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Some Random Questions

Discussion in 'PC Discussion' started by voltajtepes#7278, Feb 20, 2021.

  1. voltajtepes#7278

    voltajtepes#7278 Member

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    1. What is the "lead truck"?
    2. Why is the "Sanding Lead Truck" button a toggle, but the "Sand" button a momentary pushbutton?
    3. Can I run out of sand? If not, why not just leave it on every time (other than realism)? Does it slow me down?
    4. In my current timetable scenario, I have the following: Two SD40's (3000 HP each) pulling 6700 tons east. Not a good HP/tonnage ratio. I get stuck at the 1.2% grade just before Sand Patch. No matter what I try.
    So.. I was thinking can I do this?:
    Unhook about half the cars.. go up the hill past Sand Patch or somewhere that the grade starts going down hill. Park, disconnect everything.. take my engines.. find a way to go back and get the first half of cars.. bring them up the hill then back over to where the other half of cars are ... lol... Well I think you know what I mean.. is this possible?
     
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  2. Olaf the Snowman

    Olaf the Snowman Well-Known Member

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    1. In the United States, a truck is what we in the UK would call a bogie. So the lead truck would be the front bogie (which is the front 3 axles and put very simply, the front half of the train)

    2. Sanding Lead Truck provides sand to the number one axle of the loco you’re in- this will light up the white ‘Sand’ button in the cab. Whereas the Sand button will cause sand to deposit from all locos in the consist. As this will use a lot more sand, this is why they made it a push button so you use it when absolute necessary. The Sanding Lead Truck switch uses a lot less sand and is normally adequate for most conditions.

    3. Yes, in real life you can run out of sand- I guess not in the game though. Obviously, the amount of sand that will be on the train is finite so yes, it will eventually run out. The way modern trains work in the UK is that sand is automatically deposited when wheelslide (during braking) is experienced. Depending on traction, some even will deposit sand automatically when wheelslip (during acceleration) is experienced. So, sand isn’t used exclusively to slow you down- it is used to give you better grip or adhesion thus reducing wheelslide (during braking) and wheelsip (during acceleration). During emergency braking, sand is deposited continuously until the train comes to a stop regardless of whether or not wheelslide is detected.

    If sand levels are low on modern train, a warning light or warning on the TMS will come up. Depending on company/traction and weather conditions, you may have to stop and contact the signaller and take train out of service at first convenient opportunity. For traction that automatically deposit sand for both wheelslip and wheelslide, during low sand levels it will only deposit automatically sand for wheelslide in order to preserve sand for when braking.

    During preparation of the train when it leaves the maintenance depot, the sander will be checked manually by pressing the sander button in the cab and then getting out of the train to manually check sand has been deposited. Of course, if sand levels are low then they will be topped up by the maintenance team.

    Another quirk when it comes to manually pressing the sander button, some traction you can only press it when you’re accelerating. Other traction, you can only press it while you’re braking. On some American locos, you can only manually deposit sand when you’re below a certain speed- e.g. 15 mph. Another difference between traction is that you may have to be in a certain brake position before sand is automatically deposited which is why in low adhesion conditions, instructions are such that you are required to use minimum step 3 or 50% braking, for example.

    On the subject of sand running out- the Voyagers (Class 22x) used to have the ‘one shot sander.’ So you could only use the sander once and that’s it, there would be no more sand. That all changed when a voyager hit the buffer stops at Chester so now they all have proper Sander equipment.

    DE36F428-579C-45D6-A702-57124F2E0F1B.jpeg
     
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  3. Olaf the Snowman

    Olaf the Snowman Well-Known Member

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    In the example below, there are 2 bogies. In America, bogies are called trucks so it means the same thing.
    Each bogie/truck has 3 axles. As there are 2 bogies, there are 6 axles in total on this loco.
    Each axle has 2 wheels- one on each side, you can only see the right side in the picture. So there are 12 wheels in total on this loco.

    E245D1A7-8638-4448-9270-2A555AE15387.jpeg



    E521001B-34E5-448F-A099-F49BA74F70D6.jpeg
     
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  4. Lamplight

    Lamplight Well-Known Member

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    First of all: Are you absolutely sure you set up the trail and lead loco correctly?
    For the first engine:
    Engine run, generator field, fuel pump ON
    MU-2A valve LEAD or DEAD
    Cut-out valve for auto brake Freight
    For the second engine:
    Engine run, generator field, fuel pump OFF
    MU-2A valve Trail 6 or 26
    Cut-out valve for auto brake CUT OUT

    If all of this is set up correctly, did you (try to) keep to the speed limit as closely as possible to get a good run up? Did you try using sand to gain traction? What weather conditions did you play with? You‘ll have a lot less traction in winter for example.
    If you tried all of this, then the service is simply underpowered with 2x SD40-2 and you should have at least one more powerful loco (C40-8W, AC4400CW) in your consist and try again.

    You can‘t. The switches are all remotely controlled, not manual ones. You either make it with your entire train or not at all.
     
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  5. JGRudnick

    JGRudnick Well-Known Member

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    The SD40-2s in the game are very underpowered. What service were you running?
     
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  6. MetrolinkF125#916

    MetrolinkF125#916 Well-Known Member

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    Well you can’t get half the train up the hill and go back for the other half, this’ll be a time consumer and u can’t set the switches anyways. U gotta be able to get the whole train up the hill, to do this both locos gotta be FUNCTIONAL.

    Lead SD40:
    Engine Run, GEN field, Fuel Pump ON
    Reverser IN and in FWD
    Cut-out valve (located under the AUTOMATIC brake) FREIGHT
    MU-2A valve LEAD OR DEAD

    Trailing SD40:
    Engine Run, GEN field, Fuel Pump OFF
    Reverser OUT
    Cut out valve CUT OUT
    MU-2A valve TRAIL 6 OR 26

    These settings mean the lead loco is operational and the engineer will be operating the train from this cab, so all controls must be ON for this to work. No one is in the trailing loco so that cab has to be shut off, meaning the controls have to be turned off since the lead loco is operational. Like in British/German EMUs, u have to shut off the opposite end cab cuz ur not operating the train from there. If all this is good but the train cannot be moved still, I suggest u try doing the service but with 2x AC4400CW locos or multiple Dash 8s, or at least one heavy GE and one EMD loco (preferably SD40 than GP38, 3000 vs 2000HP), if you have more horsepower u can get the train up the hill with less difficulty, I know someone already stated these settings but I’m just restating.

    Hope this helps!:)
     
    Last edited: Feb 20, 2021
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  7. Lamplight

    Lamplight Well-Known Member

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    Knew I forgot something. Thanks for adding this.
     
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  8. kalteVollmilch

    kalteVollmilch Well-Known Member

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    It sounds as if the engines are simply underpowered, having a power-weight ration of less than 1 hp per ton.
    You could try 2 things:
    1) simply uncouple some waggons if you get stuck and then carry on - they will stay where you leave them and they will mess up the route, so maybe don't plan another trip on SPG without reloading the map :D
    2) restart the service until you get some more powerful traction. Maybe look if this service also is available for the AC44
     
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  9. voltajtepes#7278

    voltajtepes#7278 Member

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    Thanks everyone. Yes I set up the pair exactly as shown. I did try sand. I am ok up to about 0.9% (ish) then when I hit a grade of just over 1.0% I start to slide. (I had gone full speed to get a running start but could not get faster than about 15 mph on a 0.5% grade).
    I did end up disconnecting about half of the cars and was able to finish the route. Ok I found it was N536 (now I see I could have taken the larger locos). I just really enjoy the SD40 but I guess I can't complete the entire time table with only this loco.

    Thanks Olaaf for the great description on the sand technology! That is very helpful.
     
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  10. solicitr

    solicitr Well-Known Member

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    The SD-40 has 3000 hp, which American railroads have found is a very useful modular unit of power which is why it was so popular for so long, but the key word there is modular. In planning a consist they just keep adding locos until there's enough juice, and a run like N536 simply wouldn't be sent over a grade like Sand Patch (or any grade, really) with just two of them. In RL, CSX might just add more SD40s. It's not uncommon to see long coal consists with four up front and two more at the back, sometimes with a pair in the middle as well (TSW doesn't model the really big trains).

    But one way or the other you're going to need close to 1.5 hppt, or 10k hp. Even a pair of AC4400s isn't quite that much (8800), but it's 1.3 hppt and should be enough.
     
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  11. MetrolinkF125#916

    MetrolinkF125#916 Well-Known Member

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    True, and in modern days I don’t think railroads use the SD40 anymore, but instead opt for more powerful locos, like ES44ACs, SD70s, and AC4400s. More raw power for coal hauling I think was the reason for locos like the SD90MAC and AC6000CW, even if those locos performed badly in those scenarios.
     

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