Penzance To St. Austell And St. Ives.

Discussion in 'PC Discussion' started by nwp1, Apr 20, 2021.

  1. OldVern

    OldVern Well-Known Member

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    As discussed, if the HST was included, for the notional time period the sounds would need to be backdated from the MTU mumble to the beautiful Valenta scream.
     
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  2. atpyatt

    atpyatt Well-Known Member

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    Yes, it was a sad day when they stripped the Valentas out and replaced them with then non event that is the MTU. I can remember them screaming out of platforms at Crewe, quite an experience.

    Happily I'm interested in all of the 1950 - 1990 period, so should find something of interest regardless of the exact period they set it in.
     
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  3. Rob39

    Rob39 Well-Known Member

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    To me Rivet doing the mainline section from Truro to Penzance would mean that DTG perhaps have ideas for routes to the east. Par, Plymouth and the Riviera. Setting the route around 1989 would be ideal imo, more things to do in terms of Penzance turnarounds. Id welcome not being restricted to something with only a power/brake controller on a 30 mile route. Plus there would also be the option to add a Valenta HST at some point down the line if Rivet dont get to make it.
    Possibilities in this era would be
    Class 50 with mk 3’s
    Class 142 Pacer
    TTA fuel tanks (Long Rock depot runs)
    Subs? If Rivet can use them
    Class 47
    Class 45 summer services
    Class 101
    Class 08
    Class 31
    Class 37
    Class 20 (why not)
     
    Last edited: Apr 24, 2021
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  4. elarthur

    elarthur Well-Known Member

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    With my list mentioning classes not yet seen, I can't believe I forgot the Hoovers. Did Class 22 ever reach this far west?
    As for the 45 46 and 47 plus 101, era depending, they were indeed common but should be functional within the pack rather than being used instead of something new. It was my intention to list types that we so far don't have.
     
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  5. theorganist

    theorganist Well-Known Member

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    I am sure the class 22's did get that far west. I think they were supposed to replace the Prairies and take over their duties and were used on goods, parcels and local passenger trains as well as banking turns over Dainton etc. I think the only diesel hydraulics which rarely entered Cornwall, in fact were rarely seen west of Exeter were the class 35 Hymek.

    If we get to add layers I would be concerned that they don't match the time period included. With the GWE pack the locos which are included in the layers don't match the class 52 in terms of the period they are from. That pack apparently wasn't supposed to be realistic but I hope with a specific route set in a specific period realism will be a consideration.
     
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  6. Warspite

    Warspite Well-Known Member

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    Absolutely, but if we had to, I would settle for the main line between Liskeard and St Austell with the freight branch from Lostwithiel down to Carne Point. And yes, a Valenta HST would be very special.
    Sorry to be pedantic, but I think they were mainly mk 2b/c or 2d/e (air-conditioned). I don't think Mk 3s were used on WR except as part of HSTs.
    ... and on year round inter-regional services
    Why not indeed but I don't think they ever got west of Exeter let alone Plymouth!
     
  7. elarthur

    elarthur Well-Known Member

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    Class 41 Warships are a good choice too.
     
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  8. Clumsy Pacer

    Clumsy Pacer Well-Known Member

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    Well if this is set in the late 1970s-early 1980s, I'd rather they don't include a 47 and instead just layer in the one from Northern Trans-Pennine, possibly also take the coaches (so have mk1s included in this) and maybe even use the 45? Headcodes were not used from 1976 onwards, and were set to 0O00, blanked over, or (in the case of the 52s) set to the loco's running number.
     
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  9. theorganist

    theorganist Well-Known Member

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    If it is set in the late 70's the class 52's shouldn't really be part of the package, the last ones went in February 77. Most had gone by Jan 1976 and they would have been playing second fiddle to the class 50's by then I think.
     
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  10. Warspite

    Warspite Well-Known Member

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    The class 22s were certainly used in Cornwall right up to their demise in the early 70s. I have a photo in one of John Vaughan's books of D6322 in BR blue shunting the yard at Penryn on the Falmouth Branch in September 1970. By mid-1971, only 10 were left and they were soon replaced by class 25s, a class we haven't mentioned much on here. As well as freight around Truro, the class 25s were used on clay trains in east Cornwall until replaced by class 37s.
     
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  11. theorganist

    theorganist Well-Known Member

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    I would love a 25, my favourite type 2. I love the Sulzer sound. Could also be used on NTP too.
     
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  12. junior hornet

    junior hornet Well-Known Member

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    Can you imagine the backlash from the community if they reuse engines from other routes?

    Rivet are good at locos so it is in their interests to develop their own. As long as they can get good sound files, the Valenta 125s would be brilliant and make a good contrast to the newer engined ones on GWE. Also, I don’t think we’ve got Sprinters yet in the game so that would be good.
     
  13. Clumsy Pacer

    Clumsy Pacer Well-Known Member

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    Layering has been a thing for quite a while, which is what I'm suggesting - ie you'd need to own NTP to use the 47 on this route, it's been put to good use on the German routes, although it was branded as "hidden costs" by some when they used it on DLGW so idk if they'll want to do it again much on UK routes.
     
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  14. dave from Cornwall

    dave from Cornwall Well-Known Member

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    There is another interesting thing about going "too early" with the St Ives line.

    St Ives station has changed a lot. It is now a single line end. Whereas back in time there were numerous platforms and it went right to the very end of what is now a carpark.

    As can be seen from this old post card in my collection.

    The current line sort of finished near the two buildings centre left of the picture

    So modern times they can use google earth to map the line. If they go too far back, I would be expecting them to be looking at the old postcards of the station like this and modelling from that!

    D

    p.s you can see the modern station /carpark on google maps quite well

    St Ives, England - Google Maps
     

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    Last edited: Apr 26, 2021
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  15. Warspite

    Warspite Well-Known Member

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    St Ives station was rebuilt in 1971 when the line was cut back and the station building replaced by a station office in the car park with a shelter on the platform. It would make sense for Rivet to date the route post-1971 as this makes the timescale and particularly the rolling stock more flexible. Although many have welcomed the inclusion of the St Ives branch for its scenic attraction, operationally it was very limited with a DMU shuttle service on the single line to/from St Erth with no run round at St Ives..
     
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  16. AirbourneAlex

    AirbourneAlex Well-Known Member

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    If Rivet made a Class 150 for this route, they could adapt the Mk3 multiple unit body shell into a Class 318 add-on for Cathcart Circle.

    Similarly, if DTG ever make the Riviera line in TSW, a Class 143 featured could also be used as a DLC for Tees Valley Line.

    Otherwise it would be nice to see a Class 50 with some Blue/Grey Mk1s, and maybe a Class 122 bubble car using sounds and maybe parts of the Class 101 simugraph code (like the gear changing logic) which might make development easier. You could even adapt a 122 into a Class 121 and maybe a Class 117 to replace the 101 in GWE Diesel legends (I doubt that would happen though, but never say never).
     
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  17. james64

    james64 Well-Known Member

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    I had a dream last night that Class 155s in regional railways livery were included in the route, along with an upgraded version of the Peaks.

    I doubt these two would have been on the line at the same time, unless I'm mistaken. Did 155s even run that far west?
     
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  18. theorganist

    theorganist Well-Known Member

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    Class 155's did run as far west as Penzance, from Cardiff mainly. They were introduced in 1987/1988, the last Peaks withdrawn in 1988 so it is possible they could have been seen together but I don't think Peaks regularly worked down to the south west much after 1986 and barely in their last year of service. So the chances would have been small but not impossible.

    But a blue/grey class 101 running commuter services on the GWML some time in the 1970's wouldn't have happened yet it is portrayed in TSW so rule nothing out! Although Rivit might have a better grasp of reality than DTG.
     
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  19. james64

    james64 Well-Known Member

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    At this point I'm just desperate for some type of Sprinter to be in the game. I grew up with them and have very fond memories of them. I'm actually writing this post on one!

    I'm holding out hope this is the route to debut them, but I know a first generation DMU is probably more likely.
     
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  20. theorganist

    theorganist Well-Known Member

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    I do like Sprinters too, I was driving a class 155 in TS1 yesterday.

    I doubt this route will be the one unless the diesel hydraulic element is referring to Sprinters which it might be.
     
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  21. dave from Cornwall

    dave from Cornwall Well-Known Member

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    There is "more sense" them doing ~1972-89 in terms of trains everyone likes and the ease of modelling the line.

    So 1955 here we come! :)

    D
     
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  22. james64

    james64 Well-Known Member

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    Surely 1955 would mean the vast majority of trains would be steam though? I can't see them doing anything before the mid 60s at least.
     
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  23. Tank621

    Tank621 Well-Known Member

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    An early BR diesel route would be a smart idea, would be perfect to add in a couple of steam locos as add-ons later on
     
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  24. dave from Cornwall

    dave from Cornwall Well-Known Member

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    My attempt of humour has been missed again. Sorry.

    I was trying to say that it would be *easy* for them to do later in the 1950-90 period.

    As the majority of peeps on here seem to *like* 1970-80 and that would keep them *happy*...

    Rivet and DTG will 'annoy' everyone and do something early.

    But it could be the first steam one...so peeps might be happy.

    D
     
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  25. WVUadam

    WVUadam Well-Known Member

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    if you check the release dates your find TSw for uk routes and locos was mainly period stock.
    Great western express was the only modern route for TSW untill East Coastway in 2019.
     
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  26. Warspite

    Warspite Well-Known Member

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    According to John Vaughan, the Peaks were banned west of Bristol in October 1985 so they wouldn't have been seen together. Shame.
     
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  27. theorganist

    theorganist Well-Known Member

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    That is interesting, I hadn't realised it was that early. The last photos I have seen of them were in Summer 1985 so that would make sense.
     
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  28. Jpantera

    Jpantera Well-Known Member

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    They definitely got west of Bristol even if there was a ban although I doubt in great numbers. Pretty certain one made it at least to Paignton in 1988.
     
  29. OldVern

    OldVern Well-Known Member

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    There was probably no diagrammed work and unless Saltley men had route knowledge beyond Bristol, any Class 1 for the west would have had the 45 taken off at Temple Meads and replaced by a 47.
     
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  30. Jpantera

    Jpantera Well-Known Member

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    Bottom of this page on the Derby Sulzers website shows workings of 45s right up to 1988 as I thought to the West Country although limited in number by then https://www.derbysulzers.com/devon3.html
     
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  31. Warspite

    Warspite Well-Known Member

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    You were absolutely right! Good find.
     
  32. your attempt at humour was great, no need to apologise. There's always someone that doesn't understand jokes, but it's not them we write them for!
     
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  33. volvolover1972

    volvolover1972 Well-Known Member

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    New roadmap update: "When the West Cornwall Local was added to the Roadmap last time around the code was listed incorrectly. It was listed as an era 5 route (1951-1990) which was incorrect - the route is actually era 6 (1991-2010)"
     
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  34. theorganist

    theorganist Well-Known Member

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    Sprinter and a HST I guess then.

    A little bit disappointed as I was looking forward to what I assumed was another 1970's route but this will do I guess! So I wonder which end of the era it is BR or FGW!
     
    Last edited: May 4, 2021
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  35. Snek

    Snek Well-Known Member

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    That's... disappointing.
     
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  36. Knightfire1964

    Knightfire1964 Well-Known Member

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    on the roadmap it was incorrect so it's modern!!!!!
     
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  37. Knightfire1964

    Knightfire1964 Well-Known Member

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    this is the new code for it GGD-R6 01
     
  38. james64

    james64 Well-Known Member

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    I'm much more excited for the route now, although some will likely be disappointed.

    A HST is all but guaranteed now, and I'd be surprised if a Sprinter wasn't featured. I'm interested in what specific decade it's in though.
     
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  39. volvolover1972

    volvolover1972 Well-Known Member

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    Some type of Sprinter has to be included otherwise the St. Ives branch wouldn’t be drivable. It’s not even an option not to include one.
     
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  40. james64

    james64 Well-Known Member

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    Have Pacers ever ran on the route?
     
  41. Mr JMB

    Mr JMB Well-Known Member

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    Likely the FGW HST getting an official release?
     
  42. theorganist

    theorganist Well-Known Member

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    Only for two or three years in the 1980's after which they were banished up north as the four wheel chassis were not considered suitable for the west country curves.
     
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  43. theorganist

    theorganist Well-Known Member

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    A class150/2 would make sense.

    Then again class 158's probably worked in from places like Bristol/Cardiff during that time period, although wouldn't have ran on the branch line.
     
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  44. Shaun123

    Shaun123 Well-Known Member

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    I’d still expect a Class 101 or even a 121/122, for the St Ives branch if it’s early 90’s specifically.
     
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  45. volvolover1972

    volvolover1972 Well-Known Member

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    Would the 150/1 work as well? If I remember correctly FGW did have some for a period of time.
     
  46. Northerner

    Northerner Well-Known Member

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    I wonder what could the Diesel Hydraulic part of the code could represent in the new era.
     
  47. theorganist

    theorganist Well-Known Member

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    Yes they could justifiably reuse the class 101 then. A class 122 would be great though. Heritage units ran on the St. Ives branch up to around 1996.
     
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  48. Clumsy Pacer

    Clumsy Pacer Well-Known Member

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    Sprinter of some form - don't know if there's any other appropriate 2nd gen DMUs?
     
  49. theorganist

    theorganist Well-Known Member

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    Sprinters use a hydraulic transmission
     
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  50. theorganist

    theorganist Well-Known Member

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    At the end of the time period I think. I would say the 150/2 might have been the more numerous down there though.
     

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