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Penzance To St. Austell And St. Ives.

Discussion in 'PC Discussion' started by nwp1, Apr 20, 2021.

  1. Skyz2020

    Skyz2020 Well-Known Member

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    The mail would be great. Would be a class 47 in red in theory running to plymouth (as far as truro for this route in terms of what we can drive)
     
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  2. Skyz2020

    Skyz2020 Well-Known Member

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    Mail.jpg

    Something like this would be awesome
     
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  3. byeo

    byeo Well-Known Member

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    I'll openly admit I don't know the difference between Diesel Electric and Diesel Hydraulic. Could someone "in the know" make a list of each possible train we could see on this route under both Diesel Electric & Hydraulic?
     
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  4. Cameron's Gaming

    Cameron's Gaming Well-Known Member

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    As a gross oversimplification: A diesel electric uses a diesel engine to generate electricity to power motors which drive the train. Diesel hydraulics use a diesel engine to drive the train with hydraulic transmission. Diesel mechanicals are the same but use mechanical transmission, similar to the gearbox in a car.

    As a general rule in the UK nowadays, locomotives are diesel electric, and DMUs are diesel hydraulic. The only exception I can think of a unit classified in the 200 series (Voyagers and HSTs*), and the class 172 (which is diesel mechanical). Class 141 and 142 pacers were originally built as diesel mechanicals. The 142s were later converted to hydraulics, and the 141s were withdrawn, because the Leyland guts within both were really unreliable.

    *This is if, like GWR (or BR when they were first introduced), you take a HST set as a single multiple unit, rather than 2 locomotives with coaches.
     
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  5. Skyz2020

    Skyz2020 Well-Known Member

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    The voyagers would be quite something for this route. I wonder if it would be in the virginxc setup?
     
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  6. Warspite

    Warspite Active Member

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    Cam (above) has described very well the differences between 'diesel electric' and 'diesel hydraulic'. The time period chosen, 1991-2010, is quite a wide one in terms of motive power and the classes we would expect to see would be different in 1991 than in 2010. So, depending on a more specific date period, we could see the following (more likely ones in bold):

    Diesel electric:
    08 (shunter)
    43* (HST)
    47/4
    57 (Night sleeper, after 2001)
    50 (only a handful left in 1991)
    66 (after 2000 but rare in West Cornwall)
    67 (after 2000 but again rare in Cornwall)
    220 (Voyager, from 2001)
    * Class 43 HST is the one class (together with the 08 shunters) which is a constant in the period 1991-2010 but they were refurbished during this time period and their original Paxman Valenta power units were replaced by MTU units from about 2006.

    Diesel hydraulic:
    150/2
    153

    155 (until rebuilt as 153 in 1992)
    156
    158

    Diesel mechanical: all until mid-1990s?
    101
    108 (until about 1992)
    117 (until about 1996)
    118
    121
    122

    Not sure if I've got everything but I'm sure others will correct the list if I've got it wrong!

    EDIT - Changes made to 'Diesel mechanical' list following The Organist's post.
     
    Last edited: May 11, 2021
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  7. Warspite

    Warspite Active Member

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    I should have added that realistically we may only get a 150/2 and an HST if we're lucky (plus 08 and 47 as layers?) but I would be happy with those two.
     
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  8. Cameron's Gaming

    Cameron's Gaming Well-Known Member

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    It's almost certain we won't get a voyager - DTG have no license for either operator that have used them.
     
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  9. theorganist

    theorganist Well-Known Member

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    The class 118's had pretty much moved away by 1990, most had been withdrawn, a handful ended up at Tyseley.

    Laira then Penzance had a handful of class 117 sets, including the chocolate and cream set from the early 90's to around 1996. These were mostly ex Reading NSE sets and I think were all running as two car power twin sets.

    Class 108's were operating alongside class 101's at Laira from around 1987/88 to 1992ish. In fact I think the class 108 was more numerous than the class 101 at Laira.

    Most of the bubble cars were class 122, I know 55026 ran there for a while in the late 80's.
     
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  10. dave from Cornwall

    dave from Cornwall Well-Known Member

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    Thats what we *should* get...

    Anything else is a bonus as Warspite says.

    D
     
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  11. LIRRGuy

    LIRRGuy Well-Known Member

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    Keep in Mind the route is set between 1991-2010....so me might get another Class 101
     
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  12. theorganist

    theorganist Well-Known Member

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    That would fit in this case though (if it is set right at the beginning of the period)!
     
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  13. Tonto62

    Tonto62 Well-Known Member

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    I hope so, I love driving that thing. If not I wish they'd include a layer for it so we had the choice. Fully understand most people are sick of the 101 but it is fun to drive.
     
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  14. theorganist

    theorganist Well-Known Member

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    It is fun to drive that is certain. It isn't the only DMU out there however.
     
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  15. Geth_2234

    Geth_2234 Active Member

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    thank you that’s really helpful.

    going by the years they’ve chosen and the types of locos it’s very likely that we will get a 150 as these were used by all 3 operators during this time (wales & west, Wessex and GWR) with GWR still still using them on the route now.
     
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  16. Skyz2020

    Skyz2020 Well-Known Member

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    Agreed, going to be great to have Livery designer to make as many alternatives as we want too. Thinking for NTP etc
     
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  17. Jasper_Rivet

    Jasper_Rivet Active Member

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    Hey Monder, couple of things that made us curious.

    1. Can you give us more detail on what you think we weren't honest about? We were pretty upfront with the distant scenery topic and we were aware that this might upset some people. But we published a statement on that here: https://forums.rivet-games.com/foru...line-chur-arosa-available-now?p=3868#post3868 We also talked about the derailing issue and fixed it after just a couple of days.
    2. What was negative on how we handled feedback? Again, I think we were listening and responded to almost everything we came across (there might be posts we didn't replied to, yes). But let us know, what went wrong?
    Now back to Penzance: No reused stock on this route. And no, the route won't be set back into the 50s, I can imagine why that date appears there. But more on that later, when I can give you more reliable information.

    Cheers
     
    Last edited: May 13, 2021
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  18. theorganist

    theorganist Well-Known Member

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    Let the Speculation begin!

    So either a new HST or a locomotive of some description, I can't imagine what though, too late really for a class 50 so maybe a class 47.

    And a unit, probably a class 150/2.
     
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  19. volvolover1972

    volvolover1972 Well-Known Member

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    The question is how much new stock will be included. We know almost certainly based on the era that a sprinter, specifically a 150, will be there. Now will anything else be included? Based on Rivet's past content as well as DTG's recent routes, two or more completely new locos is unlikely to be part of a route package.
     
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  20. stujoy

    stujoy Well-Known Member

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    Monder is correct about how Rivet handled the feedback about the derailing issue. When the train was bouncing off the track, Rivet’s official position was that everything was as it should be and it was the players not driving correctly, even going as far as to give tutorials on how to drive it incorrectly using mainly the vacuum brake. When the issue was fixed, the official position of Rivet was that you had changed the physics slightly to be more forgiving to the player but still made out the original behaviour of the train was correct.

    Matt from DTG posted in this forum that the real reason the trains were derailing was because the weight of the coaches was too high and the coupler physics were acting in the wrong direction, which caused the derailments. These are the actual problems that were fixed to make the train drivable.

    There was no such admission of there ever being an issue with the physics from Rivet, with your official line still being that nothing was wrong with the product to start with but you had taken pity on the players and made it easier to play. We already knew the real reason from DTG, but never from Rivet. That’s where the impression of dishonesty comes from, Rivet stuck to the story that the physics were ‘as close to real life as they could be’ when they were actually broken, even after the issue was fixed.
     
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  21. Monder

    Monder Well-Known Member

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    stujoy was faster, so I'm not going to repeat myself a whole lot.
    Although I myself think the scenery could use some not completely difficult steps to be improved (helping the sparse trees by darker textures underneath has been mentioned by many people here on forums), if you think that's fine, it's your opinion. But as mentioned, your physics on the train was seriously broken and the first reaction was to avoid this by telling people the braking is done in a completely unreal way. After Matt explained the origin of the problem, you still went with your story and only "generously" made the train easier to handle. Yeah, I stand by my initial statement, that's not an approach I like. And it's not me being just anti-Rivet, I have been pretty vocal about DTG's disastrous handling of HHL. At the very least though they admitted the problem there. If I was to make a route and proper train handling (in a simulator) would make it yeet itself of the tracks, that's probably something to be explored and not ignored.
     
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  22. Warspite

    Warspite Active Member

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    I'm a bit concerned that "No reused stock on this route" means we might not get the HST as it could be considered as 'used stock'. However, a non-refurbished HST with the original Valenta power unit would be 'new' as it is different to the refurbished HST in lots of ways, most particularly the wonderful engine sound. I cannot see any other suitable diesel-electric being included for this period. Much as I would love to see a class 50, the '1991-2010' period is really too late for them. Unless Rivet just move the date back a few years ...
     
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  23. Jpantera

    Jpantera Active Member

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    They were very regular on charters to Cornwall right up until the end of their BR careers, also once preserved examples could be on the mainline they visited then too, Last charter I did with them in BR days had 50050 and 50033 in pair Exeter to Plymouth and then 50007 solo Plymouth to Penzance and back were 50050 and 50033 backed onto 50007 for a triple header Plymouth Bristol, Tour started at Crewe with a pair of RfD 37/0s (110 & 073 iirc). That was one of many tours around that time (1993).

    I would take a 50 even if its slightly out of date because it would be entertaining. the 47 is already in the sim elsewhere.
     
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  24. volvolover1972

    volvolover1972 Well-Known Member

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    There’s a very high chance we’re only going to get a FGW 150/2 with the route set in late 2000s. Anything else would be bonus in my view.
     
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  25. Warspite

    Warspite Active Member

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    So would I. But, push the route back to 1987 so I can drive 50014 'Warspite' on the route!
     
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  26. Warspite

    Warspite Active Member

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    Unless they change it on the next road map, DTG's route code says 'diesel hydraulic' and 'diesel electric', so assuming the diesel hydraulic is a 150 (or a 158), there should be a diesel electric of some sort. The route has to have something for the Paddington trains so an HST is the most likely based on the time period.
     
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  27. fabristunt

    fabristunt Well-Known Member

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    How about the whole brake usage thing on Arosa? Do you really think Rivet dealt with it in the proper way?
     
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  28. dave from Cornwall

    dave from Cornwall Well-Known Member

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    Jasper_Rivet hello from Cornwall!

    I am really intrigued how you are not going to "reuse" stock?

    Are you going to build a brand new 43? Or are they being ignored by Rivet?

    Anyway. I am REALLY REALLY REALLY pleased that you are doing some of Cornwall.

    Thanks again,

    Kernowbisvyken.

    Dave
     
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  29. Geth_2234

    Geth_2234 Active Member

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    Finally getting a sprinter in TSW would be enough for me but getting 2 new locos would be a bonus for me.
     
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  30. james64

    james64 Well-Known Member

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    "Diesel Electric" does make me suspect we could actually see a Voyager, which I would love although I'd be slightly disappointed not to get it on a route where it could stretch it's legs.
     
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  31. byeo

    byeo Well-Known Member

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    Who knows, DTG love to reuse locos, it could pave the way for another UK route which is longer and includes a Voyager.
     
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  32. james64

    james64 Well-Known Member

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    I hope so. Something like Newcastle to York or the WCML South would be great for the Voyager.
     
  33. Cameron's Gaming

    Cameron's Gaming Well-Known Member

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    Given DTG very recently lost both the Virgin Trains and CrossCountry licenses, I think there's more chance of pigs flying. It'd be nice to see a voyager but unless they somehow convince Arriva to renew the XC license, then it's not happening any time soon.
     
  34. Jpantera

    Jpantera Active Member

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    I doubt due to licensing that one will feature.
     
  35. james64

    james64 Well-Known Member

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    Ah. Well there goes that theory then.
     
  36. dave from Cornwall

    dave from Cornwall Well-Known Member

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    I know no one asked for it, but this weekend I went for train ride from St Erth to Carbis Bay and then walked to St Ives.

    Granted in the time period the train will be stopping at Lelant Saltings for the the Park and Ride and Lelant itself.

    So here is some pictures of the 4 carriage 150's working the line this weekend.

    It was looking stunning :)

    D
     

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  37. Northerner

    Northerner Well-Known Member

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    Nice photos! It looks like Carbis Bay station has seen a bit of TLC in preparation for G7 summit.
     
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  38. junior hornet

    junior hornet Well-Known Member

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    I agree. Great photos. Now Rivet Games, it’s up to you. Make it great.
     
  39. chieflongshin

    chieflongshin Well-Known Member

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    Can we just have a class 101 service pack like diesel legends. It already has about 600 services across 45 routes. I feel we need another 300 please :D
     
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  40. james64

    james64 Well-Known Member

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    Still no news on the rolling stock on today's roadmap. I can't help but question why they chose to announce it so early that they haven't decided what trains to put on it yet.
     
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  41. Cameron's Gaming

    Cameron's Gaming Well-Known Member

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    Especially given they don't want to announce things until it's only a few months away from launch. They then went on to talk (not in an entirely positive light, mind you) about TSG (without their knowledge) doing exactly that given at least 2 of the 3 products on the roadmap are not coming out until next year.
     
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  42. martschuffing

    martschuffing Well-Known Member

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    Defo will be holding off on buying from Rivet, never bothered with the IOW, and regretted buying Arosa. After the HHL disappointment DtG is joining the holding off from buying regime now too, Sounds are the deal-breaker now for me as far as DtG are concerned, as it appears no one is listening or just don't care or they can't implement the powerful tools in Ue4 for audio.
     
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  43. byeo

    byeo Well-Known Member

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    So, another fortnightly update with no West Cornwall loco added, are they still deliberating or do they know and have just not announced it yet? Either way, c’mon Rivet, pull your finger out, actually take your time and make sure the scenery is good for once.
     
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  44. Cameron's Gaming

    Cameron's Gaming Well-Known Member

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    I have a feeling they decided not to announce it because of the whole Rapid Transit/LIRR/Hamburg dibacle.
     
  45. rabid

    rabid Well-Known Member

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    If they roll out once again the class 101 DMU for use on this route I will chew my own leg off. Please don’t make me do that Rivet, I need that leg, and we as customers desperately need a little more variety. A 2nd generation unit would go down nicely, and be a good substitute on TVL.
     
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  46. Northerner

    Northerner Well-Known Member

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    Jasper from Rivet has said there will be no reused stock on this route so it's quite likely we'll be spared from getting the 101 this time.
     
    Last edited: May 18, 2021
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  47. BR125

    BR125 Well-Known Member

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    E1rp9kgWUAEnjbs.jpg

    they posted this, anyone smarter than me able to make out the green train?
     
  48. Rob39

    Rob39 Well-Known Member

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    Its some sort of freight car. Not British.
     

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  49. Rob39

    Rob39 Well-Known Member

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    A bus replacement perhaps.
     
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  50. Jpantera

    Jpantera Active Member

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    It's accurate for some of the period covered same as the 47 and 08.
     
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