Stutters After Latest Updates.

Discussion in 'PC Discussion' started by Airbus A319, Oct 3, 2020.

  1. Airbus A319

    Airbus A319 New Member

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    I have searched the forums for stutters and appreciate that people have experienced this issue before.

    When I first purchased TSW 2, mainly for the Bakerloo line I was really happy with the performance, no stutters. I added a few mods and was content with what I was seeing.

    This morning after about 2 weeks of not running the software I fired it up to be presented with 3 updates. I let the updates run their due course. On entering the Bakerloo line cab I immediately noticed something was not right. Moving around the cab was all stuttery. It did settle down but I noticed stuuters in the tunnel and when I walked around at the first stop it was painful.

    I took out all the mods I had installed and tried again, same result. I played with the FPS unlimited down to 20 same result. It has basically become unplayable, for me anyway. The FPS are fine the stutters not.

    I was really quite happy before these updates is there anyway I can get back to a pre-update state ?

    Has anyone else experienced these issues and maybe has a solution.

    Thanks in advance.

    My PC Specs are:
    Nvidia GeForce GTX 1080
    Intel i7-8700K
    32 GB RAM
    Separate SSD for Steam and Windows

    It all work perfectly before the last updates.
     
    Last edited: Oct 3, 2020
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  2. JZJ90

    JZJ90 Active Member

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    Yes I have actually started experiencing these stutters on the East Coastway route after that update. It used to run absolutely perfectly, but not it stutters quite badly when playing. FPS is still a solid 60 other than when it stutters. I thought perhaps it was my machine but watching the gpu usage, it it solid around 60 to 70%
    It is a shame really because the update which was pushed to fix the issue with the AWS on the HUD, and the brake needle not animating, did not actually fix those 2 issues for me.
     
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  3. Richard CZE

    Richard CZE Well-Known Member

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    On my PS4 pro the game also stutters. It started with the advent of MSB DLC.
     
  4. chieflongshin

    chieflongshin Well-Known Member

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    I’m getting about 90fps on sand patch but I am noticing the occasional loading of things (frame rate stable)
     
  5. breblimator

    breblimator Well-Known Member

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    I was surprised to complain about this kind of thing, but the karma got me. TVL started to limp for me. It irritated me so much that I ended up formatting disks. I couldn't bring the game back to 'fresh', although I deleted the folders with the configuration files and then ordered Steam to restore them. I am not persuading anyone, but the purge helped me. It's such an hour of work to restore Windows and TSW. The rest depends, I know :)
     
    Last edited: Oct 3, 2020
  6. Airbus A319

    Airbus A319 New Member

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    I did uninstall from Steam and reinstall. It did appear to improve (couple stops) but has returned. Going out the cab into the passengers is like a slide show. I have also put on and off the -DX12 trick someone mentioned in another post but to no effect. Lets hope another update/patch will return it to a working state for me.

    breblimator thanks for the suggestion but it could take me quite a while to restore my PC after a format. Steam is on a separate dedicated drive (SSD).
     
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  7. breblimator

    breblimator Well-Known Member

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    Consoling fact is, it can be better. I hope DTG will find the cause someday... :)
     
  8. Airbus A319

    Airbus A319 New Member

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    IIt could to be a cache issue for me. When I pull into a station then take a walk about it is like a slide show. However once I have walked around gone back into the cab and come out again it is fine. Then pull into the next station and it happens again.

    The funny thing is I moved away from MSFS 2020 because of all the issues that it is having for some relaxation on the Bakerloo line. You know what I think I will watch a DVD this afternoon and keep my fingers crossed :cool:.
     
    Last edited: Oct 3, 2020
  9. montes_1234

    montes_1234 Well-Known Member

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    Yes I can also confirm that the game lately stutters more than ever. I wonder if IOW will be released in such a state of the base game?
     
  10. martschuffing

    martschuffing Well-Known Member

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    Does on PC for me too.
     
  11. londonmidland

    londonmidland Well-Known Member

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    Stutters for me too. FPS seems to have reduced too. Definitely a performance downgrade after the recent update(s).

    I am also noticing considerable anti-aliasing flickering despite not changing the settings.
     
    Last edited: Oct 6, 2020
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  12. Mikeboy

    Mikeboy Active Member

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    While I seem to be okay on the TSW2 routes am having some bad stutters on preserved routes, especially Tees Valley, where the game can freeze for 4-5 seconds at a time.
     
  13. chieflongshin

    chieflongshin Well-Known Member

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    I must admit I noticed at one point on sand patch the other day the trees kept flashing almost like someone was turning them on and off.
     
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  14. Jeannot41

    Jeannot41 Well-Known Member

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    Degradation at home too, on PC ....
    Sorry
     
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  15. maxthum

    maxthum Active Member

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    Same here, I'm noticing significant stutters on many basic routes (Bakerloo, Sand Patch Grade and SKA.) It's playable but not ideal imo.
     
    Last edited: Oct 7, 2020
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  16. DTG Natster

    DTG Natster Producer Staff Member

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    This is already being looked into, I will investigate further as the quality most definitely shouldn't be worsening after an update, sadly I can't offer a timeframe for when this will be resolved.
     
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  17. londonmidland

    londonmidland Well-Known Member

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    Hello, have you found out any more information regarding this? Gameplay definitely isn’t as smooth as it used to be for me.
     
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  18. zawal.belili

    zawal.belili Guest

    Hello
    I also have this problem since the update with the MSB
     
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  19. firstpon

    firstpon New Member

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    I got more stutter too.
    I7 7700K
    1080TI
    16Gb of ram
     
  20. TerryBalldriver

    TerryBalldriver Member

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    Stutters for me as well on TSW 2. TSW 2020 runs smoother. I have a reasonable spec PC. Big stutters ruin the immersion factor.
     
  21. TerryBalldriver

    TerryBalldriver Member

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    Just read about the update due tomorrow. Fingers crossed.
     
  22. londonmidland

    londonmidland Well-Known Member

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    This won't affect performance. It'll only use up less game memory so it'll prevent the game from crashing for those that experience that issue. Predominantly consoles..
     
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  23. Callum B.

    Callum B. Well-Known Member

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    Not necessarily. The memory optimisations could mean a number of things, and if it includes streaming less or optimising the streaming of assets, it could lead to less stutters.
     
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  24. Jack O'Track

    Jack O'Track Active Member

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    Same-thing, and i also experienced quite a few stuck situations, following all the darn orders alright, where the game's response is not showing. This happened a lot less in TSW2020. Tried two ímported 2020 routes now, CSX heavy and Canada, gave them up. PS in both cases i think the instructions given are not complete, as i found earlier with German routes in 2020.

    As for TSW2: Besides that i 'see' and feel not many differences between the two versions, i wonder if this so called upgrade is only a money making scheme from DTG while trying to skip just their bug-fixing obligations for TSW2020. Selling the same horse twice?
    PS just tried that scenario making tool briefly; it's very primitive with a clumsy interface. Gave TSW2 up for now.
     
    Last edited: Nov 4, 2020
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  25. bsmm

    bsmm New Member

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    Same thing for me, the FPS stutters started occurring for me a day before the update. It made the game unbearable, with my fps constantly alternating between 30fps and 8fps every after 20 seconds.

    The latest update release did not fix it for my case.
     
  26. Rutger Luiten

    Rutger Luiten Active Member

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    After the latest update my fps dropped and the stutters increased, but also turning the headlights on of the BR363 takes a few fps.
     
  27. martschuffing

    martschuffing Well-Known Member

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    Yes, still no change with the stutters, becoming very distracting to the point I'm firing up TS more.
     
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  28. Celendis

    Celendis Member

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    I have noted that after the latest patch, TSW2 stutters are much worse. During each stutter (about every 20-30 seconds), the program seems to behave as if it is performing extremely aggressive garbage collection. However, it is now freeing textures that are in use. I notice that the cab dashboard textures go to an extremely low resolution for half a second each time the stutter occurs, with significant disk usage at the same time.

    I theorize that TSW2 is freeing data that it needs during garbage collection, and it immediately reloads the data from storage.
     
  29. Callum B.

    Callum B. Well-Known Member

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    This sounds like texture streaming is not working properly. This is what happens when you try to use the -DX12 command line option without disabling texture streaming in the Engine.ini.
     
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  30. hightower

    hightower Guest

    The brutal truth is that most games these days, and particularly TS2021 and TSW2, need an SSD. It is not DTG’s fault that people don’t have one.

    If they relentlessly cater for the lowest common denominator then games in general, and this one in particular, will never improve.

    SSD’s have never been cheaper, and Black Friday is coming up. Do yourself a favour and get one!
     
  31. michael hooley

    michael hooley Well-Known Member

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    I have a 2T WD_BLACK SN750 NVMe™ SSD
    Intel Core i7-10700K 8 Cores 3.8GHz
    GeForce RTX 2070 Super Graphics Card
    32 gig of Ram
    and only basic software on my computer, and have always had stuttering, but since the latest update it is worse even to the point of stalling for a few seconds.

    The last 3 services I have run have all crashed before completion, The first from Minehead crashed just before Blue Anchor, the last one 100 yards from Leeds City Station.

    TSW1 and TSimulater ran fine on my old pc with a basic disc drive, so I cannot see how you can blame the drive although for many reasons you are better with an SSD.

    Mike
     
    Last edited: Nov 7, 2020
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  32. martschuffing

    martschuffing Well-Known Member

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    I have SSD's installed and good ones so that theory doesn't hold water as far as I am concerned.
     
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  33. Jack O'Track

    Jack O'Track Active Member

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    Stutters AND SSD .... worse in TSW2
     
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  34. hightower

    hightower Guest

    Me too though. The ones i’m getting are micro (0.1 seconds or so) and there are far too many of them, but other than on a couple of very noticeable places (always the same) where it might pause for a second or so I’m not seeing anything else.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Nov 8, 2020
  35. geloxo

    geloxo Well-Known Member

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    That would be reduced by rendering at a constant target framerate, as the previous games did, but even with it the problem is not always solved as the routes usually have dense areas that require more rendering power than the average (yards for instance). The current FPS cap does not work as good as running game at 60Hz monitor refresh, for instance. But even with a low refresh rate you still have microstutter, which I presume to be caused by scenery loading in tiles or in batches.

    Most simulators with huge scenery suffer that. Some address it by putting the workload into different cores for different tasks, as FS2020 does, but even that is not always effective. The best would be to load scenery linearly as soon as you move, instead of doing it in batches. FS2020 has a good enhacement compared to other sims, as it´s object loading includes a linear fade-in effect that works quite good when rendering big areas like cities, as the workload is less agressive (you can see scenery spawning progressively around you). It seems Unreal does it the old way (with tiles) as you can see how a complete mountain or a forest area pops-in in one go as you move.

    Cheers
     
    Last edited: Nov 7, 2020
  36. OldVern

    OldVern Well-Known Member

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    I've had stuttering on the Bakerloo when an AI train comes into the scene but otherwise okay.
    GWE likewise though that was always a bit juddery in TSW1.
     
  37. Celendis

    Celendis Member

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    Thank you for your help. I had believed that I disabled the DX12 flag a few weeks ago, but I checked again, and it was still configured. I switched it back off and the game is back to its normal stuttering self. Thanks again.
     
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  38. geloxo

    geloxo Well-Known Member

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    I was also using DX12 in the beginning but I was told in one of my tickets that DX12 is not supported at all by game, even if engine allows it, so enabling it will have no effect and probably some negative effects. Who knows anyway..

    Cheers
     
  39. hightower

    hightower Guest

    No question I get much better FPS with it than without. No other negative effects.

    ps My FPS is capped at 60, the refresh rate of my monitor.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Nov 8, 2020
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  40. Inkar

    Inkar Well-Known Member

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    Same here.
     
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  41. aceridgey

    aceridgey New Member

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    Could you confirm that all users who have the - dx12 option in Steam need to do this?
     
  42. Callum B.

    Callum B. Well-Known Member

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    I do, and if it happens to you as well then you do too.
     
  43. hightower

    hightower Guest

    This texture streaming issue is a problem under DX11 too, not just 12.

    Assuming you have a half decent computer just turn it off in the engine.ini file.
     
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  44. BinaryRun

    BinaryRun Active Member

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    Can you please tell me what the command line is to turn it off?
     
  45. Callum B.

    Callum B. Well-Known Member

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    That's odd as I have never experienced it under DX11 but consistently experience it with DX12 (with streaming enabled).

    Specifically, I would only recommend disabling texture streaming if you have a GPU with 8GB of VRAM and if TSW2 is installed to an SSD. Disabling texture streaming on a hard drive will lead to pain.

    Add this line to your Engine.ini file located in Documents\My Games\TrainSimWorld2\Saved\Config\WindowsNoEditor\
    This will fix the texture flickering issues but may cause greater tile-loading lag spikes, particularly if your game is installed on a traditional hard drive.

    Code:
    [SystemSettings]
    r.TextureStreaming=0
     
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  46. BinaryRun

    BinaryRun Active Member

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    Perfect, thank you. I got a M.2 SSD with 32GB of ram etc, so that's all good. This is very helpful since I'm already running the game in DX12 mode.
     
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  47. Callum B.

    Callum B. Well-Known Member

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    I did look into some way to keep texture-streaming enabled so as to mitigate the lag spikes but I have not yet had success with any of the streaming pool or mipmap rendering modifiers. :(
     
  48. BinaryRun

    BinaryRun Active Member

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    Isn't the idea behind disabling texture streaming to stop the stuttering?

    May I ask your opinion on using
    Code:
    r.StaticMeshLODDistanceScale=0
    ?
     
  49. hightower

    hightower Guest

    This is an example of the problem under DX11, if you go to 06:15 in the video you’ll see the issue. Turning off texture streaming stops this long standing UE4 issue.

     
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  50. Callum B.

    Callum B. Well-Known Member

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    Oh I see. What happens under DX12 is a little different, where the train textures (including the interior) drop in resolution for a split second, seemingly around when tiles are being loaded in. Setting the mipmap bias to 0 mitigates it somewhat, but not entirely, so disabling texture streaming is the only proper fix I have found thus far.
    Texture streaming allows the game to load in far-away textures at a lower resolution so that it does not take as long to load the new tiles in. Disabling texture streaming forces the game to load in the highest resolution (mipmap) of the texture regardless of how far it is from the camera. For systems that can handle this, it creates little to no performance penalty in one tile, but when the next tile is loaded in, the game must transfer more data from the disk to memory, creating a long lag spike if you have a slow disk drive. So texture streaming allows little bits to load in from the disk continuously whereas disabling it allows a lot to load from the disk at once but is therefore a little bit choppier. As you can see from hightower's video above, texture streaming also has the side effect of sometimes not loading in the highest resolution textures in places where they should be.

    I have used it but there is not much of a difference. Personally I think foliage.LODDistanceScale makes the most difference visually. Here is my Engine.ini:

    Code:
    [SystemSettings]
    r.ViewDistanceScale=2
    foliage.LODDistanceScale=3
    r.Color.Mid=0.4
    r.MaterialQualityLevel=0
    r.TemporalAASharpness=1.0
    r.TemporalAASamples=64
    r.SSR.Quality=2
    r.BloomQuality=3
    r.TextureStreaming=0
    
    The more obscure ones: r.TemporalAASharpness=1.0 and r.TemporalAASamples=64 increase the quality of TAA sampling to make the ghosting less annoying. r.BloomQuality=3 turns down the bloom a bit without entirely disabling it.
     

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