Speculation: What's Coming Up ?

Discussion in 'Train Sim World Discussion' started by Yerolo, Apr 21, 2022.

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  1. Disintegration7

    Disintegration7 Well-Known Member

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    So, this is an interesting nugget from the new Railfan TV thread that seems to confirm there is no Amtrak P42 currently in development, and suggests there might never be (bold highlight is mine for emphasis):

    "Monday, April 25th - Creator Spotlight - TrainSimulatorDriver - Pennsylvania On The Curve

    This video came about after a discussion with DTG’s JD on an idea I had for building a scenario that is pushing Scenario Planner in TSW2 about as far as you can and using as much of the available “rail estate” as you can to make a lively scenario which is unusual, fills a gap in the route that could never happen commercially, and most of all, is fun."

    For context, He's talking about running the ACS-64 across the curve in off-the-rails mode via Scenario Planner.

    This seems to mesh with earlier statements from DTG that loco DLC's aren't very profitable and makes me wonder if DTG are scrapping loco DLC's altogether (the Class 313 was the last one from DTG IIRC), and we'll only get them from 3rd parties, like the G6 from TSG.

    This would be pretty disappointing if true.
     
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  2. Lamplight

    Lamplight Well-Known Member

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    Since those are Paul's words, I wouldn't necessarily attribute them to DTG. We all know that a P42 or Charger is pretty much a no-go for now. When questioned, Matt has assured us that loco DLCs are not abandoned but I do worry as well. Actions speak louder than words and the fact of the matter is that there's been no indication of any DTG loco DLC since the 313. Besides, we all know that what Matt talks about and what the bean counters decide can be two very different things (no offence, Matt).
     
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  3. Mr JMB

    Mr JMB Well-Known Member

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    No, the point he is making is Amtrak will never run their trains over those tracks, it is an "off the rails" scenario so it is not uncommercial from DTG's viewpoint but from Amtrak's.
     
  4. solicitr

    solicitr Well-Known Member

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    Well, Amtrak does run its trains over the Curve; but they are necessarily diesels and so you would never see an ACS-64 there.

    The biggest problem with Amtrak is that they run so very few services. A route with only 2 trains per day is hardly worth building.
     
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  5. OldVern

    OldVern Well-Known Member

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    Re loco DLC's, there are still a few BR Blue era classics waiting to be done and I'm sure they would sell quite well. We also need a better variety of DMU's, a Thumper and even a Pacer or decent Sprinter. However it does look as if they won't be arriving outside a dedicated route which of course spins the circle that there's nothing apparent on the horizon for the UK there either, apart from the steam line.
     
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  6. Cyklisten

    Cyklisten Well-Known Member

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    This was never the way I planned , not my intention. I got so brave, drink in hand, lost my discretion… But today I bought TSC, mostly fot the new Liepzig Riesa extension. Well, I was about to leave TS for good and just use TSW, but I'm still coming back if there is something interesting. And this extension, it would be so amazing if we got it for TSW2, of course with ICE T and... sorry for mentioning it... the IC cab car.
     
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  7. meridian#2659

    meridian#2659 Well-Known Member

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    Next tuesday its time for another roadmap stream. After "a german route" is announced, i hope they will give more information on that.

    So what are your thoughts? Will it be another stream with much talk and nothing said in the end, or do they plan a little surprise to keep their customers interested.
     
  8. hyperlord

    hyperlord Well-Known Member

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    Oh I think insights from the work Adam's team has done might take a big chunk in that upcoming stream. There should be stuff coming out all the time from QA, right?
     
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  9. redrev1917

    redrev1917 Well-Known Member

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    Until a DTG loco DLC appears on the map I will assume they have discontinued making them. After all the 313 has been out 6+ months now and when exactly was the last loco DLC actually added to the road map? Maybe 12 months ago?
     
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  10. mattwild55

    mattwild55 Well-Known Member

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    I generally try not to be too negative but I have to say it does look like there's hardly anything going on at the moment other than SoS (which I am really looking forward to, my perceived shortcomings aside).

    I would really hope to see much more content on the roadmap soon as my interest is starting to run a bit dry. I wonder what happened to the idea of doing a Class 800 for BML?
     
  11. dhekelian

    dhekelian Well-Known Member

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    It does seem that DTG have abandoned Loco DLC's which is a shame and means our routes will not be flushed out unless third parties make them. IS that DTG's intention? That DTG make the routes and third parties the Loco's? Do you think that would work? It would be nice if DTG could actually inform us if this is the case.

    Given the quickness of the TVL update it seems not everybody behind the scenes is working on SOS and given the admission of a lull in output by DTG I still can't figure out why the slow pace of the preservation updates. If they are spacing them out in case they need fixes then why are they testing them in QA, just release them and the player base will test them like they do anyway, TVL an apt example.
     
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  12. OldVern

    OldVern Well-Known Member

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    It depends on the third party (looking at you, Rivet).

    Would also mean DTG should look at substantially recruiting into the associate programme, including putting out feelers and encouragement plus offers of training to established TSC developers.
     
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  13. redrev1917

    redrev1917 Well-Known Member

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    A big part of the problem with getting 3rd parties involved has to be the hostile and negativity they face from some quarters of the community. Recently I've even seen TSG getting bashed despite the quality of their locos

    It's hardly inspiring to potential developers to take time from producing TS content in a program they know and experienced in to take a step back and learn a new program and editor knowing that if it's not perfect at the first attempt they'll get slated by the community is it?
     
    Last edited: Apr 26, 2022
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  14. volvolover1972

    volvolover1972 Well-Known Member

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    It could be that loco DLCs just don't sell well. Compared to a new route, the only people that are interested in loco addons are those who own the route already AND enjoy the route enough that they want more content for it. That's such a significant decrease in the target audience that I wouldn't be surprised if loco DLCs barely break even for DTG. It makes more financial sense for DTG to include new locos with new routes and then use layers or substitution to put it on older routes where appropriate
     
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  15. redrev1917

    redrev1917 Well-Known Member

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    That's the issue with tying locos to routes.

    Imagine if they didn't and a loco dlc would layer into 2/3 different routes. Not only are you doubling or tripling the customer base of those eligible to purchase it but also creating extra value to the pack so increasing sales further.
     
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  16. meridian#2659

    meridian#2659 Well-Known Member

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    My personal guess on Loco Dlcs is, that the Spirit of Steam keeps the entire Vehicle Team busy. We get 3 New types of mark 1 coaches (tso, bso & fk each in 2 liveries), a New Brakevan, new Five Plank & a new 16t Mineral Wagon, a new Conflat A Wagon and finally 2 brand new steam engines. It would just make sense, if they are actually working on a unannounced loco or Wagon dlc, which releases together with sos. This much effort for a single route, i wouldnt allow a "fire and forget" release as a director. It has to come with at least 3 Rolling stock dlc packages available from the release date of spirit of steam.

    Those vehicle addons gives every route variety. Its still a major problem that tsw lacks much of rolling stock. The result is an entire empty glasgow central for example. In my opinion they should even expand the vehicle team.

    About Rivet and Skyhook making the third party loco dlcs:
    So lets be honest, Rivet did a steep learning courve and the latest flirt is a solid product. But the fact they screwed up 2 diesel hydraulic locos, makes me question if customers would be happy if they announce a "cl 56" for example. This is just my personal opinion, but Rivets Trains are still way too generic in technical terms. Maybe they gonna model the dual brake mods, but for sure not switchable exhausters and compressors.

    About Skyhook.
    Instead of bashing them, i recommend to use their positive sides and talents. They can do routes, still think they have made the best distance scenery in tsw available.
    So for a brand new loco their skill and passion is just not enough in my opinion. Too much copy paste, wrong branding, sounds, but a good modeling. Would be nice if they take a course "how to make a loco from scratch" with adam.

    This doesnt mean skyhook shouldnt do loco dlcs, instead they could make high hood versions or going for a freight wagon pack. But what happend with the 187, is just a f.u right into a customers face. With their current approach on Rolling stock, its very welcome for me if they just focus on a route and reuse the stock, instead of release a new loco, which ends up broken for the entire tsw history.
     
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  17. solicitr

    solicitr Well-Known Member

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    Actually it can work in reverse. For example, I bought Haupstrecke Rhein-Ruhr, which I had no particular interest in, simply so I could get the BR 101.
     
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  18. Irish Train sim

    Irish Train sim Well-Known Member

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    A long UK route would be nice. My guess/hope/outside dream is Newcastle to York. Mileage isn’t much longer than current longest route. Class 800’s on Transpennine, Lumo and LNER. All that’s needed is a re-skin on those, a lot of countryside in the route, only Newcastle being the main built up area. Hasn’t been a UK route in a while so must be thinking something big. A lot of potential for loco DLC.

    Unlikely but not impossible and a lot of reasons as to why this could happen. One can dream eh?
     
    Last edited: Apr 26, 2022
  19. redrev1917

    redrev1917 Well-Known Member

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    Please not a class 800, give us a deltic or even a class 91. But please not yet another drab boring trainset.
     
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  20. Irish Train sim

    Irish Train sim Well-Known Member

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    I’d quite like the 800. Class 91 would also be a great shout but most companies going for the 800 nowadays so makes sense to have one somewhere, plus it’s not going to be a complete redesign for future DLC. Just makes sense and I like the modern stuff too personally.
     
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  21. OldVern

    OldVern Well-Known Member

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    Something like a German Class 103 or other older electric or a diesel like the 216 or 218* maybe a classic V200 could get it's own Journey Mode and layers on all the German routes. Maybe not strictly prototypical but that doesn't have to be an issue. Just insert a few railtours. That would give loco and stock DLC a much wider target.

    Likewise for the UK, there are several loco types and many first gen heritage DMU's that could get the same treatment.

    It really needs DTG to take a chance and have a bit of vision, can only hope once SoS releases the blinkers come off and we can get back to a nice catalogue of releases.

    Pushing out Scenario Editor 2.0 with (hopefully) a consist builder would also stimulate purchase of standalone loco etc DLC.

    * I believe one is rumoured to be in planned but current status unknown.
     
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  22. driverwoods#1787

    driverwoods#1787 Well-Known Member

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    I agree with those. DTG needs to make a GDR Deutsche Reichsbahn route. That way there's a DR V60 DR BR106 DR BR 119 U-Boat home depot for them is Dresden Friedrichstadt the missing yard on Riesa-Dresden. Furthermore DR BR211 DR BR242 electric locomotives with reskinned DR BR132 DR BR250 DR BR243 followed by 18 201 65.10 Rekolok 52.80. Those GDR locomotives will change DCZ and Riesa-Dresden.
    You have a chance of a Stadtseexpress set running IC55 to Koln Hbf via Riesa IC17 Warnemunde with DR BR250 DR BR132. S-Bahn DR Dosto with DR BR243
     
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  23. Lamplight

    Lamplight Well-Known Member

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    Agreed. I’d love something like a railtour DLC. If DTG ever do a (contemporary) route around Koblenz, that could serve nicely as a home route for the older electrics given the museum there. Last time I was in Koblenz, they had something like 4 or 6 Br 103s standing around - all (or almost all - not quite sure) still running. One of the last 2 remaining Br 150s is there as well (also still running). In general, they’ve got an amazing collection of old electrics in Koblenz.
     
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  24. londonmidland

    londonmidland Well-Known Member

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    Hopefully not another modern British third rail electric route, featuring the x'th revision of the Electrostar, yet again.
     
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  25. driverwoods#1787

    driverwoods#1787 Well-Known Member

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    You mean an Einheitselektrolokomotive Translated as Standard electric locomotive. For the Musuem in Koblenz it has DB BR218 and DB BR211/212. Speaking of DB BR211/212 will it play like its East German counter Part the DR V100 from Main Spessart Bahn or not? Halle Musuem has a DR BR131 DR BR132 which does fit Dresden Routes
     
  26. tallboy7648

    tallboy7648 Well-Known Member

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    Yet skyhook built cane creek which in reality has a train or two run every week. They did add fake services to not have very little services on the in game timetable. But I do agree that it makes no sense to make a route that sees 2 services a day
     
    Last edited: Apr 27, 2022
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  27. tallboy7648

    tallboy7648 Well-Known Member

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    There is an easy way to avoid that. Don't charge $30 for a route dlc. When the arosa line released for example it certainly wasn't a $30 dlc because of the various issues with the route. Had the dlc been cheaper then perhaps it wouldn't have gotten that much backlash since it is cheap. If a third party is gonna charge $30 which is alot of money, then frankly they should have the same high expectations that dtg get with their dlc's and the same criticisms if said dlc is in a terrible/buggy condition even if it is their first dlc.
     
    Last edited: Apr 27, 2022
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  28. meridian#2659

    meridian#2659 Well-Known Member

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    Thats what i think too. Looking at the DB BR101 and DB BR187, you get both for 20 euros. While the 101 is worth way more in my opinion, i have no idea what skyhook was thinking.
    With their release, they lost 90% of the customerbase for day 1 purchais or maybe even at all.
    This wasnt a mistake similar to the wrong physics as in rivets dlc. No this was a 1:1 copy paste with a new model. They didnt choose any beta testers, probably because they knew how bad it was.

    I like that dtg doesnt want to give strict rules to a third party, but in that case this cash grab made a lot of damage to Tsw. Dtgs quality management failed entirely.

    So sry if im not very happy right now with skyhook making any release of brand new loco dlcs. If they dont care about the rolling stock, they should just go for 2nd party.
     
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  29. driverwoods#1787

    driverwoods#1787 Well-Known Member

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    Good point lets see if Just Trains the newest TSW 2 3rd party will be better than Skyhook and Rivet Games in terms of Rolling stock and matching train waggons
     
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  30. theorganist

    theorganist Well-Known Member

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    Just Trains haven't released any stock for years, certainly not UK stock. Their steam engine builder is no longer with them if I recall. The last diesel was probably the class 67 or 20, or maybe the Voyager and that has been out for several years. I wonder if they even have anyone on their team who builds stock. Maybe they do now.
     
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  31. mldaureol2

    mldaureol2 Active Member

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    How about the Class 222 (Advanced) for their Midland Main line.
    Mike.
     
  32. theorganist

    theorganist Well-Known Member

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    The class 222 advanced was released in 2015 if I recall, I have certainly had it some years. Obviously it has had a new reskin for the newest EMR purple livery.

    They haven't released any new stock for a long time.
     
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  33. volvolover1972

    volvolover1972 Well-Known Member

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    Just Trains stock has typically been lackluster to be honest. Nothing compared to Armstrong Powerhouse. The S8 is probably their best release to date in terms of quality.
     
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  34. theorganist

    theorganist Well-Known Member

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    It was good back in the day, I thought the class 153 advanced was amazing when it was released, I guess they are showing their age now. The steam engines are very good and up there with the best I would say.

    I had forgot about the S8 stock, that must be their most recent "stock" release, I wonder if it was created "in house".
     
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  35. mldaureol2

    mldaureol2 Active Member

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    Have to agree that the S8 stock is a quality release, however the scripting to make the stock realistic takes a heavy toll on my PC frame rates compared to other LuL stock e.g. the VDL C69/D79 stock.
    Mike.
     
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  36. trainnick77

    trainnick77 Member

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    I would suspect there is quite a bit going on at DTG, I believe Matt said at one point They are usually working on three routes at a time. I suspect the reason we are not hearing anything is they are working on the summer revamp which usually includes three routes.
     
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  37. AirbourneAlex

    AirbourneAlex Well-Known Member

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    Will they build three bespoke routes for a summer release or just bundle three fairly new existing routes together? Last year they had difficulty getting the routes to release at the same time, so changed it to that season ticket thingy. Personally I don't see them making three new routes by the time summer is over when we still haven't got Spirit of Steam. They could always change it to a big winter release, or simply not do anything (which the Train Simulator Classic rebrand seems to imply).
     
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  38. AirbourneAlex

    AirbourneAlex Well-Known Member

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    According to their website "We are growing fast, and currently employ more than 200 passionate & creative individuals at our home in the Historic Dockyard Chatham"

    Bearing in mind not all of them work for TSW, and not all of them are actually doing game development (accountants, receptionists etc), but given TSW2 is their biggest title I suspect it's a large chunk of that number.
     
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  39. krustynuggets

    krustynuggets Well-Known Member

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    So how many people do you think work on their other non railway products i wonder??...........
     
  40. AirbourneAlex

    AirbourneAlex Well-Known Member

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    No idea specifically, but certainly far fewer than TSW and TSC. Their upcoming board games project may see that expand however.
     
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  41. krustynuggets

    krustynuggets Well-Known Member

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    Would be interesting to see how many people work on their fishing sim and I'm sure there are multiple games too, so it's probably not as many people as you think just working on the railway products........
     
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  42. chieflongshin

    chieflongshin Well-Known Member

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    I have a feeling next weeks roadmap steam is going to have a coal load of new things in it.

    SOS.
     
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  43. mrchuck

    mrchuck Well-Known Member

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    I wonder if we’ll get a hint of what the next us route is going to be on TSW 2.
     
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  44. Disintegration7

    Disintegration7 Well-Known Member

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    Hopefully a hint of ANYTHING..it's almost completely barren after SoS.
     
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  45. redrev1917

    redrev1917 Well-Known Member

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    Well given that according to DTG one of the reasons why the roadmap was reduced to monthly was that details of new routes would be announced in standalone articles unless they've done a u turn I don't expect any details of the new German route next week. I had expected something this week in all honesty but clearly right now DTG is throwing all marketing at TSC
     
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  46. volvolover1972

    volvolover1972 Well-Known Member

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    I'm praying the new German route doesn't reuse the same dostos for the 200th time.
     
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  47. jamesthepershing

    jamesthepershing Active Member

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    Don't forget there are physics differences between all the 80x units, sp it's not just as easy as a reskin.
     
  48. Irish Train sim

    Irish Train sim Well-Known Member

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    This is true but it’s not like it would be starting from scratch. Would be very similar if not the same regarding physics in the game. Who knows though, was just a suggestion.
     
  49. driverwoods#1787

    driverwoods#1787 Well-Known Member

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    How about something different third rail with Punktförmige zugbeeinflussung Hamburg S-Bahn or ZBS Berlin S-Bahn.
    If playing Hamburg S-Bahn future ÖBB and DB PZB routes use keyboard rather than operation shift to get access for PZB Release Override Acknowledge followed by headlights cruise control wipers
     
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  50. redrev1917

    redrev1917 Well-Known Member

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    Just what the community wants, yet another 3rd rail yawnfest
     
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