Why I’m Making This Public? My Frustrations with TSW5 I’ve been a passionate player of tsw5 for a long time, but tsw5 has taken away a lot of the joy I once found in the game. That’s why I feel the need to speak up about the issues that have ruined the experience for me, and I know I’m not alone in feeling this way. One of the biggest problems is the sheer number of bugs. It feels like every time I try to play, I run into new issues that weren’t there before, and it’s exhausting. The Free Roam mode,doesn’t even work properly anymore. It’s frustrating to see features that were supposed to enhance the game fall short. Then there’s the content I was really looking forward to, like the BR 114 (Just a example)or the Frankfurt-Fulda route. Unfortunately, they’re both huge disappointments. Whether it’s broken mechanics or poor implementation, the things that were meant to be highlights have turned out to be complete letdowns. The overall performance of the game is also a major issue. It just doesn’t run smoothly, and that kills the immersion. Every time the game stutters or crashes, it pulls me out of the experience, and that’s not what I expect from a game that should be about enjoying the journey. In the end, it’s all just frustrating. The combination of bugs, broken features, and poor performance has made TSW5 lose its appeal for me. That’s why I’m sharing this publicly – because something needs to change, and right now, it’s hard to find the fun in a game that’s become such a disappointment. (edit) I was really looking forward to new content as well as new roadmap, but as it is currently it is simply not worth it anymore.
What platform are you playing on ? Been playing it on Series X since day of release and - a coupe of crashes aside using Quick Resume - I've honestly had no issues with it all, and it's hardly been off my console.
TSW5 is the worst release to date. I have it on PS5 and Gamepass. Right now I have not touched TSW5 in 2 weeks and have gone back to using TSW4. There are too many bugs, performance issues and short sighted design work for me to put up with.
I am also playing on PS5 and actually I was looking forward to play TSW5, pre-ordered the Deluxe Version even though I saw the streams. I thought they will bring hot fixes pretty fast. But yeah not really.There has been one minor patch so far. I have constant crashes on WCML and Frankfurt-Fulda. US route I didn't play at all. But basically half of the stuff doesn't work or minor things on the ICE we already had in previous versions have not been implemented. I played a couple of scenarios on Frankfurt-Fulda. How often I needed to remove cargo train because half of the train was stuck on the main line instead of the siding. I absolutely feel the frustration.
Im getting more and more fustrated also with TSW 5 and seems a lot of the issues are on Consoles even 9th gen im wondering tsw is become so advanced even gen 9 consoles are choking on it Idk just a thought..otherwise I agree tsw 5 is the worst tsw release so far . I play on x box series x and im all the sudden getting crashes to desktop from main loading screen yesterday i had 3 crashes to desktop in a row finally on 4th attempt it struggled but booted up that was the first crashes ive had since downloaded. Free starter edition and 37 of my preowned dlcs , I did break down and get US San Bernadino commuter no UP ai traffic is showing i own sherman hill and cajon havent tried the BNSF playable freight yet but did see bnsf engines parked in a siding so hopefully the playable freight will layer in properly..otherwise i just dont like the direction DTG going with TSW lately ,,lack of any new improved US freight ,,too much emphasis. On modern passenger trains , too much EMU DMU commuter like trains, the conductor mode is a waste ..formation and even free roam is a mess now.i dont care for the rote hopping either . Alsonot interested in the annouced VR version or the Roblox kiddie game..DTG should utilising all their resources. For tsw5 get this train wreck back on track and make REAL improvements that matter ..
Mixed feelings here. After a few days avoiding the game I fired it up yesterday. Had a great blast with the 218 on Hamburg to Lubeck and, apart from the known WCML issues, quite enjoyed my run with the 390 out to MKC. However the Fulda and SBD routes haven't hooked me like I thought they would. Been having more fun on my TSC German routes Mittenwaldbahn and Pegnitztalbahn. Ditto for US, the vintage routes in TSC are so much more interesting and there's always Run 8. Think there are two crunches hanging over TSW5 for me. First is what the major patch might deliver both in terms of core fixes and addressing the routes, particularly the poor quality WCMLS. Second is what news on the JT route, the one shining light in all of this.
I feel you, but I think this is more a question on taste whether you like branch-routes, highspeed lines etc etc etc. I for my part get more and more frustrated about the missing connections and the length of the routes. But the dealbreaker, and I think that is what the OP ment, is the all in all core performance of the game. Crashes, bugs and failures just break the immersion and ruin the fun in the game. I havn't played intensive for over a year now and that sadens me because I really like the idea of TSW.
i really wasnt planning on getting SBD but someone gifted me a x box store card plus i had enough achievement points to redeem free store credit so i had just enough to get SBD other than that the only 2 routes up comming that i may consider purchasing. Later are Boston MBTA and the JT schapp route ..any others its too far out but will see when they come closer get pics or in roadmaps
plus i got TSC routes vying for my money nowespecially the US stuff and there a fair amount of UK routes in TSC im interested in and try a few others .on top of locomotive car dlc etc too
Completely agree. I was so happy when DTG ditched the yearly paid version update that was universally despised and looked forward to Five being the version where I reconnected with this game. Unfortunately the numerous crashes and freezes make it by far the least stable version of TSW ever. The ever problematic performance issues with stutters and frame rate drops are still there and on some routes seem worse than before. Being able to disable layers helps a bit but even with all layers paged out some routes like Cathcart updated and Blackpool to Preston run so poorly as to be unacceptable at least to me. I realise there are some users who tolerate the current state of TSW and if there are enough of them DTG will do little to address these issues despite numerous callouts. As customers of a product we all have the right to voice our opinions especially if we are not satisfied with what we have paid money for.
I haven't been on TSW since well before the announcement of TSW4. I just got fed-up of all the bugs. When the TSW5 Free starter edition was released, I thought I would give it another ago. So after the painstaking way of adding the TSW5 versions of owned dlc's, by was I disappointed! Same old dlc's, same old bugs! Being TSW5 versions I was expecting that my TSW2/3 dlc's would have at least had a bit of a upgrade. But No! Then I thought I would switch from the MS Store to Steam. Then only to discover that the TSW2/3/4 routes are still going at their original release prices? Spirit of Steam! A DLC Total Failure that's that bad, DTG have themselves totally given up on it, is still being sold at £30??? DGT to me are only in it for the money. They just don't care about Us, us the people who buy their products, and are ultimately let down by their lack of care just to make a quick buck! It's back to MSFS2020 for me. Roll On November 17th for when MSFS2024 is released. MicroSoft, you are very welcome to my £130. If DTG were as committed to their gamers as MS/Asobo are, DTG would be rolling around in money!
I know how you feel exactly. I played the older route on TSW5 it seem to be ok. But the newer route it a let down. It so much a let down that sooner or later it time to move on to something else. This is ridiculous seriously. Having a new title only to have so many bugs in it.to be honest boredom is starting to sat in. And you know what that mean.
I really think the yearly update cycle is damaging the game very badly. All the effort that must be required building a new interface (which isn’t needed), getting all the routes ready on all the systems etc, just doesn’t make any sense. All development effort needs to be channeled into delivering great quality on Day One and fixing any ‘unexpected bugs’. DTG should not be releasing any content that is immediately shot down by the community as being subpar or in need of a ridiculous amount of bug fixes. We’ve all given tremendous amounts of feedback to DTG about what we want that DTG must be deaf, dumb and blind not to deliver it. Things like: Realistic and full timetables. Reasonably accurate and correct scenery. Realistic sounds. Trains and AI Trains that operate correctly, e.g. correct lights, pantographs, destinations etc. Marker points placed correctly. The list is too long to write out here, but it’s not rocket science. We shouldn’t be having the same issues at this stage of development (5th game). I also think DTG should get rid of the medal/scoring system. It’s really quite pointless. Platinum medals are either just as easy to get as Gold or unobtainable due to messed up scoring on the route. Just get rid of it and never have to worry about it ever again.
This from a company that has been creating Train Simulators for many years, this is shoddy and very unprofessional. My initial thought was that they started creating this from the day TSW4 was launched. But after seeing/using TSW5 I now think it was slapped together 3 months ago? They should have spent 12 months re-writing the core software. Then when that was completed start tackling new routes, followed by updating and fixing the old routes, and only then when you have a complete product, release it. I wouldn't have minded waiting 2 years for a new version to come. Though as usual DTG weren't bothered about their existing users, they targeted getting new users, by laying a web of falsehoods. Do the powers that be at DTG honestly believe that this Tat will entice and then retain new, future victims? TSW is literally a case of "Don't Judge a Book by its Cover!" The cover may look nice, but the contents will disappoint.
The biggest problem in my eyes with TSW, is the progressive decline in quality. One person in particular seems to be creating their vision of a game, that sadly isn't able to deliver, and the said person keeps promising things will get better and they aren't. It's time for a shake up in the senior team and a new direction or vision. Edit - Just a few things that were in the original plan for TSW that were dumped... Multiplayer (plan was for each route to have a interactive server where you could jump on a service and drive it past your mates, randoms etc) Signaller mode Add-on manager for all platforms Accurate signalling (all UK routes run a different signalling model at present and ranges in accuracy), can't comment on German or US content as I'm not trained in their signalling. Easy to use editor for creating content on all platforms.
The elephant in the room, but I think you could be right. A firm hand on the steering oar both in terms of the core and quality of DLC,
Easy and editor will never go together. Unreal engine is never going to be easy to work with if you're going in for the first time. It's a professional game engine for a reason and with that comes a huge learning curve
It was originally said it was going to be included within the game, so that you'd build from directly inside the TSW world. So basically everything in a route, you could use to create content. Instead we ended up with a half baked scenario creator, a half baked consist builder and a paint shop...
Playing devils advocate for a second but hear me out. When I started my current job the company was a similar size to Dovetail Games. We made the decisions about what products we released and while we were making modest money, we put quality ahead of reaching for bigger profits. Then we were taken over by a much larger company and it's all gone to chaos. Constant meetings full of management BS about "sweating our assets", "driving efficiency" and "oven-ready deliverables". When I dared raise my hand to tell a senior manager of our parent company that our staff are overworked, stress is building, quality is slipping and it's damaging our reputation I was sent a very terse email about "bringing a more positive attitude to work". I'm off sick long-term after the constant pressure made me seriously ill. I did warn them! Dovetail may be under huge pressure to meet a whole list of targets in 2024 from Focus. I'm inclined to think that the people within Dovetail have been working their backsides off to try to make TSW5 a success but.......Parent Company mandated targets. That's what I think about whenever people pile-in on DTG, I'm lucky that my company's product didn't have a forum discussing it because it's heartbreaking not being able to deliver the best possible quality to customers because..... Parent Company mandated targets.
Quality of TSW started slipping before the Focus takeover, since the takeover it's gone off a cliff. The Focus take over was supposed to provide more resources and expertise to help DTG get the best from their assets, staff and products. Instead we've seen a further slip in quality, and further expansion to VR and Roblox, all while the key product falls further down the toilet.
Apart from WCMLS which apparently all DTG's work, I haven't seen a fall in quality personally. DLC like Voralberg, Rosenheim, Suffragette line, San Bernadino, Cathcart remaster, class 380 and others have all been better quality in my view.
Yes, but the core updates have been shocking, and the bug lists per release are getting longer and longer. I don't buy anything outside of the UK now, as I don't get the time to learn and play, so I can only talk about UK stuff. GOBLIN while on the surface is good, there's a lot of infrastructure/signalling issues that are masked by the busy timetable. The Cathcart remaster, was a pet project for a staff member if I remember rightly, and wasn't dedicated to a team as such. The reason the quality of some releases has gone up, is because they are smaller projects by external developers on behalf of DTG. Again this is my opinion.
Yeah, dude, I don't. Get it.I can Load it ten times in its different nine times I can do the same thing.Press the same buttons and it does something different each time No video ever matches.No manual ever matches like nothing works
Great post, and I feel your pain. We were taken over in 2019, with the promise of little interference........
Always remember if the train looks like it should, moves a bit and there is some trees and buildings then it's marketable. Accuracy and realism.are slowly creeping away.
There you are. The quality of routes has always been inconsistent but the impression I got, especially during the early days, was that DTG didn't have resources, then Matt was put in charge and things improved. Then Focus turned up and, as you say, quality has suffered. The GOBLIN line was during the Focus era however which goes to show that, given time and resources, they can make excellent quality products. While it's really appreciated, that someone remastered the West Somerset railway in their own time is a big red flag. When Focus discuss the complaints around WCML (and trust me, there will have been half a dozen meetings about it already) they will either do the usual parent company thing of demanding better without providing sufficient resources or they'll be smart and realise that TSW is not far off being a good product but needs more investment. All speculation obviously but having worked through 4 takeovers in my 35 year career in business, it's the same every single time. Focus won't hesitate to pull the TSW series if it's not making a profit. I do feel genuine sympathy for DTG staff and managers and hope that any staff who are struggling and feeling overwhelmed are putting their health and well-being first. Working long hours under immense pressure slowly kills you.
I keep reading you guys mentioning you know this dude, Matt and the other dude.Is there only like three people that make this game???
They don't like being tagged in posts. There's about 30 or 40 in the development team. The 2 you've mentioned or tagged are the executive producer and the community manager.
They just make the tea and biscuits, and put crumbs in Matt's headset (I did that once to a work colleague, crushed up some salt and vinegar chipsticks, put them in the crevice between the earpiece and the faux leather cushion. He took about 5 minutes to realise after complaining about getting an itch in his ear, much hilarity was had)
I doubt very strongly that Focus has has any meetings. TSW is just a drop in a lake for them. DTG yes but not Focus. They would only care if revenue has gone down and from what I'm hearing sales are up from TSW4 during the same time frame from release.
I’m sort of in the same boat with TSW5. As much as I enjoy TSW I have been finding it rather stale lately, the 3 core routes I’m sick to death of playing now and wouldn’t be in two minds of deleting them to make space for future content. The upcoming just trains route hopefully will peak my interest.
I'm very ambivalent. Basically, TSW5 runs just as well or badly on my Xbox Series S as TSW4. At least when it comes to TSW4 content or older - I own all German routes and locomotives (except for the BR 343 and the BR 187, which I do own but haven't installed because it's so abysmally bad and I imagine it's also responsible for crashes). The TSW 3 routes were the worst so far in terms of performance, especially Bremen - Oldenburg and partly Kassel - Würzburg, where half of the Main-Spessart-Bahn apparently exists in the background and takes up memory. The Kinzigtalbahn is now the winner, and I'm seriously wondering how such an unfinished route can make it to release without anyone noticing these problems. Here, too, there are parts of the route that still exist, even though they are not used in the final version. I am a product manager and software designer by profession, and that's why some of the things I read here from DTG or hear in the live streams sometimes leave me speechless. Statements like "the beta testers should just play around a bit and if they happen to find bugs, report them to us." To me it feels like there is no testing concept, bugs are not reproduced properly and not all platforms are tested with the same intensity. I no longer report bugs myself, because my tickets, which are written in the same detailed and well-founded way as I do in my job, are only answered with a cliché and then closed anyway. Why should I put in the effort? For me, TSW5 is a clear step backwards compared to TSW4, especially in terms of the user interface. Fonts that are difficult to scale and read, tiles that you can't immediately tell whether they are selected or not, and a sometimes completely chaotic usage pattern (for example, why is the right tile suddenly preselected in the "To the trains" menu?), strange color concept (actually very subtle, which I like, and then suddenly brightly colored again). On the XBox, the very first loading screen has a TSW5 logo that has a completely different color and font, and so on. Of the new features, only the digital displays are a real improvement for me. The new map seems artificially inflated without offering much added value, especially in free roam. Route hopping and fast traveling are well-intentioned, but don't seem to have been thought through to the end. The layer selector seems to have been added at the last minute when they realized how poor the performance of the new routes is, but you can't just hard-cut the layers on the PCs, as was apparently also done at the last minute on the Xbox Series S. It's no wonder that TSW 5 will now be free until next year. DTG is trying to get all players onto a uniform version, which makes perfect sense. But TSW 5 in its current state is not attractive enough to actually persuade many players to switch. The Add-on Manager was probably introduced secretly and quietly with TSW4 for all platforms, but DTG never communicated this publicly. But that's why the game has taken significantly longer to load initially since then, especially if you own a lot of tracks. And leaving a track also takes longer because assignments probably have to be managed and then removed in the background.
A quick update on TSW route releases and announced forthcoming releases so far; London Midland - 8 Southern - 5 Western - 4 Scottish - 3 Transport for London - 2 Eastern - 2 Or on a map, to assist Focus/DTG on where their next releases should be. I don't buy the licencing argument given for the lack of East Anglian routes (for example) given that no such permission was necessary for any pre-privatisation routes. It seems certain builders have their favourite parts of the network and if you're not in one of those areas, tough. Rivet have mostly done Scotland lately, JT do the North West, DTG Southern and the middle of England, ATS North West, Skyhook Midlands.
I suspect Focus’ big seller is Snowrunner and the newer Explorations, which I haven’t got round to buying yet. Well I found myself back in TSW5 last night and have to agree, the formula is getting old. Bugs aside we have a lot of samey routes as I went from a commuter EMU run on HRR to another, oh, EMU commuter run on Vorarlberg. All debate about route length and piggy backing on existing rolling stock aside, I can’t get excited about the ATS Manchester Suburban route as it’s just more of what we have already in the game. Ditto MBTA. Already got numerous US commuter routes barely touched. The new routes with TSW5, apart from the quality issues were all just more of the same even Frankfurt to Fulda no different than running DCZ, MSB or any of the other inter urban runs. I can go across to TSC and pick from a variety of routes from many different countries and eras that offer a much broader gameplay experience. The one thing you should be able to do in TSW which you can’t due to the borked save game, is remain in the same persistent “World” for an extended period. Otherwise it rapidly descends into a monotonous succession of A to B runs, usually on clear signals (unless the game stuffs up), or scenarios where you board a train in the depot, take it to the terminus, run a few stops and then get relieved at an unlikely location. Or daft nonsense like farmers or Emily Turner giving you operational notifications that should come from the signaller.
Well I guess it depends on what one wants from a Train Simulator, and what one's expectation level is. And apparently, what one is playing TSW on. I'm on PC, and are getting tired of hearing people on potato boxes complaining that their potato box can't run TSW5 satisfyingly. It is perhaps time to upgrade instead of holding TSW back. Just my opinion. I haven't touched Train Sim Classic for years. It doesn't meet my visual expectations, nor has the TSW gameplay possibilities. TS Classic having a ton of routes too chose from is not enough for me. TSW5, as TSW's goes, is the best TSW, so far, in my opinion.
Explorations is really fun. Thats what I've been playing while I take a little break from TSW. Until some patches come in and some xbox improvements.
Might have to put that on my Christmas list. Still got so much to do in Snowrunner though, ironically, just like TSW that can get a bit samey at times.
It's funny how different each of us is. Visually I prefer TSC, it's visually really low quality for 2024, but the lighting is far more realistic and it makes scenery in places like the UK more realistically coloured (ie deep greens in the countryside/grey towns) in TSW our sunshine is far too bright and has been since the game launched. The trains sound better and mostly perform better in TSC and considering it's such an old game, most of the cabs have better functionality in TSC. While TSW looks more realistic there are elements that shatter that realism (the passengers and foliage loading 100 metres ahead of me for example). While you're not bothered about variety of traction, it's my biggest problem with TSW. Obviously some routes are better than others. The lack of routes that interest me in TSW is also a problem. Being a lover of AC Electric trains in the South and East of England, 7 years down the track there's only a handful of routes that particularly interest me in TSW, I'm building a collection but I'm starting to have doubts about it. In TSC there's whole mainlines and big networks to play with. However, you're right about TSW being so much better for gameplay possibilities. Timetable mode and spawning a train within it and the ability to simulate a realistic shift on most lines and being able to walk from one end of the train to the other are brilliant in TSW. I just wished that we had routes that I'd love to see in TSW......but don't we all?
Well as for myself until they get this handle hopefully. I’m just gonna get into flight simulator 2020. I’m tired of the crashes on TSW. but as for now I’m gonna be using my airbus380 until DTG can get this sorta out.
Out of interest, are you getting MSFS 2024 when it comes out? I'm feeling like holding off for a year or so. Most new games have lots of bugs upon release and after a while player feedback improves them. I'm also avoiding Football Manager 2025 for the same reason as it's being rebuilt on Unity, the 2026 will be a much more polished version.
Im gonna hold off on that for a bit. It comes out on the 19th of nov. I’m surly gonna get gta6 no doubt about that. The massive realism in that game. Everyone gonna have a copy on that. Hopefully there no mishaps on that probably not
