what I am sure was a class 37 the other day but by the time I had rushed upstairs to look out of the window whatever it was had gone! We do get class 68's on the Marylebone passenger service though! And, last year I was waiting on Langley Green station a light class 50 came through leaving that lovely diesel smell behind, nostalgia! I have never heard of a class 93, I will go and google!
Sorry I should have made it clear, Class 93s aren’t out yet. They have been ordered by Rail Operations Group and from my understanding, they are very similar to 68/88s but 93s are tri-mode.
The 93 is ROGs future loco, basically based on the same platform as the 68 and 88 but is much more alike to their European cousins. Likely going to displace at least some of their 37s and 57s. They've placed an order for 30 at this time.