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Rt And Nec In The Ps Store

Discussion in 'PS4' started by UnlimitedMagic, Sep 5, 2019.

  1. UnlimitedMagic

    UnlimitedMagic Well-Known Member

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    Please could could you do this Dovetail so the newcomers could experience this route in TSW. (Although NEC has so much bugs apparently so If I was dtg I would release RT first and fix NEC bugs)
     
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  2. Mikey_9835

    Mikey_9835 Active Member

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    So does this mean that new players can't get the BR 182 and the SW100R?
     
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  3. ildario77

    ildario77 Active Member

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    You mean, no Rapid Transit on TSW 2020? I got the game just a few days before the release of 2020 (I didn't know the update was coming...) and I got both. I understand they sidelined NEC, too subpar compared to new DLCs, but why RT? I love that route, well done, smooth as silk and visually captivating. And the Talent 2 is so cute :D
     
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  4. xD 2Bad4You

    xD 2Bad4You Well-Known Member

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    They should both be available as standalone purchase in the store. They are both in the Xbox Store and on Steam i believe. but for some reason Sony or DTG have made a mistake and they got removed / not added.
     
  5. ARuscoe

    ARuscoe Well-Known Member

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    Third post on this in two days...
     
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  6. synthetic.angel

    synthetic.angel Active Member

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    No. It's much much worse than that. PS4 customers can buy the BR182 and the SW1000R, if they want. And if they have bought TSW2020, without having bought TSW2018 first, then they won't be able to use these DLCs.....!

    I do hope that DTG management have told the Support team to treat such customers, when they complain, with a degree of fairness. In fact, I think they really should trace back to every single person that has done this, and provide them with a recall refund (it can't be that many people to chase up), without asking for onerous evidential requirements.

    Normally the PlayStation Store will not let you purchase daughter DLC if you don't own the parent. So, as you can see from the link below, the Class 33 is indicated as "unavailable". You'd need to own WSR to buy the Class 33 (or even see the price...).

    https://store.playstation.com/en-gb/grid/EP2866-CUSA10019_00-TRAINSIMWORLD20S/1?relationship=add-ons

    But this hurdle hasn't been applied to the BR 182 and SW1000R, and they are advertised as requiring "Train Sim World". If you buy "Train Sim World 2020", then surely you have bought "Train Sim World", right....? Most would think so, but they'd be wrong....

    Quite misleading.... especially since TSW2018 (the true parent) is not listed. NEC is not listed either. Nor RT. And the BR 182 and SW1000R are listed as DLCs for TSW 2020. And even if NEC and RT are made available, those customers will be wondering why they have had to buy TSW twice (and buy GWE twice), or buy TSW2020, and then newly appearing parent DLC for the (now) grand-children DLC.

    This is, of course, likely to be considered as not quite legal, as it could be regarded as not quite compliant with the Consumer Rights Act 2015.

    Feel free to correct me, if you think I am wrong.

    Anyway, I suggest that this is all tidied up, PDQ, because it looks really quite bad.
     
    Last edited: Sep 6, 2019
  7. ARuscoe

    ARuscoe Well-Known Member

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    You ARE wrong.

    You can buy any add on DLC but not have the route for it, in the same way you can buy tyres without owning a car... Nothing illegal in that. This is why each listing on the store has the warning such as "Please note: Northeast Corridor New York (Included in Train Sim World) is required, as a separate purchase, in order to utilise the content featured in this add-on." (Taken from the SW1000R listing page of PS Store)

    So the warning is there, and this is also true of MS Store and Steam Store.

    As I've said on other posts of this same topic, someone should submit a ticket but I don't know if anyone has as yet
     
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  8. Mikey_9835

    Mikey_9835 Active Member

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    I remember trying to buy the 155, but the game wouldn't let me because I didn't have Ruhr Sieg Nord. Although I used the in game store, so I guess it's different on the PS Store?
     
  9. Mikey_9835

    Mikey_9835 Active Member

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    If they do get added to the PS store, it should be for half the price of a regular route, since it lacks the polish of newer routes.
     
  10. TrainSim-Dmitri

    TrainSim-Dmitri Staff Member

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    The product page for these DLC contains a warning mentioning pre-requisites, so it's up to users to make sure they do not buy DLC for the product they do not own.

    However, current PS users should not have issues anyway because both RT and NEC are currently included with TSW 2020 base game, only for PlayStation users. This is not how it's supposed to be and our team is currently looking into it.
     
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  11. synthetic.angel

    synthetic.angel Active Member

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    I think you are just reinforcing my point. The misleading bit is:

    "Please note: Northeast Corridor New York (Included in Train Sim World) is required, as a separate purchase, in order to utilise the content featured in this add-on."

    This isn't reasonable, because "Train Sim World" (the 2018 variant of TSW2020 that included NEC/RT), is not available on PlayStation Store. And it won't be made available. As it stands, the DLC can be purchased, without the block affecting the purchase of the Class 33 (as DLC to DLC). And these NEC/RT DLC locos won't work if you are a new player that has just bought Train Sim World 2020.

    It is unreasonable to expect someone that has just bought Train Sim World 2020 to know that it is not the same as the "Train Sim World" referred to in the caveat/pre-requisite text, especially when this DLC that depends on "Train Sim World" (the 2018 variant) is now listed as an add-on to "Train Sim World 2020", which they are not an add-on to. They would be DLC to the NEC DLC and RT DLC, but these DLCs are not, themselves, available on PlayStation Store.

    For the PlayStation Store, the BR 182 and SW1000R DLC should say:

    "Please note: Northeast Corridor New York (Included in the original version of Train Sim World) is required, as a separate purchase, in order to utilise the content featured in this add-on. You cannot purchase this version of Train Sim World on PlayStation Store - you will have to find it via another vendor selling it on disc, or you will have to wait until the publisher makes the NEC/RT route available on PlayStation Store as DLC to the new version of Train Sim World, now known as "Train Sim World 2020", but there are no plans to do this yet. So, if you purchase this item without having bought the previous version of Train Sim World, your DLC won't work"
     
    Last edited: Sep 6, 2019
  12. synthetic.angel

    synthetic.angel Active Member

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    If I have understood you correctly, and that someone buying TSW2020 (for the first time), on PlayStation, gets at least six routes, including RT and NEC, (on top of NTP, GWE, MSB and LIRR), all for £25, then I would strongly support leaving it like that. The RT and NEC routes (combined) could be regarded as equal in value to CSX Heavy Haul on PC. This would bring parity with PC users. It would be an excellent solution, going forward.
     
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  13. Factor41

    Factor41 Well-Known Member

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    That would be a good solution for users, bulking out the main game with extra routes. Might make people less likely to spend extra on DLC, at least for while though. It sounds like they'll put it right at some point anyway, with NEC and RT becoming standalone DLC, which you'd need to buy before getting the extra Amtrak and 182 locos to use on them (although the 182 also seems to drop into freight service on MSB too).
     
  14. ARuscoe

    ARuscoe Well-Known Member

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    To clarify this, the TSW(18) version of the base game is no longer available. The BUNDLE which contained TSW18 etc is no longer available, but the DLC which you're talking about SHOULD be available as has been confirmed, thus rendering your argument utterly pointless.
    Continue if you wish, but you are getting it all mixed up seemingly just to make an argument which should boil down to "It isn't in the PS store, someone might want to look into that"
     
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  15. ARuscoe

    ARuscoe Well-Known Member

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    You can only buy the game as a bundle. I haven't seen TSW for sale as a standalone no matter what the revision, presumably because TSW itself has no content. ALL of the content is in DLC
     
  16. Factor41

    Factor41 Well-Known Member

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    Yeah, that's what I mean. The bundles usually come with three routes, which they've just switched over, but the dev said that if you buy TSW2020 (what I meant by the "main game") on PS4 at the moment, you'll get all five.
     
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  17. synthetic.angel

    synthetic.angel Active Member

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    I reckon the six routes should be left together, now that it has been deployed like that (assuming this is what Dmitri is actually saying), and leave those six routes as the standard "core bundle" for PS4 (or seven if you get the "Bigger" version for the extra £15).

    I can't imagine how complex it would become if NEC and RT were now removed from the TSW2020 core "bundle". If you removed them from future sales, what would you do with customers that already bought them as part of a set of six? Would you take RT and NEC away from them? What if they bought the DLC to RT/NEC? How would you compensate people fairly?

    What if you let them keep the routes, but made them newly available to future customers as DLC to a revised TSW2020, as a different core "bundle"? How would you upgrade and patch the PS4 TSW2020 core in future, if there were different vesions? You'd have to track everything as it branched out. It would be a complete nightmare in version control.

    Yep - I reckon the six routes should be left together, now that it has been deployed like that. And the description for TSW2020 on PlayStation Store could then amended to say that it includes NEC and RT - it might even help drive more sales.

    Seems fair to me.
     
    Last edited: Sep 6, 2019
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  18. xD 2Bad4You

    xD 2Bad4You Well-Known Member

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    Not sure why it would be so complex?
    If they correct the bundle, and this is going to happen, RT and NEC are getting removed from the TSW2020 bundle as its supposed to be.
    They then become purchasable as standalone DLC´s, just like the other routes, for everyone that wants them.

    If you have bought the TSW2020 bundle which currently includes the 2 routes you will keep them.
    If you owned them before you have kept them aswell. They cant remove anything you purchased and of course they dont want to do that.

    So a new user who buys the game now gets lucky, because he gets 2 additional routes.

    And anyone that owns the routes will get possible fixes to them like before for free. No matter if you purchased them in the old bundle, in the current 2020 edition or as a standalone DLC once they´ve corrected the bundle.
     
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  19. ARuscoe

    ARuscoe Well-Known Member

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    We're only on the second revision of the bundles, so I don't think there's enough info to say "usually"
     
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  20. synthetic.angel

    synthetic.angel Active Member

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    I think that when TSW updated to TSW2020, anyone who then acquired TSW2020 were given:

    - a core called "Train Sim World" including GWE (the core's core "Founder" core core core thing) plus NEC and RT
    - a DLC for MSB
    - a DLC for NTP
    - a DLC for LIRR

    And they were given this package, even if they didn't have TSW (the "bundle" sold in 2018) in the first place.

    In short - DTG have been giving out NEC and RT to PS4 players buying TSW2020 (as currently on sale), even though they didn't mean to. And this is very difficult to undo.

    (Unless I have completely misunderstood Dmitri, in which case I apologise profusely).
     
  21. ARuscoe

    ARuscoe Well-Known Member

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    It's not complex at all. Those DLC are downloaded when you buy them. If they become unavailable in future you retain your license for them so can use them. The only issue becomes if they are taken off sale and you lose your downloaded copy, but this is fairly standard in the digital world and is a "how DLC work" problem rather than DTG one.
     
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  22. ARuscoe

    ARuscoe Well-Known Member

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    Let's analyse what you said...

    TSW updated to 2020: So anyone who already HAD TSW18 got the core software upgrade, but did NOT get any additional DLC
    Anyone who acquired TSW2020: Except they didn't, what they bought was a bundle. Even if they hadn't bought anything further they would have got TSW2020, so what they bought when they bought the bundle were the additional DLC. Their license for TSW2020 was inherited from TSW18

    In other words you're making it far more complex than it needs be
     
  23. synthetic.angel

    synthetic.angel Active Member

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    Well, yes, of course, you could make it as simple as that... ;-P

    but....

    ...it would be awesome for the pack to have all six routes! (And for the "Bigger" SFJ one to have seven). Just for PS4. For £25, or £40 for the Bigger Version.
     
  24. xD 2Bad4You

    xD 2Bad4You Well-Known Member

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    IMO they already have included a lot of routes in that bundle at a very cheap prize so i think with those 2 it would be too much.
    NEC shouldnt be a full price DLC though with all the bugs but thats a different story.
    It would also be hard to explain why one platforms gets more routes in the bundle than the others when all routes are available on all platforms (which HH isnt)
     
  25. synthetic.angel

    synthetic.angel Active Member

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    There is a common thread that runs through everything that I put on this Forum, which is:

    "How does this encourage a PS4 player to buy and enjoy TSW?"


    There is a core belief of mine that underpins this, which is:

    "TSW is very nearly ready to become a fully fledged triple A game, with lots and lots of content, and sold at a normal price, to a wide range of people. To some (the new vast majority) it will be a train driving game. To others it will be a technical railway operation simulation. Like Assetto Corsa, but for trains."

    So, I look at everything from marketing and publicity, to the DLC policy, the manuals and documentation, the ease of use of the UI, the trophy system and PS4 tie-in, through to individual modules in the simulation and their construction and programming, through to individual locomotives and how they look and operate.... always thinking about the above two points.

    I want TSW to really do very well. I am excited about it. I can't wait to see TSW2025 (but in 2025....).

    Some of my posts will drive people nuts, and I know that. Apologies.
     
  26. xD 2Bad4You

    xD 2Bad4You Well-Known Member

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    People just need to take into consideration that a Simulator is different to a game.
    Creating routes, locos and rolling stock is a lot of work and costs money.
    Money that needs to be brought in again. TSW will never be a AAA game. That just isnt happening in a nieche market with the team size and money that DTG has.
    Its AA with a bit more polish and bug fixes.

    Simulators are expensive. Planes for Flight simulators are one example. Compared to those the TSW prices are rather fair. Even most of the TSXX routes are more expensive. A Simulator isnt really aimed at the totally casual market.

    And i´m not saying they couldnt do any better in terms of responding to bugs and such things. It takes way too long
     
    Last edited: Sep 6, 2019
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  27. Factor41

    Factor41 Well-Known Member

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    I take your point, but I'm guessing it's not in their plan to keep changing the initial bundle (and keep having to update the base set of trophies along with it), particularly now they've developed the AP game element of it into what feels more like a finished product. 100% of the time it's been on consoles seems like 'usual' to me :D

    Three bundled packs seems like a good amount too - gives you three different countries to keep most players happy, and enough passenger/freight variety to get a decent amount of play before you really need to download more.

    Totally agree. The very nature of TSW means it's never going to be more than a niche product, but hopefully it'll be a niche that will bring in enough cash for DTG to thrive, grow and keep producing quality DLC. There's certainly enough people suggesting routes to keep them busy and the level of polish is definitely higher in the later DLC as they're getting to grips more with UE4. A few more bug fixes here and there, and it'll be a very strong product.
     
    Last edited: Sep 6, 2019
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  28. synthetic.angel

    synthetic.angel Active Member

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    Assetto Corsa is a Simulator. A comprehensive simulator. So is GT Sport (even though Polyphony have magically made it possible to play it with a DualShock.... but with a steering wheel it is a simulator). Project Cars 2 is a simulator. And they are all games.

    Goat Simulator isn't a simulator, but interest in it is not limited to Goat Herders.

    Sim City is/was a "town and country planning" simulator - possibly the driest subject that you could ever want to simulate.... (and this is being said by a sometimes train enthusiast...) ....with surely the smallest audience imaginable.... - but one of the most successful games ever.

    Train Sim World, has potential to be AAA. Add an Indian route, a Chinese route and a Japanese route, and it will be a world-wide AAA game. The thing that is holding TSW back right now isn't polish. TSW2020 made some key advances on TSW, but it hasn't been done properly. They will get it right, but I would like them to do this sooner rather than later, because I am starting to get old and grey.

    DTG need to sort out the UI first, and be sure that everything that is published - and I do mean everything - is completely clear of bugs.

    Otherwise it won't make it to AA. And the AA won't be towing TSW to the nearest depot.
     
  29. xD 2Bad4You

    xD 2Bad4You Well-Known Member

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    Thats how opinions differ. The UI for me is the least important thing i want to see improved in the game
     
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  30. ARuscoe

    ARuscoe Well-Known Member

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    Except they only model a few miles of circuit most of which people can't go out and photograph on the average wednesday
    "Driving games" also have a limited shelf life in that each generation comes extant. If TSx is anything to go by then TSW could be around for a decade (subject to hardware)
     
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  31. synthetic.angel

    synthetic.angel Active Member

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    Yes, of course. I completely understand that. My point is about creating a broad appeal to new PS4 customers, and improving their retention, and future custom. Bringing them "on board", and encouraging them to "stay on the rails" and "enjoy the journey".

    I suspect that you quite like TSW as a simulator. And I suspect that you are well invested and "retained". The UI isn't that important, and maybe it never was, and it never will be. It might not matter if it is a struggle to start with, because that can be worked around if you are interested enough in the simulator, and after a while, the UI just becomes an inconvenience. And perhaps even more inconvenient if it gets changed/improved, because it then needs to be learned again, when you just want to get to the simulator.

    But that is not what a fifteen year old goes through - if they are given barriers, then they will just move straight on to something else, like Fortnite. And it's not what a fifty year old goes through - if they are given barriers, then they will just move straight on to something else, like clearing the loft for a model railway.

    For me, the most important thing is also the simulator. I can quite happily get around the UI, knowing there are bits glaringly wrong with it, ignore the AP system (good introduction, but not really optimised, at all), ignore trophies, etc., and get straight down to the nitty gritty of the challenge provided by the Clas 47 in NTP across those gradients. That's just me, and a very few other people, in a very niche, and select group. We'll put up with anything, and maybe at any price. That market is very small.

    But....I'd like more people to enjoy TSW, and learn to appreciate the simulator (which is superb), even if they think they are playing a game. And I genuinely think that the market out there is much much bigger than maybe some people a think. More people buying, more people playing. More money for investment in the simulator, so that we get fully modelled slip/adhesion at the wheel/rail interface in TSW2025.... etc.
     
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  32. synthetic.angel

    synthetic.angel Active Member

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    The dozens of tracks that come with modern racing games are laser scanned. They have photo-realistic graphics, and hundreds of very finely modelled cars, with mm detail inside and out. The cars individually run on a fairly sophisticated physical model, including suspension geometry, aero, power, mass, and tyre/road interface (grip and gravity, etc.) which changes in real time. And GT Sport provides a free DLC update with several new cars every month, and a new track every two or three months -- you can buy the whole game for £15. Now, obviously it has built up a broader appeal over the years.... but anyway... that is an aside....

    The GOOD NEWS is that you are right that I was wrong about the loco DLC for the NEC/RT routes. These loco DLCs can be bought and played on TSW2020 on PlayStation Store (inferring from Dmitri's message), because the RT/NEC routes are (apparently accidentally) included in a six route pack. This is great! Hopefully they won't change this.

    I think that this could be the right model going forwards. So, TSW2021 would include GWE/NEC/RT, NTP/MSB/LIRR and TVL/RSN/SFJ - that's nine routes, for £25. They could also roll in the loco DLC for everything apart from TVL/RSN/SFJ as part of the same £25 package. The very latest routes and locos could be made available as paid for DLC, for a year, for those that want early access.

    The great thing about developing for PS4 is that PS5 will also run PS4 titles, so there is a good ten years or so of development available here.
     
  33. UnlimitedMagic

    UnlimitedMagic Well-Known Member

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    Exactly
     
  34. underwaterdick

    underwaterdick Active Member

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    I agree with you here.
    The UI works, ok, it's not up to the apple apple standard of a big idiot proof icon which you are not allowed to delete, but it works.

    I don't think I have ever played a simulation game where starting it is as easy as the "Start game" of a console FPS...
    The reason being that there is so much to decide on and different methods of play. For example, location, rolling stock type, weather, scenario or service mode.

    The simulation is key for me too, not the UI
     
  35. underwaterdick

    underwaterdick Active Member

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    But racing games are often sponsored by multi million pound organisations who want their Motorsport related brands seen in game. They also usually have many expensive tie-ins with the real world to generate interest and revenue.
    GT certainly wouldn't be a fraction of the game it is without this money.

    Regarding the scanning of tracks and measurement of cars... You are once again talking about companies participating that want their technology demonstrated and the results of their testing sent to other customers. Or car manufacturers who are happy for someone to analyse their cars and share the data with them.
    Not to mention the fact that tracks and cars are modern and can be tested.

    The routes in TSW can be old ones, with old stock, and cannot be replicated in the real world. Scenery has to cover large distances of railway and not a small racing circuit.

    This is a different ball game to a racing sim sim for many reasons.
    More like a flight sim in terms of modelling and physics. - It has to be a good playable approximation of how the train handles on that route, rather than a racing game designed to replicate the real world as far as possible.
     
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  36. synthetic.angel

    synthetic.angel Active Member

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    I agree with you, agreeing that the simulation is the most important thing, and not the UI. My main point is that in order to get a wider customer base, to generate the income to develop the simulator, and provide more content, more quickly, and at a cheaper price, that it is important to have a minimum standard on things like:

    - a clean and functioning and accurate UI
    - well written informative manuals and documentation
    - bug-free content (especially the tutorial content...!)
    - a decent amount of content
    - an understandable and fair DLC policy
    - decent customer support/service

    Racing games are, admittedly, an unfair comparison (although they show what can be done with a PS4...). And yes - simulation games often ignore developing the UI, and that includes racing games like Assetto Corsa (a really bad UI, which people tolerated, because the simulation is awesome).

    Anyway - the good news is that with TSW for PS4, some progress has now been made on the "decent amount of content" bit. Six routes for £25 is probably about half-way there. If they add three more routes per year to the base game "bundle", then there could be as many as fifteen routes available (as a single bundle, for £25) by 2022. And if they are all bug-free, with a decent "gamer" UI, then TSW2022 on PS5 will take off.... (And the simulation at the core will be even better, and the options will be wider - everyone* wins).

    *(well, nearly everyone)
     
    Last edited: Sep 11, 2019
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  37. idiosis

    idiosis Member

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    How about fixing NEC? I mean it's only been out since March 2018...

    Seriously though who releases a route in the state NEC is in and then decides "yup that'll do".
     
  38. spina304

    spina304 Member

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    Mayby march 2022? . Dont bee too impatient. Dtg mayby didnt fixed the route, but give us a free of bugs dlc, as a free gift for this sweet route ... sorry it isnt free You have to buy it , and safe system are not working. ..
     
  39. synthetic.angel

    synthetic.angel Active Member

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    Guys... not sure if this helps, but NEC was patched yesterday (freight services):
    https://forums.dovetailgames.com/threads/train-sim-world-playstation-updates.15673/#post-95412

    If that doesn't cover what needs to be fixed, then have a look at this page:
    https://forums.dovetailgames.com/threads/forum-list-of-known-bugs-and-issues-poll.18278/

    I have a feeling that a community tracker for Bugs and Issues will be appearing in the next couple of weeks... ;-)
     
  40. ARuscoe

    ARuscoe Well-Known Member

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    There are posts for each route already all over the forum, but feel free to start new ones and hopefully they don't descend into anarchy too quickly.
     
  41. synthetic.angel

    synthetic.angel Active Member

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    Well, I was hoping that DTG would put out, and maintain, a single definitive list. Their process for managing faults might appear to be chaotic from the outside, but anarchic would imply there is no governance at all.... That seems a bit unfair, but maybe you are right.

    Your suggestion that maybe it would be better for someone else to manage the list might be a good one!
     
  42. ARuscoe

    ARuscoe Well-Known Member

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    I wasn't talking about DTGs bugfixing process... I was referring to the posts on this site being anarchic
     
  43. bowie87

    bowie87 New Member

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    Hello! I'm new there, as I am thinking of getting TSW2020.
    Is the RT DLC still included for the PS4-Version? It's still not available seperately and I really like the Talent 2. Otherwise I would get it on Xbox at the current sale and buy RT extra. Thanks in advance for your answers!
     
  44. Factor41

    Factor41 Well-Known Member

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    I believe so, yes. I think it was part of the core download for PS4 so everybody gets it by default. They may change this in future, but seems to be the case for now, which is why it isn't yet available separately.
     
  45. TrainSim-Dmitri

    TrainSim-Dmitri Staff Member

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    RT and NEC are included in the TSW 2020 package for PS4 users currently.
     
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  46. bowie87

    bowie87 New Member

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    Thank you for the answers. I couldn't reply yesterday, as I was busy with playing TSW.
     
  47. Doomotron

    Doomotron Active Member

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    Polyphony spend about 6 months modelling each car, which I presume is how long DTG spend making a route. Imagine if the trains were that detailed...
    I've suggested this in the past. Negative reception, obviously, but I'm certain the money made from free content all of the time would easily self-fund making the routes and trains. If not, there's nothing stopping DTG from getting a publishing deal or even selling the company to Sony Interacive Entertainment or Microsoft.
    Like TSW, Gran Turismo was going to be a niche product. Nobody had done a racing simulator before, which is why when Polyphony Digital was started (they were then called Polys Entertainment), they 'hid' Gran Turismo in their arcade racer Motor Toon Grand Prix* (which I desperately want a remake of). However, when Sony realised Motor Toon got positive reviews because of its more realistic physics than other arcade racers, they greenlighted Gran Turismo. It's the best selling game on the PS1, and nobody saw it coming. So maybe it's not that Train Sim World isn't a niche product, it just hasn't broken into the market yet.

    *There was an unlockable car in the game which was a realistic racing car, and the physics were more realistic.
    Didn't Assetto Corsa have a 1960s version of Monza, and Gran Turismo 80s versions of it and Brands Hatch? And I'm sure a (terrible) racing game on the Dreamcast (probably) had a version of Nurburgring Sudschleife, which was closed decades before it was modelled.
     

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