Penzance To St. Austell And St. Ives.

Discussion in 'PC Discussion' started by nwp1, Apr 20, 2021.

  1. junior hornet

    junior hornet Well-Known Member

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    If done well, I would buy a Valenta based HST as a separate DLC at a later date.
     
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  2. Cameron's Gaming

    Cameron's Gaming Well-Known Member

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    If a Valenta HST is made as a separate DLC, I'd rather it be for a route where you can get it up to 125, but that's just me tbh.
     
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  3. dave from Cornwall

    dave from Cornwall Well-Known Member

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    Yup, on this line you wont get it anywhere near full throttle!
     
  4. lcyrrjp

    lcyrrjp Active Member

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    We already have a route for high speed running with an HST - GWE is perfect for that. We lack a route to show off the HST’s power and braking capabilities at lower speeds, which were themselves a huge step forward on the trains they replaced. It’s a bit like driving a sports car on a country road - you don’t get anywhere near the top speed, but you absolutely get there quicker then the person in the family saloon, and it’s an exhilarating ride. Plymouth - Penzance was a classic example of how the HST slashed journey times, even on routes where it couldn’t utilise its high speed capabilities.

    An HST on this route would be great, but personally I’d be equally happy with a class 47, which continued to work expresses through Cornwall in the 90s (normally with 7 mk2s on a cross country service). If it’s just the 150 and 37 that will be very odd. Basically it will be impossible to drive the vast majority of services which ran between St Austell and Penzance in this era.
     
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  5. Rob39

    Rob39 Well-Known Member

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    I don’t see it having the same livery. Might have a radio added in cab and maybe grey/yellow engineers or railfreight distribution sub sector.
     
  6. Warspite

    Warspite Active Member

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    Perhaps I could repeat something I said on here some time ago. Although Laira's 37s were 37/5s, they did not have the same noses as the 37/5s in TVL. Those were in the series 37501 to 37521 and rebuilt from the split headcode 37s. The headcode boxes were removed on rebuilding leaving a plain front with the marker lights as in TVL. The Laira 37/5s were in the series 37667 to 37699 and rebuilt from centre headcode 37s. The headcode 'panel' was filled in with the marker lights incorporated. From 1991, Laira also had at least four 37/4s including two (37417 and 37420) in the original InterCity livery. To be correct for a Cornish class 37/5 in the early 1990s, Rivet will need to rework the nose to have the filled-in headcode panel and not the TVL version with the plain nose and marker lights. The only exception was 37521 which had the TVL nose but I don't think it arrived in Cornwall until EWS days.
     
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  7. Iskra

    Iskra Active Member

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    I foresee an Intercity DLC pack coming up with a HST and a 47...

    However, I'm sure many users will be happy to use the current GWR/FGW HST on the route in the scenario planner and run modern day services. It would be no different to the WCML routes in TS20XX that used routes from one era with stock from another, West Coast Mainline Over Shap as an example.

    Can DTG create a shorter GWR HST consist for us so we can pretend it's a Castle Class?
     
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  8. junior hornet

    junior hornet Well-Known Member

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    They could have it as a layer on GWE. It’s not the right era but then, neither is Diesel Legends. Of course it could also be used in Scenario Planner.
     
  9. Skyz2020

    Skyz2020 Well-Known Member

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    Agreed
     
  10. Rob39

    Rob39 Well-Known Member

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    They already have. Shorter sets are in scenario planner.
     
  11. matinakbary

    matinakbary Well-Known Member

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  12. KMAN

    KMAN Active Member

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    Thanks for adding this.
     
  13. solicitr

    solicitr Well-Known Member

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    As always with Rivet, the 3d rolling stock modeling is superb. But that's never been Rivet's problem.
     
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  14. bricksathome

    bricksathome New Member

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    Ah yes, a GWR liveried 150 on a poster in the 1990s :P
    [​IMG]
     
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  15. trainsimplayer

    trainsimplayer Well-Known Member

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    Forget that: St. Ives was invaded by the Imperium of St. Erth! Screenshot_20211001_170659.jpg
     
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  16. chieflongshin

    chieflongshin Well-Known Member

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    nice looking train and carefully crafted video :D
     
  17. driverwoods#1787

    driverwoods#1787 Well-Known Member

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    I agree and for the class 47 it will be perfect to introduce Mk3 Sleeper Coach London Paddington to Penzance service.
     
  18. meridian#2659

    meridian#2659 Well-Known Member

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    Much impressed of the class 150. For me the Route will be a buy for sure.

    Reading people say here about rivet to stop making content for tsw is a real shame!!
     
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  19. LucasLCC

    LucasLCC Well-Known Member

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    No wonder St Ives looks wrong, they've modelled the wrong town!
     
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  20. Tank621

    Tank621 Well-Known Member

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    I am very excited to get my hands on the 150 specifically, I imagine we'll see a lot of liveries for it with the editor which will be awesome
     
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  21. martschuffing

    martschuffing Well-Known Member

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    Idle sounds ok but putting the power on sounds completely wrong!

    Anyone pick up the poster that said: "going to Scotland then think of a glen"?
    A Scottish route in development?
     
    Last edited: Oct 2, 2021
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  22. DB628

    DB628 Well-Known Member

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    61 services is pretty low or how it is real life?
     
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  23. trainsimplayer

    trainsimplayer Well-Known Member

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    Firstly, it's an excellent pun.
    Secondly, it's likely just because Rivet are from Scotland, and also because of their Scottish Content on TS, and involvement in Cathcart.

    (As a Scot, I'd be worried as to how much Rivet could butcher a Scottish route).
     
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  24. martschuffing

    martschuffing Well-Known Member

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    Maybe a bit harsh TSP, but yes they need to up their ante when it comes to accuracy without a doubt.
    Take the IOW (I don't have it) but an ironing board smooth ride! Obviously haven't been on it probably as it is so far south? ;)
    But a lot of people that have been on it have actually felt quite queasy! :|

    It is probably going to be a lot smoother and quieter now they have spent a small fortune on relaying all the track, but the Rivet route is set before now.
     
    Last edited: Oct 2, 2021
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  25. trainsimplayer

    trainsimplayer Well-Known Member

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    I quite liked IOW, tbf, although I've never been there.

    However, knowing Rivet's tendancy for going for Scenic Routes - and considering that Scotland has many scenic routes (mostly mountainous, Arosa, anyone?), I would be doubtful about how high quality it would be.
     
  26. jasonpfc

    jasonpfc Well-Known Member

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    Just found this...
     

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  27. meridian#2659

    meridian#2659 Well-Known Member

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    Probably back then the cl.150 didnt have more services. (I mean we dont have a rush hour like london commuer here).

    This would be the opportunity for rivet to bring in a class 50 loco dlc, add tour services or create the hst loco dlc (as far i have understood this hst is different than the one from gwr, not only the livery).

    London underground is releasing soon, so i hope rivet can focus on loco dlcs for this or cathcart circle
     
  28. meridian#2659

    meridian#2659 Well-Known Member

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    Here an info about the train frequency (found in another thread)

    What you will find in the 1990's is a very antiquated, low volume railway.

    John Majors crowd were really considering stopping the trains at Plymouth for good.

    There was only 1 train an hour going each way 1) because of the antiquated signalling 2) the single line between Truro and Snozzle 3) Because of cuts.

    The line was only duelled again in the early 2000's for the millennium.

    So yes there should be a HST or two kicking about, but if Rivet have populated the line with 150/2s for our pleasure, then there really isnt any space for the HST!

    I note they have said there are 62 services, and that makes sense, an half hourly service between St Erth and St Ives (~20 ish), and then the rest on the mainline.

    In real life there was until the improvement in the signalling along the line and the introduction to a train every half hour, only a HST to Paddington every other hour, with the intermediate hour taken by the 150/2 as the Plymouth hopper train with a connection to London. Which was really annoying if you got the wrong train home as it meant changing at Plymouth in the pouring rain and blowing gale.

    Compared to the Brighton Mainline this is going to feel like the Mary Celeste in terms of action!

    But then back in the 90's Cornwall train frequency was like the Mary Celeste!
     
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  29. SBos

    SBos Well-Known Member

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    Won’t take much to improve on their last two attempts.
     
  30. LucasLCC

    LucasLCC Well-Known Member

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    If it's a half hourly service, then this is four moves per hour. Assuming a 15 hour service 06:00-21:00, then this is 60 moves alone....

    So we are getting another cutback timetable it seems.
     
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  31. meridian#2659

    meridian#2659 Well-Known Member

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    Well i really hope not. its rivets chance to get it right with this route dlc. Set the bar to the absolute minimum in scenery details and accuracy is not enough. Too many customers are pissed of their politic of fixing bugs.

    I for me can be patient until they fix arosa. But if the real timetable was for example until 23:30, i wouldnt understand why they create the layers only to 21:00.

    But "maybe" we get surprised with something according layers or additional rolling stock, like yesterday in the london to brighton stream. i have no doubts the cl. 150 will rule it, just say the route is as same important.
     
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  32. Northerner

    Northerner Well-Known Member

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    It does seem to be quite a low number of services, especially if you consider ECS moves.

    Roughly, an hourly service on the mainline would give around 36 services, leaving 25 for branch or an hourly service from 7 till 7.

    Does anyone know when the half hourly service on the branch was introduced?
     
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  33. mrcharliemiggins2.0

    mrcharliemiggins2.0 Well-Known Member

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    As I quote from Wikipedia:
    The line initially saw just five trains a day, but by 1909 this had grown to nine and in 1965 it was 17 with up to 24 on summer Saturdays. Some trains included through carriages from London Paddington and in the 1950s the Cornish Rivera Express ran from St Ives through to Paddington on summer Saturdays. The number of services continued to increase following the opening of Lelant Saltings and the summer of 2006 saw 26 daily services operated by Wessex Trains. GWR took over the operation later in the year and the winter timetable was reduced to 16 trains which caused some concern but the summer of 2007 saw a return to the previous service level.

    As of August 2016, trains run at approximately 30-minute intervals in each direction for most of the day, including Sundays.

    The Article: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/St_Ives_Bay_Line
     
    Last edited: Oct 3, 2021
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  34. Northerner

    Northerner Well-Known Member

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    Thanks, I've just looked up when Lelant Saltings was opened and wikepedia says 1978 so there was an uplift in services from that point according to the above. That does make sense as a park and ride wouldn't be too useful with just an hourly service, but it still doesn't state that it was a half hourly in the 90s service so I'm not too sure.
     
  35. Shaun123

    Shaun123 Well-Known Member

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    Before people start complaining about the number of services, does anyone actually know for certainty what the correct number of services should actually be then?

    With the Class 150 running stopping services a frequency of a train every 2 hours or so between Penzance and St Austell would be accurate.

    Naturally the HST would fill in the blanks, making an hourly service but don’t forget because of the single line sections then a clockface hourly timetable was difficult.

    The St Ives branch didn’t go half hourly until 2006/2007 clockface TT if I remember rightly, before then the time were quite random as they tied in with Mainline connections.

    Is 61 services for the 150, low? Yes I’d say so.

    Is it accurate though? Maybe a couple missing but I’d say in the right ballpark.
     
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  36. Purno

    Purno Well-Known Member

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    I'm not familiar with the line or it's schedule in real life, I'd prefer a more busy timetable even if that wouldn't be realistic.
     
  37. TimTri

    TimTri Active Member

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    I‘m really looking forward to this route. Even though I‘m from Germany, I have quite a few personal connections to the general area. One of my first English teachers came from Plymouth. I‘m also quite interested in spaceflight, namely SpaceX and its Starlink internet constellation. An important ground station for this constellation is located at Goonhilly Earth Station, just 20km away from the tracks we‘ll be driving on. Judging by my Starlink antenna‘s latency data, I‘m sometimes even connected to it! SpaceX also uses this ground station to communicate with their rockets as they fly overhead shortly after launching from Cape Canaveral.
     
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  38. Skyz2020

    Skyz2020 Well-Known Member

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    Is it just a single 1 track section? Between truro and st austell? The rest is doubled?
     
  39. Warspite

    Warspite Active Member

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    The single track started at Burngullow Junction, 2 miles from St Austell, and extended to Probus, about 5 miles from Truro and 7 miles from Burngullow. The rest of the line to Penzance was all double track. The St Ives branch was all single track with no passing loops.
     
  40. DB628

    DB628 Well-Known Member

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    Jasper_Rivet please make the DTG Class 43 and 47 as layers
     
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  41. trainsimplayer

    trainsimplayer Well-Known Member

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    The Class 43 doesn't fit - it's in GWR Green and has the wrong engine for 1992.
     
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  42. junior hornet

    junior hornet Well-Known Member

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    This is the problem with this game. Different people have different expectations. You (and I’m sure many others) would prefer a more busy timetable but then other people will complain because it is not accurate. Damned if they do, damned if they don’t.
     
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  43. formulabee#1362

    formulabee#1362 Well-Known Member

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    The gwe timetable is wholly inaccurate anyways, no Greenford shuttles on consoles etc…
     
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  44. CK95

    CK95 Well-Known Member

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    They are there on next gen and PC, you can also access them on last gen by loading up a journey chapter and then quitting back out to the menu.

    Not sure what the official line is on these services not being available on PS4/X1, since service numbers apparently aren’t an issue.
     
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  45. formulabee#1362

    formulabee#1362 Well-Known Member

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    I know, and I’m on next gen console. Thank god that chapter hack exists
     
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  46. Skyz2020

    Skyz2020 Well-Known Member

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    Cheers warspite, looking forward to using the planner to make it a busy little route packed with 150s, 101s, hsts, 47s and 37s. Just need that Livery designer on hst now so I can pretend the IC hst is bursting along..
     
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  47. trainsimgaming1001

    trainsimgaming1001 Well-Known Member

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    While loads are upset about no HST being in the route, I would imagine that would vanish as soon as it is in livery designer and has Valanta and replaces maybe the 150/2 with a mod like someone did on NTP with the 166 replacing 101?
     
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  48. meridian#2659

    meridian#2659 Well-Known Member

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    I still prefere clearly an accurate timetable than a busy one.

    To be honest im glad to have highly frequent routes like london commuter and also less frequent like iow and west cornwall.

    To fill the 24h timetable with layers no matter if they are real, would make the entire idea and charme to a joke.
    I like the fact that it became standard to put real world timetables, so there is also a way to enjoy a route as a passenger.

    At the bottom of the line to me, an unrealistic timetable comes the same as inaccurate scenery and it will get a no buy from me.
     
    Last edited: Oct 4, 2021
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  49. JZJ90

    JZJ90 Active Member

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    I agree it's nice to have a mixture of busy and quiet routes. There's nothing like a laid back relaxing trundle along the Isle of Wight!
     
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  50. OldVern

    OldVern Well-Known Member

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    There is also a short single line section out of Penzance past Long Rock Depot. Used to be a PITA in wet weather or high tides as the tide would knock outthe track circuits and require pilotman working, who might have to come from a distance.
     
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