Train Sim World 3 - Bustling Birmingham

Discussion in 'Dovetail Live Article Discussion' started by DTG Alex, Nov 15, 2022.

  1. dudders

    dudders Member

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    Hopefully as the route seems to be not so busy there won't be such a performance hit and we might get a smoother ride
     
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  2. theorganist

    theorganist Well-Known Member

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    Personally I would have preferred the route to have been extended to Worcester or Hereford and included a class 170/196 (or whatever it is) but DTG don't seem to think like that. I still like the look of what we have got however as I have long wanted to see the Cross City line.

    The vast majority of Worcester trains came through Stourbridge, certainly until the ex GWR route into Snow Hill was reopened in 1995. Class 121/122 bubble cars tended to work a shuttle between the single platform Bromsgrove station and Worcester around the late 1980's and early 1990's.

    It is amazing to see how Bromsgrove station has changed in 30 years. It isn't even really in Bromsgrove being in the village of Finstall.
     
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  3. fakenham

    fakenham Well-Known Member

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    Definitely purchasing and v much looking forward to this today, the stream was v good. My only concern is the lack of AI which would lend itself running on greens most of the time. We have approach control, which is great, but I think the time is right for DTG to work towards implementing slightly delayed AI services to introduce variety. Difficult task I know, but this should be one of the priorities now.
    But lets see how XC plays out, Matt suggested that there should be a bit of adverse signalling in the timetable.
     
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  4. standit

    standit New Member

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    Nice to see the Cadbury plant modelled in the route. If only the massive works at Longbridge still existed. The Austin Works, later British Leyland, had extensive sidings joining the line just south of Longbridge station. I understand that many years ago there was also a worker's station within the complex served by some trains from New Street.
    It's already been mentioned that Bromsgrove originally had only one platform. Bromsgrove had engine sheds for the bankers and was also the site of another large factory with sidings (Garringtons GKN) where car parts were fashioned to supply Longbridge.
     
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  5. james64

    james64 Well-Known Member

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    Everyone's really getting hung up over New Street. Don't get me wrong I'm not a huge fan of it being so empty either, but it's not at all a deal breaker.
     
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  6. theorganist

    theorganist Well-Known Member

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    Indeed there was a branch line from Old Hill on the Stourbridge line through Halesowen to Longbridge, I think passenger trains ended 100 years ago, which is odd considering Halesowen is quite a large town and too large not to have a railway station.

    I drive an ex Longbridge product and it is sad to see the site being a shadow of its former self.
     
  7. theorganist

    theorganist Well-Known Member

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    That is how I feel, and I think the approach to Birmingham will be one of the highlights of the route. I suppose they could have put some 323's on the Walsall and Wolverhampton services, although I don't know when they last operated those. I recall last being on one on a Wolverhampton service around ten years ago.
     
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  8. Tigert1966

    Tigert1966 Well-Known Member

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    Same for me. I would hope that we see extra DLC in the future that expands on this. But the rest of the route looks so nice, I will enjoy it anyway.

    I like both Cathcart and LGV and they both have a pretty empty terminus. Sure it would be better with more traffic, but it won’t spoil it for me.
     
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  9. Mattty May

    Mattty May Well-Known Member

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    Bring back the day you could get 10 Freddo’s for a single UK £1.
     
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  10. rennekton#1349

    rennekton#1349 Well-Known Member

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    Dtg had to license back in tsc but they lost the license for whatever reason. Could be that cross country simply said I don't want to be in the game anymore. There was an article that was posted for tsc but all it said is that they no longer have the license and that the dlc that had the livery would be removed and have another livery or something. Ever since then, dtg have no xc license and we still don't have it in tsw so not going to happen. I'm sure dtg have tried to ask but might have been unsuccessful or xc said no
     
  11. Redbus

    Redbus Well-Known Member

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    They could use a faux-livery like the Island Line 2022 for unlicensed brands.
     
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  12. arek#2842

    arek#2842 Well-Known Member

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    I think it is not possible until dispatcher will be more decisive, to be able to find different routes if main one is blocked for some reason, which is hell of a job to develop, probably, so don't expect it to come soon (if ever).
    Right now, as far as I know, all AI trains are running following the scripted routine, place one train that will block the track for few minutes for whatever reason and you have the "famous" red light issue.

    To me, BCC looks very much like CCL in terms of environment, train and even AI traffic recreation (as far as I can judge from preview video). Lot's of work has been put into the details, the only downside for me are the empty tracks. I'll buy it at some point probably, but definitely not convinced me to move to TSW3.
     
    Last edited: Nov 17, 2022
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  13. Jpantera

    Jpantera Well-Known Member

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    Zusi manages to alternate routes, as do human beings in Signalling control centres. Why do we have to have this immersion breaker continue for those of us who have real life railway operations experience....
     
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  14. stujoy

    stujoy Well-Known Member

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    I don’t fancy having to make all my own liveries, or leave it to chance on Creator’s Club downloads, and then hope the trains appear where they should. Not really defending DTG with this reply, just the practical limitations of being a console player. It’s not great that the licensing holds some things back but a DIY approach is just as unsuitable in reality. This isn’t an editable PC only game like TSC.
    If only that era was popular enough to sustain it. I think I would be very happy driving BR blue era on every UK route, with a new multiple unit or loco with every new route. It would be a fantastic collection that could build up and get close to or even rival the variety we see on German routes.
     
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  15. stujoy

    stujoy Well-Known Member

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    Only ten? What a rip-off.
     
  16. ARuscoe

    ARuscoe Well-Known Member

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    I worked for the company that demolished much of that site. Funny enough that company was mismanaged too and went bust...
    Not really, unless DTG also program the livery designer to be able to apply to single trains or locos as well as random ones (which they haven't done)
    So you'd end up with liveries on incorrect trains and could see multiple liveries on trains which are supposed to be unique
     
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  17. james64

    james64 Well-Known Member

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    I was at Wolverhampton 3 years ago and there were 323s there then. 90% sure they still are but obviously not for much longer.

    Agree about the approach to New Street. Cardiff to Birmingham is a journey I'm very familiar with, and the approach to New Street from Five Ways is always a highlight for me. It just seems so dramatic. I love how the speed slowly decreases and the engines on the Turbostar slow to a low rumble as they idle, and then you're plunged into darkness, with brief flashes of daylight. And then, tantalisingly slowly you emerge into a metropolis of platforms and a vast array of Pendolinos, 350s, Voyagers etc.

    At least that's how I saw it when I was 10. I still get that same excitement though.
     
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  18. solicitr

    solicitr Well-Known Member

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    I think that this may have been the original idea back in the TSW1/2020 era. Set everything in BR days, get a nice stable of 101s, 47s, 37s etc that can be used everywhere. (Note the earliest UK routes after GWE were West Somerset, Northern Trans-Pennine, Tees Valley and the Heavy Freight Pack; in this time frame they also released the Classes 20, 31, 33 and 52). But, at a guess, the market for vintage rail and wheezy old diesels just wasn't there; and the subsequent East Coastway was a runaway sales success, launching the era of "All Electrostars, all the time.".
     
    Last edited: Nov 17, 2022
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  19. theorganist

    theorganist Well-Known Member

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    You might be right there, but it is depressing none the less.
     
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  20. OldVern

    OldVern Well-Known Member

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    As does the new dispatcher in Run 8, a game essentially coded by one guy (actually, genius).
     
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  21. royalscot#3684

    royalscot#3684 Well-Known Member

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    My. biggest hope is that now we have New Street, WCML South (Brum to Euston) will follow as the next route. If that does happen I can forgive the current emptiness...
     
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  22. royalscot#3684

    royalscot#3684 Well-Known Member

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    Has anyone had a go with scenario editor yet and tried to make it a bit busier? I'm tempted to try to do a c.1990 scenario (just before the juice was switched on) with lots of DMUs and diverted diesel hauled expressed, but I've no idea if the paths exist to do this...
     
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  23. junior hornet

    junior hornet Well-Known Member

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    I love the “No smoking, vaping or bog snorkelling” signs. Apparently these are a real thing.

    I couldn’t care less about BNS. It’ my least favourite station in the country, having been stuck there in it’s dinginess for ages on more than one occasion, and the less time spent there, the better.

    Anyway, apart from that, I’m enjoying it so far. Next time I’m in that neck of the woods though, I’m definitely going to park and ride from Selly Oak. That enormous great car park is totally empty!
     
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  24. Jpantera

    Jpantera Well-Known Member

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    How busy would that be if two or 3 service groups are missing as per BCC or is that 10 or so...
     
  25. theorganist

    theorganist Well-Known Member

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    They certainly are. I had to do a double take the first time I saw them!
     
  26. fakenham

    fakenham Well-Known Member

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    I wonder what will happen if, for example, you run v late from Redditch. Will the Bromsgrove services be pathed in preference or will they wait for the player train? If they get the path, this could create some kind of random delay? Intrigued, one to try....
     
  27. OldVern

    OldVern Well-Known Member

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    Scope for some interesting tangles. If you are late from Redditch and booked to cross the next Down service at Barnt Green, will the game run it down to the new crossing loop at Alvechurch, which is what might happen in reality. I'm almost (but not quite) tempted to just spend the £30 to see if I can break the timetable. Maybe if there's some Steam Wallet credit left after the sales...
     
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  28. fakenham

    fakenham Well-Known Member

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    Indeed, but the glass half empty part of me reckons we'll just be stuck at a red light. But you never know!
     
  29. Crosstie

    Crosstie Well-Known Member

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    How gross ! ( I had to look it up ).

    Why would this apply to a railroad station?
     
  30. theorganist

    theorganist Well-Known Member

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    I don't know to be honest, I assume an attempt at levity. Something very much required considering the service you get on the Snow Hill lines!
     
  31. royalscot#3684

    royalscot#3684 Well-Known Member

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    In popular English humour it is, of course, a euphemism for something else... but as this is a family forum...
     
  32. Crosstie

    Crosstie Well-Known Member

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    From players' initial reactions to the route, I'm almost tempted. If only there was one more train, perhaps a 1st or 2nd gen diesel stopping service, like in GWE.

    Maybe I'll stay on the fence until a sale or a Christmas Steam card comes my way.

    Thing is, if the US route and/or loco releases soon, there goes another 60 bucks.

    Ah, as stujoy said recently, it's never been a cheap hobby.
     
    Last edited: Nov 17, 2022
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  33. breblimator

    breblimator Guest

    Not as "cheap" as drinking. There is still a hope. BR o7
     
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  34. redrev1917

    redrev1917 Well-Known Member

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    Reminds me of when Virgin Trains had the supposedly funny message everytime you went to the toilet. Ive no idea if Avanti still have them or if they've got rid of them as everytime Im due on an Avanti service I get a rail replacement bus (or just a cancellation and told to walk)
     
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  35. royalscot#3684

    royalscot#3684 Well-Known Member

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    If you think train simming is expensive don't go near model railways - these days in 00 it's about £200 for a loco, £60 for a coach and £40 for a modern wagon. The recent APT was north of £400. And then you have to build a shed to put it all in!
     
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  36. meridian#2659

    meridian#2659 Well-Known Member

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    Until the rush hour packs the tsw routes barrely had static stock, almost nonexistent a.i traffic.

    The improvement last 1.5 years in features and additions, made a lot of routes more immersing & atmospheric.

    So yes birmingham is empty because we dont have the nessecary trains, same as cathcart.
    But looking at bakerloo, they went back and created a 600+ service timetable. Whenever the trains are ready for the midlands, dtg can always go back and enhance the timetable or expand the route.

    People wanted a route not in the south, and now we have it.

    Personally im happy, nothing to complain about the decision of making this route. Now there is a solid foundation for loco dlcs.
     
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  37. Crosstie

    Crosstie Well-Known Member

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    :D

    Unfortunately, I'm rather fond of expensive wines, the price of which I never, ever complain about. :D
     
    Last edited: Nov 17, 2022
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  38. OldVern

    OldVern Well-Known Member

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    My No.1 priority is getting the Turkish route for TSC when it releases tomorrow. Then there's a couple of back catalogue TSW routes - Harlem, then HSC and/or Lubeck I want to pick up if they get a decent enough discount in the sales. Oh and Montana + Texas for ATS. Quite the shopping list already for my Steam credit...
     
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  39. Tigert1966

    Tigert1966 Well-Known Member

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    I'm happy, very happy in fact. I used to live in Birmingham a long time ago and the route is bringing back a lot of memories. Sutton to Birmingham New Street is almost exactly as I remember it. It seems very well done. Looks like a full weekend of nostalgia ahead for me as I explore the other side of the city. Love the train model and sounds. I wasn't optimistic given the TSC version, but they sound really good to me. Makes a nice change from the German routes I normally play.

    Still annoyed at the price on Steam in my country, but the XBOX Price was ok and I can play that on PC and console so I can live with that.
     
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  40. redrev1917

    redrev1917 Well-Known Member

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    Ive taken the plunge, despite my reservations over it being similar to what Ive already got the additional features and safety systems swayed me.
    Lets see if its worth it......
     
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  41. OldVern

    OldVern Well-Known Member

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    Same here. Despite my posturing and pontificating I just folded. Should still have enough Steam credit for the TSC Turkish tomorrow and Harlem in the sale. ATS can go on the back burner for now.

    However, for £30 I will be judging this like Simon Cowell when it comes to any review and I do want DTG to address the issues that have been raised with regard to bare scenery and missing fences, also look at expanding the end user scenario creation potential.

    Two platforms at New Street are not enough, DTG Matt DTG Alex any views please.

    Downloading now so more later.
     
    Last edited: Nov 17, 2022
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  42. breblimator

    breblimator Guest

    Hardly waiting for Your tough first impressions to share with us! :)
     
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  43. Nick Y

    Nick Y Well-Known Member

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    Both really great add-ons for ATS. Well worth the asking prices with lots of cities to deliver to. Also now there's the new photo trophies to collect which makes you go back and explore previous states too.
     
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  44. Crosstie

    Crosstie Well-Known Member

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    I'll be looking for your review in a day or two.
    Positive or negative, might knock me off the fence one side or the other.
    " Heavy is the head that wears the crown" :D
     
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  45. junior hornet

    junior hornet Well-Known Member

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    I remember one about flushing away your hopes and dreams.
     
  46. junior hornet

    junior hornet Well-Known Member

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    In Britain, it applies as much to a railroad station as it does to a Training Center ;)
     
  47. Jpantera

    Jpantera Well-Known Member

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    Will wait your views as am pondering it but lack of AI really puts me off.
     
  48. Crosstie

    Crosstie Well-Known Member

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    Your spelling is improving. Keep it up! :D
     
  49. royalscot#3684

    royalscot#3684 Well-Known Member

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    The problem with New Street is not so much that only two platforms are available in timetable mode but that only two platforms are available in scenario mode.

    Yes, you've read that right. DTG have only modelled two accessible platforms in one of the UK's busiest stations. ( Even though even just the cross city services often use other platforms).

    Without access to any sidings or a depot that adds up to a rather bland route.

    It's another half arsed effort I'm afraid. It's a massive contrast to routes like Clinchfield where there was so much to do.
     
    Last edited: Nov 17, 2022
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  50. OldVern

    OldVern Well-Known Member

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    Well only done the one run so far, Bromsgrove into Birmingham. The 323 I have to say is very nice, much better than the Electrostars of the other UK routes. Track and point sounds are a bit quiet, at least at speed. Not really seen enough of the route to judge the scenery yet and this run was done in twilight too.

    But yes, lack of other services is going to be the Achilles Heel of this route, as expected. On the run above I had the two back to back GWR power cars pass me west of Kings Norton and something with a 66 was poking its head off the Camp Hill line. But no Cross Country services, no WMR diesel services the southern section should be alive with all this traffic. Maybe it won't feel so bad on the northern section, well at least north of Aston but there is definitely a Cathcartish feel to the proceedings. I don't think I'll be refunding as the route is interesting enough and I do have a devilish inclination to cause mischief with late running. However I firmly feel this should not have been pitched at the £30 price mark, for what you get.
     
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