PC Teaching Everybody About Class 377 Variants And It's Differences.

Okay, i am quite tired of hearing people saying that all electrostars look the name. So I am going to teach everybody what the differences between the different Class 377 variants. (I am not familiar with Class 375s however, I only live in brighton and are a regular on the Class 377s, have mercy on me.)

There are in total of 7 Variants of the Class 377s and are as follows (these are pictures taken by me, expect the /5s):
/1


/2


/3


/4 (which is already in TSW).


/5 (picture not taken by me).

/6


and lastly /7



First of all, the earlier generation of Class 377s which are /1,/2 and /3.
/1 being the first of the Class 377s being 3rd rail only. And in fact it has 3 different interior layouts.
From 377 101 to 377 119 have its entire 4 car consist to be all 2+2 with seats. From 377 120 to 377 139, have 2+2 in each end of the carriage and 3+2 and each middle of the carriage, this applies to all of its carriages. And 377 140 to 377 164 (and pretty much all of the /2s) have the most common sitting arrangement that you see in other 377 variants, which are the 2+2 seatings in the leading/end carriage and 3+2 seatings in both middle carriages. While /2's interior is pretty much the same as the later /1s. Its pretty much a /1 but its a dual voltage unit. Both ends of the /1 and /2 have first class however with no partition doors. to separate from standard and first.
/3s are pretty much the only Class 377 variant that are 3 cars. These are pretty much Class 375/3, just with different couplings which makes it a Class 377. The entire 3 car consist are all only 2+2 seatings. And /3s are 3rd rail only. And only have a first class on one end behind the cab.

(image found from google) older generation 377 first class section


Now the 2nd generation of Class 377s. The /4 and /5. Both variants have the 2+2 seatings in the leading/rear end carriage and 3+2 in the 2 middle carriages. However with one exception, for the first class section on the cab end of the leading/end car, there would be partition door separating first class from the rest of standard class which is placed between the door and the first class compartment. And comparing between the /4 and /5 to the interior of the /1,/2 and /3, the colour of the interior is a bit different (i think).
the /5s are pretty much /4s but dual voltage mode.

(image found from google) 2nd generation 377 first class section.


The 3rd generation Class 377s /6s and /7s, the last 2 377 variants. They are the new gen electrostars and the whole exterior is completely different compared to the 1st and 2nd generation. While the older generations of electrostars (doesnt apply to 378s and 376s) all of which have a square window with a bold outline for its windows. While new generation ones like the 379s and 387s including the 377/6s and 377/7s have a window that, in each of its corner its rounded instead of an outright rectangle shape. And most notable the interior in the new generation is more white compared to older generations. The 377/6s and 377/7 are pretty much 387s but 5 cars. And its seating layout is same as the 387s with one exception, places on 387 where there are luggage racks has been replaced by a seat that's placed sideways instead and with one additional carriage that for some reason doesn't have a toilet. 377/6s are 3rd rail only and 377/7s are dual voltage. And unlike previous variants of the 377s, both /6 and /7's first class section are same as the 387s where the first class is placed in one end and at the back of one leading carriage and separates from standard class by a partition door.
And in terms of exterior, the southern paint scheme have its dark green cheatline (i think thats what its called) have it connected to the bolded windows.
Exterior wise the /6 and /7 have the dark green cheatline on the southern livery follows along throughout its windows.

(image found from google) /6 and /7 interior


Between the generations of Class 377s. The /1 and /3 have same headlight clusters (note the square top headlight), /2, /4 and /5 have the same headlight clusters (note the top rounded headlight) and for the /6 and /7 are the same as /2, /4 and /5 but from what I can tell their headlights are a bit more brighter?
There is also some /1 having the same headlight clusters and top headlight as the /4 and /2. But the interior is unchanged, still no partition door for first class.


Compare to the other variants and this is something I have only heard however I am unsure rather or not is it true. The /6 and /7 have a better acceleration in DC mode compared to previous 377s. And 377/2 and 377/7 (unsure does this also applies to 377/5 cuz also dual voltage) have their acceleration slowed down when in running in AC overhead wire.

I hope this helps make people get a bit more clear on what differences is there between each 377 variant and get the conclusion that they aren't similar. If anybody have any extra knowledge on the last part please do comment down.

 

To be quite honest, beside the colour scheme, I can not see the difference between all of them, they are all identical and all are 377

 

What on heck does this have to do with TSW Discussion? I know exactly the commenter you were referring to and he is right in what he said. All of these would offer the exact same, dull driving experience on BML (I have added my own personal thoughts to it but this were the general gist of his comment). The differences are there, but do not impact the actual driving experience.

At the end of the day, from the cab, an Electrostar is an Electrostar, and we have all had the 'pleasure' of handling one in TSW.

 

This isnt aimed at one commenter, this is for everyone, serious.

 

This should be in off topic.

 

ah uh... is there anyhow i can move the thread to off topic or can a mod help me move it?

 

This would make for a decent 'spot the difference' game as there isn't all that much between them.

They're all Electrostars, they're all 377s, and in TSW we only have two (three counting the /4s numbered as /1s) variants - the only difference between them being that the /2 uses OHLE.

Into Off-Topic and less pedantry, please.

 

Also worth noting the 377/3 have smaller tables than other variants, and some 377/1 have the later headlight cluster.

 

Just add a few TSW screenshots and it should be no longer be off topic. Or make a reality-game comparison I guess?

 

Ohhhh this is exactly what I needed! Thank you! The differences between the Electrostars is something I could never figure out.

I've said it before, and I'll say it again. Trains look the same. The Electrostars look the same, so do all of whatever these trains are. There may be differences between them, but only if you care.


I care about the Electrostars, less so about these older units.

 

If that's all the variety we have to behold these days on station platforms, I am so glad I'm not a gen Z.

 

Heretic! Summon the mob! We storm the castle at dawn.

 

That's a Class 411 CEP in that picture. There are quite a few differences between Southern Region Mk1 EMUs, very easy to tell them apart...

As for Electrostars there are quite a few subtle differences between the sub classes. But most people wouldn't recognise them. I know all of them because I'm a nerd... But most people wouldn't be able to tell. (The headlight clusters can vary, seating is far superior in the Connex specification 375/6s and /7s, and early 377s . Older generation units also have glass overhead luggage racks compared to newer generations that have plastic ones... All Electrostars up until the 387 had ribbon glazing windows, opposed to the single individual windows later generations had. There are so many... but to your average traveller or enthusiast who doesn't pay attention to Southern Region EMUs they probably look and feel the same.

 

Oh no! What have I done! Soldiers, hear me! Defensive formation!

I saw a Moleman978 video about an Armstrong Powerhouse pack of those. I will admit, there are some difference (some seem to lack a gangway at the front), but it seems even AP can't tell the difference between some. At least, that's how I understand it. Why do they have 411/412?

 

What's up with all the grumpies in this thread ? It's very nice ! Thanks for the info ludwigtails

 

In fairness though the only difference between a 411 and a 412 is the 412 had a buffet car.

Compare a 411/412 to, say, a 421, and the differences are very noticable. Even between a 421 and a 423 (423s had doirs for each row of seats whereas a 421 only had a few per coach)

More accurate comparison would be the PEP units (313/314/315 etc)

 

You are very much welcomed. Thank you for appreciating the info.

 

As mentioned the difference between the 411 CEP and 412 BEP is the buffet coach, very similarly you have Class 421 CIGs and Class 422 BIGs (I believe thats their TOPS number), both are essentially the same Class, but one has a buffet coach. (CEP: Corridor Electric Pneumatic, BEP: Buffet Electric Pneumatic)

CEPs are easier to distinguish because they have hopper style windows from when they went through their 'Swindon' overhaul in the late 1970s. Also the front is far more functional looking. CIGs/VEPs have the same, but smoother appearing cab end, and CIGs have conventional sliding Mk1 windows, where as VEPs have push down windows. There are also some bogie differences that were chopped and changed over the years. Also CIGs and CEPs have a mostly conventional Mk1 coach body. Where as a VEP has a more suburban coach profile with a door at most seats giving them a very distinctive side profile.

Southern Region EMUs are very interesting if EMUs are your thing...

 

If this is the biggest problem in your life right now, can we swap places?

 

I found it interesting too, not sure why the OP is getting stick for it!

 

I think that for both Electrostars and Mark 1 EMUs the main classes are easier to tell apart whereas the subclasses are to an outsider indistinguishable.

 

* First-generation EMUs

 

Thanks for the information, very informative.

 

No, Mk1 EMUs are based off of the Mk1 BR coach hence the name.

Southern Region EMUs from the 1960s are not first generation either, they were atleast 3rd generation if you take into account LBSCR and Southern Railway EMUs dating back to the 1920s.

 

"First Generation BR EMUs" is perhaps more correct. But nothing is easy when it comes to BR. The Class 306 was probably the first new EMU into service in the BR era, they're considered "1st Gen" but BR had nothing to do with their pre-war design.

AM10/AM12 (latterly Classes 310 & 312) are now considered 1st gen BR EMUs but were based on the MK2 coaching stock.

Nowadays it's generally;
1st Gen - Anything designed and built before the PEPs - mostly slam-door
2nd Gen - From PEPs to Privatisation - sliding doors
3rd Gen - Post Privatisation.Sliding doors, mostly built with Passenger Address systems and the 376s apart, all have air con.

We're probably due a 4th Gen, perhaps those should be trains with level-boarding. So just Stadler units at the moment.

 

And this is exactly why I had no idea what to call units such as the Class 411. I was going to call them first generation EMUs, but then I thought about it, and decided that there must have been units from before the Class 411 (and others). Lo and behold, I think I'm right, but I could be wrong. I have to wait for a conclusion on this discussion of what these EMUs are called.

Did I do any research on it? Not really, but that is on me. I was confused enough trying to figure out what the difference between the 411 and 412, and ended up finding out that the 4-character codes actually mean something (5WES, 4CIG, 4BEP).

 

which sounds weird cos AC usually means better acceleration

I am quite fond of them, even if they are kinda ugly, kinda like tin boxes of milk lol... they offer nice, chill and relaxing driving experience, and are the next best thing we have in TSW if one wants a subway-like driving experience

it was kinda interesting to read about the differences, even though I like 387s more in-game

 

I hope they dont reuse the old model 377 - the gangway are broken
And I can enjoy making my own 377 on formation designer.

 

Yeah Southern Region EMUs are slightly more difficult to learn about as there are many variations dating back to the 1920s all the way through to the 1980s when modern sliding door stuff took over along with just having a TOPS number. I am a big Southern Region EMU enthusiast, so I'm biased, but I certainly think they are a interesting genre of their own to learn about! Also, unofficially I believe the modern(ish) Class 458 'Junipers' were known as 4JOPs amongst some workers/enthusiasts!

 

What came before depends on which line they served. The South Eastern area units were for the electrification of the network in Kent so they mostly replaced steam traction.
They were certainly "2nd generation" in the South West Division as they replaced LSWR 4-RES, 4-BUF and 4-COR EMUs from the 1930s, though they also replaced steam on the Bournemouth line when it was electrified.

I recommend this website for those who want to learn about classic 1st and 2nd-ish Generation Southern Multiple Units.

https://www.bloodandcustard.com/

 

Got to love some good 'ol Blood & Custard, it has got some really good information on there!

 

I'll take a look tomorrow. Blood and Custard sounds like a fantastic website name (looking at Spirit of Steam).

 

How about some Roobarb and Custard in the meantime