PlayStation Strange Pzb Behaviour On Hrr Or User Error?

Discussion in 'TSW Troubleshooting & Issues Discussion' started by li150special, Jun 28, 2021.

  1. li150special

    li150special Well-Known Member

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    I came across something which is a bit odd in my opinion.

    On HRR, between Mülheim (Ruhr)-Styrum and Mülheim (Ruhr) Hbf, there is an Lf1 signal (Langsamfahrscheibe) showing 9 for 90 km/h. If I understood the tutorial and other materials correctly, this needs to be acknowledged because the target speed is lower than 100 km/h. So I push the PZB acknowledge button, no problem.

    But then... the 1000Hz sign on the HUD turns yellow and the blue 85 box starts blinking.

    Is it correct that the speed is monitored to be lower than 85 km/h in this case. Because, technically, PZB of 85 km/h acutally means 80 km/h and the speed indicated by the Lf1 is 10 km/h higher than that.

    Does PZB acknowledge ALWAYS trigger the 1000Hz supervision at 85 km/h? Am I missing something here?


    Edit:

    I think I may have found a possible answer. It might be a speed testing section (Geschwindigkeitsprüfabschnitt).

    According to the (very good) documentation on a German website, an Lf1 signal showing "9" can be paired with a 1000Hz magnet. The monitoring is then for a speed of up to 105 km/h. Where an Lf1 shows "8", the monitoring is for up to 95 km/h.

    That would make sense to me.
     
    Last edited: Jun 28, 2021
  2. Lamplight

    Lamplight Well-Known Member

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    Indeed, glad you found the explanation yourself. The DTG manuals do a somewhat poor job of explaining PZB, but it baffles me to this day that Geschwindigkeitsprüfabschnitte are correctly modelled in the sim but never once mentioned in a manual. That‘s also the reason why I‘ve got an English explanation of them in red in my signature :D
     
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  3. solicitr

    solicitr Well-Known Member

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    Although it isn't really a factor in PZB Mode O, in Modes M and U a 1000-hz does require a speed reduction to under 70 (65) or 55 (50), followed by a resumption of the new line speed after the magnet supervision is off.

    The mitigating factor here is that passing a reduction between 50-90 km/h while going not more than 10 over that limit does not require acknowledgement or the above PZB slowdown. All reductions 40 and below do require acknowledgement.
     
    Last edited: Jun 29, 2021
  4. Lamplight

    Lamplight Well-Known Member

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    This is not correct. All reductions to or below 70 require an acknowledgement and trigger a 1000 Hz monitoring. All reduction to or above 80 feature what you describe, but not always with a 10 km/h tolerance. For some it‘s 10, for some 15, and for some even 20. Check out the red link in my signature for the exact tolerances for every possible reduction in permitted speed.
     
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  5. solicitr

    solicitr Well-Known Member

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    Thanks
     
  6. OpenMinded

    OpenMinded Well-Known Member

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    Thanks for that link in your signature. I always tried to find a decent English speaking site explaining this stuff. As I get asked occasionally to explain this to English speakers, this will come in handy in the future:cool:

    Nevertheless, I find it difficult to explain it without some illustrations. Therefore, allow me to also mention the Wikipedia article on Geschwindigkeitsprüfabschnitte. Just get your browser to translate it for you. I like the structure of this article, as it gives different cases with illustrations:
    https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Geschwindigkeitsprüfabschnitt

    And if you really want to get nerdy, check out the official DBNetz manual on it, which will be more difficult to translate, however:
    https://fahrweg.dbnetze.com/resourc...67029c36d9ec8dd5dea4a/rw_483-0101A01-data.pdf
     
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  7. li150special

    li150special Well-Known Member

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    Yes, I was only talking about PZB mode O. With M and U, of course, different speed limits apply. Sorry for the confusion.

    I find this page (in addition to the TSW forum, of course) highly valuable. Unfortunately, it is only available in German.

    http://www.tf-ausbildung.de/BahnInfo/gpa.htm
     
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