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Thoughts On Fishing Mechanics In Ef...

Discussion in 'General' started by Spirit-X, Apr 15, 2017.

  1. Spirit-X

    Spirit-X
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    Hi,

    Have been playing this since PS4 release and wanted to share my thoughts on the game. First of all it's good, so well done there. Secondly it's very naughty to release it so buggy without prior notice on the game's PSN page. Sometimes I don't mind paying to play test an early version but I do mind finding that out after I've payed my money.

    Anyway, on to the post. I'm writing this because I think EF has a a lot of potential to be great and would like to contribute what I can in terms of feedback and ideas. I've done a lot of fishing in the game since its PS4 release. Enough that the game's flaws and assets feel pretty clear to me now.

    First off is the player feedback system when you're fighting a fish. Obviously the sound needs sorting out. On the PS4 at the moment, as soon as you hook a fish you lose all sound from the reel (or at least mine does). Having that noise of the fish taking line and having it be analogue in nature so the quicker it takes line, the louder and quicker the sound, will make a HUGE difference to how satisfying it is to fight. Second is vibration. The game is missing a major trick here because a well implemented vibration system would increase the 'feel' tenfold IMHO. You should be able to feel the difference between a little roach and a hefty carp. More importantly, with a good vibration system you would be able to feel the tension on the rod and be less reliant on the visual cues from the meter. This one is a must as far as I'm concerned.

    Next I have a couple of thoughts regarding the way EF handles fishing multiple rods. I think there's a fundamental issue with not needing to strike. It just feels wrong...and I'm not even an angler, just a gamer who's done a bit a fishing here and there as a young man. However, I believe this is rectifiable without ruining game balance or engagement. I would suggest that rather than using the Dpad to open a menu which allows rod selection, it would be better if, when holding no rod, they were short-cutted to square, triangle and circle as rods 1, 2 and 3 respectively. In addition to this I think it would be good if holding a shoulder button made the angler hover his hand over the rods (when you think you might be getting a bite) and at that point, if you press the shortcut key for any particular rod, it will grab it and allow you a quick strike. This would be good if, when holding the button to hover over the rods, the camera would adjust down a little to show the beep sensors on screen so you can see which one is going off and select correctly (and with experience you'll learn the beep sounds and not need to look). Likewise, using this method while already holding a rod would drop your current rod and grab the selected one so you can perform the quick strike.

    This next one is very much related to the point above. One of the things that feels off to me in EF is that if you're fighting a fish on one rod and you get a bite on another one, the fish generally stays on the line and doesn't get away. You just catch too many fish because of this and it makes that whole thing feel a little too gamey. It's unnecessary and the player can be perfectly well engage by fighting one fish at a time I think. We already get bites way more often than real life and I think that that is the correct decision for the game, it makes it just gamey enough to not get boring. I feel it would be a great improvement to implement the strike mechanic in the game so that you generally lose fish that bite another line and maybe once in a while, just here and there, a fish might bite so hard that it will stay on the line on it's own, but not often. That way, getting a 'double catch' will be an occasional occurrence that makes the player feel like they've been rather fortunate.

    Also related to the above, the beep sensors should occasionally just beep once or maybe twice from a little nibble or a big gust of wind. This would work really well in concert with the aforementioned strike mechanic, so you would be hovering your hand over the rods trying to figure out if it's a real bite or not (just like John Wilson used to do on telly when I was a kid).

    Let's talk about casting now. The current "total casting" mechanic is a very good idea that is currently not well implemented. Just way too inconsistent and the difference between a good cast and a bad one is about a hundredth of a second at the moment. It is a damn good idea though and I would really like to see it fleshed out into something controllable and master-able. I would suggest that, as we already have the gauge in the bottom left, it should be used for casting. The casting action would need to be slowed down a little, which may mean that the player would need to input the cast before the animation starts rather than it being in 'real-time', but to me it would be a definite improvement. It could be done so that we pull back and as we flick forward, the gauge rises and then we let go at the right moment for the distance we want (the gauge would be labelled with distance markers obviously). (Side note: Possibly a three-click mechanic would also be more engaging for the simple-cast method too, ala the old-school golf games.)

    Free-look should be a thing. Great that the camera focuses on your hook when you're holding a rod but we should also be able to look around if we want to. See where the rises are etc... Holding R2 while fishing should enable free-look on the right stick I think.

    When you open the little side window that shows your 3 rods, it should tell you not just the name of the hook but whether it's a silt, gravel, weed or float. It's annoying to keep backing out and pressing triangle to find out when you're not familiar with all the names.

    Next a couple of visual things. I've noticed that while fighting a big fish they have a tendency to clip through the surface of the water when pulled upward. Obviously that's kind of right and good but it should be accompanied by a splash of water around them to make it feel right. Also tail patterns in the water would be awesome.

    I have heard that there used to be a netting mechanic in early versions which is no longer there but please, get it right and put it back. Just pressing X once the fish is in close just feels kinda' meh. I want to net it (right stick rod, left stick net surely!) and then see the angler lift it up onto the bank.

    Almost done. I haven't caught any 40kg monsters yet but from what I've done so far, I would say that once you get how to do it, catching fish is just too easy. I haven't lost one since the first day I started playing. It's a bit of a vague criticism I know but I really feel like some of the bigger fish, especially boss fish, should be a lot more challenging and should test your judgement and patience.

    This final one may be wrong and any anglers can correct me if it is. It's about the size of fish that go for bait. I've been fishing a size 4 hook with 20mm tiger nuts and still getting bite after bite from roach less than 1kg in size. Surely this is wrong? I'm assuming it's just a bug and hopefully will be sorted.

    Ok I'm done. Obviously more venues and let him sit in the chair and yadda yadda please. Looking forward to future updates and if you're still here, thanks for reading the whole thing!
     
    Last edited: Apr 15, 2017
  2. Hendore

    Hendore
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    +1, Good feedback!
     
  3. MnMarton

    MnMarton
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    Amazing feedback, most of them I have the same opinion.

    Triple bites are not uncommon. Fighting with one fish, Rod 2 gets a bite, bit later Rod 3 gets a bite, I just stack fish on like crazy, I dont mind, Im used to grinding in games, but its a bit too arcade I think. (even tho yesterday I just had a session when I had absolute 0 movement on all 3 rods in the water, without any bite for like 40 mins, I was testing if there will be a time when the game decides the bait was there for too long and puts a fish there, but I researched a bit and found out all fish is a separate AI, moving in water to places where fish would usually go.)

    I also do have the sound issue. No sound of the line going off the reel when fighting a fish.

    As someone who have been fishing for 20+ years, it was really strange for me as well, that you don't have to strike on the non-float setups(sorry english is not my first language). Don't need to make it as sensitive as float fishing, but a striking movement implemented when picking up a rod would be nice, even if it would't have any significance in the later fights.

    On the other hand, the casting system is really good, I think. It can be improved but defo not broken. Like in real life, splits of seconds can decide if your throw gonna splash in front of you, or have a proper cast. The first commenter is right, we could have a bigger scale of "proper cast" part in the movement of the rod while casting.

    +1 for free look feature. sometimes I find myself trying to look around when fighting a fish but i realize I cannot. Not game breaking, its a comfortable option.

    also +1 about the size of the bait/hook and fish caught. I try to use the thickest line, biggest hook (no. 4 atm) and 18-20m baits but still get roaches and tenches way too many times. rarely it defo happens in real life(specially tench, he has a big mouth) but not that much. I dont mind cutting off the number of bites but increasing the chance of not catching 0.5-1 kg fishes, I can go for those with match setup.

    Also, I know this is kinda hard to fix, because of coding, after a release, but the fishes go into the shore quite a lot, lost big fishes because of this, as sometimes the line just gets 100% tension even when not doing anything(0% reel resistance, rod lowered). So pulling a fish out of the woods if defo not too realistic, but the game itself is amazing, gets that fishing feeling back as much as never a game before. I am really happy it has been released on ps4 now.

    Also, adding a bit more tackle, like not just match-float, but thicker, sturdier floats for bigger, more rough fishing. feels really strange to catch +10kg(20lbs) carps and same catfishes with a 12 waggler setup, not impossible, but doesnt happen too often.

    Also, for fishing on the margin, a feature when you can just throw a handful of baits(lets say corns) into a small targeted area where your float is in the water would be amazing, thus you could do baiting while floatifshing at a certain distance.

    Line tension. You have tonon-stop, constantly reel to keep the tension so you dont lose fish. That is a bit strange, as supposedly you have a fish at the end of the line which should pull it keeping the line tense, at least a bit most of the time.

    More fish-specific baits. Like leech for catfish, or liver, maybe something that we can separate concentrating fishing on catfishes from other catches. (same with carp, but we have corns and boilies so thats fine)
    Great game, I hope you guys keep on working on this game, its already good and theres still huge potential, love what you are doing, thank you for this game.
     
    Last edited: Apr 19, 2017
  4. Connorbrown98

    Connorbrown98
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    Brilliant feedback and I agree with you! I'm getting a little annoyed with how all 3 Rods go off at the same time and all 3 stay on. I hope dovetail read this and take notes from it :) the game is by far the best on the market fishing wise, it also has masses of potential!
     
  5. TrainSim-Jio

    TrainSim-Jio
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    We are reading and taking notes, have no fear :)
     
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