Suggestions Regarding The German Highspeed Trains

Discussion in 'PC Discussion' started by colinL, Nov 11, 2020.

  1. colinL

    colinL Active Member

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    Just came to my mind right now. It'd be nice if the two kinds of ICE 3 (BR403's) from Munich Augsburg and Cologne Aachen would be interchangeable. Pretty sure not every ICE around Munich has the green stripe and I personally like the plain red more. Also the Cologne Aachen one has the older cabin instruments, personally like them more as well. Would be cool if this could be incorporated into a future update, doesn't seem like too big of an issue. Just to make them both available for timetable services.

    Second thing would be, seeing as there will be a BR101 somewhere in the future. I'm like 99% sure that it will come with the intercity cars in the ICE paint scheme, hopefully also with the control car as well. Now it'd be very nice if for the people who have it, the BR182 could also be used in front of the intercities in the timetable mode. And hopefully the 101 will also be available on more routes rather than just Cologne Aachen.
    Just some stuff that came to my mind :)
     
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  2. mclitke

    mclitke Well-Known Member

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    The issue with both ICE variants is that they don't interchange irl which is why this was limited for reasons of authenticity. So I feel like you will have to create custom scenarios using the other ICE variant...

    Regarding BR 101, I could swear I heard that it will have IC wagons confirmed already. So far unfortunately we have no clue about the cab car - I must say without it would be a bit disappointing, but let's wait for the time being.
    And I agree, the Taurus should get a lot more options for scenario planer at least. This thing almost hauls anything, but I believe right now you can't even haul Dostos with it apart from when using the cab car? (and the Leipzig route of course)
     
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  3. 2martens

    2martens Member

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    Thing is, Cologne-Aachen and ICs do not really mix. In the real timetable, there is not really an IC on this route. Munich-Augsburg, however, has plenty ICs. Therefore, I do not know why they have chosen Cologne-Aachen for the 101.
     
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  4. BjornGroen02NL

    BjornGroen02NL Well-Known Member

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    It might have to do with the fact that everyone who bought TSW2 owns Köln-Aachen. Therefore, if they make it for Köln-Aachen, a lot of people could buy it. If they make it an München-Augsburg Loco DLC, only people who own that route will get to play with this additional DLC. It would be the more relealistic and logical way, but if DTG would like to go for more profit they would probably take Köln-Aachen as the route where the BR 101 has its' scenarios. Maybe though, they will add it for both routes. So it will have its 3 scenarios on Köln-Aachen, but additional timetable services on both high-speed routes.
     
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  5. mclitke

    mclitke Well-Known Member

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    Well München is a terminus station and would require a cab car. Now if you were to do the BR 101 on Köln Aachen, would that mean one could spare the effort of creating the cab car...? I don't like this train of thought...
     
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  6. mclitke

    mclitke Well-Known Member

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    Understandable argumentation but still weird, since they like to be as authentic as possible up to the actual timetables. Surely they must have been trains that do actually travel on SKA and regularly at that. Is the IC with the BR 101 even stopping at both stations at all irl?
     
  7. BjornGroen02NL

    BjornGroen02NL Well-Known Member

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    Well there are no IC services between those 2 cities, and as the BR 101 only operates IC services, it doesn't drive there ;) You might see BR 101 trains and/or IC trains at those stations, but they do not drive between those 2 cities.
     
  8. mclitke

    mclitke Well-Known Member

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    This begs the question as to why this loco was chosen then... Not that I am complaining about the loco itself!
     
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  9. nberneck99

    nberneck99 Well-Known Member

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    upload_2020-11-11_13-37-58.png
    rivet posted this a while back, it definitely looks like its for TSW2

    I looked on 3DZUG’s website and there is a tab for TSW2 that is blank at the moment, so it would certainly be plausible.
     
    Last edited: Nov 11, 2020
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  10. JAAK

    JAAK Member

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    I cannot imagine them realeasing the 101 without IC wagons
     
  11. nberneck99

    nberneck99 Well-Known Member

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    Also keep in mind the roadmap didn’t say the 363 was coming with cement wagons. It’s plausible that they just don’t put rolling stock on the roadmap.
     
  12. FD1003

    FD1003 Well-Known Member

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    Surely MRCE BR182 will be a BR101 substitution, right?
     
  13. Callum B.

    Callum B. Well-Known Member

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    I am very excited for a BR 101 with IC wagons (+ control car!), but will be much more reluctant to buy it if it does not come with layers for HMA. SKA is a fabulous route but it's not its home. :(
     
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  14. colinL

    colinL Active Member

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    Well could be, but it'd also nice to have the DB 182 to do that.

    Regarding the interchange of the two ICE 3's... Why shouldn't that be possible? I simply meant to also be able to choose the Cologne Aachen ICE on the timetable services of Munich Augsburg and vice versa. Not to actually interchange the cars or locos of it.

    Regarding the BR101, I also cannot imagine it coming without IC wagons, as its pretty much the only service the BR101 does.
     
  15. space_ace96

    space_ace96 Active Member

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    The SKA DB 406 is an ICE 3M. This version is specifically used on routes that travel internationally and is set up to be able to use the electrical setups in other European countries. These ICEs can adapt to the voltage in countries like Belgium, I believe France, and possibly other countries. Because it is special, you will only see it on services that need it. The services included in the HMA timetable stay within Germany and thus do not use ICE 3Ms. I believe the green stripe paintjob was part of the refurbishment to the ICE 3s and thus you are unlikely to see a refurbished ICE 3 with all red stripe. To make an unrefurbished ICE 3 for HMA would probably be more work than DTG is willing to put in without charging for it, and nobody is going to buy that considering it's just a combination of what we already have.
     
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  16. Callum B.

    Callum B. Well-Known Member

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  17. FD1003

    FD1003 Well-Known Member

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    I believe in the case of the 403 and 406 it's fair to keep them separated if it's unrealistic, but I understand you wanting to use both, but seeing how we can't use the 423 on the S19 (which is the train used in RL) because it's not in the Rhein-Ruhr S-Bahn config. you can guess how restrictive DTG is about substitution
     
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  18. w.lichko

    w.lichko Well-Known Member

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    Exactly, if you're going to argue that the 403 and 406 shouldn't be interchangeable because of realism, then what about the 101?
    There's only ONE intercity service that passes through Aachen per day. It doesn't even run on the Köln-Aachen line!!
    Screenshot 2020-11-12 at 11.44.28.png
    Here SIX different intercity's and eurocity's run between Munich and Augsburg. Most terminating in Munich. Plus IC's are very frequent on HMA compared to SKA and actually run on the line.
    Screenshot 2020-11-12 at 11.43.39.png
    I don't understand how this is "realistic" if the 101 is a SKA add-on.
    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: Nov 12, 2020
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  19. mclitke

    mclitke Well-Known Member

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    That is my issue as well. Like I said I have a feeling that it might be deliberate in order to not do an IC control car...
    Like they Said in the new devblog, sometimes they trade a little bit of accuracy and authenticity for gameplay. But even when applying this it seems absolutely unfitting for SKA.
    It is either they wanted a Loco for SKA and made an unfitting train choice or they wanted to do the 101 and made the unfitting route choice.
     
  20. BjornGroen02NL

    BjornGroen02NL Well-Known Member

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    To make it even better, the IC that terminates at Aachen Hbf isn't even a BR 101, but a BR 120 :D

    DTG really need to decide whether they make it for SKA or HMA. In my opinion, make it for HMA. More realistic.

    Thankfully it is still in the "In Planning" section of the Roadmap, so a lot can change between now and the release. I estimate it will probably take 6 to 12 months before we see the release.
     
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  21. FD1003

    FD1003 Well-Known Member

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    I think that in general DTG is too restrictive in how they handle substitution, for example the BR425 can be seen as a Twindexx replacement from time to time on MSB, and also the lack of the BR423 on SKA and possibly HRR and RRO because it's not the correct specification is a big big shame, same for the BR420, TSG said it will be in the HMA spec. and because of that chances are we won't be able to use in RRO, which is another huge huge shame.

    A part from the BR423 on SKA, I can understand why DTG has been so strict, they explained in a stream the AI has the same choice we have when selecting the trains as the player has (so if you decide to allow another train, the route will populate with that train), and IIRC they talked about how they wanted to modify this systems, so I really really REALLY hope the reasons why they are not investing a lot of time in substitutions is because they are working (or at least thinking) at creating a system which will allow us to do any service with any train... as part of the overhaul to the layer/subsistion system which really showed its limitations with HMA on Consoles.

    About the 101, If the system remains as it is will probabily add an IC layer to hopefully a lot of German routes (old and new) and then allow for a substitution to either the TSW1 BR182 (if it gets remastered) or the Ham-Lub BR182.

    Maybe even a BR146 with DoStos for the IC2000 (or whatever it's called)
     
    Last edited: Nov 12, 2020
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  22. nberneck99

    nberneck99 Well-Known Member

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    I’d rather the 101 come to HMA and simply add a layer to SKA
     
  23. theorganist

    theorganist Well-Known Member

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    I suppose if there was a tick box where you could choose which trains were included in your service mode it would satisfy all parties, but that might be somewhere on the scale from virtually impossible to extremely time consuming to include.

    Personally I err on the side of realism so would rather they aimed to make service mode realistic but it isn't then so fair on those who aren't worried about realism. I suppose if you pay for some DLC you want to use it where you want. Then again if the class 101 doesn't run on the Koln to Aachen route then it seems odd DTG choosing to release it for it as they do talk about wanting to keep service mode realistic.

    I know little about German operations, although since TSW I have started researching more, so I might not notice unless it was pointed out.

    Still if a green class 33 popped up on a Trans-Pennine service or shunting Tees Yard I would be annoyed and it would ruin the experience for me.
     
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  24. colinL

    colinL Active Member

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    Just noticed with the 24th November Roadmap that the BR101 is now listed for Hauptstrecke Rhein-Ruhr. Kinda odd, maybe a typo or change of mind? Either way, I'm 100% certain that we'll get to drive it on München-Augsburg and Köln-Aachen as well.
     
  25. CowBoyWolf

    CowBoyWolf Well-Known Member

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    the DB BR 101 was first for SKA and now for HRR
     
  26. mclitke

    mclitke Well-Known Member

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    I asked on stream yesterday and they confirmed that the switch to HRR was intentional, which is kinda a good thing because the 101 usually is only stopping in Köln but not Aachen, whereas between Bochum and Duisburg it runs and stops regularly.
    Yes let us hope we get another layer for München-Augsburg. With scenario planner you can use it on SKA as well.
     
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  27. colinL

    colinL Active Member

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    I'm fairly certain that it will be available on München Augsburg. SKA should be possible too. With the scenario planner, Can I use it in the timetable mode as well? I never ever used the scenario planner as of now.
     
  28. mclitke

    mclitke Well-Known Member

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    I doubt it will be in timetable for SKA. Check the online timetable for IC services at Köln, the IC services stop in Köln but they don't stop in Aachen. So either they would have to make imaginary services or leave it out. but we will see when it is closer to release I suppose.

    Scenario planner let's you set up your own custom services, which is not the standard timetable mode. You will have to chose your train and the destination/stops as well as computer controlled train services, which you need to setup manually as well. But there it will be possible 100%.
     
  29. colinL

    colinL Active Member

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    Alright. Sounds good though, nonetheless
     

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